There once was a time...

Where SimHQ would be the place to be for E3 News and current events related. But alas, it seems those are days gone by.

I'm with you brother... even if you can't go... have a small team of people to post news and info, or sharing it from other sites would suffice... I'm afraid SimHQ as we knew and loved it is gone... oh well all good things must come to a end. I was actually going to post some stuff, but their 1 MB pic limit made it too much work. So I shared at Mudspikes.

I agree, too many quality members have left

All websites have some of their long time members leave after a while but what worries me is the lack of new people.

Indeed Panzer,you are correct. Although I don't frequent all of SimHQ I do tend to try to work through all the new posts and it's very rare I come across a new 'introduction' post. I think the most we get is in the DCS section which as we all know can get quite lively down there

Is it just a decline in people that are interested in flight sims or something else? Did we lose members when the racing section departed? I never go there,how active is it?

More importantly,is there anything that could be done to improve the situation?

That's a good question. Several long time members did indeed leave after the website changed ownership but I think overall the number of people who post stuff on message boards is declining while the number of people who post stuff on social media is increasing exponentially. Essentially, people are abandoning the traditional message boards/forums and going to Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, etc.

Yep, it's just us dinosaurs left.
Imo PhotoBucket's change in their ToS is another casualty of this migration from forums to other social media platforms.


Alexa Rankings for both SimHQ sites.
SimHQ: http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/simhq.com
SimHQ Motorsports http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/simhqmotorsports.com

SimHQ is trending downward for the most part and SimHQ Motorsports does not have enough traffic to be trended.


Wheels

Thanks for posting those Alexa links. There's some fascinating stuff in there.

I've also noticed that traffic at IMDB took a hit after the message boards were discontinued.

This makes no sense. No one is forced to go to PWEC and post there and it's not like posts made in PWEC are transferred over to Community Hall or any other forum. So in other words, if someone hates politics and doesn't want to discuss it on SimHQ, they can very easily avoid it by simply not going to PWEC. I also find it amusing how you try to conceal your obvious political bias.


Oh, and if you go purely by post count, Community Hall is significantly busier than PWEC so you may want to do your research first before posting a claim like that.

I agree with dcredence's assessment.

It's not an easy pill to swallow but the statistics show it to be true. PWEC was a bad idea to reopen here, however interesting it may be. SimHQ has turned into a veritable old boys club for people who like the Republican Party. I think that has turned off a lot of members who are left wing or center or just apolitical.

More after action reports etc. would probably start getting more traffic here. It is very effective. I recently bought DayZ after years on the fence, simply because someone posted up their "Jenny Wing" AAR.

Again, no political discussion is allowed on any forums outside of PWEC so it is easily avoidable for members who don't want politics.


Now, if you are saying some members left the site because it upsets them that the majority of members of SimHQ are right leaning then that's their problem. Tough.

It may be tough but it has also resulted in the shrinking of this forum. Nobody still using this forum benefits from an "Us vs Them" mentality as there are plenty, PLENTY of other choices to choose from.

I'm sure those people will find PLENTY of European based simulation sites where the majority of the members are left-leaning so they'll feel right at home.

IMHO, if someone quits visiting a message board simply because the majority of people there don't mesh with their own personal politics then that is a sign of immaturity.

I think the issue is that the moderation and writing staff has gravitated towards the right wing which has alienated a lot of members, not only from Europe. I can imagine they feel smothered.

I think SimHQ could do with a big facelift and should be looking for new writers who can put out a lot of high quality content using the sims people are playing a lot these days.

The recent release of Cold Waters was a huge opportunity to grab the Naval sim crowd but the Naval forum is nearly empty, and even in there, it's full of politics and personal battles.

Back when I was a Moderator here, it was a requirement to write no less than one article per quarter. If we did not write an article, stay on top of our fourms assigned, participate in forum discussions... we were no longer kept on as Moderators. As for my situation, I quit being a Moderator. Not because I couldn't handle being a Moderator, but, at the time (after SimHQ changed hands) there was far less content worthy of the SimHQ quality formally seen being produced. Things had changed in article format and the "approval" of said article. I was doing what I could to keep abreast of all things sim related as well controllers... Not all that easy to say the least. I don't play in the PWEC (typically), as PM implies, if you're not into that crap, stay outa the swamp. Me, I voted for the current SECDEF.

A few comments:

I've been visiting SIMHQ since the late 1990's--not posting too much though.

Back then, the forums were filled with crazy but fun to read people. Now not so much.

The forums were also a go to place for PC hardware news, flight sim news and discussion, and even the site front page was pretty good for getting some info.

Now I only give a quick visit to Community Hall and the flight-controller sub-forum--the latter of which is mostly dead. Community Hall rarely has threads that interest me to even read. No offence, but its an old man's forum in there now.

Since the early 2000's there have just been a constant increase in websites that are just more lively, and frankly, better at providing information than what I used to come to SIMHQ for. There has also been a dwindling in the variety of sims and sim related product (flight sims at least which I think made the core of the site in the past). Nothing really new to discuss. Plus the developers host sites that are far better for people to visit who are actually interested in a particular sim (i.e. IL-2 BOS, BOM series, ATAG, DCS home forums). What ends up here is just rehashed news from those sites with no discussion--it occurs at the site of origin.

I am not sure I buy the politics induced theory of SIMHQ decline. It is easy enough to ignore. I simply point to other sites out-competing this one in terms of content that attracts membership.

Good post Pugio.


Yes, the fundamental core problem is that the site is simply not attracting new blood. Like you mentioned, it is mostly due to a combination of the reduced overall interest in flight sims and the fact that the developer specific websites usually offer better discussion and information.

"Back then, the forums were filled with crazy but fun to read people. Now not so much."

Remember Ming? One of my favorites.
I can't speculate as to why traffic has slowed down, here. I only know that, for myself, I stopped coming because I stopped simming. And yeah...it has gotten a little less fun.

What's interesting is that quite a few people who still post frequently on SimHQ have also largely stopped playing flight sims. I still fly them but I hardly ever visit flight sim specific forums simply because I have no questions to ask.

Yeah, I've started coming back again but I find myself up in the general conversation area most of the time.

Quite often these days I find that even after reading the forums for two or three hours I can't find a topic where I have anything to contribute.


Wheels

I still post here to get expert opinions from the "old" members. Where else could I go to? What other forums can I go to for flight sim stuff?

They're out there. For the most part I'm flying FSXSE and Prepar3D now. Too big a PITA to maintain and fly DCS, although I do own several aircraft as well v2.0 (still in beta).

Back in the day, with the weekend that just passed, we would have wall-to-wall coverage of E3 and the just-completed FlightSim Expo 2018. But, I guess people are more interested in talking about Fallout, weight loss, and stock tips.

This site ain't what it used to be at all.

Well, I have a suggestion...

The members could all agree (unless SimHQ wants to enforce it) that for a set amount of time (say...3 months?) that there'll be no OT, only discussions related to gaming and simming. Just see where it goes, it doesn't *have* to be a permanent condition. The site will either become more active (and I think some believe that it will) or less active, in which case the OT stuff can be allowed to continue.

Weird idea coming from me, I know. But I'd respect it (assuming I'd have the choice).

I want the credit if this idea takes off.

EDIT: Anything military should still be allowed, as most sims are military related.

"Community Hall" has always been a forum where discussion about any topic (except PWEC stuff) is allowed. Nothing has changed as far as that forum goes for the past 18 years or so.

Concerning the E3 coverage, Luke makes a very valid point and my only answer to that is that it's simply not a priority under the current website management. Online forums change over time and sometimes they change a lot. It's just the way it goes.

Almost minute by minute. I miss those days... Hell, the front page hasn't changed in almost a year! (July 2017)

We have great ads though.

I certainly need to know how to end my menstrual cramps forever! A real life saver

I actually shut of my ad-blocker for a few minutes to see what this wonderful ad-machine would serve up for me.

Even though my cramps are gone forever, I flipped ad-block back on.

Oh, and now OVER a year since the front page has changed. Think back to all the great free articles we were given. Not always super professional, but most always HONEST.

Oh...and we had BABES!

Why is that so scary?

Old guys aren't allowed babes, it's bad for the ticker.


Wheels

I've read the opposite! That in fact sex is very healthy for the heart. It's a good cardio workout!

I once wanted to post his/her heart-rate monitor results (no narrative whatsoever, just the numbers) and was told no.

Sex is VERY heart healthy, also confirmed by a cardiologist.

I'm open for contributions for the home page/blog/articles, it's very easy to add articles and publish. I'm even open to compensating for them and I have asked a few times.

Could you pin something to the top of the forums stating that Racer? I'm thinking that perhaps not too many pop into this section.

I have contributed. When it was mandatory for moderators/admins. It doesn't seem to be the case, anymore.

Near necro.

Simhq was thriving when i pulled in here in late 2001. Most of why it is like it is now has already been posted above. The Q moves a lot slower now compared to when i could spend hours flying with a bunch of members here and simhq open in the background to keep up. It does seem more old boys club now than then but more because a lot of the core is still here and no new blood has been injected. The silly fun vibe that a lot of forums had has mostly gone, people like Ming, Fearless Frog, Beach and others long gone all added a ton of much needed silliness and humour.

Guod was awesome and definitely kept the ship on a even and fast spirited keel, but you can't hang around forever. Of course it wasn't just Guod, it was a lot of members contributing to make simhq what it was. Pwec, meh, not a fan and i can see why people don't like it. You get a different look in at members and some of it is pretty bleh and can skew your view of what you thought they were like. Like Panzer said, you can avoid it but it does hang down there like a smelly old ball sack I do pop in there every now and again and overall, it really is fairly tame.

My main news/games/music/space etc site changed to reddit years ago.much more open and fresh and obviously tons more content. If you want real political craziness, that's the place! Easy to use, always pumping and thousands of niche subs. Very different from here though, much more youthful and vibrant, i know that isn't everyones favourite dish. Here is comfortable though and, what's the word, stable maybe. It's like having a mad busy day and then coming home and putting your feet up. Reddit is like opening your door and the world falls in, same as pwec, easy enough to close the door on what doesn't interest one.

It is sort of crazy though still seeing so many of the same people here after 17 years, we are all getting old together despite coming from different coubtries, backgrounds and beliefs. Overall i think it's a very cool and down to earth community and i'm glad i stumbled on it when i opened my EAW disc and it had a link to simhq.

Wish it wasn't so #%&*$# slow sometimes and the lack of front page is s bit disheartning.

I just discovered or rediscovered this forum. Perhaps I forgot it was here. I enjoy reading your posts though about the days when things were more active. I remember all those many and varied articles by BeachAV8tr. I miss seeing comments from 20mm and so forth. There's many folks who are spoken fondly of that I never "knew" but I've been here since 2005 and I feel that's its been a good online home for me. I post here more than I have ever done anywhere else ever. I detest Facebook and am close to divorcing it and would much rather communicate with people in a place like this. We don't always get along but that's why we have folks here with a hard job doing their best to keep the peace. My earliest PM message is a short interaction with USAFMTL where he emailed me an edited HUD .ini for one of the Thirdwire games. I have some other early ones with questions about FS2004. One of the coolest PM and SIMHQ interactions I had was when a member named Kramer sent me, free a charge, a large box full of FS2004 addons such as commercial scenery packs, the major C-130 addon and the F-117 along with other games. I already owned it but there was a copy of Project IGI in there too. A really nice fellow who did and extremely nice thing. I've tried to do similar things over the years and its always and pleasure and joy to do so. In around 2009-10 I was finally able to buy a new PC after having been without one for some years. Some of the first games I bought were things that I had longingly watch come out during that time I had no gaming PC. Those included Silent Hunter 4 and Crysis and I bought those from fellow SimHQ friend PanzerMeyer.

I don't know if there is a way to find out, but I'm thinking there may be lots of PMs that have gone missing on me which makes me sad. I know you can only have apparently 10 pages and 100 PMs at a time but I'm quite certain I have had other conversations that I know longer see there. For example, I also have a delightful and fairly long PM exchange I believe with LukeFF about Akella's age of sail games and at the time, the upcoming City of Abandoned Ships game. I also miss my interactions with MaceUK. I'm still friended with him on Steam but I no longer know if its the same gentleman as I remember once Mace talking about selling his Steam account. In the past few years I was fortunate to have "met" and interacted with Murphy and quickly learned of the truly good man and gentleman he was. I miss seeing posts from folks like JediMaster. I'm still friended with him on Steam but I don't know Jedi like you Panzer but I enjoyed many of his responses. I did not know him well but I have a beautiful PM or forum post somewhere(I hope its still there)from PositiveG where he indeed made an encouraging post. I think this was way early on in my joining SimHQ and I was timid in asking questions, probably feeling silly and nervous that my questions weren't worthy of the kind of clientele I figured occupied this fascinating place. He just kindly said something to the effect of, "No worries Coot. There are no dumb questions, only dumb answers." I also have a lengthy PM conversation with Jeevz who helped me set up my Xbox 360 ethernet and Xbox Live Gamertag.

There's some really cool memories in there and all of them SimHQ related. I know its been a bumpy road at times but I sure have appreciated this place and most members over the years. Its been very helpful and entertaining. I do miss how busy it was at times but mainly because I don't want SimHQ to feel like a ghost town. But I also don't like seeing people act almost contemptuous over how slow its gotten. I've seen a few comments that just baffle me. Its not one person's fault so I don't see how people can be that angry and scornful for no good reason. I sure wish simming was still like or would return to the level of the 90s. Maybe it will someday but until then we can just do the best we can with what we have.

I've been wanting to do another Hidden and Dangerous 2 AAR and I was amazed to see that the first one I did was from almost a decade ago! I did not realize it had been that long. Speaking of AARs, what if an AAR would be chosen to headline the "Current News" heading at the top of the main page that could air every month or so so that there would be some noticeable activity? At the same time it might remind people to head in there and maybe even start participating.

Great post Coot.

Look, people come and go with message boards all the time. It’s a completely normal thing.

What has concerned me is the failure of the site to attract any new members but I think that largely has to do with the simulation genre. It’s become much more of a niche genre over time. How many people do we know who are under 30 who play hardcore flight and naval sims?

FWIW, at some point after RacerGT instituted an approval process for new members (to combat the spam attacks), I started handling most of that. We probably average somewhere between 1 and 2 new members added each calendar day. Now, how active they get with posting... I don't see a high amount of activity from them, but then I don't really watch for that, and there are a LOT of forums on here that I don't visit regularly.

The online world has changed a lot from the earlier days of SimHQ. The rise of Facebook, Steam, Reddit, YouTube, etc. has introduced a lot of other places to go. Change is inevitable. One value that SimHQ can provide is a forum where users can speak frankly about product lines in a way that vendors (understandably) usually do not allow upon their own forums. Seeing the discontent that exists for some product lines is not everybody's cup of tea, but it can serve the sim'ing community, and I believe it has.

It is entirely understandable that folks miss the articles from previous times. As RacerGT has indicated, he would be glad to host new articles if people want to write them.

I was thinking, we could always do a classy babes thread that wouldn't break the rules. Maybe include a fetish...

Its good to hear that articles are desired and encouraged. There may be a lull for now but I imagine some intrepid souls will come along and create some. I still think it could be kind of cool if an AAR is posted from time to time on the main page header to show activity as well as to get people to dig in to that and other forums more. Maybe even have a "legacy" article pulled up once a month or so to give people some nostalgia while at the same time others who never saw them in the first place to see them and maybe even stoke interest in members to get back into older sims they may have put away.

I agree with the AAR idea been following dbonds excellent AAR on War in the East and Now war in the West ,,Would give new members or even older ones a chance to learn the ins and outs of a new game ,,I've learned a lot reading some of the AAr's just can't see the screen shots to well,,but was prompted to dig out War in The Pacific Admirals Edition That's been on the shelf a few years

I still pop in here once or twice a week, just to skim over things incase something intresting catches my eye.
I still do stuff for the Strike Fighters2 series but no longer post screenshots since the Photobucket changes, is there a way to directly upload from my pc ?

"Back in the day" we had multiple shall we say current/newish flight sims all with a fairly heavy user base but there's nothing REALLY new anymore, nothing to get us all excited about the same sim, instead we've become a very fragmented bunch who all have our favourite eras and stick to them be it the TW stuff, IL2 based, CFS3/FSX etc etc.

The lack of proper new sims is not helping the current situation here or at many other boards in my view.

Time to post this again for any young newcomers...

The Computer Chronicles - Flight Simulators (1990)...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tm8VTZ2fyos

Yup, flight sims were once that popular, and stayed that way for another decade after this show aired.

Flight sims have gone through the same path as rock music. Both were firmly in the mainstream in the past but now are only appreciated by relatively small niche groups.

Just take a look at the current Billboard Top 40 and tell me how many rock songs you see.

Not a single song or artist I would waste my time to sample.
https://www.billboard.com/charts/pop-songs


Wheels

Rock music (like Big Band, Doo-wop, Disco, New Wave, and all that has come before) has had its day and the world has moved on. I'm cool with that because...

1. Nothing released today could ever match what I already have anyway, IMO.
2. I stopped listening to radio (or equivalent, whatever that might be) for new music a long time ago, although I occasionally listen to Classic Rock and 80's Pop/Rock radio when driving my parent's car.
3. There's never a shortage of live Rock for me to enjoy, even if it's 'oldies', cover or tribute acts. The shows are usually local, substantially cheaper and far more pleasurable to attend (no real crowds or traffic).
4. Rejecting current trends, lifestyle and culture (including music) doesn't make me feel old at all, quite the contrary. Trying to accept it and somehow fit in would probably make me feel older.

I don't even try to compare old and new music anymore because to me it's irrelevant.

New Rock music still exists as a genre BUT it went from being mainstream to being underground or "indie" if you will.

I usually give New Rock a listen whenever someone provides an example that Rock isn't really dead. IMO, it is in current culture, or it's morphed into something that I'm not interested in.

But that's ok, as long as the Rock that I listen to is still being played live everywhere. For example, I have a 5k on Saturday in downtown Baton Rouge and I have no doubt that the band, as always, will be covering the Rock that I listen to (70's and 80's).

Walking the crowded streets of downtown Nashville on a Friday at midnight back in April, live Classic Rock (Journey, Foreigner, Eagles, Van Halen, Bon Jovi) being played everywhere. Like a candy store, wish we could have hung out for a while. Classic Rock is far from dead, as long as people keep gathering to hear it.

That's the thing though, If new fans of classic rock don't arise then it will eventually die out as its last remaining old fans die off as well.


Opera is currently on the same course.

College-age kids know good music when they hear it (Varsity Theatre at LSU)...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lU9Mj11fkk

It's very common at the shows I attend, to see ages 21+ in the crowd having fun (same with ZoSo, Led Zeppelin tribute). That's probably not the case with Opera.

Well, here's a bit of news...

Air and Space Museum

Have you seen the GameFaqs message boards lately? A decade ago, it was sprawling with activity. A popular game could easily get 30 thread refreshes per hour. Nowadays, they're pretty much dead. Even NeoGAF had a steady year-on-year loss of traffic, well before it went down.

Reddit, Steam Forums, Twitch and Discord is where the youngcrowd talks about games, and there are some VERY active DCS Discords out there, with 20 to 30 posts an hour easily. Subsim.com is also still going strong, with a high "refresh" rate of people. But that is mostly due to the incredible mods that are there, and people having trouble with getting it all set up.

However, I do see a common tendency among all forums I visit, and not only the gaming ones: People that belong to the core of any forums these days are all 40+ years of age, have been on that forum for many years, and that forum is one of their main hobbies and pillars of online social activity.

The "why" is quite simple in my view.
Before Facebook, Youtube and Steam broke through to mainstream a decade ago, the main hubs of online social activity were forums and instant messaging programs like MSN and ICQ. The latter being mostly used (at least in my environment) by people you already knew, and forums were used for people to talk about shared interests. However, the hobbies and interests of young people change overtime, and so do the crowds they visit. Adults which are settled come from work and check on their family and friends. They're not really looking for a new crowd because they're happy where they are. They have a place where they can talk about their hobby, know the people on the board for a long time and have a good time along the way. The social relations of young people tend to fade away quite quickly while they are still developing themselves into adulthood, and they are much quicker to pick up new things like Facebook, Steam, Instagram, Discord, Twitch, etc... So all the new influx of simmers go the new media, while the adolescent simmers have mostly changed where they post for news and chat, and keep forums around for mods and other archival stuff.

So while all the younger gamers have transferred over to those new media, the message boards and gaming sites are mostly visited by the ol' captains. This is just how things go, just how mailed letters are the stuff of 80-year olds, while the younger lot uses e-mail.

And fun fact:
Sim games attract the same amount of crowd as they always have, according to multiple sim devs. It is just that the expected standards have grown, which pressure profit margins. Thats why fewer games come out, even though the cake is as large as ever (or even larger, with the rise of the middle-class in asia and all that.)

That's a great post Vaderini. I think it's perfectly on target.

I had no idea there were other places as mentioned, although I'm not interested in them myself. But I'm surprised there's as much or more interest in flight sims today, if only from my anecdotal experience...

Why am I here? See attached pic below (my apartment in 1990/91 during the Gulf War...remember when speakers were bigger than the screen? ).

I'm here because I was fascinated by the aircraft and FLIR/LGB footage they kept showing on CNN. I was fascinated by all the aircraft shows of the day, from Discovery Wings to Dogfights, and even Modern Marvels. I would drive out to Dobbins AFB (Marietta, GA) and watch the bustling activity from the end of the runway when Desert Shield/Storm started (mainly F-15s and large cargo planes). Not to mention that I grew up on Firefox, Blue Thunder, Airwolf and Black Sheep.

All of this resulted in purchasing my first flight sim from CompUSA, Microprose's F-117A Stealth Fighter 2.0. I was hooked because I wanted to play out what I was seeing constantly on television, and the captions on that big heavy beautiful box looked promising (the F-19 developers made sure to add a FLIR screen and Iraqi theater for F-117A).

During Desert Storm I was 23. So what inspires kids and young adults today to want to play flight sims?

Er...um...ah....I'll get back to you on that.

And then you open that big beautiful box, carefully placing the thick heavy manual to the side as you unfold a theater map or two.

Then you start the game...



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFg-EZ19_Z8




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8Ul5EoX4Tw




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVWXLepgPJQ




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJ62hh0a9U4

^ Forgot my favorite, and one from the DOS era...



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBG3E5RHoGg

Imagine after all the CNN/Discovery Desert Storm footage, seeing this intro as you crank up your very first flight sim (while being one of the few who owned a PC powerful enough to run it smoothly...a 486DX2/66 was a big deal then).

I was blown away.

Never had F117 but it would have been right up my alley at the time. Could you see kids sitting through a two minute start up scenario these days though?


Wheels

Absolutely not for about 98% of them.


I don't blame the current day kids entirely though for that. Today there are so many more different forms of entertainment competing for the consumer's time compared to even the 1990's that any kind of game that requires a significant time investment in order to learn how to play gets pushed aside. We also cannot underestimate how mobile gaming has changed the market.

F117A was a relatively 'brisk' start-up, at least on a 1991 386/387.

My daughter cannot comprehend waiting 15 minutes for a game to load off of cassette tape (with the still evocative warbling, of the loading process)... or a screen made of 40x30 8*8 cells in 16 colours (hackable to 16 on each 'row' of cells). Ah. The 'Joys' of the original rubber keyboard ZX48.

That said she does play games - while my ex can't see why anyone would want to... but then watches wall-wall 'true crime' and 'reality' TV shows and reads crappy novels.

Never in a million years did I think the day would come when my posting activity on Facebook would exceed my posting activity on SimHQ but that happened about one year ago.

Seems like your ex doesn't comprehend the concept that personal preferences in entertainment are highly subjective.

SimHQ needs to being back the cool swag so that I can replace the cap I lost in NYC. Also, I want a black v-collared shirt like the one my wife picked out...

I have been back to SimHQ more in the last couple of weeks since knee surgery but only because I am kinda burned out on Arma 3 at the moment and am considering buying a set of rudder pedals for my Warthog that is sitting collecting dust so I can boot up DCS and get some F-14 Tom/Bombcat time. Other than that I have been a nearly 100% Arma gamer for the last few years and have only stepped off of the curb to check SimHQ as a lurker a couple of times a month.