Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
Hop To
Page 2 of 2 1 2
#4521374 - 05/18/20 10:32 PM Re: Canadian Snowbird aircraft crashes in Kamloops B.C. [Re: Nimits]  
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,496
Genbrien Offline
Stick to the plan man!
Genbrien  Offline
Stick to the plan man!
Member

Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,496
Quebec, Canada
Originally Posted by Nimits


My question would be why did pilots pitch up and bank into an apparent stall? A quick zoom climb to trade what little airspeed you have left for altitude would make sense, but you need to eject at the top of the climb, before the aircraft starts sinking (or stalls/rolls) to give the ejection seat and chute the best chance. I am curious if they suffered some sort of control failure along with the engine failure, were trying to make the field (which it seems they had no where near enough energy to accomplish), were trying to avoid some sort of populated area in front of them, or got heads down trying to restart the engines.


pretty much why I said that I found it odd
pilot would not place the plane volontarely in a stall situation. they would gain the more altitude they can get, than kinda levelout and try to steer the plane away/ belly land
Eager to see BST's report on that


XBL/PSN/others: genbrien
Mobo: Asus P8P67 deluxe Monitor: Samsung 23'' 1920*1080
CPU: i7 2600k@ 4.8Ghz Keyboard: Logitech G15
GPU:GTX 980 Strix Mouse: G700s
PSU: Corsair TX750w Gaming Devices: Saitek X55, TrackIr5
RAM: Mushkin 2x4gb ddr2 9-9-9-24 @1600mhz
Case: Cooler Master 690 SSD: Intel X25m 80gb
Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#4521380 - 05/19/20 12:01 AM Re: Canadian Snowbird aircraft crashes in Kamloops B.C. [Re: WangoTango]  
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 430
Vaderini Offline
Member
Vaderini  Offline
Member

Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 430
How does the ejection sequence work in the CT-114, does each person control both ejection seats or individual only?

Both the stall and either person not ejecting at the stall is weird

#4521382 - 05/19/20 12:04 AM Re: Canadian Snowbird aircraft crashes in Kamloops B.C. [Re: WangoTango]  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,113
KraziKanuK Offline
Veteran
KraziKanuK  Offline
Veteran

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,113
Ottawa Canada
Capt Jenn Casey was not the pilot, she was the squadron's public affairs officer. The Snowbirds often carry a passenger in the 2cd seat when transitioning to another airport.

In May 1976 a high school friend, and his trainee pilot, died when their Tudor ingested a duck while taking off. They stayed with the a/c to steer it away from a residential area.


There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#4521383 - 05/19/20 12:06 AM Re: Canadian Snowbird aircraft crashes in Kamloops B.C. [Re: KraziKanuK]  
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 430
Vaderini Offline
Member
Vaderini  Offline
Member

Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 430
Originally Posted by KraziKanuK
Capt Jenn Casey was not the pilot, she was the squadron's public affairs officer.

But isn't it standard procedure that to be a passenger, you get briefed on the safety procedures?

#4521384 - 05/19/20 12:10 AM Re: Canadian Snowbird aircraft crashes in Kamloops B.C. [Re: Vaderini]  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,113
KraziKanuK Offline
Veteran
KraziKanuK  Offline
Veteran

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,113
Ottawa Canada
Originally Posted by Vaderini
Originally Posted by KraziKanuK
Capt Jenn Casey was not the pilot, she was the squadron's public affairs officer.

But isn't it standard procedure that to be a passenger, you get briefed on the safety procedures?

Sure but pilots talk and learn and will react much quicker.


There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#4521407 - 05/19/20 03:24 AM Re: Canadian Snowbird aircraft crashes in Kamloops B.C. [Re: Vaderini]  
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 5,945
Nimits Offline
Hotshot
Nimits  Offline
Hotshot

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 5,945
United States of America
Originally Posted by Vaderini
How does the ejection sequence work in the CT-114, does each person control both ejection seats or individual only?

Both the stall and either person not ejecting at the stall is weird


Well if the back-seater was not aircrew, my guess is she would be less likely to initiate ejection.

Give that the CT-114 is a trainer by nature, I would guess it has linked ejection systems. However, that does not necessarily mean the linked system is enabled as standard practice.

So, potentially, the pilot might have delayed ejection to try and get the passenger more time to prepare and/or egress on her own? Still does not entirely explain why the aggressive bank and nose high stall.

#4521415 - 05/19/20 09:50 AM Re: Canadian Snowbird aircraft crashes in Kamloops B.C. [Re: Nimits]  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,113
KraziKanuK Offline
Veteran
KraziKanuK  Offline
Veteran

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,113
Ottawa Canada
Originally Posted by Nimits

So, potentially, the pilot might have delayed ejection to try and get the passenger more time to prepare and/or egress on her own? Still does not entirely explain why the aggressive bank and nose high stall.


Sure it does if there is a problem with the engine. Altitude required for safe ejection.


There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#4521446 - 05/19/20 01:53 PM Re: Canadian Snowbird aircraft crashes in Kamloops B.C. [Re: KraziKanuK]  
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 5,945
Nimits Offline
Hotshot
Nimits  Offline
Hotshot

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 5,945
United States of America
Originally Posted by KraziKanuK


Sure it does if there is a problem with the engine. Altitude required for safe ejection.


It was a 0/60 (or 0/90? I have seen that listed on the internet too) seat. Which means as long as they were airborne, above 60 (or 90) knots, not inverted, and no sink rate on the aircraft, they should have been in the safe envelope for ejection. The initial pitch up to trade remaining airspeed for altitude would improve their position, but if you delay past that point (to where the aircraft is partially inverted and/or developing sink rate), you may actually by closer to the edge of the safe ejection envelope, despite the gain in altitude.

#4521456 - 05/19/20 02:22 PM Re: Canadian Snowbird aircraft crashes in Kamloops B.C. [Re: WangoTango]  
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 6,779
EAF331 MadDog Offline
XBL: LanceHawkins
EAF331 MadDog  Offline
XBL: LanceHawkins
Hotshot

Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 6,779
Oslo, Norway
The problem with "steer away from populated area" is that the pilot did the exact opposite of that.

If the plane have continued straight out from the runway he would be over the river and almost no population.
Turn right and into unpopulated area.
Turn left and right over the town. Which is what he did.

#4521471 - 05/19/20 03:59 PM Re: Canadian Snowbird aircraft crashes in Kamloops B.C. [Re: EAF331 MadDog]  
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,703
WangoTango Offline
Hotshot
WangoTango  Offline
Hotshot

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,703
Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by EAF331 MadDog
The problem with "steer away from populated area" is that the pilot did the exact opposite of that.

If the plane have continued straight out from the runway he would be over the river and almost no population.
Turn right and into unpopulated area.
Turn left and right over the town. Which is what he did.


They must have lost complete control. Incredibly nobody was hurt or killed in the residential area.

#4521504 - 05/19/20 06:46 PM Re: Canadian Snowbird aircraft crashes in Kamloops B.C. [Re: WangoTango]  
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 6,779
EAF331 MadDog Offline
XBL: LanceHawkins
EAF331 MadDog  Offline
XBL: LanceHawkins
Hotshot

Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 6,779
Oslo, Norway
Here is the airport.

Most of the videos are probably shot at the Tranquille road NE of the airport.

Google map of airport https://www.google.com/maps/place/Kamloops+Airport/@50.6978876,-120.4320145,3669m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x537fd357e9aadb89:0x3a17ce6b644e87ce!8m2!3d50.7052202!4d-120.4417902

Last edited by EAF331 MadDog; 05/19/20 06:46 PM.
#4521530 - 05/19/20 09:57 PM Re: Canadian Snowbird aircraft crashes in Kamloops B.C. [Re: WangoTango]  
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,703
WangoTango Offline
Hotshot
WangoTango  Offline
Hotshot

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,703
Ontario, Canada
If you input the address - 2410 Glenview Ave, Kamloops, BC V2B 4L4, it shows the location of the crash site.

Page 2 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  RacerGT 

Quick Search
Recent Articles
Support SimHQ

If you shop on Amazon use this Amazon link to support SimHQ
.
Social


Recent Topics
Whitey Herzog was 92
by F4UDash4. 04/16/24 04:41 PM
Anyone can tell me what this is?
by NoFlyBoy. 04/16/24 04:10 PM
10 Years ago MV Sewol
by wormfood. 04/15/24 08:25 PM
Pride Of Jenni race win
by NoFlyBoy. 04/15/24 12:22 AM
It's Friday: grown up humor for the weekend.
by NoFlyBoy. 04/12/24 01:41 PM
OJ Simpson Dead at 76
by bones. 04/11/24 03:02 PM
They wokefied tomb raider !!
by Blade_RJ. 04/10/24 03:09 PM
Good F-35 Podcast
by RossUK. 04/08/24 09:02 AM
Gleda Estes
by Tarnsman. 04/06/24 06:22 PM
Copyright 1997-2016, SimHQ Inc. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0