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#4583292 - 10/22/21 01:33 PM Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident  
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edit :Changed title because of nanny state, and people who cant read] (original sensacionalist title was Alec Baldwin charge of murder of cinematographer ....by the internet)

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An investigation is currently underway after actor Alec Baldwin (30 Rock) discharged a prop gun, killing the movie's cinematographer and wounding the director


The Hollywood Reporter has confirmed that a prop firearm discharged on the New Mexico set of Rust has resulted in the death of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins. Director Joel Souza, meanwhile, is said to be in critical condition. Producer and star Alec Baldwin fired the gun, and while an active investigation is underway, no charges have been filed by authorities.

There's every likelihood this was a tragic accident, but something clearly went badly wrong here. Apparently, there was a misfire with blanks, and it's possible the gun wasn't modified properly.

"The entire cast and crew has been absolutely devastated by today’s tragedy, and we send our deepest condolences to Halyna’s family and loved ones," a spokesperson for the movie says. "We have halted production on the film for an undetermined period of time and are fully cooperating with the Santa Fe Police Department’s investigation. We will be providing counseling services to everyone connected to the film as we work to process this awful event."



sauce : https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/alec-baldwin-rust-movie-incident-1235035095/


as a non american who is not gunho but not against firearms either, my honest question is....why are real guns still being used as props in movies ? you can do with fake ones, producers enjoy cgi everything to make it cheaper. blanks will still fire whatever is in the barrel like shotgun,right ?
some heads will roll after this. do you think that * political side* as herefor mentioned as to avoid pwec will use this to a wide ban on sets ?
you can easily make fully functioning replicas to replace with a cgi double to get the actors the feel and even weight.

Last edited by CyBerkut; 10/22/21 02:13 PM. Reason: Correcting thread title
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#4583294 - 10/22/21 01:40 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and quite honestly insulting.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583296 - 10/22/21 01:43 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Exactly, I've not seen a single source claim he has been charged with anything, let alone murder. But then Blade has never met a tale of misfortune that didn't make him giddy with delight. This is likely just wishful thinking.

So any source confirming the charges? The article you linked specifically states no charges have been filed.


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#4583297 - 10/22/21 01:47 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and quite honestly insulting.


and thus i confirmed you are a bot, good for postings but cant get the nuances of human humour. as it is written in the small text (BY THE INTERNET) as in, people are blaming him, the quote i gave you and the source, give you the facts. the title is misleading on purpose.do i really need to add a joking before the quote ?

edit>you too Dbond missed the sensasionalist headline joke......woosh.....

Last edited by Blade_RJ; 10/22/21 01:48 PM.
#4583299 - 10/22/21 01:50 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Yeah, because that was clear, right?

How could I be so blind?


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#4583304 - 10/22/21 02:04 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Originally Posted by Blade_RJ
Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and quite honestly insulting.


and thus i confirmed you are a bot, good for postings but cant get the nuances of human humour. as it is written in the small text (BY THE INTERNET) as in, people are blaming him, the quote i gave you and the source, give you the facts. the title is misleading on purpose.do i really need to add a joking before the quote ?

edit>you too Dbond missed the sensasionalist headline joke......woosh.....


Titling a thread "Alec Baldwin CHARGED with the MURDER of cinematrographer on set" isn't humorous, it's just a falsehood. Changing it.

#4583306 - 10/22/21 02:08 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: CyBerkut]  
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Originally Posted by CyBerkut
Originally Posted by Blade_RJ
Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and quite honestly insulting.


and thus i confirmed you are a bot, good for postings but cant get the nuances of human humour. as it is written in the small text (BY THE INTERNET) as in, people are blaming him, the quote i gave you and the source, give you the facts. the title is misleading on purpose.do i really need to add a joking before the quote ?

edit>you too Dbond missed the sensasionalist headline joke......woosh.....


Titling a thread "Alec Baldwin CHARGED with the MURDER of cinematrographer on set" isn't humorous, it's just a falsehood. Changing it.


i just did, did you rechange, or you override what i did?

#4583307 - 10/22/21 02:18 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Originally Posted by Blade_RJ
Originally Posted by CyBerkut
Originally Posted by Blade_RJ
Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and quite honestly insulting.


and thus i confirmed you are a bot, good for postings but cant get the nuances of human humour. as it is written in the small text (BY THE INTERNET) as in, people are blaming him, the quote i gave you and the source, give you the facts. the title is misleading on purpose.do i really need to add a joking before the quote ?

edit>you too Dbond missed the sensasionalist headline joke......woosh.....


Titling a thread "Alec Baldwin CHARGED with the MURDER of cinematrographer on set" isn't humorous, it's just a falsehood. Changing it.


i just did, did you rechange, or you override what i did?


I was changing the original title, apparently at the same time as you. I have now changed again, as your second choice was still placing suspicion upon Alec Baldwin, when it appears they are investigating the prop gun or its handler.

#4583315 - 10/22/21 03:48 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Of course they'd investigate the gun.

After all, guns kill, not people. rolleyes

I guess Baldwin missed the old adage, never point ANY gun at anyone.

Unless of course you have to use it.


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#4583316 - 10/22/21 04:05 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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An actor put a pistol to his head (in a jokingly manner) with a blank in it in 1984, and the force of the 'shot" killed him.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon-Erik_Hexum

Somebody screwed up, or the "weapon malfunctioned".

Last edited by LB4LB; 10/22/21 04:05 PM.
#4583317 - 10/22/21 04:20 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Nixer]  
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Originally Posted by Nixer
Of course they'd investigate the gun.

After all, guns kill, not people. rolleyes

I guess Baldwin missed the old adage, never point ANY gun at anyone.

Unless of course you have to use it.



Huh? What's this ramble about? This accident happened on a MOVIE SET where most likely Badlwin was rehearsing a scene where the director told him to point the gun so that the director and director of photography could see how the scene would look.


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#4583327 - 10/22/21 05:52 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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As many here know (and noted above), blanks are not "risk free". It will be interesting to eventually read the "mechanical details" of how discharging this "blank" caused a death.

i.e. Were they "filming" a scene or was it an accidental discharge nominally "off camera"? Did a "particle" unexpectedly fly out of the barrel? Was the barrel too close to someone and the gas discharge did it? etc

Was it even an innocent accident or something more unconscionable (e.g. was the gun "jokingly" pointed at someone and discharged)?


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#4583328 - 10/22/21 05:54 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Well it wasn't a blank, it was a live round, according to reports.


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#4583329 - 10/22/21 05:54 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Allen]  
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Originally Posted by Allen
As many here know (and noted above), blanks are not "risk free". It will be interesting to eventually read the "mechanical details" of how discharging this "blank" caused a death.




It was not a blank. One of the Hollywood production unions already confirmed that the gun had a live round in the chamber.

edit: Dang! ninja'd by DBond!

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 10/22/21 05:56 PM.

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#4583330 - 10/22/21 05:56 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Told ya!

(about being a ninja I mean)


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#4583333 - 10/22/21 06:10 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Read the report. According to reports, the first impressions are a "live round" in a real firearm without a "safety block" in the barrel. The fact that it penetrated one person and hit another indicates a "penetrating projectile" of some sort.

How did a live round get on a movie set in the first place (it that's what happened, its totally unjustifiable in my mind)? There seems to be more to this one.


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#4583337 - 10/22/21 06:15 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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One News cast sated Baldwin said that who gave me a Hot Gun ? or words to that effect. It could mean: 1 loaded with blanks Or 1 loaded with real Bullets Used in some scenes for realism and special effects .In any case the Basic Firearm Safety Rules that He did break was not to point a Firearm at anything that U do not want destroyed and always check to make sure its empty He is partly to blame for Loss of life.




May the lovely Woman Rest In Peace and be in our thoughts.


Last edited by carrick58; 10/22/21 06:18 PM.
#4583361 - 10/22/21 10:02 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Interesting info about the union people leaving due to safety concerns. Brings up the possibility that someone might have wanted to make a point or something, or just that it really was an unsafe environment.

https://www.latimes.com/entertainme...-baldwin-rust-camera-crew-walked-off-set


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#4583362 - 10/22/21 10:05 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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^ If that's the case, that's one sick #%&*$#.

#4583365 - 10/22/21 10:35 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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The comment about someone making a point was just conjecture on my part, and there's no evidence to support it, other than people complaining about safety and leaving the set.

There was this comment in the article, which also brings into question whether it was an actual bullet, although I don't know what else would be able to cause what happened:

A source close to union said Local 44 does not know what projectile was in the gun and clarified that “live” is an industry term that refers to a gun being loaded with some material such as a blank ready for filming.


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#4583366 - 10/22/21 10:41 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: carrick58]  
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Originally Posted by carrick58
.In any case the Basic Firearm Safety Rules that He did break was not to point a Firearm at anything that U do not want destroyed and always check to make sure its empty He is partly to blame for Loss of life.

Unsupportable at this point, carrick. Lots of movies dating back to The Great Train Robbery have used P.O.V. shots at/into the camera. Guess who is usually right behind the camera? Camera operator, cinematographer and the director. Actors would not be responsible for securing and inspecting firearms, there would be a prop master or armorer for that. So while there certainly could be some blame there, it's too soon to say that yet...


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#4583369 - 10/22/21 11:02 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Watch Bret Baer on FOX just now. He reported that the "weapon" had missed fired before and there was concern from the crew about safety before today. He also reported working conditions were why six crew members walked of the set hours before in protest.

#4583370 - 10/22/21 11:04 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4583377 - 10/23/21 03:22 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Originally Posted by Blade_RJ


Excellent, just what I needed to form a serious response. Thanks dude! ...Oh wait...

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#4583378 - 10/23/21 03:39 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Rick_Rawlings]  
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Originally Posted by Rick_Rawlings
Originally Posted by carrick58
.In any case the Basic Firearm Safety Rules that He did break was not to point a Firearm at anything that U do not want destroyed and always check to make sure its empty. He is partly to blame for Loss of life.

Actors would not be responsible for securing and inspecting firearms, there would be a prop master or armorer for that. So while there certainly could be some blame there, it's too soon to say that yet...


My dad gave me an old Mossberg .22 when I was about 10. He had already been hammering firearm safety into me since the first time I touched that .22 Mossberg. I was well educated that I WAS ABSOLUTELY RESPONSIBLE for that weapon and that it could kill someone.

I guess Baldwin missed that class...and you also Mr. Rawlings.

edit: Good to see your skewed viewpoint as usual though. Hopefully, there are zero firearms in your household.

Wouldn't want an accident.

Last edited by Nixer; 10/23/21 03:49 AM. Reason: Skewed Viewpoints

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#4583395 - 10/23/21 11:44 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Nixer]  
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Originally Posted by Nixer
My dad gave me an old Mossberg .22 when I was about 10. He had already been hammering firearm safety into me since the first time I touched that .22 Mossberg. I was well educated that I WAS ABSOLUTELY RESPONSIBLE for that weapon and that it could kill someone.


Agree -- FWIW: my background similar.

Grew up in the hills of Virginia (literally). One of the couple things I remember from before age 4 -- at age 2 my Father took me into the woods and let me watch him shoot a pistol at a tree. Taught gun safety.

The "shooting accident" I eye-witnessed. When I was 5 standing in the kitchen, my Father's shooting buddy handed him a "supposedly empty" pistol to consider buying. My father aimed it out the back window but kids were playing out there; so he aimed at the kitchen sink (i.e. never aim a gun towards people for any reason -- unless you intend to use it) -- and pulled the trigger on the "empty gun" -- BANG -- a very damaged kitchen sink. He and that same buddy took me into the woods at age 6 and we really went over it all.

I became an NRA Life Member at 16. I follow all the safety protocols without exception.

Regarding a value of gun ownership: Our house was broken into 17 years ago as we lay in bed. Now living in a peaceful Suburb in Ohio, I had no loaded guns in the house. They were all locked up.

As the "flashlight light" from the "bad person" came down the hall towards the bedroom, I faked it -- loudly told my wife to call the cops -- and I would "take care of these guys". They ran out the open window they used to get in. The cops investigated the whole house. Found proof of the "break in" (It wasn't a dream). Saw my guns. They said breaking into occupied houses was extremely rare in our Suburb because 1/3 of the residents were armed. So, gun owners occasionally save unarmed neighbors from having to face down criminals in their own home.


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#4583396 - 10/23/21 11:59 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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While I am a strong adherent to the 4 rules of firearm safety, I have to agree with Rick_Rawlings that things are different on a movie set, and also that it is still too early to say who is to blame.

What are the safety protocols for guns on movie sets?

Some recent information on what transpired:

Alec Baldwin didn't know weapon had live round before fatally shooting cinematographer, warrant says

As Hollywood practices go, it appears that actor Baldwin is not responsible for checking the chamber(s) / barrel. Producer Baldwin could potentially be looking at civil liability though.

From what that second link says, I would think that Armorer Gutierrez, and/or Assistant Director Hall have the largest legal problem(s), depending on how the specifics are determined.

It's still early in the process. More will come to light in due time.

Edit: I should probably point out that I am no fan of Alec Baldwin. In fact, I have a very low opinion of the man, to put it mildly. Nonetheless, the incident and its fallout do not rest upon that.

Last edited by CyBerkut; 10/23/21 12:07 PM.
#4583397 - 10/23/21 12:16 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4583399 - 10/23/21 12:26 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: CyBerkut]  
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Originally Posted by CyBerkut
As Hollywood practices go, it appears that actor Baldwin is not responsible for checking the chamber(s) / barrel. Producer Baldwin could potentially be looking at civil liability though.


A good statement of the current situation. More investigation is warranted to determine culpability. For example, I just read this:

Quote
"Baldwin’s stunt double accidentally fired two rounds Saturday after being told that the gun was “cold” — lingo for a weapon that doesn’t have any ammunition, including blanks, two crew members who witnessed the episode told the Los Angeles Times."


What "fired two rounds" means was not clear (i.e. Blank or Live?).


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#4583409 - 10/23/21 02:27 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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What a mess they are in. Personally, I don't like and won't watch Alec in movies. His convictions and mine are very dissimilar. But I would never wish this tragedy on him. And I would think it wrong to hold him accountable, no matter how brain dead he is, because he is an actor and dependent on others to make his props work and safe. The failure would be with the armorer, from my understanding of how they work. And also if they have any 'rules' about pointing 'guns' at people on the set. You can obviously never be too careful doing that. With guns, there are two types of shooting when you don't mean to: Accidental Discharge, and Negligent Discharge. Almost everything can turn a supposed 'Accidental" discharge into Negligence. You not checking the weapon, not securing the weapon, or being unsafe with the weapon is never and 'Accident'. My point: Someone was Negligent in making sure that the Actor didn't get a gun that could hurt someone.


~Bill

In my defense, I was left unsupervised...
#4583412 - 10/23/21 02:36 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Allen]  
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Originally Posted by Allen


The "shooting accident" I eye-witnessed. When I was 5 standing in the kitchen, my Father's shooting buddy handed him a "supposedly empty" pistol to consider buying. My father aimed it out the back window but kids were playing out there; so he aimed at the kitchen sink (i.e. never aim a gun towards people for any reason -- unless you intend to use it) -- and pulled the trigger on the "empty gun" -- BANG -- a very damaged kitchen sink. He and that same buddy took me into the woods at age 6 and we really went over it all.

Why didn't your father check to make sure the gun wasn't loaded?


There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#4583416 - 10/23/21 03:06 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: KraziKanuK]  
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Originally Posted by KraziKanuK
Why didn't your father check to make sure the gun wasn't loaded?


Because he stupidly believed his gun-aficionado friend would never hand him a loaded gun. Pretty much the same excuse being used by the Actor in the subject situation. Its never an excuse. Fortunately, my Father did use the precaution of never aiming any gun (loaded or unloaded) at, or near, people -- he wasn't completely stupid.

Rather than trust a stage hand (who may have nefarious motives), actors who will be using real guns in scenes should be taught basic gun safety and how to check. Heck, basic safety is easy/quick to learn and checking for live rounds only takes seconds to do in most cases -- so easy a child can do it.


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#4583418 - 10/23/21 03:10 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Bill_Grant]  
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Originally Posted by Bill_Grant
And I would think it wrong to hold him accountable, no matter how brain dead he is, because he is an actor and dependent on others to make his props work and safe.


Too early and not enough information for me to agree with you on that. Hopefully the people who witnessed this tell the truth about what happened.


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4583427 - 10/23/21 04:42 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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I don’t understand why they had a live round on set. That is if the early info is correct about the round.

Early info is usually wrong info.


Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4583428 - 10/23/21 04:55 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4583432 - 10/23/21 05:27 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Crane Hunter]  
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Originally Posted by Crane Hunter
Worth a read:


Great link.

The women in charge of the guns seems to have been unqualified. Trained -- but lacking confidence regarding gun handling; and, thus, a candidate to make a mistake someday.

Per experienced firearms handling staff the Basic rule was: No live ammo on set, never point a gun at a real person (even behind a camera) and pull the trigger (just setup so it looks like that on film). Etc.

I.e. For films, they're merely requiring that strict/basic Gun Safety rules be followed.


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#4583444 - 10/23/21 07:03 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Deadline also cites an unnamed source who said a gun had gone off 'in a cabin' while someone was holding it, days prior to the shooting that killed Hutchins.

'A gun had two misfires in a closed cabin. They just fired loud pops – a person was just holding it in their hands and it went off,' they said, apparently referring to unintentional discharges.


See what I said about Accidental or Negligent discharges. Guns don't "just go off" These people have no idea how to handle a gun, real or otherwise.


~Bill

In my defense, I was left unsupervised...
#4583446 - 10/23/21 07:06 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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What a difference some training makes....


~Bill

In my defense, I was left unsupervised...
#4583449 - 10/23/21 07:23 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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after firearms were accidentally discharged three times - including once by Baldwin's stunt double who had been told the gun was not loaded, and twice in a closed cabin. "

Say what you want about gun safety, its not his job to check it. And after 3 misfires that would be time the producers should halted production and closely review the handling or safety of guns and if need replace or supervise their armorer. So i dont blame alec on the shooting, but if he is a producer (even if just in title as it is common these days) and he was aware of the misfiring before, then that is on him for neglicence.

#4583462 - 10/23/21 09:42 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Bill_Grant]  
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Originally Posted by Bill_Grant



What a difference some training makes....


Ayup! I was thinking about the John Wick movies and Keanu Reeves, myself. I would like to see some behind the scenes footage of how they filmed the scenes where close range shooting is occurring.

#4583470 - 10/23/21 11:32 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Mr Rawlings: The laws hold Individuals Responsible for their Acts. For example, A neighbor steals a cow. U dont get arrested for it. The individual that committed the crime does. Even Aristotle back in 384-322 BCE wrote that an individual is responsible for his action. Our current laws also reflect that ethic. Mr Baldwin pointed the gun, pulled the trigger and a person lost their life with another hurt. In this case I think will be just a tragic accident, According to reports of the Safety requirements for film productions The prop master should be the last person to handle the weapon . In this case , the Assistant director took the firearm off a table The new inexperience prop master/ armorer was in the area. ( If Real it should have been in a locked box ) assuming it was clear and gave it to the actor saying it was cold ( meaning ok to use ) Mr Baldwin then used it. ( Re- ported ) If The Problem here is Safety procedures/ Firearm Training were not followed or intentionally dis regarded for what ever reasons. Added to, I doubt if any time or money were spent on Gun Handling for the Actor because he would have followed Nixer's advice which is the same as an Ex FBI Officers on the News. In summation, The actor is at fault in lack of safety training or common sense around deadly weapons causing Death and injury. He is listed as a Producer who are among those that coordinates , , Oversees Safety on a Film production which may explain all the problems reported and turning a blind eye ? I agree the Asst Director was Negligent and just dumb for assuming a gun on a a table was Safe then giving it to an actor ., But Mr Baldwin pointed the gun took a life and caused injury and He helped to create the environment for the tragedy as a producer he allowed his Production Company to be negligent in common sense Safety Procedures with no supervision for the Armorer when 2 accidental discharges occurred days before As reported to the police and News. There is a chance that Mr. Baldwin will be charged with Manslaughter due to Negligent s. On the Money side, Wrongful Death is the beginning The inexperienced Armorer ? The assistant Director ?

And what if ? a disgruntled employee slipped to the table and inserted the shell t that the armorer removed after the shot ?



Last edited by carrick58; 10/24/21 02:31 AM.
#4583471 - 10/23/21 11:36 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Ref to John Wick films: I also would like to see behind scenes of his Gun Ballet's They truly changed gun handling in films

#4583474 - 10/24/21 12:52 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Bill_Grant]  
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Originally Posted by Bill_Grant
Quote
Deadline also cites an unnamed source who said a gun had gone off 'in a cabin' while someone was holding it, days prior to the shooting that killed Hutchins.

'A gun had two misfires in a closed cabin. They just fired loud pops – a person was just holding it in their hands and it went off,' they said, apparently referring to unintentional discharges.


See what I said about Accidental or Negligent discharges. Guns don't "just go off" These people have no idea how to handle a gun, real or otherwise.


I had a roommate in 1995 who had a lot of guns. Grew up with this guy. Not a dumb person. He stored his rifles in a gun safe. He only had rifles, no handguns. Usually a proper gun safe kind of makes you think the person is responsible enough?

He blasted a round one night right in our kitchen while doing whatever he was doing with the rifle. In a 2 bedroom apartment. I was standing 5 feet away. The bullet went straight through the wall to the outside. We never found any trace of either the bullet or a second impact point.

He said (with extremely wide open eyes) "I don't know why it went off!".

I replied "Because first the gun was LOADED, then you somehow DEPRESSED THE TRIGGER".

Ready for a kicker? This was the second time this happened - the first was before he lived with me, there was this hole in a dresser he had from it. I actually knew of that incident before we co-habitated, but it'd been a few years back and I figured he wouldn't do that twice (again I will say this guy wasn't someone I considered stupid).

Another kicker? This guy had a third incident a few years later - I wasn't living with him then.

But hey, DRIVING is a privilege and not a right!

#4583475 - 10/24/21 01:24 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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That gun story reminds me of a train accident tale.

You would imagine that it would be nearly impossible for a train to hit a car, right? After all, the train is big, loud, and impossible to not notice. However, they occasionally hit cars primarily because the locals grow so accustomed to their noise and presence that they simply tune them out.

I reckon the same happens with guns and their associated safety protocols.


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#4583490 - 10/24/21 09:19 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Allen]  
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Originally Posted by Allen
Rather than trust a stage hand (who may have nefarious motives), actors who will be using real guns in scenes should be taught basic gun safety and how to check. Heck, basic safety is easy/quick to learn and checking for live rounds only takes seconds to do in most cases -- so easy a child can do it.


It's not that simple.

For some scenes (especially for a western like here, front of revolver closeups, loading a gun from your belt ammo) you'll need cartridges with a projectile in them. Usually those are empty cases with no powder. How should an actor check if it's a dud round or a live round?

That's btw half of the story how Brandon Lee died on set.

Yeah, I guess you could use fired primers or holes in the case side to mark them as safe. And expect an actor to check every round?
For some scenes again this might be visible to the audience, so modified cases might spoil the camera shot/angle.

Also, how should an actor check if you hand him a magazine full of blanks (or a Henry/Wichester...), to make sure there isn't a live round in the stack somewhere?

The real question is how a live round made it onto set to begin with. My assumption would be they needed dud rounds, and one wasn't modified.

#4583495 - 10/24/21 11:52 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Good post RSC.


Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4583496 - 10/24/21 12:25 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: carrick58]  
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Originally Posted by carrick58
Mr Rawlings: The laws hold Individuals Responsible for their Acts. For example, A neighbor steals a cow. U dont get arrested for it. The individual that committed the crime does. Even Aristotle back in 384-322 BCE wrote that an individual is responsible for his action. Our current laws also reflect that ethic. Mr Baldwin pointed the gun, pulled the trigger and a person lost their life with another hurt. In this case I think will be just a tragic accident, According to reports of the Safety requirements for film productions The prop master should be the last person to handle the weapon . In this case , the Assistant director took the firearm off a table The new inexperience prop master/ armorer was in the area. ( If Real it should have been in a locked box ) assuming it was clear and gave it to the actor saying it was cold ( meaning ok to use ) Mr Baldwin then used it. ( Re- ported ) If The Problem here is Safety procedures/ Firearm Training were not followed or intentionally dis regarded for what ever reasons. Added to, I doubt if any time or money were spent on Gun Handling for the Actor because he would have followed Nixer's advice which is the same as an Ex FBI Officers on the News. In summation, The actor is at fault in lack of safety training or common sense around deadly weapons causing Death and injury. He is listed as a Producer who are among those that coordinates , , Oversees Safety on a Film production which may explain all the problems reported and turning a blind eye ? I agree the Asst Director was Negligent and just dumb for assuming a gun on a a table was Safe then giving it to an actor ., But Mr Baldwin pointed the gun took a life and caused injury and He helped to create the environment for the tragedy as a producer he allowed his Production Company to be negligent in common sense Safety Procedures with no supervision for the Armorer when 2 accidental discharges occurred days before As reported to the police and News. There is a chance that Mr. Baldwin will be charged with Manslaughter due to Negligent s. On the Money side, Wrongful Death is the beginning The inexperienced Armorer ? The assistant Director ?

And what if ? a disgruntled employee slipped to the table and inserted the shell t that the armorer removed after the shot ?




If you listen the western legal mindset, he is still responsible for the unintentional murder of a human being. He should have test the gun before to use it, to be sure there was not a real bullet inside. He would be a punishment a little bit soft than in a case where he did intentionally but it is still a punishment.

This is a very strange story. Some people told me the gun was used to shoot for fun the day before or a couple of hours before to start working by a person of the staff and they forgot to remove the real bullets.

If this is true...

Anyway, a very strange story!


I speak many languages one of them is cesky
#4583510 - 10/24/21 03:40 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: oldgrognard]  
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Originally Posted by oldgrognard
Good post RSC.

Thanks OG. Coming from you, for a non-gun-owner like me (too many legal fees and complications I can't be bothered with currently) that feels like being knighted. biggrin

It does seem to me to be a reasonable theory.

However, if it's true they were using the gun for fun plinking the day before, and then brought it onto the set someone should be strung up by their balls or equivalent female parts.

Also wondered if it might make sense to partially block the barrel on film guns. But I guess the risk of injury from the ensuing handgrenade (in case of a live round mixed in) isn't much better than the chance to not hit someone with the bullet.

#4583515 - 10/24/21 04:41 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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I don't know if Hollywood productions make regular use of partially obstructed barrels, or not. I could see the use of such barrels having their own challenges / issues.

A "blank" round (one that has primer & powder, but no bullet) still has to have something in front of the powder to keep it contained in the cartridge... a cardboard / plastic / paper / thin wax barrier, or even the cartridge walls folded in. So you end up with the potential for that engineered partial obstruction to gather more material and become much more obstructed... which can lead to bad things happening.

The armorer has supposedly said that she wasn't sure she was ready for that job. She is Thell Reed's daughter, and one would think she would be experienced enough to know her way around firearms & firearms safety. That doesn't mean she had enough experience on Hollywood production practices though, which may be where her supposed sense of insufficient preparedness stems from.

It has been reported that the Assistant Director grabbed the gun off of a table, announced it was a cold gun, and handed it to Baldwin. I'd like to know why he felt justified in proclaiming it was a cold gun, etc. Did the armorer tell him that, or did he assume it? Or, as seems unlikely, was something nefarious going on?

Shoestring budget with cost cutting leading to shortcuts seems to be the likely culprit at this point. Cutting corners is frequently the cause of mishaps.

#4583520 - 10/24/21 05:36 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Luv reading these posts so much information and input.

If the stories are true of Plinking the night before then they must be real Guns using Blanks or capable of firing Real Ammo. The Armorer/ Prop master who I believe is required to keep them locked up and giving each weapon a final check before allowing use made a serious mistake and my well be charged / sued In addition to Mr Baldwin's production Company for not following or supervising the In experienced Armorer after Malfunction of guns were made.

Some Re Inactors approach the safety problems of Western style weapons in their Public Shoot Outs by Not aiming at a person, dummy ammo or ammo with out a primer or power in Belts for Looks, One person to load/ check guns and blank cartridges. and following all required Industry Safety Rules. Another way is the Rules of the Cowboy Action Shooting which is a closed Range setup Guns are Supervised when loading or unloading and everyone at the location is a Safety Officer that can stop the routine at any time when seeing rules not followed by anyone. No Free Passes.

https://youtu.be/q3pUgNFQpZs

https://youtu.be/QZqn1V05UoQ


Last edited by carrick58; 10/24/21 05:54 PM.
#4583524 - 10/24/21 06:49 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4583546 - 10/25/21 07:58 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Crane Hunter]  
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Originally Posted by Crane Hunter
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Uhm, interesting...

This character is a bit complex


I speak many languages one of them is cesky
#4583554 - 10/25/21 10:48 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Crane isn't known for making politically correct memes. biggrin


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#4583609 - 10/25/21 06:09 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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lol

#4583617 - 10/25/21 07:02 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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RSColonel, you do me too much honor.


Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4583618 - 10/25/21 07:10 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Just when I thought this story couldn't get stranger.

According to the 911 call by the Script Girl ( the Transcript shown on the News. ) She said the Blank Blank " Asst Director is yelling and blaming me for not checking the Gun " Other people stated that The Asst Director gave the Gun and told the Actor It was cold ( safe to fire)
Unbelievable ! Mr Baldwin's Company allowed this crew Guns to play with ? Another Tid Bit that came out : Live Bullets were on the set. ! Who, what, and, why are still unknown. I think the Assistant Director should be De-Nutted.For not checking and Assuming the gun was unloaded. Bottom Line : this Production Company was not concerned with Safety.


Just a Guess : Someone / some ones. had the gun last and went Plinking with live Ammo and never emptied the gun. or maybe it had a misfire so thought it didn't go bang so just leave it inside the weapon Returned it to the Armorer's location. ( thinking she will check it } Next day during production, the armorer placed the guns on a table ( not checking the fire arms or assuming that they were empty the last time or maybe busy doing something else The Asst Director comes along Assumes they have been checked and passes a loaded firearm to the Actor telling him it was cold . A totally preventable tragedy occurs then the Asst Director Blames the Script Girl for his actions. ( she did the right thing during that sad time period Clearly Upset by what happen and being yelled at She Called 911 for Help }

Last edited by carrick58; 10/25/21 07:11 PM.
#4583626 - 10/25/21 10:42 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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From the reading I've done, I see normal movie filming using weapons (real, fake, etc) has very reasonable "film industry standard" procedures to follow. Its a "safety first" meme.

They are actually easy to accomplish (my "a child can do it" meme). Often a double check is required -- i.e. the person who hands the gun to the actor must check just before handing it over -- even though it should have been checked previously that day.

Some individuals "responsible" for doing this, get tired of following all the procedures every day all the time (they are simple, quick, repetitive, boring procedures -- but, part of the job). Per statements by people involved, one of the responsible individuals on this film was known to be of that "irresponsible" type.


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#4583640 - 10/26/21 08:56 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Some of his crew said, Alec was one of those responsible to check the guns before their use

https://rumble.com/vo847o-alec-bald...-checking-gun-rust-crew-member-says.html


I speak many languages one of them is cesky
#4583650 - 10/26/21 10:51 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Gigolety]  
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Originally Posted by Gigolety
Some of his crew said, Alec was one of those responsible to check the guns before their use

https://rumble.com/vo847o-alec-bald...-checking-gun-rust-crew-member-says.html


I'm not an expert on Hollywood film labor laws but since he's one of the producers for the film they may have a point. I guess we'll see how this all pans out.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583663 - 10/26/21 02:50 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Methinks this Gutierrez-Reed wench should have stuck to making Antifa porn.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...illed-cinematographer-pictured-home.html

#4583665 - 10/26/21 03:16 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Crane Hunter]  
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Originally Posted by Crane Hunter
Methinks this Gutierrez-Reed wench should have stuck to making Antifa porn.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...illed-cinematographer-pictured-home.html


Quote
Zak Knight, a pyrotechnic and special effects engineer who is a member of Local 44, told DailyMail.com on Friday that Hutchins' death was caused by a 'cascade of failures' by multiple people: 'There should have never been live rounds on a movie set, that's number one. Number two is every single person on a movie set has a right to inspect a weapon before it's fired. And number three is, there is no reason to ever put a person in front of a weapon that's firing.


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#4583667 - 10/26/21 03:49 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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I take one look at her pictures and know she’s not who I would want managing firearms.


Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4583675 - 10/26/21 05:24 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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This story gets stranger and stranger by the minute.

#4583682 - 10/26/21 06:01 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: oldgrognard]  
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Originally Posted by oldgrognard
I take one look at her pictures and know she’s not who I would want managing firearms.


looking her previous pictures, she can still be salvaged to handle my firearm.
but jesus hwat a transition

#4583691 - 10/26/21 08:14 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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First of all, let me say that I have been a prop master for numerous TV shows and film for over 30 years.
There is so much gross negligence and incompetence to go around with this. First off, the assistant director has no business ever picking up or handling a firearm, let alone handing it off to an actor… this alone is a major violation. The weapon is always examined, verified and managed by the prop master and/or armorer under extremely strict safety measures.

The fact that there were live rounds on set and the firearm was used the morning of for plinking or target practice by some of the crew members is unfathomable. How this was allowed to happen is something that will be investigated to the fullest. This absolutely starts from the top with production creating an extremely reckless environment with complete disregard for the safety and wellbeing of the crew. The production, producers and several crew members that were allowed to disregard the extremely strict safety measures put into place to prevent this type of scenario from happening will all share responsibility in the end.

Last edited by rjetster; 10/26/21 08:27 PM.
#4583700 - 10/26/21 09:40 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Assistant director had been sacked before over gun safety.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-59055138


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#4583714 - 10/27/21 03:17 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4583715 - 10/27/21 03:39 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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She should be held on 1st degree murder charges after setting him up for this.

Baldwin is an idiot gun handler to show it.Never checking first.


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#4583718 - 10/27/21 06:31 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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I have always been taught as a part of very basic firearms safety NEVER to assume a gun is unloaded, even though you’re handed one by someone qualified who says it is. Check it yourself! Yes, the routines are boring and it seems superfluous to check the same gun two or three times innthe space of a minute if it changes hands, but it really would have saved the day here.


In all my years I've never seen the like. It has to be more than a hundred sea miles and he brings us up on his tail. That's seamanship, Mr. Pullings. My God, that's seamanship!
#4583739 - 10/27/21 04:18 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Quote
A number of actors insisted that the proper procedure for handling firearms on set is to personally check the gun, regardless of whether the AD calls out “cold gun.” Also, the proper method of shooting on a set is to use a “dummy point” according to other reports, waiting until the crew and other cast members clear the background before operating the firearm, “cold” or not. A gun is never fired at a person, not even a so-called “prop gun,” according to film experts talking to other media outlets. If that’s the case, then Baldwin has another vector of potential criminal liability.


More public statements of the "common sense" rules that we've already "discussed" in this thread.

But, it is true that some folks who have not been trained in safe firearms handling procedures, might tend to think unwavering adherence to some of these rules represents "overkill" in some situations -- no, they prevent avoidable accidental "deaths" and lesser "wounds".


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#4583745 - 10/27/21 04:56 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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'You just blew my f**king eardrums out!' Rust armorer Hannah Gutierrez-Reed 'discharged weapons without warning and infuriated star Nicolas Cage' on her previous film

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...s-film-infuriated-star-Nicolas-Cage.html

#4583752 - 10/27/21 05:49 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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I wonder what her "credentials" were that showed a working knowledge of fire arms and fire arms safety. I'll wait.....

#4583754 - 10/27/21 06:23 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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I'll be surprised if it was ever more than, woke, cheap and the daughter of someone who was good at it.

This girl was, like, clearly in over her head, and like, said so.


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4583757 - 10/27/21 06:56 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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The hypocrisy of most of Hollywood stars including Alec Baldwin is..."I'm against the NRA and guns in general...UNLESS I can make millions of dollars showing me killing folks with them on screen"

confused


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#4583758 - 10/27/21 07:14 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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The whole industry has made BILLIONS in the last fifty years making movies that use fantasy gun violence to convey vicarious empowerment to their audience. It has been a main staple in just about every movie made. The video game industry has too. The fact that they do this is not the problem. It is their galling hypocrisy about guns that they are constantly virtue signaling that is the issue.

#4583759 - 10/27/21 07:16 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583761 - 10/27/21 07:20 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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“I wonder how it must feel to wrongfully kill someone” - Alec Baldwin.


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#4583764 - 10/27/21 08:00 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Awesome Reading to go with my Coffee I feel a sense of Community.

Just an Update: 16 People in the immediate area while filming or Rehearsing ( no actual film was found of the shooting )
90 to 100 people 0n the set ( still being talked to.)
3 Guns on the table for the Rehearsal 1 Plastic or Rubber, 1 with a strange looking revolver cylinder and a reproduction Colt Peacemaker in .45 Caliber Long Colt

The Police are still checking Ammo Est 500 rds on the set Mixed They think ? Dummy. Blanks, and , Live as in Real bullets
Some on the news conference also said that Charges probably will not be used against the Director ( one of the Victims }

No Charges as yet. Popular TV talk show/News people suggest As both the person and the producer / owner He might as well just Bend Over Multi Millions in law suits are headed his way.


On a different note: The Armorer should learn to Handel Other Things Clearly, shes failed at this profession
Finally, In a past Safety issue Directors have been found guilty ( they have overall authority on a set ) and Charges were brought to bare by Police.

Last edited by carrick58; 10/27/21 08:04 PM.
#4583773 - 10/27/21 10:42 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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This one needs no text if you've seen the movie and know this scene:

[Linked Image]

Attached Files AB.jpg
Last edited by Force10; 10/27/21 10:42 PM.

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#4583781 - 10/28/21 09:31 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: DBond]  
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Originally Posted by DBond
I'll be surprised if it was ever more than, woke, cheap and the daughter of someone who was good at it.

This girl was, like, clearly in over her head, and like, said so.


Yeah, I have the same suspect: she must the daughter of someone important in Hollywood


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#4583790 - 10/28/21 11:41 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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What's for me rather fuzzy is what parts of all the gun handling are actually legally covered, or contractual, or just "best practice" or some such.
What is covered by law, I mean beyond the part about not pointing and shooting (live) guns at people.
Contractual could be the gun handling at the film set - I doubt that there are any specific laws covering (most) of that stuff, but there are contracts signed who's responsible for what. Like separating of weapons used for some live fire excercise from weapons used for filming, and separating ammo.
Or even basic rules you would have on a proper shooting range, like immediately after a shooting excercise, before leaving the shooting position you clear the weapon and ensure it is empty (magazine out, chamber clear, or drum empty on a revolver) before you even turn around and point the weapon anywhere other that is not down the firing range.

There seem to be so many cases of violations of good practice or common sense in gun handling, but which parts of those are actually in violation of what kinds of laws/regulations that actually can be charged against someone?!

I guess the contractual part to be rather difficult to figure out for us, as it would be part of the contracts of the production with the employees/actors/... Except if it was supposed to followed some standard contracts.

Last edited by WhoCares; 10/28/21 11:56 AM.
#4583791 - 10/28/21 11:50 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Then again, this could very well be a percentages thing where you will never have 100% safety. The incident with Brandon Lee in "The Crow" happened in 1993 and I cannot think of another Hollywood film where a death resulted from a firearm between that and "Rust". How many films have been made in those 28 years? At least a couple thousand.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583793 - 10/28/21 12:14 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Then again, this could very well be a percentages thing where you will never have 100% safety. The incident with Brandon Lee in "The Crow" happened in 1993 and I cannot think of another Hollywood film where a death resulted from a firearm between that and "Rust". How many films have been made in those 28 years? At least a couple thousand.

Often I would be tempted to agree with such judgement, but in this case there seems to have gone so many things wrong - it seems to me more like negligence, maybe exactly for the same reason you gave, that nothing has happened for such a long time...

But I am sure for ongoing and future productions this incident will lead to everybody involved to pay so much more attention.
Especially the actors may want to get some extra gun handling training to actually qualify them to evaluate the weapon that is handed to them - I mean it's in their own interest, in the end they are the ones doing the pointing and shooting, and nobody wants to end in Baldwins position...



Last edited by WhoCares; 10/28/21 12:25 PM.
#4583795 - 10/28/21 12:23 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: WhoCares]  
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Originally Posted by WhoCares


But I am sure for ongoing and future productions this incident will lead to everybody involved to pay so much more attention, especially the actors may want to get some extra gun handling training to actually qualify them to evaluate the weapon that is handed to them - I mean it's in their own interest, in the end they are the ones doing the pointing and shooting, and nobody wants to end in Baldwins position...



Oh yes, this will absolutely be the case.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583796 - 10/28/21 12:50 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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You guys have a lot more faith in people than I do, expecting this incident, this cascade of errors, of unprofessionalism, of thinking everything is someone else's responsibility, will lead to a different mindset among the people who make films. Sure, at first, there will be a big show about it, with signage saying things like "all weapons checked here, no exceptions"

Instead, I think you'll see the guns further stigmatized, blamed and feared, leading to even less practical knowledge about them, and increasing the chances of a repeat.

This isn't going to cause moviemakers and others on set to want to get hands on and learn, but to distance themselves from the evil guns that killed Halyna.


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4583804 - 10/28/21 02:58 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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There is too much money and political hay to be made for Hollywood to turn away from making movies that have firearms, even ones where firearms are pointed at the cameras.

Will there be some fools who simply take someone else's word for the gun being "cold"? I suspect so. But I also suspect there will be camera operators / cinematographers / directors who see the wisdom of being involved with the weapons check right before a scene is shot.

That 28 year period of no fatalities didn't just happen by pure luck. There clearly were some standardized practices in the business that worked well enough when they were adhered to.

Numerous reports / opinions appear to be coalescing around failures by multiple people involved in the production of the Rust movie.

In the Human Performance Improvement field, the Swiss Cheese model is often referred to:
[Linked Image]

"Accident" isn't really the best term to use there. "Adverse event" would be more accurate.

It appears there were at least 3 people who could have been the layer whose hole didn't line up to allow the hazard to get through. You can also think of rules/practices such as 'No real ammunition allowed on site' as additional layers that could/should have served to block adverse events occurring.

It's been widely reported that Rust was a low budget project. Apparently, corners were cut, etc.

[Linked Image]

28 years of Hollywood productions without a fatal shooting would seem to indicate that the industry has some effective practices in place. This movie appears to have dropped some layers of protection.

#4583806 - 10/28/21 03:14 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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I expect that they will clamp down with the wrong solutions.


Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4583808 - 10/28/21 03:26 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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I suspect that it will be "spun" into a cautionary tale of how bad guns are. Something like a ban on single action revolvers. They are far too dangerous. biggrin

Last edited by LB4LB; 10/28/21 03:47 PM.
#4583833 - 10/28/21 07:55 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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WhoCares : I also would like to know know the meaning of Contractual obligations on a film set and laws concerning Gun safety. Great Question.

2 more Tid Bits : 3 shells were seen in the Gun Who, what, when, and why ?
The Sheriff stated that there was complacency on the Set ( What does that Mean ? }

A question that I have is can they let Baldwin Walk ? { No Crime committed } Hes a Star, Money, Political connections, Can generate money coming into New Mexico .


Cyberkut: MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM, Cheese.

Last edited by carrick58; 10/28/21 07:58 PM.
#4583840 - 10/28/21 09:55 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: oldgrognard]  
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Originally Posted by oldgrognard
I expect that they will clamp down with the wrong solutions.

Guaranteed!


~Bill

In my defense, I was left unsupervised...
#4583841 - 10/28/21 10:05 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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In other Hollywood news:

Stormtrooper accidentally discharges 238 live laser shots on the set of "The Mandalorian" ; thankfully no one hurt.


~Bill

In my defense, I was left unsupervised...
#4583842 - 10/28/21 10:13 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Bill_Grant]  
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Originally Posted by Bill_Grant
In other Hollywood news:

Stormtrooper accidentally discharges 238 live laser shots on the set of "The Mandalorian" ; thankfully no one hurt.


[Linked Image]

#4583899 - 10/29/21 04:39 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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I wanted follow up on this story,but I seem to circle back to the last Sheriff statement. " Her pockets were searched for bullets " Cant get the image out of my head.

Attached Files imagesAromorer I.jpgimagesReed.jpg
#4583928 - 10/29/21 08:15 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Read this on another discussion board and thought it had some good info.

————————

But there is also another dimension to this tragedy. Industry (union) standards require that whenever a scene is shot that is meant to simulate a view from in front of the shooter, such that the muzzle of the gun is pointed at the camera, a remote camera with no person behind it should be used. Even YouTubers that make home-brew firearms videos know this. But the police search warrant affidavit shows that this set was using only a single, manned camera, which Baldwin pointed the gun at to achieve an effect.

As the producer, he made the conscious decision to make this movie "on the cheap", to include substandard housing and pay for his crew, use of a single camera, and hiring a new and inexperienced "armorer" with no observable qualifications for the job. All of these errors stacked up to produce one tragic death and another person wounded.


Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4583935 - 10/29/21 10:19 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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I agree,

Another point is that the film was to be shot in New Mexico which according to Web sites has no Movie Safety ( using guns ) requirements. ( Other states do have Gun/ pyrotechnics requirements/ Laws ) A decision made by the Production Company ( Mr Baldwin's ) However, It does have laws regarding the loss of life even if accidental. Referred to as Involuntary Manslaughter. and other lesser chargers. Just my 2 Cents, The Actor seems to have contributed more Bad decisions, to the Tragedy than the Assistant Director ( Who lawyer-ed up ) and the Armorer put together.

#4583942 - 10/29/21 11:58 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Rule zero for working on set with Alec Baldwin. Check the shooting schedule, and make sure your name/title isn't on it.

11:00 scene high street.
12:00 lunch
13:00 rehearsal church interior
13:10 cinematographer and director.
13:11 close set.

#4583948 - 10/30/21 10:44 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Lieste]  
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Originally Posted by Lieste
Rule zero for working on set with Alec Baldwin. Check the shooting schedule, and make sure your name/title isn't on it.

11:00 scene high street.
12:00 lunch
13:00 rehearsal church interior
13:10 cinematographer and director.
13:11 close set.


If you name is on the schedule, sign a life insurance :-)))


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#4584008 - 10/30/21 08:59 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4584042 - 10/31/21 10:20 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4584372 - 11/04/21 01:54 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Reed's lawyer's are saying it was sabotage. Somebody put live rounds in with the dummy rds Ammo box while no one was attending it. Talk about Muddy Waters. However, it does seem to point out her Contractual Obligations did not include Ammo Never mind the Industry Safety
Standards called for by the Union. and just common sense.

#4584390 - 11/04/21 10:39 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: carrick58]  
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Originally Posted by carrick58
Reed's lawyer's are saying it was sabotage. Somebody put live rounds in with the dummy rds Ammo box while no one was attending it.



Good luck proving that in court unless they actually find fingerprints or some other forensic evidence.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4584397 - 11/04/21 11:48 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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You do have to admit Baldwin hasn't shot a single crew member either. He got a Twofer.

#4586217 - 11/30/21 11:37 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4586237 - 12/01/21 02:00 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Seems like a case of negligence and reason to prosecute someone.

Also seems like a case of skimping on quality lower-tier crew members which may have been avoided had they paid top dollar for these critical roles that were responsible for the failure. Top actors draw audiences only if they are kept alive.


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#4586264 - 12/01/21 04:57 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: CyBerkut]  
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Wow.

So basically, movie ammunition being handled like the grapbox at a dollar store, everyone brought some leftovers from other projects...

#4586265 - 12/01/21 05:33 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4586272 - 12/01/21 09:27 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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This just in...Alec Baldwin says he didn't pull the trigger:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/worl...rust-shooting/ar-AARm0Sh?ocid=uxbndlbing


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#4586273 - 12/01/21 09:30 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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So, it was haunted? It just fired itself? It was his stuntman?

#4586274 - 12/01/21 09:34 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Force10]  
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Originally Posted by Force10
This just in...Alec Baldwin says he didn't pull the trigger:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/worl...rust-shooting/ar-AARm0Sh?ocid=uxbndlbing



Say what?

How?

Is this man even human? Or is he a pure psychopath?

How can he have absolutely no empathy or accountability?

#4586275 - 12/01/21 10:13 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: wormfood]  
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Originally Posted by wormfood
So, it was haunted? It just fired itself? It was his stuntman?


there were two cases of guns going of on their on days before.

#4586278 - 12/01/21 11:03 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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That’s why I said doing that interview was probably not the smart thing. What he said isn’t going to help him. It makes him look like he is willing to lie to cover things up. People are going to think that he isn’t interested in the truth or has something to hide. It will diminish not add to his stature.

It was a stupid thing to say.


Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4586282 - 12/02/21 02:07 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: oldgrognard]  
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Originally Posted by oldgrognard
That’s why I said doing that interview was probably not the smart thing. What he said isn’t going to help him. It makes him look like he is willing to lie to cover things up. People are going to think that he isn’t interested in the truth or has something to hide. It will diminish not add to his stature.

It was a stupid thing to say.

or its on purpose because it will, if he gets flak he can claim he didnt have a fair trial because the jury wasnt impartial.

Last edited by Blade_RJ; 12/02/21 02:08 AM.
#4586283 - 12/02/21 02:54 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4586395 - 12/04/21 02:22 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4586416 - 12/04/21 06:02 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4586420 - 12/04/21 06:16 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4586421 - 12/04/21 06:19 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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What a moron. Who's advising this idiot? Well, he's not listening.

I hope the judge doubles the sentence for stupidity.

Sociopathic narcissist. He deserves to do hard time. Lock him up!


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#4586429 - 12/04/21 09:16 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Oh to see Gutfeld have a SNL-style skit on his night show with Trump playing as Baldwin in an interview denying he pulled the trigger...


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#4586432 - 12/04/21 09:28 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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I noted that in between scenes in which he made efforts to act sad at killing a woman, and taking responsibility for it... he interspersed scenes in which he was clearly denying all personal responsibilities as a human being, an actor, the person who fired the gun, the producer of the movie who had created it as a vanity project etc... and showed more believable emotion about how he had once acted in a movie with Meryl Streep...

I don't think I trust this member of the Film Actor's Guild in a heavily edited, soft-soap interview in which he still failed to be convincing.

Perhaps there is something linking to the next project this cinematographer was going to do after completing Rust? An expose of Holywood sexual exploitation and criminal acts with minors - Halyna Hutchins didn't kill herself. Maybe she knew more about some unpleasant people in Holywood/Media/Government etc than someone was willing to permit. Baldwin as a fall-guy or a motivated person.

#4618955 - 01/19/23 10:55 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Slow system! A person can commit a murder and be free while waiting for charges and leave the country and never have to pay for their crime.
https://apnews.com/article/alec-bal...-movies-22f60cabd837b6b9c3300851094e605a

#4618959 - 01/19/23 11:36 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: NoFlyBoy]  
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Originally Posted by NoFlyBoy
Slow system! A person can commit a murder



Has Baldwin been charged with murder or is that just your insight?


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4618964 - 01/19/23 11:57 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Read it again.

#4618965 - 01/19/23 12:00 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: NoFlyBoy]  
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Originally Posted by NoFlyBoy
Read it again.



Your statement is contradictory. You say he committed murder but is also awaiting charges. If someone is awaiting charges then they haven't committed murder yet. This is why I mentioned your insight. In your mind he already committed murder.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4618990 - 01/19/23 04:15 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4618994 - 01/19/23 05:06 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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New Mexico DA doesn't care who he is.

Last edited by Mr_Blastman; 01/19/23 05:06 PM.
#4618995 - 01/19/23 05:30 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Mr_Blastman]  
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Originally Posted by Mr_Blastman
New Mexico DA doesn't care who he is.



Which is good. The law should be the same for all.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4618999 - 01/19/23 05:47 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Originally Posted by NoFlyBoy
Read it again.


Your statement is contradictory. You say he committed murder but is also awaiting charges. If someone is awaiting charges then they haven't committed murder yet. This is why I mentioned your insight. In your mind he already committed murder.


No it's not what I said.

#4619001 - 01/19/23 05:57 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: NoFlyBoy]  
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Originally Posted by NoFlyBoy
Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Originally Posted by NoFlyBoy
Read it again.


Your statement is contradictory. You say he committed murder but is also awaiting charges. If someone is awaiting charges then they haven't committed murder yet. This is why I mentioned your insight. In your mind he already committed murder.


No it's not what I said.


You said:

"A person can commit a murder and be free while waiting for charges and leave the country and never have to pay for their crime"


So how should this be interpreted?


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4619010 - 01/19/23 10:24 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Anyone can commit a murder and be free, until they are charged and arrested. That's kinda how it works. wink


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#4619020 - 01/20/23 03:33 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Bet ya 10bucks he never does a day in jail wink


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#4619029 - 01/20/23 11:19 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: No105_Archie]  
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Originally Posted by No105_Archie
Bet ya 10bucks he never does a day in jail wink



Oh yeah, that's a given. The armourer for the film though will probably get some jail time.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4619031 - 01/20/23 11:34 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Originally Posted by NoFlyBoy
Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Originally Posted by NoFlyBoy
Read it again.


Your statement is contradictory. You say he committed murder but is also awaiting charges. If someone is awaiting charges then they haven't committed murder yet. This is why I mentioned your insight. In your mind he already committed murder.


No it's not what I said.


You said:

"A person can commit a murder and be free while waiting for charges and leave the country and never have to pay for their crime"


So how should this be interpreted?


A person, any person. You, me, members here. That person is not Baldwin. Don't know why you interpreted the person as Baldwin. duh

#4619057 - 01/20/23 02:41 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: NoFlyBoy]  
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Originally Posted by NoFlyBoy
...

A person, any person. You, me, members here. That person is not Baldwin. Don't know why you interpreted the person as Baldwin. duh


Well, let's see...

Originally Posted by NoFlyBoy
Slow system! A person can commit a murder and be free while waiting for charges and leave the country and never have to pay for their crime.
https://apnews.com/article/alec-bal...-movies-22f60cabd837b6b9c3300851094e605a


1. You make the statement, including a link to a story about Alec Baldwin's incident / legal proceedings.
2. You posted it in a thread titled "Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident".

If you weren't referring to Baldwin, then you provided no support for the claim of "Slow system", and your included link would make no sense.

Context matters. A reasonable person would conclude you were referring Alec Baldwin as an example of how "A person can commit a murder and be free while waiting for charges and leave the country and never have to pay for their crime".

#4619058 - 01/20/23 02:41 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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The court rules in favor of Mr Meyer.


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#4620537 - 02/11/23 04:50 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#%&*$#, I wish I went to law school cos this is becoming more complex and confusing. https://deadline.com/2023/02/alec-baldwin-rust-killing-firearm-law-dismissal-motion-1235256071/

#4620596 - 02/12/23 02:10 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Lock him up ! ..... 30 yrs hard labor and without a cell phone


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#4620624 - 02/12/23 07:22 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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He won't see any jail time. The victims family will sue him in civil court. It will drag out for years. Lawyers will get richer. The poor victims family will still have lost a daughter.

#4620645 - 02/13/23 12:27 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: LB4LB]  
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Originally Posted by LB4LB
He won't see any jail time. The victims family will sue him in civil court. It will drag out for years. Lawyers will get richer. The poor victims family will still have lost a daughter.


He might. He is facing negligent manslaughter - which is met exactly by the circumstances. And is attacked on two paths - that he pointed the firearm at a person and pulled the trigger - and that he is prominent in the production company management, and the person who proudly proclaimed they knew how to cut corners and costs and then had an inexperienced/incompetent armourer forced to work on an 'all the guns all the time' production with limited hours and instructions clearly returned to her that she could have no more hours for armoury work and should focus on her second role as 'assistant wardrobe'.

The negligent attitude to doing things right and on cutting costs and ignoring inconvenient complaints about conditions comes from the top... and seemingly directly from the Film Dummy who held the trigger down while fanning his hammer, and then lied and lied again in all of his interviews and statements to the police and media.

#4621550 - 02/27/23 02:15 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: NoFlyBoy]  
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Originally Posted by NoFlyBoy
#%&*$#, I wish I went to law school cos this is becoming more complex and confusing. https://deadline.com/2023/02/alec-baldwin-rust-killing-firearm-law-dismissal-motion-1235256071/


Thank God you didn't.We all have way to many frivolous lawsuits as it is.

Retrain all lawyers...we have an excess of garbage to pick up.


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#4621561 - 02/27/23 11:30 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Nixer]  
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Originally Posted by Nixer




Retrain all lawyers...we have an excess of garbage to pick up.



Roughly about 70% of the lawyers on the planet practice law in the US. There is a very concrete and real reason for that!


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4625205 - 04/21/23 12:08 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4625207 - 04/21/23 12:47 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Not surprising at all.

#4625217 - 04/21/23 05:32 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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It seems odd, considering the FBI had supposedly examined / tested the revolver and concluded that the trigger had to have been pulled.

The charges can be re-filed, so Baldwin may not be in the clear yet.

#4625223 - 04/21/23 10:27 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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What a long drawn out drama queen incident this has turned out to be.

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 04/21/23 10:27 AM.

“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4625239 - 04/21/23 02:45 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Why recharge? It will just have the same outcome. The movies insurance will make a deal on the civil suit filed by victims family. Mr. Baldwin, being of the new Westen royalty, will suffer no changes to his lifestyle or financial situation.

#4625243 - 04/21/23 04:58 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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what is important here is. will the movie come out ?was it canceled ? a celebrity geeting out of jail and charge is not news worthy

#4625244 - 04/21/23 05:03 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Originally Posted by Blade_RJ
what is important here is. will the movie come out ?was it canceled ? a celebrity geeting out of jail and charge is not news worthy



I read today that filming for "Rust" will resume soon.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4625249 - 04/21/23 07:26 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Originally Posted by Blade_RJ
what is important here is. will the movie come out ?was it canceled ? a celebrity geeting out of jail and charge is not news worthy



I read today that filming for "Rust" will resume soon.

i was joking but no #%&*$#.....

#4628846 - 06/14/23 08:44 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Baldwin may get charged again. The lady armorer was hung over. https://deadline.com/2023/06/rust-armorer-likely-hung-over-fatal-shooting-criminal-case-1235417292/



Quote

Prosecutors have responded to Rust defendant Hannah Gutierrez-Reed’s attempt to have her involuntary manslaughter charge dropped in the 2021 shooting death of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins, saying the indie Western’s armorer “has a history of reckless conduct that has resulted in loss of human life and it is in the public interest that she finally be held accountable.”

They also said in the filing last week that a decision on whether to recharge star Alec Baldwin, who was holding the gun when it discharged, killing Hutchins and wounding director Joel Souza, could come by early August.

witnesses will testify that Gutierrez-Reed was “drinking heavily and smoking marijuana in the evenings during the shooting of Rust,” and that she was likely hung over on the morning of October 21, 2021, when an antique gun loaded with a live round and held by Baldwin discharged during a rehearsal.

#4628848 - 06/14/23 09:09 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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How does her being hungover, reflect on him ?

#4628849 - 06/14/23 09:12 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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There was a fly that landed in the ear of a rabbit, which hopped onto the back of a big, green, mean crocodile...

Which ate a sailor.


The fly must pay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



I mean, good luck. But this Baldwin stuff is simply theater.

That poor girl that was shot, however, quite tragic, nonetheless. Her husband and children lost something great and special. I hope the settlement was reasonable and adequate, although no sum can replace that of a lost love.

#4641336 - 01/19/24 08:51 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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They dismissed the involuntary manslaughter charges last April and now he's indicted again for the same charges. I do not understand.


https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...laughter-charge-rust-shooting-rcna134564

#4641339 - 01/19/24 09:10 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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They needed more time to go through the evidence to create a case against him so the dropped the charges to buy more time and gather the evidence. Now they have that and are trying to present that evidence so they're trying to press charges.

#4642543 - 02/14/24 05:50 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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This is the best thing I’ve read on the incident. Plenty of issues.

Budget and positions.
Armorer being double tasked.
Armorer inexperience and training
Baldwin attitude about weapon training and safety.
Constrained training time.
Possible drug/alcohol usage by armorer.



https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-features/rust-armorer-fair-shot-trial-1235823841/


Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4642544 - 02/14/24 05:53 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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I'm no lawyer but if the drug/alcohol usage by the armorer can be proven then I'd say that pretty much absolves Baldwin of any blame.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4642545 - 02/14/24 05:59 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
I'm no lawyer but if the drug/alcohol usage by the armorer can be proven then I'd say that pretty much absolves Baldwin of any blame.




I would disagree. He still had ultimate responsibility to insure the "prop" he was using was safe.


"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
#4642548 - 02/14/24 07:02 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Good article OG, thanks for the link.

Reed and Baldwin at minimum should be convicted here. I'm sure more are culpable but it appears the sheriff's office is either incompetent, corrupt, or both. Bungled investigations lead to a poor case, and limit the scope of charges.


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4643508 - 03/07/24 02:52 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4643511 - 03/07/24 03:32 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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It sounds like a xxxx show all around.

How/why were live rounds on set at all? From what I read she did not check before the incident Why were rounds in the gun for a camera angle test with two people in front of the gun?
Why didn't Baldwin check the gun himself?

One armorer pointed out months ago, that young /inexperienced crew members are vulnerable to being intimidated by senior actors, its a recipe for disaster.
I'm glad I wasn't there.
Tragedy al around.
I hope she doesn't take the whole weight by herself.

#4643512 - 03/07/24 03:46 AM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Some of the live rounds could be identified within the props over the course of 12 days of the shoot*, including still in a variety of gun belts, holsters and the incident gun secured and tested. *From the production archival photographer.

The whole production was a 'you get what you pay for' shi-show, with hubris and cost cutting production side... and complete complacency and negligence from the actors/extras and the safety employees.

#4643545 - 03/07/24 08:04 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Incredulous she was hired to be the armorer of a movie production

[Linked Image] [Linked Image] [Linked Image]

#4643546 - 03/07/24 08:06 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: NoFlyBoy]  
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Originally Posted by NoFlyBoy
Incredulous she was hired to be the armorer of a movie production

[Linked Image] [Linked Image] [Linked Image]




She works cheap.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4643547 - 03/07/24 08:13 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Her father is a legendary armorer in the film business

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0715715/bio/

His first movie was Tombstone

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0715715/


[Linked Image]
#4643548 - 03/07/24 08:21 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
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Carl Yastrzemski’s son also tried to follow in his father’s footsteps. He failed.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4643550 - 03/07/24 08:27 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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What movies Carl Yastrzemski was armorer on?

#4643555 - 03/07/24 10:44 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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The Dirty Dozen and Where Eagles Dare. Consulted on The Guns of Navarone.


Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4643559 - 03/07/24 11:15 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Those are good movies.

#4645248 - 04/15/24 07:07 PM Re: Alec Baldwin Rust movie incident [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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