Blacksix patch update 28/4/2012

BlackSix
Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Moscow, Russian Federation
Posts: 226
"Friday" Update, April 28, 2012
Dear friends,
Yes, we know it's ridiculous. No one is more upset at the situation than us,
believe me. You have lives outside flight sims. You have jobs, you have homes.
For us, Cliffs of Dover is our life. When we can't get it right, it hurts us. When we
are in the constant state of "almost ready", when we break promises week after
week, it affects us very deeply.
Unfortunately, even though it looked like we had something releasable this
morning, by lunchtime we felt we should work on it more. What we almost
released would have been a "DX10 alpha". All the FM changes are there, lots of
other great things, FPS and stability improvements, etc.
However, the things that are the current "known issues" are:
· No dynamic low-caliber hit decals showing on aircraft;
· Detached aircraft chunks losing their texture and becoming pitch-black;
· Little particle "dust" that comes out of weapon hits looking like untextured
squares;
· Gunsights always white in color;
· No waypoint lines rendered in map or FMB;
· Pilot and Plane models not rendering textures in Options - Pilot and Options -
Plane respectively;
· DX9 support not ready for public consumption.
We just felt that this was one known issue too many. The decision was very hard
to make. Many team members are unhappy with it, especially those responsible
for the parts of the patch that are fully tested and working such as the FM.
I believe however that, rather than presenting ourselves as a team that releases
half-finished patches with lots of graphic issues, we should work very hard on
building the reputation for making things right, the first time, however long it
takes.
We’ll keep providing regular reports.
__________________
1С:MG, Mission Designer & Community Manager

Glad to see the problems that were holding up the release 5 months ago are still "last minute problems"

Its almost funny now.

What is really funny?
How much BlackSix has suddenly improved in language skills...

Well, he was contrite and gave an explanation of what exactly they are dealing with, kind of puts it in terms everyone can understand. I have no problem with that.

You guys know Blacksix just copy's and pastes Luthier's text right? its been that way since Blacksix started posting updates.

Damn!!! So close, yet so far

I agree, I really think their coding skills are not up to par with the current technologies.

Now I'd like to see how a member of the team would respond to this. This type of statement plants a seed in my brain, and I'd like to hear a member say either 'This is ludicrousness in its' highest form!!' or 'It is true we are quite unlearned people in the way of electric.'

One of my favorite replies in the thread is "It's a stunning update.". Any who, thanks to CloD's failure to keep me interested I have now discovered the awesomeness of civlian flight sims, FSX to be precise, off to my a2a Piper Cub again! Thanks CloD for not wanting me to fly you.

P.S Of course I couldn't post this @ banana, the "Knights of the Holy CloD" would have torn me to pieces.

Day after day, day after day, We stuck, nor breath nor motion; As idle as a painted ship Upon a painted ocean

lol this is a new 'blame it on CLOD' angle. Would the reality not be that as a flight simmer FSX had something to offer you, with or without CLOD.

Okay SlipBall you're supposed to distribute that hemp rope, not smoke it!

Oh, I'm not blaming CloD, didn't you read the part "thanks to CloD's failure..."? If I weren't so bored and fed up with the state of CloD I wouldn't have tried FSX I think, never was much in to civilan simming before but now thanks to the debacle that is CloD I am. Now I have better things to do than to be attacked by the "rabid ones" over at banana-rama. Take it easy bisher, I only expressed what I felt and thought about CloD I wasn't talking about you, go and enjoy CloD which I'm sure you are doing this very moment, instead of questioning my opinions.

P.S Don't you worry, I'll be back flying CloD when Battle of Mos....erh! the patch is released.

LOL!...funny bisher

Understand me addman, I'm simply engaging in conversation, virtually sipping on my coffee, leaning on a picket fence relaxing. No hostilities here.

I fly CLOD? No I don't at present

As far as your opinion goes addman, my post was asking for more of your opinion. Let's be straight.

Sorry about that then bisher, too much time at banana...makes me all paranoid and stuff, used to people jumping on every little thing I post that isn't in line with the policies of the "Praise CloD Party". Trying to get used to forum posts that contains humor and irony again.

P.S Thank baby Jesus for simhq, why did I ever leave?

I'd really like to see it too, but I doubt anyone from the dev team will come forward and tell us straight, "This is more than we can handle, we know how to code in Java, but not C++" Or perhaps, they know how to code, but only with the simplied constraints the old game had?

What would be more interesting, if someone from another more successful project, looked into their code and reviewed it for us.

lol that's so true addman, I have found myself hanging out at banana land, some kind of morbid curiosity I suppose.

I hang out there too, mainly because that's where the devs post. I rarely post there though, it just seems a bit more mature around here, plus it seems that smoking the rigging is legal around here too

Would you like to buy a foot of rope?

It really is about time they stopped handicapping themselves by keeping DX9 support active! Anyone running such an old clunker honestly has no right to expect playable modern games, it's just a simple fact of life, time to move on!

Craig

[Admin Edit]Nope. Any accusations of developer fraud will get deleted. There are very few rules here but that's a line we can't cross. Thank you.[/Admin Edit]

Sorry. A rush of blood to the head following morning coffee.

LOL great stuff boys

Rofl, the banana forums are even banning guys working on the project!

Fix one thing , something else breaks. Its like solving a big rubix cube isnt it? Oh its not ? ok oops.

Well I guess they will have to get all the issues fixed for BOM so they might as well do it for CoD.

Thats about as positive as I can be. Its good they give reports on progress. I appreciate that.

cheesehawk has it right.
It's a melt down over at the "yellow submarine"...

Particularly with "Ps Fat", cuz he got "played"....and is peeved.

Given that you have a billion possible buyers who cannot afford a modern pc perhaps it was a quite good business decision, at least on paper. Even though there is an increasing amount of people in Russia with a reasonable income, there sure are a lot of people not earning very much. If you manage to make a good game which scales well down to dx9 cards you may have tapped into a whole new customer base. In hindsight I agree with you though.

-C-

If an individual is on a system that relies on DX9, either because of WinXP or the video card does not support above DX9, they are better off on Il-2:1946 because their system has about as much chance of running CloD as a secret service member remaining covert when getting a hooker in foreign lands.


Too soon?

The people stuck running DX9 will never be happy due to to many compromises having to be made to make it playable, there is no value in it, and it will look and play worse than the original IL-2. The people with new systems won't be happy either because of the time and resources wasted trying to flog the dead horse, and the compromises made to get it to run on old systems!

Craig

I think the trouble is that a large portion of their userbase is in Russia, and a significant portion of those users are still rocking XP. I agree by the way, DX9 support for a sim that's supposed to last the next 10 years is pretty pointless, but I think they're afraid to make that hard choice in a niche market.

The update was a whos who of how desperate the game is, the nauseating flatus that poured from the mouths and keyboards thereafter did it for me though. Luthier and co have turned failure into an art form and they have clearly convinced quite a few that its art worth collecting.

No more 1C forums for me. I had my say in the middle of the love-in so I'm probably banned to perdition anyway. Game is off my system and until somebody who I know and trust tells me its worth putting back thats it.

Yup, sums it up pretty well for me too. Also, some people seems to think (still!) that the patch is coming out any day now, I couldn't believe some posts I read in the patch thread, lol! That patch is further away then ever before, and I'm almost starting to believe Tree_UK's prophecy that the patch will actually be Battle of Moscow...almost.

It's not the rope, it's that damn albatross...

You see I take the opposite view...I can fly at will both on and off line, but there are things that need fixing for sure. My fear is that so much will be striped away so as to allow the older systems to function with the game.

That would explain these nasty bird mite bites I have.

What flavour is it?

I don't have any problem running it either and have only had a CTD maybe 1 in 3 times of playing, which I find odd that folks with much better rigs are having so many problems. It makes me wonder if with this patch are all the testers having the same issues or only some of them and that is why they are so baffled, back in the day with 1946 there were certain Drivers that worked well and others that would completely bork the game and it was only by talking with each other that we came to a consensus on which ones were safe and which to skip, I wonder how many of the team are using similar rigs. You really need a cross section of the communities PC specs to test so you can see every possible outcome. I play with my vid card settings often to get the best performance, but those settings don't work across the board with all my games.

They are working hard on an old game that they could have shelved last year and you complain? Most developers would be gone by now and you know because you have seen it, been there and got the T shirt. They really don't even have to say anything but instead put out honest reports for you to take pot shots at. Come on, stop using your keyboard for your mouth and live in the real world.

Oh, I'm sorry Warbirds, after reading your post I booted up CloD and I'm now enjoying it more then ever, thank you! Seriously though, I don't see the difference between devs that have officially left a game 6 months ago and devs that say they haven't left the game 6 months ago but haven't produced anything of substance except for a handful of excusing updates about last minute glitches (aka the new "2 weeks be sure"). Do you see what I mean? When I see the patch and have updated CloD and everything is hunky dory I will rejoice and praise until then, what do you want me to say? The game is great? For me it's not but I don't go all ape-poo over it, instead I deal with it with a sense of humor, here, where it is allowed. Now pass the spliff boys.

PS. If the patch will be called "Battle of Moscow" I'll have the laugh of my life.

It's the entitled generation... - To be expected.

There is no point replying to you really.

If anybody either raises a valid criticism of the game or God forbid disagrees with your take on things it is either a)'thats all been said, whats the point of going on about it any more' or b)'You are wrong, I am right, this game is the saviour of the combat flight sims, you should think yourself lucky there are developers like 1C' etc.

Point is the game has been in limbo for a looong time and (I know it has been said before) it came out in a state many people who were used to the like of old IL2 and RoF just couldn't accept. That was from a company who's products were the standard by which anything else was judged. Although I happily accept that there are parts of CoD in which you can see genius peeking through the sum total of its parts is pretty flaky at best, and because of its miriad issues there are a lot of keen simmers who can't even get it to run decently enough to play at all.

The run in to the next (maybe) patch has been a shambles. Week in week out for months its been 'almost'. The last update pretty much summed up how almost it is. As to 'how sad we all are' etc, etc, well... you know, this is their craft and if you are pitching in your own field and continually drop the ball it is reasonable to be called out.

As far as I am concerned you are welcome to enjoy this game until rapture but objectively anyone who points out that this game is badly flawed and the attempts to put it right appear to be more and more desperate (and futile) have a fair and valid point which should be respected as a measured opinion.

Let's stay on the topic of 'Blacksix patch update 28/4/2012' please.

Okay then, but that will hurt my rope business...I think the devs need to find Igor Egorov and put him back on code. He was the lead programmer at the beginning of the series. Just saying maybe the staff are not the sharpest tacks, and I can only imagine how difficult all that is.

There is no chance in H#ll they will release BOM before the patch for COD. People will have to see the sim working before they touch BOM with a ten foot pole. If they don't get the game engine sorted, BOM will never see the light of day anyway.

And no one thought there'd be a chance in H#$@ that we'd still be waiting for the first patch 6 months after the introduction of the CTDs in early October. Please Chivas, save the sunshine and rainbows for the banana forums...

What did you expect when they decided to rewrite the graphic engine. A two week wait? Yes the bugs may be basicly the same but there appears to be a marked improvement in performance, which is a little sunshine and rainbows, amongst the doom and gloom. I know its hard for you to notice anything positive when your wallowing in negativism.

'hurt my rope business' lol

But I like sunshine and rainbows Cheesehawk. They should be allowed.

There have been no patches since October, please tell me where the marked improvement is?

Chivas & AoA, the Knights Templar of MG, they've found the holy grail and hidden it away...

Well I suppose your right, the developer could be lying about the performance improvements they've made over the past six months.

Cheesehawk, member in good standing of the Debbie Downer Assc, nothing positive to see here.

Well, if they already have fixed the FM, I think the best course is release it. A small patch now is better than 100 mega-patches tomorrow.

10-17-2011
We are in final stages of testing a thorough overhaul of the game’s graphic engine. It won’t look any different but it will be much more streamlined. It’s too early to say what the FPS increase will be in the final version, but it shouldn’t be less than 50%.

03-23-2012
Only one relatively minor issue remains that prevents the gunsight, tracers, and bullet decals from being drawn. Of course, this minor technical issue has a huge impact on gameplay, and that is why we cannot release it to the public in its current state.

04-28-2012
However, the things that are the current "known issues" are:
· No dynamic low-caliber hit decals showing on aircraft;
· Detached aircraft chunks losing their texture and becoming pitch-black;
· Little particle "dust" that comes out of weapon hits looking like untextured squares;
· Gunsights always white in color;
· No waypoint lines rendered in map or FMB;
· Pilot and Plane models not rendering textures in Options - Pilot and Options - Plane respectively;
· DX9 support not ready for public consumption.


We have gone from final testing 5 months ago to the problems getting worse, the patch seems to be further away than ever...

Remember this Chivas?-
http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/3505219/Searchpage/1/Main/351310/Words/%22they+cant+fix+clod%22/Search/true/Re_Update_27_1_12.html#Post3505219

Just a realist now, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me... fool me (counts quotes in Furb's post, and all of MG's posts)... I'm going to diss your deceptive business practices at every oppurtunity, so some poor clod doesn't go through the same pain we all have.

And unless it's released, any improvements haven't hit the community, and are pure speculation, we haven't even had a video of supposed frame rate increases, much less any specifics as to numbers or hardware, or what else they've removed from the graphics.

So your only reason for staying in the COD forums is to warn simmers away from the broken sim. Thats a noble pursuit. I would agree that the developers were very deceptive on the state of the sim at release, but it should have been obvious their motives weren't to screw people over. Their motives were to keep the project alive, their jobs intact, investors a chance to get a return on their investment, and finally a new sim series we all want. Now you would have been right if they shut down the development after the western release, but that didn't happen. Right now the development hasn't taken in any substantial monies for months and are bleeding even more investors dollars to get the patch out. That doesn't appear to me to be a corrupt publisher/developer. They also know full well the patch must be successful enough to warrant some confidence in the future of the series, before sales of any sequel will be large enough to keep the development alive, let alone get even a tiny portion of their investment back.

If people understood the process of doing a major code rewrite and debugging rewritten software that has no known finished working state, they wouldn't be so dumbfounded by the delays.

Personally I can't see the investors throwing good money after bad, much longer, unless they see a very bright light at the end of this very dark tunnel. The failure will certainly scare away any other future investment in the last bastion of complex WW2 air combat sim development. These complex small genre sims are just too time consuming, expensive, and risky for investors to even contemplate for the foreseeable future.

"No...."




"....there is another."




(Maybe)

[quote=ChivasPersonally I can't see the investors throwing good money after bad, much longer, unless they see a very bright light at the end of this very dark tunnel. The failure will certainly scare away any other future investment in the last bastion of complex WW2 air combat sim development. These complex small genre sims are just too time consuming, expensive, and risky for investors to even contemplate for the foreseeable future. [/quote]


I don't see a very large amount of money needed here from the so called investors. I mean just what is there that is so much money?, weekly salary's, electric bill, rent for the building etc, hardly a lot of money I would think...okay possibly vodka, unknown

@LIXMA:

LOL Perfect, that was!

I can appreciate what you are saying Chivas but whatever the developers intentions were the fact is they did grossly underplay the technical difficulties the sim had in its release state, I could easily be wrong but I think the Epilepsy filter debacle was a panic reaction in the sure knowledge of the battering they knew they were going to get after release. Don't you think it might have been a better strategy to release a paid beta ? that way anyone who chose to take part would have known from the outset what it was they were getting involved in and a greater part of the bad blood that has arisen could have been avaioded. Water under the bridge I suppose but the decisions taken then affect the mood you take such strong objection to now.

As to the patch the fact that there is obviously disagreement in the team is a concern, I think I can see the point of those who have done good work being frustrated in not having their efforts recognised and enjoyed due to other parts being unfit. The next patch is make or break for the game and as I see it the series. 'Failure to Launch' is (imo) doing more harm than good now. If people could play the game without ctd's and with better, smoother performance the glitches would be far less of an issue than the dev's may think. If they are flying it they ain't in front of keyboards complaining about it.

I agree Scott that a paid beta would have been afar better option, in many respects, but I'm not sure it would have garnered enough support and cash to keep the investors/beancounters willing to keep footing the bill. Unfortunately the development has been spending millions for so many years, that I doubt the investors are going to get their monies back, plus profit until they are well in the series. People making the money decisions, must be seeing some sunshine and rainbows, that the rest of us a hard pressed to see, or Luthier is one h#ll of a salesman atleast in the boardroom.

Personally I just think the epilepsy filter was just another roadblock in a long line of roadblocks the development has had to find away around.

Its been a h#llish development for "everyone" involved. Hopefully it will have a happy ending.

Anyway, anyone testing WarThunder see any positives that the IL-2 crowd could gravitate too and stay? And no I'm not asking you NuggetX. Actually he's been awfully quiet for a year or so, he must be playing alot of COD, or testing WarThunder. Gaijin has done some decent work and its possible they could enter the more complex sim market, especially now that they have a revenue stream with their less complex sims. I'm not holding my breath for that to happen, but remain hopeful.

Maybe, but probably not.

From the developer..."DCS is not intended to be a full WW2 era simulation."

Although they could change their business model in the future. Even if they did, it would be many years before anything substantial would be released.

Atleast the P51, would be fun target practice for modern jets, weapons systems.

I know its old ground Chivas, but please tell me you didn't buy that epilepsy filter rubbish?

You telling me a professional software team didn't know about that and for the first time in game development history it caused a major roadblock just weeks before release?


Some things you say Chivas make sense, but that? come on pull the other one its got bells on.

I never believed the ignorance of the epilepsy filter thing either...I still would like to hear from Chivas about the money thing, backers and all. I can't see the devs having much expense, and they should be loaded with our money.

Seems to me a "patch" is something that is applied to fix a few minor problems andmaybe add a few updates or additions.

This thing they are working on now ought to have a new word. I guess one could call it a "Major overhaul" but I doubt such

a term will stick in the computer software world. So.. what do we call something that is way bigger than a patch, in fact

virtually a complete re write of the product ? Just wondering.

For CLOD "CPR"

I believe UBISOFT said that they wouldn't publish COD in the west without the Epilepsy Filter. Who knows what the timing of that request was, it would be quite possible that a copy of COD was sent to UBISOFT to publish in the west and after their tests decided they wanted an Epilepsy filter. The epilepsy filter was a problem, but obviously not the main problem with the sim, just another delay.

Personally I've never seen a sim make use of an epilepsy filter, although I understand certain people are susceptible to the condition playing some video games. I don't believe the COD developers used the issue as some sort of boondoggle, as they certainly wouldn't have time to play that game. It would serve no purpose.

I inferred in a couple of posts back that the developers aren't even close to covering the costs so far for the sim. They've spent millions of dollars so far trying to get the new game engine built and working properly. Those costs won't be recovered by COD, but should be recovered sometime during the release of quite a number of sequels the new game engine will spawn. This is why the performance/graphic patch is so critical, without the much needed performance and stability the series is dead, and the developers will have a lost a considerable amount of money.

The already did it, it was called a patch, and a complete overhaul of the graphics engine with 200% more performance.... then not.

So when they signed the contract with UBISOFT to publish CLOD the epilepsy filter was not in it and was added at the last minute?...come on.
A professional game studio would of known about this sort of filter form the very start, if they forgot then its gross incompetence. It was used to explain bad performance at release, just like the excuse of the show PC's of "only 2 GB of RAM at the shows PC's at Kiev dont worry everything will be fine with 4 GB", though let me guess, you believed that too?

Anyway...its old ground like i said Chivas, not worth arguing over again, its done now.

Furbs, tone it down a bit on the agressive-o-meter please, I know you guys get on but Chivas didn't write the bad game.

Given Ubisoft's well deserved reputation with developers it isn't impossible to imagine a scenario where a build was given to them as a publisher and they had all sorts of daft criteria to add. I've no idea if that's credible, but it is all speculation..

Sorry Frog if i came across aggressive, its meant in a jokey ribbing in the pub way. ...im sure Chivas knows that but to anyone else who reads my post i get your point.

Must remember to add smileys.

Cheers - just don't want to scare anyone off otherwise it's just us 3 weirdos left lol

Folklore certainly, however if a similar spirit is delaying the release i have every reason to look forward to it.

What I never understand is how they 'fix' something and then something completely unrelated goes west i.e. they update the damage decals and the gunsights all turn white?

I mean is this sim coparable with the proverbial house of cards and one little tweak here and there causes the whole shebang to collapse...I mean who would write stuff to behave like that?

I've given up on this title ever being 'fixed' in that it fullfills the original concept of simulating BoB and not just one tiny little snapshot from the battle.

I still think that if someone were to combine the campaign engine from Rowan's Bob with the 'fixed' graphics of CloD then that would be something, a title worthy of being called the Battle of Britain.

From inside Ubi (i think even Luthier wrote this once, but not inclined to go dig banana forum, those interested will), this is not exactly what happened.

What happened is Clod failed the epilepsy tests, and would have needed some adjustments to pass it. Either 1C or MG (not known at Ubi) decided the antiepilepsy filter would do.

Another myth: "Ubi pulled out the Su26". From Oleg's mouth, 1C pulled it out. MG nor Ubi were able to oppose.

A last mostly unknown fact, again form inside Ubi: MG threatened to try Ubi for not promoting the Sim enough. Ubi threatened back to try MG for delivering a faulty product (Ubi was denied the right to test the RC) and their lawyers applied to MG the maximum penalties negociated in the distribution contract, wich made the game distribution a no loss operation for Ubi.

Now back on apr 28 update, i don't know any more what to think. I don't have a high opinion of Luthier as a boss, as many i know who worked with him once, but i'm pretty sure he really loves his current job (as Oleg did) and wishes to get the game to work properly. Has he got the right team for this ? The money to pay for the right team ? Another full time work to pay the bills while working overnight on the patch and sequel ? I really don't know, and have no hope of seeing the patch soon (or see it but with the game still broken), but can't say neither "we will have no patch, that's for sure". The only sure thing is it's entertaining to read you people, can i have some rope as well ?

Interesting, though surely Luthier and the team would have known what it would take to pass the epilepsy test months before release?
Just turning on the EF in the game basically screws the graphics up, so its clearly not working is it?
I agree it seems the patch is still a long way off, Luthier is talking about almost releasing with the problems it has currently...

· No dynamic low-caliber hit decals showing on aircraft;
· Detached aircraft chunks losing their texture and becoming pitch-black;
· Little particle "dust" that comes out of weapon hits looking like untextured squares;
· Gunsights always white in color;
· No waypoint lines rendered in map or FMB;
· Pilot and Plane models not rendering textures in Options - Pilot and Options - Plane respectively;
· DX9 support not ready for public consumption.


...if thats the case then it seems they are having alot of problems finding fixes.

It would seem to me that these are, or must be related somehow and maybe if they released a beta patch with the caviat that it is not without problems that someone in the community might figure out that which is eluding them and at the very least get a bigger sampling of what hardware the community is using, not everyone may have the same results. just a thought.

I think when it gets down to it, Maddox Games are a bunch of well meaning, extremely hardworking guys, who have really high ambitions for what they do, but don't have anyone with any business or management sense.

Yea no, not happening, till rope has time to dry out...took a big wave over the bow

It would be interesting to see if they have an Epilepsy Filter Option on the Russain version of the sim. I still believe it was UBISOFT who ran the epilepsy test on COD and refused to release it in the west until it was fixed. Luckily they were finally able to make it an option otherwise the sim would be far worse off than it is now.

Maybe Ataros can answer that question about the Russian version...he stops in here now and then.

Wouldn't the sim with the epilepsy filter turned off (like we all run with) just be the same as the Russian version of the sim where they don't have an epilepsy filter?

I don't think there would be two radical versions of the game, but more something that just 'turned stuff off' in the flicker-thon version.

Here's three posts by Luthier during the Epilepsy problem. This was after the Russian release so the Russian version wouldn't have had the filter unless it was added with a patch. The posts suggests UBISOFT asked for the filter, because they were afraid of being sued. At first they weren't allowed to have it as an option, but apparently UBISOFT relented or found a legal workaround that allowed the developers to just add the Epilepsy Filter as on option instead of having to rewrite the code.

Luthier

I want to confirm that everything said here is true, we have implemented some drastic features for anti-epilepsy protection which are affecting FPS and killing SLI support.

We CANNOT make these optional. That will allow an opportunistic or an unfortunate person suffering from epilepsy to sue Ubisoft for damages and literally close down the studio for good.

This was a stop-gap measure to make sure the game gets released. As I explained in the clumsily-translated Russian article, everything in our game causes seizures - gunfire, explosions, fire, sun passing behind canopy framework, etc. Basically flight sims are an epileptic's nightmare.

We'll work to improve the framerate and perhaps address individual issues individually as opposed to applying a single rough post-effect filter, but it is basically a very sad situation. Something completely unrelated and unexpected came to our sim with a giant axe and whacked at it at the last moment. We just didn't have time to properly address it.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

-------------------------------

Hi everyone,

The team could never in a million years imagine that a post on a Russian-language forum would so quickly make the rounds and spread around the internet.

The information there is not accurate, especially the placing of the blame on Ubisoft.

I feel that I need to describe this in more detail.

Our game did cause wide-scale epilepsy failures when tested. Propellers, muzzle flashes, smoke puffs, explosions, falling bombs, flying or taxiing between buildings, sun shining through canopy framework, etc, they were all causing potentially seizure-inducing flashes.

We worked hard to address all these issues individually, but since a flight sim is all about fast-moving large objects, there were just too many instances of things causing high-contrast flashes.

So, as we were running out of time, WE decided to implement this epilepsy filter as a stop-gap measure.

The filter sits on top of the game's graphics wrapper. It saves a previous frame, and then compares it pixel-by-pixel to the new frame. When two pixels are found with a high degree of contrast between them, the new pixel is toned down to make the change less drastic.

This causes a visual effect somewhere between bloom and motion-blur that removes virtually all instances of high-contrast flashes.

However this pixel-by-pixel frame analysis and modification takes up additional resources, it in fact delays the showing of each new frame until each pixel of it checked, and therefore the filter is causing deteriorated performance that is especially notable on lower-end machines.

We are continuing to work to optimize the game and to increase its framerate. Ubisoft has been very patient and understanding with us throughout the entire process, and we are continuing to work with them very closely to find the best solution to epilepsy issues.

In summary, I want to stress that it is OUR code and OUR game engine that is causing performance issues. And it US who has to make it better, and that's exactly what we pledge to do.

----------------------------
Hello everyone,

Once again I want to point out that a lot of your earlier anger was misplaced. Actually, our colleagues at Ubisoft are extremely interested in making this game a success, they care about our opinion and yours, and everyone we work with there is understanding and cordial and more than willing to listen and change their mind.

Having said that, I'm glad to announce that the debacle has been resolved.

We will be making the filter optional, however turned on by default. And we will be adding a large epilepsy warning to our splash screen. I am almost certain that this update will hit the steam servers on March 30th and thus seamlessly make it onto everyone's machines when the game is installed on the 31st.

The March 30th update will also address some of the issues reported with the Russian version, but we'll provide more details with the patch notes once we know for sure what it'll contain. Obviously, we need to test the heck out of all the changes to make sure we don't introduce any new bugs while fixing the old ones (the team's favorite past time lately as it seems).

So there! Do a happy dance, I know I did.

Both sims are the exactly the same. The Epilepsy filter is just an option, added after the Russain release, but before the release in the West. The filter could have been added to the Russian version after a patch, but like you suggest, 99% of us would have it turned off anyway.

That's the way it works. The developer had a list of bugs before the major rewrite to gain performance, after the rewrite, the performance was gained, with some bugs fixed, some others stayed the same, and new ones created. You fix three bugs, but create two. You just keeping fixing until you have none left, or those that are left you can live with, to fix at another time. This is nothing new, its just how it works.

If and when its done the tools and the performance should be there for the community to build all the historical missions and campaigns you would like. You won't be able to play as the overall Commander like BOB WOV, but that was never in the plan, but most everything else should be better with time, just as BOB WOV continues to get better with time, thanks to the mod community.

Biggest mistake Oleg ever did was put Luthier in charge. I remember the clusterf**k that Pacific fighters was, when Oleg had to bail him out. Now he's in charge of this mess. They release a pre-alpha, and they are just getting into actually coding the game and calling it a "re-write". Suuuure, whatever you say. To many things point to the release version being a heavily modified IL2FB with the same bugs, engine limitations etc. What was Luthier doing for 6 years. Having them code trucks and buildings and making little movies, that's what he was doing. The guy is in over his head, the extreme lack of any real progress over 6 years is proof enough.

Nobody was more pissed than I was when Oleg put SOW on hold to help Luthier finish Pacific Fighters. I realize now that it was the right decision, as the average computer in 2005 would never be able to handle the complexity they wanted to put into SOW.

In Luthier's defense, he was just doing a few mods, starting with an aircraft carrier, that ballooned into a stand alone sim that required all of Oleg's crew to finish. At this time Oleg must have realized that SOW had to be put on hold while they continued to make monies with the original IL-2 addons. Although he still had a skeleton crew working on SOW.

Oleg couldn't get SOW working like he wanted, and he was either pushed out, or made Luthier the lead developer for Maddox Games. Again I don't put the blame on Luthier, he's doing the best he can in the situation. Not that long ago the developers were getting 1 fps, now I can play the sim at between 30fps to well over 100 fps. After the patch everyone should get atleast that. Sure there are alot of bugs and unworking features, but you can't forget there is alot more that is working. There have been dozens of conspiracy theories over the last few years, but few have more than an ounce of credibility. Its just a group of combat flight simmers trying to develop a very complex sim, with hard work, a few laughs, some victories, and alot of setbacks. Anyone who has been part of complex projects fully understand how setbacks continually come out of left field.

You're off the rails in more than one regard
Stick to what you know.

I wouldn't expect the full-blown RAF/LW commander option from Rowan's BoB but having the campaign play out under computer control and then jumping in to individual contact sorties would be my idea of heaven, especially if your direct action influences the overall outcome of that days fighting albeit on a minor scale.

I know it's a lot to expect anyone to invest time/money into a 'released' title but at the very least you'd expect some of the money that was garnered from releasing early would be ploughed back into development to produce a title that lives up to it's expectations.

You are perfectly right. Simply Ubi didn't ask for the filter, this was the fastest solution found by Luthier but certainly not the best for framerate (most shooters display huge explosions, yet pass the epilepsy tests, and still have an excellent framerate).

The RU version doesn't have the Epilepsy Filter, and while most of the game is the same, its not exactly the same either. When I was still using it, I had to grab a keygensis (something like that anyways) to change the language, and update patches. Wasn't worth the hassle before long, so I got the EU version after a bit. That was the first time I needed to turn off the Epilepsy filter, or delete the Ubi logo.wmv.

I've never heard of epilepsy filters until this thread.

It's in your graphic options by SSAO and V-sync, turn it off and you will see a few more fps.
My theory about the filter is that it was put in because of the strobe effect that used to happen when flying through clouds. I haven't noticed that for a while though, I try not to fly through clouds where possible due to icing of the carb. I really need to map that pitot heater to somewhere convenient.

Would you get icing flying through clouds at 3000m in British summertime?
I have no idea.

Your right I should have said UBISOFT asked for the problem to be fixed, which was my meaning. Luckily UBISOFT relented and allowed the developer to just provide an optional Epilepsy filter, otherwise we might still be waiting for the Western release, and more probably the cancelation of the sim in the west.

I would have thought it was looking thru the prop, but according to Luthier in his statement below there are quite a few causes.

As I explained in the clumsily-translated Russian article, everything in our game causes seizures - gunfire, explosions, fire, sun passing behind canopy framework, etc. Basically flight sims are an epileptic's nightmare.

This is speculation, but i think the same indeed. Cancellation could have been temporary (as temporary as our waiting for a patch) until new graphic engine is done, though. But that anti epilepsy legislation sure came at the wrong time for the sim, and i wonder too if Ubi did not over react to it.

I think that is very possible, when I used to fly I would occasionally have to apply heat at that altitude...conditions dictate...more chance of icing in the summer that in the winter, dew point/humidity the main players

I've gotten ice at 3000 feet in the sim. (What's the lowest altitude you can get ice in the sim?) The dewpoint and temperature in the sim are unknown but using a freezing level of 3000 feet and an average lapse rate of 2C/3.5F degrees per 1000 feet, that means the temperature at the surface would be 6C/42.5F degrees. Again, was it that cold in August 1940? I've not researched it so I don't know.

The icing is a bit more complex than just outside temperature, just the air rushing through the carburetor lowers the temperature. I always turned on the heat and left it on during a landing decent. I'm not sure how well it is modeled in game though, when ice melts the engine runs like crap till it is burned a way...I will have to see in game how the engine responds to an icing event/and then a deicing condition.

6C in the day? no i wouldn't of thought so.

If I remember right, the air going through a carb can be 50 degrees cooler than the outside air the plane is flying through.

Try an offline mission with heavy clouds, it has the effect of choking your engine to the point of being at a great disadvantage in a dogfight, and as I mentioned in an earlier post I haven't mapped a key or HOTAS button to the pitot heater yet. I think that's because I fly mostly online where clouds don't really feature at the moment. What I'd like to know is how effective the pitot heater is. Does anyone know how long it takes to get to an effective temperature, or if there is a disadvantage to keeping it on all the time 'just in case' you have to dive into cloud as an emergency measure?

The pilot heater should not affect performance even if left on, just to keep the windows clear...in game I would turn on the carburetor heat prior to entering a cloud, then turn off on your exit. I would turn on for any long decent such as preparing to land, then turn off when close to landing (this will give you max power if you need to do a go around, for the landing)...just for fun try this, enter a cloud with carburetor heat off, hand off throttle, take note of your RPM at entering..just keep watching your RPM to see if there is a drop...then turn on the heat and take note of the time till the RPM makes a rise to your set value.

Thanks for that Slipball, I'll try that.
You mentioned you have a little flying experience yourself in a previous post. What have you flown?

A Piper 140 but it was long ago when I could rent the aircraft for 10.00 per hour. The PA28 140 is the only aircraft that I ever piloted...try saying this three times



BUMMMFITCHH

The freezing issue is not solely related to outside temperaure, it is a reaction to fuel and air being pulled over a venturi such as those in a carburettor, the outside air temp can be well above zero and this will can still happen, especially if there is some moisture in the air to start with!

Craig

Interesting stuff, i never read anything about "BOB" pilots having freezing issues, and ive read about 50 books on the battle.
Maybe just a mundane point they never thought to write about.

Wouldn't that be because there is equipment on the plane to prevent it? We don't have frozen engines now, but planes fly even higher and faster than they did in 1940.

Slipball, the PITOT heater doesn't do anything for the windows, its for the pitot tube that measures the air-pressure for altitude, and I think the air velocity to determine IAS.

On the later model 109s, its the big long tube sticking out from the port wingtip.

I thought I was reading pilot not pitot

Haha, I thought the same thing early on. Found out quickly when I advised someone on comms to use the "Pilot" heater when flying through clouds. As he was a real pilot, I got a lengthy explanation on "PITOTs" and their uses.

When I read the post by Bokononist my eyes saw the word pilot, I know I need to get to the eye doc soon.

Take your own advice, boy.