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Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th

Posted By: vonBaur

Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 12:05 AM

Yeah, I don't care, either.
Posted By: DaBBQ

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 12:37 AM

Drats, that means I have to go to McDonald's to get a misorder instead of it getting lost on delivery.
Posted By: Haggart

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 03:55 AM

If i ever need a cab it won't either one of those
Posted By: PanzerMeyer

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 10:40 AM

What's the motive for the strike?
Posted By: rwatson

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 11:07 AM

Just the usual PM..pay,,benifits,,They are treated as private contractors and get the short end of the stick..

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/uber-lyft-drivers-strike_n_5cd22e3fe4b0a7dffcce3fe1
Posted By: PanzerMeyer

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 11:23 AM

Originally Posted by rwatson
Just the usual PM..pay,,benifits,,They are treated as private contractors and get the short end of the stick..

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/uber-lyft-drivers-strike_n_5cd22e3fe4b0a7dffcce3fe1



It's my understanding that the traditional yellow cab drivers were also for the most part private contractors. If that was the case then why should it be any different for Uber and Lyft?
Posted By: PanzerMeyer

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 11:26 AM

It just seems to me that Uber and Lyft have the same business model as insurance companies do with their agents. When I worked for New York Life over 20 years ago I was classified as a "business partner". I was paid for the insurance policies I sold for them but that's it. I was essentially a small business owner who decided to partner up with a specific insurance company to sell their products.
Posted By: rwatson

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 11:52 AM

Seems it's rough for cab drivers
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/oct/20/new-york-yellow-cab-taxi-medallion-value-cost
Posted By: PanzerMeyer

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 11:57 AM

Originally Posted by rwatson



They have joined the ranks of encyclopedia salesmen, film critics and retail store workers.
Posted By: rwatson

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 12:36 PM

WOW do they still have encyclopedia salesmen ??
Posted By: PanzerMeyer

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by rwatson
WOW do they still have encyclopedia salesmen ??



In the US they are extinct but I don't know about other countries.
Posted By: JimK

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 01:09 PM

Have never used any type of ride service in my life. Road the bus in my teens.That was it.

This new generation of millennial's without cars or licenses fuels this type of service, not wonder its imploding.
Posted By: MarkG

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 01:39 PM

On the planning thread for my first NYC trip a couple of years ago, I think it was Bones who said, "Just catch a Uber (to some location he was showing me)." My first thought was, "What's a Uber?"

Taking a taxi from Newark Airport (where we drop off the rental car) to our Manhattan hotel (near the Flatiron District) is ~$100.00, including tolls and tip. I thought about trying Uber as I would guess it's a little cheaper but there's something comforting to me about traveling in an actual taxi cab, especially for that distance. Once in NYC it's all walking, with the occasional subway (usually under time constraints first thing in the morning...we purchase 7-day unlimited passes). I took an emergency cab twice on my first trip when I had kidney stones and it was kinda pricey.
Posted By: vonBaur

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 02:06 PM

OOPS! Got the date wrong. It's today, the 8th.

In the 90's I worked for a courier service in southern California. Same arrangement: private contractor, paid by the delivery not by the hour, no health coverage or paid time off, responsible for my own vehicle expenses. I can relate to their concerns, but it's still the drivers' choice to stay or go. Everybody likes the good sides of their jobs, but all jobs have downsides and you accept those when you say, "yes" as well. If the company changes the rules afterward, that's one thing. But to accept the terms and then get mad when those downsides stop being an abstract is just more whiney garbage.
Posted By: HomeFries

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 02:22 PM

The irony is that working as an independent contractor is both appropriate for Uber/Lyft drivers and it benefits them with the new tax law.

Drivers are independent contractors because they determine their own hours and other than contractual agreements, Uber/Lyft never directly tells them what to do. The drivers who want to become employees and get W2s should be careful what they wish for, especially if driving is a supplemental form of income.

Then, of course, employee benefits completely went away with the latest tax law. Since drivers use their own vehicles, with the new law they wouldn't be allowed to claim mileage or depreciation as an employee. As a contractor, there are no such restrictions claiming a business expense. Most drivers end up losing money (i.e. tax break) once depreciation/expenses or standard mileage rate are factored in as business expenses.
Posted By: Mr_Blastman

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 02:22 PM

They should go on strike. Their companies use and abuse them, constantly reducing their tips and pay they collect, all while stringing them along with ever changing elaborate schemes to keep them chained to their phones. I think Amazon is worse to their delivery drivers, though. One thing is for certain--these companies truly don't care about their drivers as they are actively working on ways to eliminate them entirely with self-driving car technology.

Maybe the drivers should think about a different career. Most don't consider it a career, though, and work these jobs to supplement their income. They'd likely be much better off mowing lawns.
Posted By: Mr_Blastman

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by vonBaur
If the company changes the rules afterward, that's one thing.


This is the crux of the issue with Uber, vonBaur. They are gaming their employees, constantly changing the rules.
Posted By: JimK

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 02:50 PM

Originally Posted by Mr_Blastman
Originally Posted by vonBaur
If the company changes the rules afterward, that's one thing.


This is the crux of the issue with Uber, vonBaur. They are gaming their employees, constantly changing the rules.


Same thing goes for just about all this type of service work. Company I have worked for the past 25 years has just done the same.
We were forced to sign new employment contracts with out knowing what changes applied to us. Big mistake. We are now looking
for way out of this type of work. Never again.
Posted By: PanzerMeyer

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 03:03 PM

The fundamental problem is that Uber and Lyft never intended for people to want to drive for them as their primary full time job. These driving jobs were intended to be part-time supplemental income type jobs for mostly college aged people.
Posted By: PanzerMeyer

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 03:05 PM

Originally Posted by Mr_Blastman
Most don't consider it a career, though, and work these jobs to supplement their income. They'd likely be much better off mowing lawns.



That has not been my experience in Miami. The majority of the Uber/Lyft drivers I've met do it as their primary full time job. Miami may be unique though since there's such a high constant influx of low income/low skilled immigrants who find Uber/Lyft attractive since all you need is a car and a smartphone.
Posted By: F4UDash4

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 03:15 PM

Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
The fundamental problem is that Uber and Lyft never intended for people to want to drive for them as their primary full time job. These driving jobs were intended to be part-time supplemental income type jobs for mostly college aged people.


+1

Everyone, these days , wants their entry level no skill job transformed into a high paying career with no more exertion on their part.
Posted By: F4UDash4

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 03:18 PM

Oh, and instead of receiving praise for providing a way people can make some extra money on the side and go to school etc. Uber/Lyft are castigated for being evil corporations.
Posted By: Khai

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 03:24 PM

I thought there was less crap driving on the roads today.....

(seriously, in the UK, most of the crap driving I see are these gig drivers...)
Posted By: Mr_Blastman

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 04:14 PM

F4--none of the drivers expect Uber and Lyft to be high-paying jobs. They only want to be treated fairly.

When a company pays you x, then gives you a 30% cut, then another 30% cut, and then another, etc., workers notice the drastic reduction in income. What irks the drivers even more, though, is how these companies haven't lowered their fare rates, and instituted policies forbidding cash tipping, so the company can swipe the tip money for themselves rather than pay it to the drivers.

Read up on what Uber in particular has done--pretty despicable in some instances.

The drivers aren't shackled to the platform though. They do have the ability to leave and find other work. Many left Uber and went to Lyft--who was better, for a while. Now even Lyft is tightening up. And since Lyft just IPO'd, and Uber is this week, both will be held accountable to shareholders which likely means further tightening.

What boggles my mind is both of these companies have issues with profitability, when their drivers bear the lion's share of burden. Sure, these companies run a "matchmaking" server, for customers and drivers, and payment processing, tracking, etc., but I'd think by now they'd be quite profitable given the increased take from their drivers. But truth is, both are pouring large amounts of money into self-driving tech--which is very smart from a management point of view, as once they eliminate the workers, they cut out a large cost.

Last summer, Lyft ran a test with Aptiv, a Delphi auto spinoff, who specializes in developing self-driving car technology. In Las Vegas, Nevada, they delivered 5000 passengers to their destination, safely, using robotic cabs. Pretty impressive. Vegas is flat, and a grid, but definitely prophetic of the future of cabs for hire.
Posted By: PanzerMeyer

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 04:23 PM

Eventually automated taxis and buses will happen but we're still quite a ways from getting there. Two big hurdles to contend with and resolve are the liability/insurance issue and the reliability/safety issue.
Posted By: Raw Kryptonite

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/08/19 04:39 PM

I didn't think these ride/food delivery services were ever meant to be a full time job...that's what taxis are for. Using your own vehicle for something like this isn't a good way to go. I learned that at 18 delivering pizza and having to buy tires, brakes, oil changes etc, not to mention the loss of value. I thought this was meant to be a "give someone a lift" every now and then kind of thing for a few extra bucks on your way out, or weekends. A great service for seniors.
Posted By: wheelsup_cavu

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/09/19 07:10 PM

Never is a long time but I can almost guarantee I will never be riding in a self driving car as long as I have my full set of faculties.


Wheels
Posted By: vonBaur

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/10/19 02:14 AM

With computer glitches, viruses, and hackers I have no confidence in a self-driving car. Glad I'm too old to have to worry about it.
Posted By: KraziKanuK

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/10/19 02:17 AM

Originally Posted by vonBaur
With computer glitches, viruses, and hackers I have no confidence in a self-driving car. Glad I'm too old to have to worry about it.


Lots of that in the gray matter as well.
Posted By: JimK

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/10/19 03:21 AM

Originally Posted by Mr_Blastman
F4--none of the drivers expect Uber and Lyft to be high-paying jobs. They only want to be treated fairly.

When a company pays you x, then gives you a 30% cut, then another 30% cut, and then another, etc., workers notice the drastic reduction in income. What irks the drivers even more, though, is how these companies haven't lowered their fare rates, and instituted policies forbidding cash tipping, so the company can swipe the tip money for themselves rather than pay it to the drivers.

Read up on what Uber in particular has done--pretty despicable in some instances.

The drivers aren't shackled to the platform though. They do have the ability to leave and find other work. Many left Uber and went to Lyft--who was better, for a while. Now even Lyft is tightening up. And since Lyft just IPO'd, and Uber is this week, both will be held accountable to shareholders which likely means further tightening.

What boggles my mind is both of these companies have issues with profitability, when their drivers bear the lion's share of burden. Sure, these companies run a "matchmaking" server, for customers and drivers, and payment processing, tracking, etc., but I'd think by now they'd be quite profitable given the increased take from their drivers. But truth is, both are pouring large amounts of money into self-driving tech--which is very smart from a management point of view, as once they eliminate the workers, they cut out a large cost.

Last summer, Lyft ran a test with Aptiv, a Delphi auto spinoff, who specializes in developing self-driving car technology. In Las Vegas, Nevada, they delivered 5000 passengers to their destination, safely, using robotic cabs. Pretty impressive.

Vegas is flat, and a grid, but definitely prophetic of the future of cabs for hire.


Its amazing they have anyone doing the job after getting robbed all the way around.
Posted By: LB4LB

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/10/19 03:35 AM

It was a good idea. It provided a service that people wanted, at a reasonable price. It also created many jobs that people could make extra cash with. Now how long did you think that was going to last until it was ruined.

Prediction: The service will now cost a lot more, and the drivers will make a lot less. But hey, the stock holders will be happy.
Posted By: vonBaur

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/10/19 04:15 AM

Originally Posted by KraziKanuK
Lots of that in the gray matter as well.

More gray matter outside my head than inside, these days I'm afraid.
Posted By: PanzerMeyer

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/10/19 10:57 AM

Strikes like these are only going to accelerate the progress towards autonomous cars.
Posted By: Top Gun

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/10/19 07:19 PM

Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Originally Posted by Mr_Blastman
Most don't consider it a career, though, and work these jobs to supplement their income. They'd likely be much better off mowing lawns.



That has not been my experience in Miami. The majority of the Uber/Lyft drivers I've met do it as their primary full time job. Miami may be unique though since there's such a high constant influx of low income/low skilled immigrants who find Uber/Lyft attractive since all you need is a car and a smartphone.


The 2 Uber/Lyft drivers we used in Vegas did it full time, 6 days a week. I think it depends where you live? If you live in a tourist hot spot then sure you can make a living out of it. You won't in Manchester NH and Boston is so against Uber/Lyft that I doubt they can down there either.
Posted By: LB4LB

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/10/19 08:25 PM

My niece and all of her friends that live and work in downtown Chicago rely heavily on Uber. Owning, driving, and paying for parking in that area makes owning a car into a major money pit. I think many young, urban professionals in almost every major city have come to "need" this service. I just hate to see a good business idea turned into just another racket.
Posted By: Haggart

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/10/19 08:38 PM

The Uber company is already losing investor's money on its IPO
Posted By: Dart

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/11/19 07:10 AM

Originally Posted by wheelsup_cavu
Never is a long time but I can almost guarantee I will never be riding in a self driving car as long as I have my full set of faculties.


Wheels


Exactly - once they get the autonomous car thing figured out we can go back to a good old fashioned pub crawl!

Saying "one more for the road" will no longer be an archaic saying!
Posted By: F4UDash4

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/11/19 11:43 AM

Originally Posted by Dart
Originally Posted by wheelsup_cavu
Never is a long time but I can almost guarantee I will never be riding in a self driving car as long as I have my full set of faculties.


Wheels


Exactly - once they get the autonomous car thing figured out we can go back to a good old fashioned pub crawl!

Saying "one more for the road" will no longer be an archaic saying!



Tesla is equipping it's cars for autonomous driving now, they're very close to making it work. And then Tesla owners can let their cars go out and earn extra bucks while they are doing other things, IE while they're working their full time job etc.
Posted By: Haggart

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/14/19 03:03 AM

Uber driver tries to kidnap female passengers
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/j...-passengers-2018-05-13?mod=mw_latestnews

lose the public confidence in their safety and a strike will become the least of their problems
Posted By: VF9_Longbow

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/14/19 08:57 AM

that's nonsense, have you looked at the number of safely completed uber and lyft trips compared to the number of problems experienced? it's like being worried about being hit by lightning on a clear day
Posted By: PanzerMeyer

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/14/19 10:31 AM

I will make an educated guess and say that many of the current Uber/Lyft drivers are people who would have originally been working in retail had that sector not been in a major contraction which has been going on several years now. That might explain the higher than expected number of people working for Lyft and Uber.
Posted By: vonBaur

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/14/19 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by VF9_Longbow
that's nonsense, have you looked at the number of safely completed uber and lyft trips compared to the number of problems experienced? it's like being worried about being hit by lightning on a clear day

Right. Just like people look at the hundreds or thousands of Boeing 737 Max8 flights that didn't end in crashes, or even experience any problems at all. Or the millions of rounds of ammunition fired every year in the USA by responsible people that hit nothing other than the inanimate targets at which they were aimed. The fact is that attention will always be focused on the rare events that are the exception because we humans seem to think that we're capable of eliminating all of them.

And that's not an indictment of government, political parties, or the media, so this should not raise PWEC concerns. It's something that each of us has within us. How many times has each of you fixed some problem only to have some overlooked detail come back to bite you in your (paratroop reference ahead) fourth point of contact?
Posted By: Haggart

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/14/19 03:47 PM

Originally Posted by vonBaur
Originally Posted by VF9_Longbow
that's nonsense, have you looked at the number of safely completed uber and lyft trips compared to the number of problems experienced? it's like being worried about being hit by lightning on a clear day

Right. Just like people look at the hundreds or thousands of Boeing 737 Max8 flights that didn't end in crashes, or even experience any problems at all. Or the millions of rounds of ammunition fired every year in the USA by responsible people that hit nothing other than the inanimate targets at which they were aimed. The fact is that attention will always be focused on the rare events that are the exception because we humans seem to think that we're capable of eliminating all of them.

And that's not an indictment of government, political parties, or the media, so this should not raise PWEC concerns. It's something that each of us has within us. How many times has each of you fixed some problem only to have some overlooked detail come back to bite you in your (paratroop reference ahead) fourth point of contact?



"A few bad apple spoils the bunch"

In the age of social media bad experiences make their way around quickly to millions of people and can and often does affect companies and how people (including how investors) react. Taxi services of coarse don't have a perfect record but perhaps if i had more confidence in Ubers ability to properly screen their drivers I'd be more likely to use them.
Posted By: vonBaur

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/14/19 06:27 PM

Social media only amplifies the issue, Haggart. It's long been a customer relations mantra that one unhappy customer will turn away 100 of his friends, but of 100 satisfied customers only one person will be referred.
Posted By: CyBerkut

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/14/19 10:54 PM

Originally Posted by vonBaur
Social media only amplifies the issue, Haggart. It's long been a customer relations mantra that one unhappy customer will turn away 100 of his friends, but of 100 satisfied customers only one person will be referred.


Sometimes. A lot of times, the kind of person who is inclined to be an unhappy customer does not have all that many friends. You know the type... the ones who treat wait staff at restaurants like crap, etc. Their associates know to discount their grumbling.
Posted By: Haggart

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/15/19 12:18 PM

Should the public be confident in Uber's ability to properly screen its new drivers ? NO

example Nov 2017

The man accused of killing eight people with a Home Depot truck in Manhattan on Tuesday in what authorities are calling an act of terrorism worked as an Uber and Lyft driver, the companies said.

most recent example May 2019

An Accused Somali War Criminal Is Working as an Uber and Lyft Driver (he came to the U.S. to escape the charges of atrocities he committed in Somalia including torture)

https://www.thedailybeast.com/an-ac...-driver-report?source=cheats&via=rss

https://www.cnn.com/2019/05/14/business/uber-driver-accused-war-criminal-invs/index.html



Posted By: F4UDash4

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/15/19 12:46 PM

There have been numerous traditional taxi drivers who were serial killers as well
Posted By: PanzerMeyer

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/15/19 12:58 PM

+1 F4U


Why are people suddenly worried about how well Uber/Lyft vets its potential drivers when that same concern didn't exist for the traditional taxi services?
Posted By: F4UDash4

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/15/19 12:59 PM

Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
+1 F4U


Why are people suddenly worried about how well Uber/Lyft vets its potential drivers when that same concern didn't exist for the traditional taxi services?



Because some people love to hate on "evil corporations".
Posted By: Haggart

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/15/19 01:20 PM

Because so often corporations put the almighty $ ahead of the public good/safety ...... Facebook and Craigslist come to mind as well
Posted By: LB4LB

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/15/19 02:49 PM

I've had a few cab rides in New York city that (IMHO) were borderline attempted murder. Total maniacs at the wheel. biggrin
Posted By: Haggart

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/15/19 06:59 PM

lol ! ..... try a Paris taxi for comparison
Posted By: Nixer

Re: Uber and Lyft Drivers to Go on Strike May 7th - 05/15/19 10:38 PM

I had a Palestinian Zealot cab driver at the Airport in New Orleans early one evening. He was ranting so bad, Israel/America... "Death to everybody" adda adda he was almost foaming at the mouth. blahblahblah

I told him I thought the Palestinians were getting a raw deal ( winkngrin ), and said I needed to stop somewhere for toiletries and cigarettes. I gave him $20 to "hold the cab" and disappeared. Only had about 15 hours in NOLA ( woot ) or I would have called the cops, Homeland Stupidity, and maybe even the Clinton Foundation on the guy.

Majority of my interactions have been good experiences with Uber recently and cabs in general in the past.
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