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#4638613 - 11/20/23 12:23 PM Bloody Tarawa - 80 Years  
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Eighty Years Today












Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#4638614 - 11/20/23 01:04 PM Re: Bloody Tarawa - 80 Years [Re: F4UDash4]  
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I've known about the battle since I started my serious WWII reading back in high school but I just read up some more on it and I learned two interesting things I didn't know before:

1. The Japanese defenders numbered only about 4,500. It's amazing to me how much of a fierce defense they put up with such a relatively small force. It just goes to show how well prepared their defenses were.

2. The Tarawa atoll today is part of the Republic of Kiribati.

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 11/20/23 01:05 PM.

“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4638620 - 11/20/23 02:08 PM Re: Bloody Tarawa - 80 Years [Re: F4UDash4]  
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If you mention TARAWA, you have to mention this.

This was a documentary filmed by a Marine Staff Sergeant Norman T. Hatch, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Hatch armed with a .45 caliber pistol and a Bell & Howell hand-cranked Eyemo camera, during the Battle of Tarawa.

It won the 1944 Academy Awards for Best Documentary.

Hollywood producers and distributors thought it was too graphic to be shown to the public.

President Roosevelt's advisors objected this to be shown to the American public because they thought it would create negative public opinion toward America's involvement in World War II.

Roosevelt authorized it to be released to the public and it was shown in movie theaters across the country before movie presentations.

It was the first time since America entered World War II after December 7th, 1941 that the American public were exposed to the reality of the war and what their sons, fathers, brothers, daughters and sisters were dealing with in the Pacific theater.

This film help drive sales of war bonds and motivated more Americans at home to get involved in the war and go work in war factories across the country. Even children were going around door to door in their towns and cities across the country, collecting anything that can be turned into weapons and materiel for the war effort:

pots, pans, old bicycles, tires, scrap metal, used cooking oil (used for explosive).


#4638621 - 11/20/23 02:14 PM Re: Bloody Tarawa - 80 Years [Re: F4UDash4]  
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If you want copy of

With The Marines At Tarawa,

Enter YT link

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AopR3TnxffQ

here

https://tomp3.cc/en27/youtube-downloader

click Start, quality, convert, download

#4638627 - 11/20/23 02:55 PM Re: Bloody Tarawa - 80 Years [Re: F4UDash4]  
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Amazing. 101 years old and he still remembers everything https://www.albertleatribune.com/20...ets-recalls-experiences-of-80-years-ago/

#4638629 - 11/20/23 03:25 PM Re: Bloody Tarawa - 80 Years [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
The Japanese defenders numbered only about 4,500.


Roughly half of which were construction crew, many Korean slave labor.


"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
#4638630 - 11/20/23 03:29 PM Re: Bloody Tarawa - 80 Years [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer


1. The Japanese defenders numbered only about 4,500. It's amazing to me how much of a fierce defense they put up with such a relatively small force. It just goes to show how well prepared their defenses were.



And how unprepared or dismissive the US forces were over simple coconut and sand bunkers. They learned their lesson though and took subsequent landings and Japanese defenses more seriously.

#4638635 - 11/20/23 04:22 PM Re: Bloody Tarawa - 80 Years [Re: wormfood]  
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Originally Posted by wormfood
Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer


1. The Japanese defenders numbered only about 4,500. It's amazing to me how much of a fierce defense they put up with such a relatively small force. It just goes to show how well prepared their defenses were.



And how unprepared or dismissive the US forces were over simple coconut and sand bunkers. They learned their lesson though and took subsequent landings and Japanese defenses more seriously.



Not necessarily dismissive. The Marines wanted a days long pre invasion bombardment, Nimitz gave them 3 hours. His concern was that a long bombardment would give the then still formidable IJN Combined Fleet time to interfere with the operation before the islands were secured.


"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
#4638641 - 11/20/23 05:59 PM Re: Bloody Tarawa - 80 Years [Re: F4UDash4]  
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Originally Posted by F4UDash4
Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
The Japanese defenders numbered only about 4,500.


Roughly half of which were construction crew, many Korean slave labor.

1200 Korean, 1000 Japanese


There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#4638658 - 11/21/23 02:17 AM Re: Bloody Tarawa - 80 Years [Re: F4UDash4]  
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The most fascinating thing I learned about the battle watching the videos in the OP (actually, I mostly listen to the audio versions on my work commute every day) was how the Japanese admiral in charge of the island met his demise.

About mid day on the first day (20 November) his command bunker had been cut off from most of his troops thanks to naval bombardment cutting communications lines. So he decided to move to another bunker location with, hopefully, better communications. He and his entire command staff exited the bunker and began to run to the new CP. At this very moment a destroyer offshore fired a full broadside of airburst 5" shells that just happened to catch the admiral and his staff in the open, killing every one of them. It is speculated, and I believe, that this incident is the only reason that the typical night time Japanese Banzai charge never took place on the first night as was expected by Marines ashore, as there was no command structure remaining to give that order. Had it taken place it is almost certain that in many places where the beachhead was still no more than a couple hundred yards deep the Japanese would have pushed straight through to the shore killing many, many Marines.


Another tidbit I learned was about the tides. Apparently there was no tidal information for the Tarawa atoll available to US forces. Estimates for Tarawa tide levels were made based on other known tides on islands "nearby", except "nearby" meaning only a few hundred up to almost one thousand miles away. It was also not taken into consideration that the "high tide" taking place at invasion time was actually a "neap tide"*. The Higgens boats needed 4 feet of water to cross the reef, planners expected 5 feet but in reality there would only be 3 feet.


* "Neap tides occur when the sun, moon, and Earth form a right angle, and this causes the regular high tides and low tides to become much lower than usual. "


"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
#4638669 - 11/21/23 11:42 AM Re: Bloody Tarawa - 80 Years [Re: F4UDash4]  
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PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
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Thanks for that post F4U. Some fascinating stuff indeed.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”

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