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Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim?

Posted By: Swordsman

Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/25/15 11:30 PM

We all know that Russians have a huge tank fetish, but come on.

How about a decent dynamic campaign instead?
Posted By: TychosElk

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/26/15 12:34 AM

One has been something the developers have worked on on and off for some time when they have spare capacity. The other one isn't. And how exactly do you propose they do it 'instead'? I don't think they've got a time machine...
Posted By: Johnny_Redd

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/26/15 01:46 AM

Originally Posted By: Swordsman
We all know that Russians have a huge tank fetish, but come on.

How about a decent dynamic campaign instead?

Yep. Unfortunately the devs have left the SP aspect for 3rd parties to try and rescue. While they put their limited resources into mouse control and tanks. Mind boggling for a flight game right?
Posted By: Hooves

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/26/15 04:07 AM

OK, that's enough disinformation

They have had Tanks control and Mouse aim sitting on the shelf for some time (years). The members of the team responsible for this content ARE NOT the ones making any SP or mission content for the game. It is a bonus that was able to be leveraged for little no extra effort on the part of the dev team. The Official forums have all the info you need to know on this.
Posted By: Veteran66

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/26/15 05:10 AM

here a Panzer Mission:


Panzer_Marsch1 Download_from_www.mission4today.com

PanzerMarsch1b.rar



The tank battle of Kalatsch

The 6th army attacked the Russian troops west of Kalatsch in the morning of August, 7th 1942. to encircle them in a cauldron battle.
Already in the evening the pocket could be closed to the west of the Don river by the 16th tank division to the north and by the 24th tank division to the south.

Today, August, 8th, our tank forces continue the attack on the encircled Russian troops.
Posted By: Sokol1

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/26/15 03:02 PM

Because tanks is... fun.

biggrin
Posted By: Swordsman

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/26/15 07:31 PM

Originally Posted By: TychosElk
One has been something the developers have worked on on and off for some time when they have spare capacity. The other one isn't. And how exactly do you propose they do it 'instead'? I don't think they've got a time machine...


What do I propose? Look no further than Falcon 4 for an example of how the put together
a dynamic campaign.
Posted By: Bearcat99

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/26/15 07:37 PM

Originally Posted By: Hooves
OK, that's enough disinformation

They have had Tanks control and Mouse aim sitting on the shelf for some time (years). The members of the team responsible for this content ARE NOT the ones making any SP or mission content for the game. It is a bonus that was able to be leveraged for little no extra effort on the part of the dev team. [b]The Official forums have all the info you need to know on this. [/b]


For sure.
Posted By: Dakpilot

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/26/15 11:32 PM

Correct me if I am wrong but Falcon 4 seems to have the type of dynamic campaign that many desire, however. as has been said, it was in development for a very long time, 7 years to work properly? so much so, that it brought the company to its knees, not what could be called a commercial success, and was a disaster on initial release, perhaps not the best example to wish to emulate...

Cheers Dakpilot
Posted By: komemiute

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/26/15 11:34 PM

Originally Posted By: Dakpilot
Correct me if I am wrong but Falcon 4 seems to have the type of dynamic campaign that many desire, however. as has been said, it was in development for a very long time, 7 years to work properly? so much so, that it brought the company to its knees, not what could be called a commercial success, and was a disaster on initial release, perhaps not the best example to wish to emulate...

Cheers Dakpilot



So essentially it was pointless to continue the Space program after Apollo 13?
Posted By: TychosElk

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/26/15 11:41 PM

Originally Posted By: komemiute
Originally Posted By: Dakpilot
Correct me if I am wrong but Falcon 4 seems to have the type of dynamic campaign that many desire, however. as has been said, it was in development for a very long time, 7 years to work properly? so much so, that it brought the company to its knees, not what could be called a commercial success, and was a disaster on initial release, perhaps not the best example to wish to emulate...

Cheers Dakpilot



So essentially it was pointless to continue the Space program after Apollo 13?


The Apollo program was funded by U.S. taxpayers. BoS/BoM isn't...
Posted By: komemiute

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/26/15 11:47 PM

Originally Posted By: TychosElk
Originally Posted By: komemiute
Originally Posted By: Dakpilot
Correct me if I am wrong but Falcon 4 seems to have the type of dynamic campaign that many desire, however. as has been said, it was in development for a very long time, 7 years to work properly? so much so, that it brought the company to its knees, not what could be called a commercial success, and was a disaster on initial release, perhaps not the best example to wish to emulate...

Cheers Dakpilot



So essentially it was pointless to continue the Space program after Apollo 13?


The Apollo program was funded by U.S. taxpayers. BoS/BoM isn't...



Posted By: Dakpilot

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/26/15 11:55 PM

While we all would like a perfect dynamic campaign I think it is an example that few would be prepared to pay for the real development cost, as a commercial venture with ROI it is not sustainable, even more so in todays times

Cheers Dakpilot
Posted By: Swordsman

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/27/15 03:59 AM

Originally Posted By: Dakpilot
While we all would like a perfect dynamic campaign I think it is an example that few would be prepared to pay for the real development cost, as a commercial venture with ROI it is not sustainable, even more so in todays times

Cheers Dakpilot


Stop cheering me up.
Posted By: Dakpilot

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/27/15 08:01 AM

Even with the campaign for F4 a lot of the work that made it so successful/popular was done by users/modders, in all flight sims the decent campaign/missions are user/3rd party made, the same for IL-2 1946.

As far as BoS franchise is concerned the good news is that PWCG is out of beta 3 and at version 1, and a lot more people are coming to terms with the ME, new missions are starting to pop up on a daily basis

As far as mouse and tanks, this YT vid is actually very interesting, not so much for its content but for the 220 odd comments, which are quite surprising, for those interested to read them, it could strike terror or be positive depending on viewpoint winkngrin

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMUV-JQNkVY&app=desktop

however any interest in the more sim oriented corner of the genre can only be a good thing?

Cheers Dakpilot
Posted By: BD-123

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/27/15 10:22 AM

I'm sure this development will give the customer base a boost.
I haven't bought BoS previously as it didn't appeal. Still happy with original IL2 with all the excellent mods from the talented community but this new ground forces element has me reaching for my debit card. (& of course the 50% off!)
I am sure many of the more serious tank fans frustrated by WT silliness will gravitate over to this sim now.
Posted By: WT Horrido

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/27/15 12:39 PM

It makes perfect sense. Produce a content-poor combat flight simulator, poorer than 17 years old (and older) sims (EAW, Red Baron 2, Aces over Europe), complain that nobody buys and then make tanks. In flight simulator. Tanks are exactly what was missing ...
Posted By: Ark

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/27/15 06:53 PM

The tank gameplay looks fun. Hope they keep expanding on it.

Glad the Devs didn't just ditch the game after the rough start.
Posted By: SlipBall

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/27/15 09:21 PM

Yeah I think they have been wanting this for awhile, tanks as seen in the early Storm of War development
Posted By: robtek

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/27/15 10:14 PM

Originally Posted By: SlipBall
Yeah I think they have been wanting this for awhile, tanks as seen in the early Storm of War development


What are you refering to is a different game (Storm of War aka Cliffs of Dover) and different devs, the only common is 1c.
Posted By: Uriah

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/27/15 11:52 PM

Well it gives me a need now to fly a Stuka to kill those nasty tanks coming for my airfield.
Posted By: Sokol1

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 11/28/15 12:28 AM

Our "tankist" will shoot down your Stuka. biggrin

Posted By: SlipBall

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 12/01/15 07:31 PM

Originally Posted By: robtek
Originally Posted By: SlipBall
Yeah I think they have been wanting this for awhile, tanks as seen in the early Storm of War development


What are you refering to is a different game (Storm of War aka Cliffs of Dover) and different devs, the only common is 1c.



Yes sorry I was not clear, but I think that 1C has been wanting tanks and other objects to be player controlled...maybe they have an all out war thingy in mind, and they previously had Maddox working on it...no real evidence, just my feeling
Posted By: dburne

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 12/01/15 07:51 PM

I have to say with so much of the discussion now regarding BOS focusing on tanks and mouse control, I am about to give up on it at this point...

Just reading their forums of late, I am getting the distinct impression they are moving into a direction I probably am not going to care to go. So glad I did not buy into BOM now.
Posted By: KRT_Bong

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 12/01/15 08:20 PM

Well I had a go of it and it's not War Thunder, but.. together with AI trucks and such it could make some interesting scenarios perhaps have player controlled flak on half tracks escorting a supply column but it is a little clunky atm.
Posted By: Dakpilot

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 12/01/15 08:38 PM

Originally Posted By: dburne
I have to say with so much of the discussion now regarding BOS focusing on tanks and mouse control, I am about to give up on it at this point...

Just reading their forums of late, I am getting the distinct impression they are moving into a direction I probably am not going to care to go. So glad I did not buy into BOM now.


Of the thirty or so threads in General Discussion section first page, there seems to be only one about mouse control, and that has not even reached one page yet, there has been a bit of a fuss in the patch notes thread, but seems to be some saying WT mouse aim is the end of BoS and those who have tried both saying BoS mouse control is not the same and is of little concern.

Player controlled tanks seem to add a lot to MP, far better and more realistic targets than AI, it seems to have dragged the combat down to a much more historical level of Eastern front combat.

The Dev's have clearly stated their intentions regarding the 'flight sim' status of BoS/BoM, PWCG is now out of beta 3, and testing in version 1, there are as many threads about the Bf 110 as tanks, which as a totally new feature (tanks) should get some topic, and the general consensus appears to be good,

Don't really see what the doom and gloom is about

Cheers Dakpilot
Posted By: dburne

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 12/01/15 10:55 PM

Originally Posted By: Dakpilot

Don't really see what the doom and gloom is about


Don't really see how you got doom and gloom out of that post.

The key phase as stated in my post:

<<< distinct impression they are moving into a direction I probably am not going to care to go
>>>

I realize many like this direction and are well pleased with it. Just not for me I don't think...
Posted By: Sokol1

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 12/01/15 11:30 PM

This mouse thing cause concern for some because point that the game can tends to more "gameplay" - like the failed (dumb) Unlocks.

Tanks - despite the WT reference - is other history, this create a new aspect in MP (who have played Battleground Europe know), the tank simulation is not better than in Red Orchestra, but due the "open" map and plane interaction result in better warfare experience. smile
Posted By: Skoop

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 12/02/15 04:38 AM

^ +1

Even DCS has tanks, I actually thinks the tanks in BOS are better than the ones in dcs. It has raised interest in MP server population.
Posted By: Trooper117

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 12/02/15 10:35 AM

More players online is a good thing... But surely what's needed is that the population should be flying planes, not driving tanks...
Posted By: lokitexas

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 12/02/15 01:11 PM

Originally Posted By: Skoop
^ +1

Even DCS has tanks, I actually thinks the tanks in BOS are better than the ones in dcs. It has raised interest in MP server population.


DCS has tanks, SAM's, other vehicles that are controllable etc.

I believe the ground units gameplay in DCS are more geared towards strategy and commanding (like an RTS or Ops command) with the ability to "jump" into a vehicle. Considering the fact you could give orders to aircraft and ground units that are player and AI controlled made it more of a commander type experience. At least that's how we used it back in the day. Never looked at it or used it like a tank "sim" due to the fact it was always used by one guy in our coop nights to give us targets etc.

You cant deny that BoS seems to be following WT in its footsteps. Exp for shooting things, pilot levels, weapon unlocks, skin unlocks, mouse controls, and now tanks too. Very similar to me. How can one not draw that conclusion?

I don't think its doom and gloom, its people scratching their heads wondering how IL2 has become WT with CEM.
Posted By: FlightJunkie

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 02/13/16 01:42 PM

Originally Posted By: Dakpilot
Correct me if I am wrong but Falcon 4 seems to have the type of dynamic campaign that many desire, however. as has been said, it was in development for a very long time, 7 years to work properly? so much so, that it brought the company to its knees, not what could be called a commercial success, and was a disaster on initial release, perhaps not the best example to wish to emulate...

Cheers Dakpilot



that was back in 98'. its 2016 now. Tech should allow it to be easier to develop. And besides they already burning money for their login/DRM servers.
Posted By: DrZebra

Re: Why Spend Development Resources on Tanks in a Flight Sim? - 02/14/16 10:45 PM

I like the tanks and the way you can coop on the battlefield.. but they still have so many issues to fix.


the driving is almost too shaky to be good fun in the long run, maybe that is realistic, but it makes for a headache quick...


the t-34 and PIII are quite imbalanced as a match and more diverse tanks would certainly make it more interesting

it also needs a bit of work in on the collision modeling of tanks:
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