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Love My New Home Defense Weapon

Posted By: Haggart

Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 04:08 AM

http://www.armslist.com/posts/2105646/bi...ga--coach-gun--
(the one shown is a 20g but mine is 12g)
http://www.stoegerindustries.com/coach-guns-single-and-double-trigger-shotguns

Stoeger coachgun, two triggers, black stock, nickle plated, side x side

Bought 5 shot turkey load for good spread

I replaced the hard plastic recoil pad with a black rubber one

Even if you can't hit the side of a red barn you won't miss with this coachgun
Posted By: Richardg

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 05:22 AM

Nice piece. Get rid of the birdshot. Only use buckshot when your shooting two legged critters.
Posted By: Crane Hunter

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 06:45 AM

Number 4 buckshot is the minimum I'd go with, and even then only for across-the-room range.

I don't know about anyone else but I really like side-by-sides and over-and-unders, IMO they're the best shotgun you can have for those first two shots at any rate.
Posted By: RSColonel_131st

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 10:58 AM

Nice! I was considering something similar but they are like 500EUR up...
Posted By: Haggart

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 11:36 AM

thanks ! I have several co-workers who are ex-police and they recommended turkey shot to me instead of buckshot. I also was going to buy buckshot but they said i would get better spread with turkey shot and without necessarily killing them. Not disagreeing with any of you just saying that's what i was told.

But since its a double barrel i could always load 5 shot in one and buckshot in the other

biggrin
Posted By: Nixer

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 11:42 AM

LOL...just want to wing them. hahaha

Got news for you Hag, if you feel threatened enough to fire a shotgun at someone you had better kill them. Unless you are being attacked by Turkey Lives Matter Birds.
Posted By: Haggart

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 11:55 AM

found this article on the subject:

"I think No. 1 buckshot is the most efficient of loads for self-defense"

http://www.offthegridnews.com/self-defense/the-best-shotgun-ammo-for-home-defense/

reading
Posted By: Bill_Grant

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 12:50 PM

Federal Flight Control No. 1 Buckshot - The one to use for Self Defense.

At 20 yards, the Flight Control has a pattern no larger than a GOLF BALL.
Conversely, the 00 shot is in a 1 foot pattern.

Beyond that, it is not so great. But then, most people aren't going to shoot over 75' distances in their home.
Posted By: Bill_Grant

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 12:55 PM

Oh an Haggart, if you are shooting someone, it is never to wound. It is "to stop the threat."

A wounded person can still kill you.

I like to reference the man who broke into a house, and the lady he was trying to assault shot him 6 times point blank with a .38 while protecting herself and her kids in the attic.
He told her "Stop shooting me!" and then left the house. And was able to drive himself 2 miles before he collapsed and died from blood loss.

A guy attacking you with a knife still has 30 seconds after you collapse his lungs with a firearm.

Rethink your gameplan.
Posted By: Haggart

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 01:10 PM

Yea I'll use the small box of 5's i got at the outdoor range and I'll get the box you recommended, thanks Bill
Posted By: Airdrop01

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 01:51 PM

Originally Posted By: Bill_Grant
Federal Flight Control No. 1 Buckshot - The one to use for Self Defense.

At 20 yards, the Flight Control has a pattern no larger than a GOLF BALL.
Conversely, the 00 shot is in a 1 foot pattern.

Beyond that, it is not so great. But then, most people aren't going to shoot over 75' distances in their home.


I agree with all that. It just made me think of every argument I've ever had over loads with folks, or for that matter, practice distances with carry guns.

"Why are you shooting so close?"

"That's 12 yards. Here I'll move it to more realistic distance if that makes you happy."

"You moved it closer!"

"That's 7 yards. I dont know about you, but I'm pretty sure the average mugging/robbery/assault or anything where I'd be justified shooting anyone takes place a lot closer than 36'."
Posted By: VF9_Longbow

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 02:13 PM

A laser sight will do more to improve your odds of hitting the target than using birdshot or small buckshot ever will.

Magpul did a video on shotguns once and showed how even at close ranges there was no useful difference between buckshot and birdshot at close ranges. Might as well hit the guy with everything you can rather than pepper him with bb's he can pick out later.

Laser sight will make you hit the target every time. They are a good investment.
Posted By: Crane Hunter

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 09:22 PM

I'm not a big fan of the FliteControl buckshot out of a hunting context or a last resort for a shotgun that patterns horribly.

IMO you want something that starts to open up evenly at a range where a little margin for error starts to become welcome.

Granted, home defense distances are likely to be too close for that to happen with any buckshot, but if that's the case why use expensive FliteControl when even the cheapest stuff will do?

I'm also not convinced that a laser sight is needed on a shotgun unless maybe conditions are such that you can't see your gun well enough for a visual reference.

Lasers are distracting and shotguns using shot are meant to "pointed" moreso than aimed, as in once you properly mount it, it should shoot where you're looking at without having to worry too much about a sight picture.
Posted By: Master

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 09:40 PM

Originally Posted By: Nixer
LOL...just want to wing them. hahaha

Got news for you Hag, if you feel threatened enough to fire a shotgun at someone you had better kill them. Unless you are being attacked by Turkey Lives Matter Birds.


This was my first thought as well. You open yourself up to civil lawsuits if you dont shoot to kill. The reasoning is that you didnt feel your life was in danger else you would have used a gun that actually had a change to kill. So you specifically shot them to wound them instead of resolving the issue. (not saying that is right but thats the general thought behind it.)

SO... 10ga slugs it is!
Posted By: CyBerkut

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 10:42 PM

Originally Posted By: Master
Originally Posted By: Nixer
LOL...just want to wing them. hahaha

Got news for you Hag, if you feel threatened enough to fire a shotgun at someone you had better kill them. Unless you are being attacked by Turkey Lives Matter Birds.


This was my first thought as well. You open yourself up to civil lawsuits if you dont shoot to kill. The reasoning is that you didnt feel your life was in danger else you would have used a gun that actually had a change to kill. So you specifically shot them to wound them instead of resolving the issue. (not saying that is right but thats the general thought behind it.)

SO... 10ga slugs it is!


If you shoot a firearm at someone, you are looking at a possible civil suit regardless. The possible exception being in a state such as Florida that has a law protecting you from a civil suit if the shooting was determined to be justifiable self defense during a criminal investigation/trial.

Where intentionally shooting to wound (and letting it be known that was what you were attempting) opens a door that you don't want opened is in a criminal trial. You utilized potentially lethal force when (by implication) you apparently had not concluded that you were in danger of death or grave bodily injury.

Folks... when you are shooting in lawful self defense, you are not shooting to wound, and you are not shooting to kill. You are shooting to stop the threat of death or grave bodily injury. Burn that into your minds.

If the attacker happens to die as a result... well, the attacker should have made a better choice.
Posted By: Master

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/26/16 11:38 PM

Also dont make any trigger modifications to your defense weapon. They can use that as intent to shoot without the need for stopping a threat. Because why else would you make it "fun" to shoot unless you meant to use that fun to kill people. (what a #%&*$# up world we live in...)

but... Really nice gun! Made me spend about an hour looking at various coach guns and saying to myself, "no, you really dont need one of those."
Posted By: Peally

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/27/16 02:56 PM

Birdshot? You're safer just not having a shotgun in the house.
Posted By: VF9_Longbow

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/27/16 03:28 PM

i dunno, maybe it depends on each person, but in the tests i did i was consistently more accurate (though maybe slightly slower) with the laser than without it.

the test i did was to run 1KM as fast as i could, uphill, get the shotgun off my back, spin around a few times with my eyes closed then take a shot at a target i had set up on a tree.

maybe it sounds ridiculous but i think that the extreme heart pounding and the dizziness simulate a massive adrenaline dump fairly well. it was also freezing cold when i did this, without gloves, so i figure i lost a lot of finger dexterity as well. without the laser i had a lot more shots hitting the fringes of the target rather than the center of it. with the laser i don't think i missed even one time.

laser also has the benefit of letting you fire from the hip rather than through the sights. even at close range without sighting a target, a hit is not a guarantee - someone at the end of a hallway is just small enough to be missed by a panicky quick shot. just my opinion tho!

Originally Posted By: Crane Hunter
I'm not a big fan of the FliteControl buckshot out of a hunting context or a last resort for a shotgun that patterns horribly.

IMO you want something that starts to open up evenly at a range where a little margin for error starts to become welcome.

Granted, home defense distances are likely to be too close for that to happen with any buckshot, but if that's the case why use expensive FliteControl when even the cheapest stuff will do?

I'm also not convinced that a laser sight is needed on a shotgun unless maybe conditions are such that you can't see your gun well enough for a visual reference.

Lasers are distracting and shotguns using shot are meant to "pointed" moreso than aimed, as in once you properly mount it, it should shoot where you're looking at without having to worry too much about a sight picture.
Posted By: Peally

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/27/16 03:50 PM

The gun industry is highly dependent on selling things people think they need (like any sporting industry) so if it looks cool to you more power to you. That being said to rely on it as your primary aiming method is to use a crutch to make up for a lack of skill, plain and simple.
Posted By: Murphy

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/27/16 04:06 PM

Originally Posted By: Peally
The gun industry is highly dependent on selling things people think they need .....(edit).


Yep, I'm sure we all have those type of weapons..... wink

As for the 'coach gun'....I would have preferred it with 18" bbls.
20" just seems an odd length, to me. Too long to move around, and too short for distance.
18" would be a nice length for close up, for me.
I've hit several bears with rubber sabots at well over 25 yds with an 18" pump.

Isn't the standard 'coach gun' equipped with 18" barrels.


Posted By: Haggart

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/27/16 04:44 PM

Murphy for you I recommend a shotgun with a 32" barrel and a long knife duck-tapped to the end of it to poke at the bears if they get too close

biggrin

I love my coach gun ...it's "purty" and its only intended for in-house use as far as I'm concerned and I am pretty sure that if a few bad guys see those shiny, nickle-plated, double barrels pointed in their faces that they will run over each other trying to get out of the house without asking each other if he was pointing an 18" barrel or a 20"
Posted By: Crane Hunter

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/27/16 06:32 PM

Originally Posted By: VF9_Longbow
i dunno, maybe it depends on each person, but in the tests i did i was consistently more accurate (though maybe slightly slower) with the laser than without it.

the test i did was to run 1KM as fast as i could, uphill, get the shotgun off my back, spin around a few times with my eyes closed then take a shot at a target i had set up on a tree.

maybe it sounds ridiculous but i think that the extreme heart pounding and the dizziness simulate a massive adrenaline dump fairly well. it was also freezing cold when i did this, without gloves, so i figure i lost a lot of finger dexterity as well. without the laser i had a lot more shots hitting the fringes of the target rather than the center of it. with the laser i don't think i missed even one time.

laser also has the benefit of letting you fire from the hip rather than through the sights. even at close range without sighting a target, a hit is not a guarantee - someone at the end of a hallway is just small enough to be missed by a panicky quick shot. just my opinion tho!


If you're not used to shooting a shotgun it may be of some use, but outside of certain specific situations, like having to immediately clear a dark interior area after being in bright sunlight, I've never seen lasers being recommended by tactical shotgun instructors.

Once you get the basics down, it's the most intuitive and fastest firearm type there is, within its rather short effective range of course.

Check out this guy:





Murph, one of the nice things about a double is that their receivers are shorter than that of most pumps and autoloaders, so you end up with a shorter overall length for a given barrel length. IMO, 20" bbls are perfectly fine on a "coach gun". Speaking of coach gun, the term dates back to the Old West, when the security guard who rode "shotgun" on stage coaches carried a gun of that configuration.
Posted By: Murphy

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/27/16 06:39 PM

Yep, it's 'purdy'.

The 2" would just be so you can swing it around easier, but whatever you like is what counts.
Just hope you don't have to 'go into action' with it.
Nobody wants that. wink

I had a blue steel 18" double barrel. I was a rookie when I bought it, and a year later they wouldn't let us carry them in the car anymore, so I sold to a guy who worked homicide.
He....had an.....'accidental discharge' with it. Long story.

But I sure wish I'd have kept that thing.
No triggers though, but a mean machine. wink

The one thing I can say....I'm sorry I ever sold any weapon I've ever owned.
Never should have sold any of them.
Financial and otherwise, it was a mistake.

KEEP 'EM ALL!!!! ...... lol....



Edit;
BTW....Crane, that's where I got the 18" from. Most of the ones on the stage coaches were...18".
In the states the overall length has to be at least 28" for a shot gun.
But that makes the perfect length for the bbl....18". Anything longer, is just extra as far as I'm concerned biggrin




Posted By: Crane Hunter

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/27/16 07:10 PM

I don't find a big difference in handiness unless you start getting well into "NFA" barrel lengths, like 14" or less.

That's short enough where the shouldered gun sticks out about the same distance a handgun would with the arm extended, and when you can take it sideways through a standard sized doorway without having to angle it much.

Trouble is, when they're that short they're very "blasty", especially in closed spaces, even with full hearing protection its a shock to the system.
Posted By: Haggart

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 10/27/16 08:06 PM

Murphy ...
"The one thing I can say....I'm sorry I ever sold any weapon I've ever owned.
Never should have sold any of them.
Financial and otherwise, it was a mistake.

KEEP 'EM ALL!!!! ...... lol...."

so darn true .... 40 years ago i sold my dad's Army .45 ...... oh Murph, wish you hadn't even reminded me

nope
Posted By: Comrade_Hedgehog

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 11/01/16 04:33 PM

Stoeger??

Who the f**k are they?
No, Haggart if you want a SBS shotgun go old school:

http://www.purdey.com/guns-rifles/hammer-guns/

or

https://www.hollandandholland.com/gun-room/royal-side-side-shotgun/
(They have a show room in Dallas)

That way you blind them with majesty as well as muzzle blast.

:P
Posted By: Wklink

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 11/02/16 12:46 AM

Nice shotgun.

Not a personal fan of shotguns for home defense. Too bulky in an enclosed room, in the dark when you don't know what is on the other side of the wall. That sound of racking a round though, definitely gets some attention.
Posted By: Haggart

Re: Love My New Home Defense Weapon - 11/02/16 11:16 AM

thanks Tom - i call it my "feel good" weapon, because as has already been pointed out here by others, shotguns can have a strong "deterrent" affect. In any case, its now 1 of 3 firearms i have in different living areas of the house.
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