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#4516876 - 04/17/20 01:32 PM Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer  
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SirMike1983 Offline
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Bought a new computer at the end of last year, and I sprung for a good one. The issue is that I'm still getting modest-to-moderate stuttering, particularly when looking around using TrackIR and when the game load is pretty heavy.

CPU: Intel Core i7-9700
RAM:16GB Memory
GPU: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1660 Ti
HD: 1TB Hard Drive
SSD: 256GB

I'm running WOFF from the regular HD (SSD is going to be too small anyway).

I am running a few optimizer mods (TrackIR not on Core 0; a couple of the cloud mods; tracers mod; couple other optimizer mods from VonS). FPS fluctuate, especially when stuttering (140 at tops - I matched the Nvidia limiter to my monitor refresh rate - down to maybe 80). On paper that's plenty of FPS, the issue is that I'm getting stuttering when the FPS drop so much. Setting the limiter to 120 FPS and dropping the graphics levels back to "3s and 4s mainly" with "2" for clouds helped somewhat. But it still has occasional stutters - enough to notice. It does this both with and without TrackIR turned on.

Is there something else I can do to stop the game from stuttering? I'm a bit disappointed that I have a relatively solid, newer computer and am still not running this came as smoothly as the other sims I own.


Last edited by SirMike1983; 04/17/20 01:33 PM.
#4516892 - 04/17/20 02:29 PM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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HarryH Offline
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Mike, do you have a G-SYNC monitor? Are you using the display port output of your GPU?

There's a bunch of things you can try. I've been working on a Tweaker's Guide for some time now. If you'd like a copy, let me know.


System: i5 8600K @ 3.6GHz,16GB DDR4 @2666MHz. RTX2080, MSI Z370 mobo, Dell 27" G-SYNC @ 144Hz. 2560x1440

#4516908 - 04/17/20 03:25 PM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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SirMike1983 Offline
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Yeah - forcing G-Sync on through NVidia control panel seemed to help a little too. Using the display port. Monitor is an Asus 140hz 24 inch I bought not long after the computer. I read your guide to the TrackIR - that's how I knew to pull it off Core-0. If you have another guide, I'd try it.

#4516970 - 04/17/20 08:18 PM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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Panama Red Offline
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What is your Forrest level and what is your Regional Air activity level ???


CPU = i9 11900K
GPU = RTX 3080 Ti
Monitor = ASUS ROG Swift PG32UQX 2160p G-sync
#4516993 - 04/17/20 11:28 PM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: HarryH]  
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Originally Posted by HarryH
Mike, do you have a G-SYNC monitor? Are you using the display port output of your GPU?

There's a bunch of things you can try. I've been working on a Tweaker's Guide for some time now. If you'd like a copy, let me know.


@HarryH,
Would it be possible to get a copy of your 'Tweaker's Guide' also?

Thanks

#4516995 - 04/17/20 11:30 PM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: HarryH]  
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Originally Posted by HarryH
Mike, do you have a G-SYNC monitor? Are you using the display port output of your GPU?

There's a bunch of things you can try. I've been working on a Tweaker's Guide for some time now. If you'd like a copy, let me know.


I will take one also, if you don't mind. I have minor stutters with trackIR. Never used to but do now.


Flying Wings Over Flanders Fields: Between Heaven & Hell II
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#4517000 - 04/17/20 11:54 PM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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SirMike1983 Offline
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Forest density set at 3, air activity historical. If I boost up so I no longer have any "3s" I notice worsening stutters, but again the FPS on paper is very good 120s and 130s down to about 90. The stuttering hits in that FPS drop.

#4517040 - 04/18/20 10:31 AM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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RAF_Louvert Offline
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Mike, have you tried setting the priority for your TrackIR on "High". That has minimized stutters for some folks here so it's worth a shot.

Hope this helps.

Lou

.


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#4517060 - 04/18/20 01:34 PM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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Panama Red Offline
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The higher the Forrest level, the higher the stuttering close to the ground (I have a 9900K CPU and still use Medium to minimize low flying stuttering).

Anything beyond "Lite" in the Regional Air Activity (in later years) will also cause stuttering because of all the planes the CPU has to keep track of. Plus if you never stray beyond the mission circles, you will never see all the extra planes the higher Regional Air Activity have in the game.


CPU = i9 11900K
GPU = RTX 3080 Ti
Monitor = ASUS ROG Swift PG32UQX 2160p G-sync
#4517143 - 04/19/20 02:04 AM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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SirMike1983 Offline
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I set TrackIR priority to "real time" - this helped somewhat, but I still get these stop-start stutters. My sense is it's game-related because I still get them when TrackIR is off. Seems they are worse earlier in the mission and as time goes on I get fewer. It isn't a slide show by any means, but I do notice them. Just sort of strange to me that I have FPS that I consider to be pretty high, but the smoothness isn't there that you would expect for that FPS level.

#4517150 - 04/19/20 04:18 AM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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In my experience, stuttering in WOFF is largely due to two main factors, besides variations in individual gaming computers. They are: 1) CPU load and 2) terrain loading.

In regard to CPU load, as PR mentioned above, since there is no spawning in WOFF, the CPU has to keep track of sometimes hundreds of planes at a time, particularly in the late war period. This can occasionally bring even a relatively powerful computer to a crawl. His suggestion to lower your regional air activity from mid 1917 onward is a good idea. You might also play around with Forced Encounters.

Terrain loading also causes stutters of up to a .25 second or so. I believe this occurs when new terrain features or objects are drawn or refreshed in the different "rings" surrounding your aircraft controlled by the compositescenerybudget file. Unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be a whole lot that can be done to ease this source of stuttering, at least without the sacrifice of a fair amount of visual quality and detail. Some people have reported some success by turning off terrain bump mapping in Workshops, however. You might also try lowering forest density to medium, although I can't tell you how helpful that may or may not be.

BTW, these limitations are not the fault of OBD; they are leftovers from the original CFS3 code.


Last edited by BuckeyeBob; 04/19/20 04:25 AM. Reason: added comments

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#4517151 - 04/19/20 04:52 AM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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orbyxP Offline
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If those stutters truly annoy you, then I would try to take some time and drill down on what it is.

To further pinpoint your issue, I would go through an extensive "test bench". I recommend using a relatively controlled environment like QC, Try flying several test flights and chart your FPS on a software that will record those major dips. maybe use a second monitor and pay attention to when those major dips in FPS occur. Here is what to try and test for those FPS drops:

set your Workshop settings to minimum everything and try with and without the DX shaders. unplug Joystick/rudder/TrackIR/etc... for now, you can tackle those variables later.

1-a QC free flight air start at 10,000 ft in an empty area like Koln.

If you don't have any major dips, then before your next QC flight, increase the workshop graphic/forest settings by 1 or 2 notches and start with (1) again.

2-same, but start on the airfield and take off.

Repeat for (2). Take note of which settings give those major dips.

For #1, you should be able to max out the settings without any FPS loss. It's probably #2 that will show you which setting slams the FPS. If you can repeat that major stutter over and over again, then you've probably figured out which setting it was.

Bonus round: In workshop, set your screen resolution to a very low number like 1280 x 720 and see if that makes a difference.

Last edited by orbyxP; 04/19/20 04:53 AM.
#4517181 - 04/19/20 11:43 AM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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RAF_Louvert Offline
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Another little trick you can do Mike, if you aren't already doing it, is to pan round and round outside your plane for 10 to 15 seconds before you take off on each mission. It helps with the preloading of all the terrain and planes and weather and such and makes things run smoother for the rest of the mission. I will often pan around again for a few seconds when I reach the front just for good measure.

.

#4517187 - 04/19/20 12:53 PM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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Mike

ORBYX procedures are good, but I would add one more to keep consistence for your benchmark. When you are in QC panel , save it as a scenario so you will be sure to fly the same scenario each time you test.


(System_Specs)
Case: Cooler Master Storm Trooper
PSU: Ultra X3,1000-Watt
MB: Asus Maximus VI Extreme
Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
CPU: Intel i7-4770K, OC to 4.427Ghz
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Seidon 240M Liquid CPU Cooler
Vid Card: ASUS GTX 980Ti STRIX 6GB
OS and Games on separate: Samsung 840 Series 250GB SSD
Monitor: Primary ASUS PG27AQ 4k; Secondary Samsung SyncMaster BX2450L
Periphs: MS Sidewinder FFB2 Pro, TrackIR 4

#4517281 - 04/20/20 02:57 AM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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HarryH Offline
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Another very significant area to look at is antialiasing. The in-game antialiasing is a big performance hit, even at 2X. If you have an Nvidia card, you definitely will be better to offload it. Set the card to override game settings using Nvidia Inspector and then apply GPU antialiasing settings. It gets more complicated, though: Major McGee noticed that anytime you update your Nvidia drivers it breaks hardware antialiasing and you have to reapply a specific compatibility setting to make it work again. I have all the details of this in my tweaker's guide which I will try to prep for release this coming week.


System: i5 8600K @ 3.6GHz,16GB DDR4 @2666MHz. RTX2080, MSI Z370 mobo, Dell 27" G-SYNC @ 144Hz. 2560x1440

#4517283 - 04/20/20 03:03 AM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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HarryH Offline
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Originally Posted by SirMike1983
I set TrackIR priority to "real time" - this helped somewhat, but I still get these stop-start stutters. My sense is it's game-related because I still get them when TrackIR is off. Seems they are worse earlier in the mission and as time goes on I get fewer. It isn't a slide show by any means, but I do notice them. Just sort of strange to me that I have FPS that I consider to be pretty high, but the smoothness isn't there that you would expect for that FPS level.


Try using Nvidia Inspector to set V-SYNC at 1/2 refresh rate and set your refresh rate to 144Hz. This will translate to a 'capped' 72FPS which the old CFS3 engine seems to like. From there, given a decent CPU and memory, things should improve. Better to have a lower (above 60FPS) but consistent framerate than a framerate that bounces around from screaming fast to momentary slowdowns. Again, all this is covered in more detail in the tweaker's guide.

Last edited by HarryH; 04/20/20 03:18 AM.

System: i5 8600K @ 3.6GHz,16GB DDR4 @2666MHz. RTX2080, MSI Z370 mobo, Dell 27" G-SYNC @ 144Hz. 2560x1440

#4517728 - 04/23/20 10:25 AM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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try RTSS and set the frame rate to say 30. might help.
I use it for Battletech, were I had 190+fps and super high gpu temps.


make mistakes and learn from them

I5 4440 3.1Ghz, Asrock B85m Pro3, Gtx 1060 3GB
#4518518 - 04/28/20 02:46 PM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: HarryH]  
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Originally Posted by HarryH
Another very significant area to look at is antialiasing. The in-game antialiasing is a big performance hit, even at 2X. If you have an Nvidia card, you definitely will be better to offload it. Set the card to override game settings using Nvidia Inspector and then apply GPU antialiasing settings...


Was just reviewing this thread as it was linked to another, newer discussion and found your recommendation Harry. This is interesting as I have tried it both ways on my older system and found that setting the in-game AA to 8x and telling my Nvidia GPUs to use application settings resulted in much, much smother game play and much nicer looking visuals. Every system is different that's for certain.

.

#4520364 - 05/10/20 05:03 PM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: SirMike1983]  
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I'll just add my recent observations to the thread.

In general, I hadn't been noticing many (any) stutters; but most of my flying has been without combat (I've been doing free flights to admire the scenery and getting the feel for many of the planes in the sim). Without a gaming monitor, my system generally holds a steady 60 FPS. Recently, rather than free flights, I've been doing turkey shoots to add a little combat at the start of my free flights. The results is that I've been noticing some stutters. They mostly occur when machine gun hits happen (usually the first few hits). To me, this reinforces the idea that it's related to one or both of the following effects: (1) additional CPU usage for damage calculation; and (2) loading of skins for the damage visual effects.

The thing that brought this to mind was an old stutter video (posted in another thread because I don't see it here) which had a stutter at the same time (first hits). As I said, this is just my observation.


i7-7700 @ 3.6GHz, 32GB DDR4 RAM, SSD (OS) + SSD (Games), GTX 1070 Ti, Acer Predator Z35p 3440x1440 GSync
#4520392 - 05/10/20 10:32 PM Re: Stuttering WOFF PE on New Computer [Re: mandrews]  
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HarryH Offline
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Originally Posted by mandrews
I'll just add my recent observations to the thread.

In general, I hadn't been noticing many (any) stutters; but most of my flying has been without combat (I've been doing free flights to admire the scenery and getting the feel for many of the planes in the sim). Without a gaming monitor, my system generally holds a steady 60 FPS. Recently, rather than free flights, I've been doing turkey shoots to add a little combat at the start of my free flights. The results is that I've been noticing some stutters. They mostly occur when machine gun hits happen (usually the first few hits). To me, this reinforces the idea that it's related to one or both of the following effects: (1) additional CPU usage for damage calculation; and (2) loading of skins for the damage visual effects.

The thing that brought this to mind was an old stutter video (posted in another thread because I don't see it here) which had a stutter at the same time (first hits). As I said, this is just my observation.



Welcome mandrews, good to see another new face here. I believe the general consensus around here nowadays is that any number of things can overburden the somewhat limited CFS3 plumbing system and cause less than perfectly smooth rendering (see RAF_Louvert's recent thread on the subject). However, your system spec is pretty reasonable. Do let us know if you ever feel the stutters cause you to get killed in combat. That would be interesting info. Also, keep in mind that, when you graduate to Campaign mode, the air density setting becomes very important as a tool for limiting problems. Basically, don't shy away from using light or very light settings. You'll still see action.


System: i5 8600K @ 3.6GHz,16GB DDR4 @2666MHz. RTX2080, MSI Z370 mobo, Dell 27" G-SYNC @ 144Hz. 2560x1440

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