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#4558210 - 03/01/21 03:39 PM Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not.  
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There are several movies that I would mention but I will only mention one for now for the sake of brevity and not posting a wall of text.

"Valkyrie" which was directed by Bryan Singer and starred Tom Cruise as von Stauffenberg and was released in 2008.


Perhaps the biggest lie perpetuated about the July 20 plot is that all of the conspirators were involved because they had a moral/ethical opposition to the Third Reich regime. Nothing could be further from the truth. Several of the key conspirators wanted to kill Hitler because his inept leadership was causing Germany to lose the war. In fact, one of the major objectives of the conspirators after Hitler was killed was to negotiate a separate peace with the US and UK while continuing to fight the USSR. This demonstrates that the plot really had more to do with saving Germany from total defeat than to overthrow an evil regime. The film clearly puts forth the notion that all of the conspirators were "good guys" who wanted to kill Hitler because of his cruel regime.


I'll be curious to see which other films get mentioned in this thread. smile

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 03/01/21 04:59 PM.

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#4558212 - 03/01/21 04:22 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Don`t want to spoil you fun, but doesn`t this count for every single historical movie?

edit: btw. there is a user called Armidas on youtube who is an historian and regularly comments on movies, it`s in German though.

Last edited by kilosierra; 03/01/21 04:31 PM.

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#4558218 - 03/01/21 05:16 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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The HBO series Chernobyl was great. The fictional "composite character" of Ulana Khomyuk was put in for "dramatic purposes". Yeah, right. Also the fictional character of Maya Harris in Zero Dark Thirty was another Hollywood move. Both of these stories were interesting, and dramatic enough without all the PC stuff.

This channel highlights many historical inaccuracies in movies. I'm sure many of you already know of it.


Last edited by LB4LB; 03/01/21 05:19 PM.

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#4558219 - 03/01/21 05:18 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: kilosierra]  
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Originally Posted by kilosierra
Don`t want to spoil you fun, but doesn`t this count for every single historical movie?

.



Perhaps no movie is 100% historically accurate but certain ones like "Tora, Tora, Tora" and "Gettysburg" get darn close. The changes to the motivations of the principal players in "Valkyrie" was a major deviation though.

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 03/01/21 05:18 PM.

“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4558227 - 03/01/21 05:53 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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https://medium.com/@jack.delaney/the-15-most-historically-inaccurate-movies-ranked-7f5e96cb01c4

https://www.historyextra.com/period...-worst-best-war-braveheart-darkest-hour/

#4558231 - 03/01/21 07:20 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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U-571


There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#4558234 - 03/01/21 07:27 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: KraziKanuK]  
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Originally Posted by KraziKanuK
U-571



Good pick but that one I knew was total BS from the very start. biggrin


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4558238 - 03/01/21 07:41 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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In fairness to U-571 (and I can't believe I said that) it was only 'based' on a historical event. I've never even watched it. You'd have to go all 'Clockwork Orange' on me to make me watch that viddy.

Didn't the British government have a go at Clinton about it?

Last edited by Chucky; 03/01/21 08:56 PM. Reason: grammar

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#4558240 - 03/01/21 07:46 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: Chucky]  
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Originally Posted by Chucky


Didn't the British government have a go at Clinton about it?


Yes indeed!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/773913.stm

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 03/01/21 07:47 PM.

“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4558252 - 03/01/21 09:14 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#4558256 - 03/01/21 09:21 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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certain ones like "Tora, Tora, Tora" and "Gettysburg" get darn close.


you possibly try watching Atun -Shei for some 'gutting a sacred cow' on Gettysburg (this is just part one)



#4558264 - 03/01/21 09:59 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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^Thanks bolox for suggestion on the Atun-Shei channel. There is some really cool stuff there. Just watched the one on the King Phillips War. I always found that subject interesting.


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#4558281 - 03/02/21 12:36 AM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
There are several movies that I would mention but I will only mention one for now for the sake of brevity and not posting a wall of text.

"Valkyrie" which was directed by Bryan Singer and starred Tom Cruise as von Stauffenberg and was released in 2008.


Perhaps the biggest lie perpetuated about the July 20 plot is that all of the conspirators were involved because they had a moral/ethical opposition to the Third Reich regime.


Many, including Stauffenberg, were motivated at least in part by moral reasons. Wanting to save one's country from external destruction does not have to be incompatible from wanting to save it from an evil internal government.

Moreover, I also take both factual and moral issue that with the basic premise that, depending on the motivations, it was necessarily wrong for Germany to have wanted to continue the war against the USSR. The USSR under Stalin was an existential threat to Germany in the 1930s and 1940s, like it was to the west afterwards. Just as Stalin was planning to launch on offensive war against western Europe before he died, he most probably would have launched an offensive war against Germany in the mid-1940s had not Germany attacked first. The plan to negotiate with the Allies and continue the war against the Soviet Union may have ben Quixotic, but it does not prima facia show the July 20 conspirators were not "good guys."

If you were in the place of the July 20 group, knowing the the threat posed by the USSR to the very existence of your country and to the lives of your family and countrymen, would you have planned an unconditional surrender to an equally evil and dangerous regime had you managed to overthrow your own evil leadership?

#4558284 - 03/02/21 02:23 AM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Very historical accurate film


#4558309 - 03/02/21 02:15 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Pearl Harbor.

So much potential but totally ruined.

Who in their right mind is going to sanction USAAF fighter pilots, who've just shot down several enemy aircraft, being chosen to fly an extremely hazardous bomber mission off an aircraft carrier? It's also a pretty bad slap in the face for the guys who did actually fly in the Doolittle raid.


"A great deal of an aeroplane could be holed without affecting its ability to fly. Wings and fuselage could be—and often were—pierced in 50 places, missing the occupants by inches (blissfully unaware of how close it had come until they returned to base). Then the sailmaker would carefully cover each hole with a square inch of Irish linen frayed at the edges and with a brushful of dope make our aircraft 'serviceable' again within an hour."
#4558310 - 03/02/21 02:22 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: Albert Tross]  
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Originally Posted by Albert Tross
Pearl Harbor.

So much potential but totally ruined.

Who in their right mind is going to sanction USAAF fighter pilots, who've just shot down several enemy aircraft, being chosen to fly an extremely hazardous bomber mission off an aircraft carrier? It's also a pretty bad slap in the face for the guys who did actually fly in the Doolittle raid.




All you need is Tora, Tora, Tora on bluray and you can ignore pretty much any other movie ever made about the attack on Pearl Harbor. smile

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 03/02/21 02:54 PM.

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#4558314 - 03/02/21 02:52 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer


All you need is Tora, Tora, Tora on bluray and you can ignore pretty much ignore any other movie ever made about the attack on Pearl Harbor. smile


Agreed, Tora Tora Tora has pride of place in my collection. Just goes to show that all the CGI in all the world can't beat top class cinematography.

But Pearl Harbor was a real missed opportunity, and the 'extras' disc is so much better than the film, as they talk to all the veterans. Those vets must have taken one look at that film and gone.....'wtf was that?'


"A great deal of an aeroplane could be holed without affecting its ability to fly. Wings and fuselage could be—and often were—pierced in 50 places, missing the occupants by inches (blissfully unaware of how close it had come until they returned to base). Then the sailmaker would carefully cover each hole with a square inch of Irish linen frayed at the edges and with a brushful of dope make our aircraft 'serviceable' again within an hour."
#4558339 - 03/02/21 04:40 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I totally get why the British would be upset by U-571 and I agree. As a Canuck I have similar feelings about Argo. Mr. Afleck did a real disservice to the people who risked their lives in the Canadian Caper. Argo is a steaming pile of poo.

Wizard

#4558353 - 03/02/21 06:32 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: Wizard43]  
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Originally Posted by Wizard43
I totally get why the British would be upset by U-571 and I agree. As a Canuck I have similar feelings about Argo. Mr. Afleck did a real disservice to the people who risked their lives in the Canadian Caper. Argo is a steaming pile of poo.

Wizard



+1


The big box office successes of both "Dunkirk" and "1917" proved that studios don't have to pander to US audiences by always making the principle players American instead of another nationality.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4558360 - 03/02/21 06:54 PM Re: Historical movies that appear to be accurate but are not. [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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OK, this is kind of the opposite, but the recent Midway movie turned out to be far more accurate than I expected. The CG was over the top, but the actual events seemed to be pretty accurate.


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