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#657405 - 04/11/01 02:25 AM Flight Models?  
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MarkShot Offline
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Somewhere over the Channel
Are there 3rd party flight models for this game like there are for EAW and CFS2?

Thanks.

------------------

Mark "MarkShot" Kratzer
Author of STK/EAW (Shoot to Kill/European Air War)
http://www.simhq.com/simhq3/sims/air_combat/stk_eaw/index.shtml


Mark "MarkShot" Kratzer
Author of STK/EAW (Shoot to Kill/European Air War)
http://www.simhq.com/_air/PDF/STK_EAW_v106.pdf
Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#657406 - 04/11/01 06:01 AM Re: Flight Models?  

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Yes there are several flightmodel enhancements to WW2F. You can find them at dogfighter.com in the ww2f section. I think ww2f.dogfighter.com works. From what I have read though if your interested in online play some pilots may get annoyed if you use any add-on fm's. I personally have not tried any yet but I have them on a zip somewhere and plan to try them when time is available. Good Luck and fly whatever works for you.

#657407 - 04/11/01 12:56 PM Re: Flight Models?  

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Indeed, you can find numerous versions of Target's FMs at http://ww2f.dogfighter.com/ . Installation is very simple -- running a BAT file will let you choose between 1944 and 1945 FMs, plus it will also give you the option to revert to the original FMs if you like them better. Couldn't be more painless.

#657408 - 04/12/01 02:08 AM Re: Flight Models?  
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Somewhere over the Channel
I have visited numerous sites and do not see any FM mods. Could you please point me to some files. Thank you.

Quote:
Originally posted by Witchdoctor:
Indeed, you can find numerous versions of Target's FMs at http://ww2f.dogfighter.com/ . Installation is very simple -- running a BAT file will let you choose between 1944 and 1945 FMs, plus it will also give you the option to revert to the original FMs if you like them better. Couldn't be more painless.




------------------

Mark "MarkShot" Kratzer
Author of STK/EAW (Shoot to Kill/European Air War)
http://www.simhq.com/simhq3/sims/air_combat/stk_eaw/index.shtml


Mark "MarkShot" Kratzer
Author of STK/EAW (Shoot to Kill/European Air War)
http://www.simhq.com/_air/PDF/STK_EAW_v106.pdf
#657409 - 04/12/01 02:15 AM Re: Flight Models?  

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http://ww2f.dogfighter.com Custom Modifications, Miscellaneous

#657410 - 04/13/01 06:18 PM Re: Flight Models?  

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I had the same problem finding the flight models there too. Its on the page that looks like a skins page.

------------------
dogfight.com

[This message has been edited by ral (edited 04-13-2001).]

#657411 - 04/16/01 12:12 AM Re: Flight Models?  
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Kit. Ont. Canada
Hey Judge, good to see yer still around.
Question please? Are the take off & landing runs a little short? Seems to me they are. Maybe lotso power und brakes maybe?
FWIW,
Good Hunting!
PS. That CFSI terrains' quite nice!

#657412 - 04/17/01 10:14 PM Re: Flight Models?  
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Hey, i just got this sim hoping the new FM would wake it up and I am sorry i waited so long. well wo/ the new FM i might not be so happy. with these FM and CFS2 w/ the 1% FM the P-38s feel very very similar.

One thing i don't get is the auto trim feature. how do i trim to climb, fly lvl ect??

BTW i got the 2cd version no printed manual but a fantastically entertaining and educational Multi media package w/ video of the aircraft, historical events put into perspective so you really know why the hell you are attackin or defending whatever you are ordered to.

I paid $7.99 for WW2F and just the video, pics and historical content is worth twice that.

These guys really did a first rate job.

Anyone really jones-ing bad for a WW2 sim can't go wrong with this sim. I like the entire presentation & experience way better than CFS2 which I bought last week to fly the Korean War Pack (which consequently was rated "No MiG Alley!!"). If ya gotta have carriers than CFS2 is required. If ya just want to have some fun and be challenged and spend less than $10.00 this is the ticket to prop nirvana (until IL2 comes out...1 reason I am developin my prop skills a bit.)

I stayed up till 4:00 am watchin videos and flying. The AI can DF pretty well but is kinda dumb, like 2 of em follow my P-38 600+ kts straight into my crater....

D3D is not so hot, i have a GF256 and there are some anomolies but nothing horrific, i may get a pair of voodoo2's for this and I have been meaning to get Grand Prix legends so they will be usefull.

The Multiplayer, coop or us vs them, with the awesome mission builder promises to be a lot of fun.

I am gonna buy this sim for every kid 8 years old and up that i ever need to get a gift for.

Ok time 2 fly...


blitz

#657413 - 04/18/01 05:02 PM Re: Flight Models?  

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blit_ZEN: you are absolutely right about the "Museum." I LOVE... LOOOOVE the combat videos, not to mention all the other historical information you can find in the Museum's nooks & crannies. This was one area where CFS2 really let me down; I don't feel half as knowledgeable about the Pacific Theater, or especially about the various planes in CFS2 as I do with the planes in WWII Fighters. Man, if you could string together all the information provided in the WWII Fighters Museum and present it in a two-hour package, you'd have one hell of a Discovery Channel special presentation

#657414 - 04/18/01 09:56 PM Re: Flight Models?  
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kroach@westman.wave.ca
http://www.ao.net/~chuck/ww2/ww2sycho.htm


this site also has lots of stuff


Most people never look up
#657415 - 04/24/01 12:43 AM Re: Flight Models?  
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Gryphon Offline
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Hello: I was wondering if someone here could please explain to me what differences I will notice in the flight models of the different aircraft and years available if I install Target's Flight Model pack v40a5. If there is no difference in a particular aircraft, please mention that as well.

Thanks!
Gryphon

#657416 - 04/24/01 05:47 PM Re: Flight Models?  

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Gryphon,

In general: the 109 and 190 have significant performance gains from 44 to 45. The P-47, 51, and 38 not too much...but a little.

Was that what you were looking for?

Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum

Dan

#657417 - 04/24/01 09:48 PM Re: Flight Models?  
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Gryphon Offline
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Dann: Thanks for the reply. I guess I should have asked a more specific question, 'cause now that I look back at my question, it really isn't too clear what I'm after. Sorry about that. I'm trying to decide whether I need to install the Flight Model pack or not. If there really isn't much difference in the way the aircraft fly, I will probably not try it. Let me ask you this:

1) Are there any noticeable differences in the way the AI aircraft's flight modeling is rendered? Sometimes those AI aircraft can pull off some amazing feats of airmanship that really seems kind of impossible. IMO, it seems the AI flight modeling is a lot different than the player's flight modeling.
2) Will an aircraft that I fly stall and enter a spin if I get too slow or pull too hard in a bank? Is the spin recoverable?
3) Are the Flight Model changes more a change in the engine performance or are they more a change in the flight characteristics?

I appreciate your help.
Thanks!
Gryphon

#657418 - 04/24/01 10:36 PM Re: Flight Models?  

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Quote:
Originally posted by Gryphon:

1) Are there any noticeable differences in the way the AI aircraft's flight modeling is rendered?...IMO, it seems the AI flight modeling is a lot different than the player's flight modeling.


I have heard, though not confirmed, that the AI uses a flight model one level lower than yours. Dissappointing, agreed...but not a show stopper because they're some of the more aggressive adversaries around. The improved flight models do help to even the playing field, once you start using your advantages against their disadvantages, again because of some of the tweaking in the flight model.

To say that they use one full level lower may be inaccurate; they may just have a relaxed model in some areas.

Quote:
Originally posted by Gryphon:

2) Will an aircraft that I fly stall and enter a spin if I get too slow or pull too hard in a bank? Is the spin recoverable?


Yes, you will definately experience spins with over-control! However, letting the contols go neutral will recover the spin. This is not entirely inaccurate; however there is not a WWII combat sim out there that does a high performance fighter spin justice. Beware the Focke-Wulf, yank too hard and she spins easily, just like the real one, I hear.

In my opinion, the spins in this game are a penalty for exceeding the aircraft's limitations, and result in you becoming a target. The recovery is hardcoded into the executable, and therefore not subject to modification.

Quote:
Originally posted by Gryphon:

3) Are the Flight Model changes more a change in the engine performance or are they more a change in the flight characteristics?

I appreciate your help.
Thanks!
Gryphon


Both.

Major accuracy changes have been made to the engine performances; this I saw by looking into the files and from my knowledge about how those aircraft were supposed to perform. I was very pleased with what I saw.

The changes to the flight model are far more complicated and out of my area of expertise, except to say that the flight model is actually complex and was "dumbed down" by Jane's.

For instance: the P-51 and P-38 were the only ones to actually have combat flaps, although you can actuate combat flaps on all the aircraft. No more. Now, the combat flap setting only works on the 51 and 38, although you will get a message saying that you've deployed them on the other aircraft. This goes to the advantage/disadvantage of each aircraft.

Depending on the year you select, each aircraft has it's own advantages over the others; 45 giving a nod to the German aircraft more so over their 44 counterparts. Overall, I'd say the flight models are outstanding representations of each aircraft now.

That said, have you posed this question to the author of the flight models over at WW2 Fighters Online?

Si Vis etc

Dan

#657419 - 04/25/01 06:55 AM Re: Flight Models?  
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Gryphon Offline
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Dann: Excellent answers to my questions and I can't thank you enough. Looks like I will probably install the Flight Model package now that I understand a little more of what's going on.

And, in answer to your question about whether I have asked the designer of the modification these questions, No, I haven't. It never even occurred to me. I tend to mentally put the creators of these modifications up on a pedestal, I guess. It's kind of a, "ssshhhhh......Don't bother the artist at work, you'll interrupt his creative process!" kind of a thing.

You're right, though, I should probably knock on the door over at WW2 Fighters Online and ask.

Once again, I appreciate your help.
Thanks!
Gryphon

#657420 - 04/25/01 05:10 PM Re: Flight Models?  

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Gryphon,

No problem. I just "discovered" Jane's WW2 fighters also.

Can you do me a favor in return? One of the first things I did when getting the game, was search for websites supporting it. I found WW2 Fighters Online, saw the modified flight models, and immediately used them. I'm kinda picky that way...I want realism. So, I've never flown Jane's with the stock FM's; could you post your opinions after installing them and tell me what differences you see?

Si Vis etc

Dan

#657421 - 04/25/01 11:32 PM Re: Flight Models?  
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Gryphon Offline
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Dann: Absolutely. I would be more than happy to share my observations with you. Give me a couple of days to compare/fly and I'll let you know what I come up with.

Did you install Target's FMv40a5 or the earlier version? The reason I ask is, I read above that v40a5 allows for easy switching between the original flight models and the modified flight models. Can you confirm that? So, you never tried the original flight model, right?

I'll get back to you with my obs. as soon as I have some.

As always, appreciate your help.
Gryphon

#657422 - 04/25/01 11:54 PM Re: Flight Models?  

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Gryphon,

Yes, I am using the 40a5 flight models; and no, outside of installation and checking, I've never used the stock ones.

It's easy to switch back and forth, you just "reinstall" the stock ones using the same installion method; be sure to back up the sqs file first!

Looking forward to your observations!!

Si Vis etc

Dan

#657423 - 04/28/01 01:57 PM Re: Flight Models?  
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Gryphon Offline
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Dann: Hey Dann, I haven't forgotten about you...I'm running into a snag or two getting a couple of add-ons squared away in the game. I'm working on it over at WW2F Online and it looks like I am coming down the home-stretch on them, so, I'll be test flying the flight models shortly. Just wanted to update you.....

Thanks!
Gryphon

#657424 - 04/30/01 04:51 PM Re: Flight Models?  

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Gryphon,

Thanks for the update; take your time!!!

Si Vis etc

Dan

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