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#4482251 - 07/10/19 12:27 PM An observation about science fiction shows/series  
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PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
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I was just doing some random brainstorming and research today and I noticed that there are almost no indigenous science fiction tv shows/series outside of the English speaking countries. I looked at lists for current shows in several countries like Germany, France, Italy, Japan, Russia and Belgium and I saw maybe one or two shows that could somewhat be considered "science fiction".



Why do you guys think this is the case?


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#4482275 - 07/10/19 04:07 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I guess if you’re willing to consider Battle of the Planets, Star Blazers/Space Battleship Yamato, etc, as sci-fi series, Japan is represented.


Phil

“The biggest problem people have is they don’t think they’re supposed to have problems.” - Hayes Barnard
#4482306 - 07/10/19 07:48 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I think it's mostly a matter of production costs. Setting up a proper science-fiction series costs a lot more than your run of the mill sitcom/crime/drama series - sets, special effects, etc.
In order to refinance that bigger investment you must sell it to a worldwide audience, and in that case it probably makes sense to produce it in English language right away. Which then brings up the question, who will co-finance it - probably media corporations from English-speaking countries, at which point you might no longer recognize it as a foreign production. Game of Thrones, as an example - largely filmed in Europe, but probably not a "European production" per your perception since it's a US company that finances it, and markets it under the own label, etc.

Even if you do it completely on the cheap like "Dr. Who", the production costs are still above average, and I suppose it only works because it's such a strong brand for the BBC that they want to keep it, and be it just for prestige. Spin-offs like Torchwood were good for a few seasons but eventually got cancelled despite having some of the more intelligent scripts and great acting.

If you're making a show in, say, French, you can sell it ... to Québec, and parts of Africa, but then you need subtitles or dubbing for everybody else. The series would have to be exceptionally good to be accepted that way by the biggest TV market, the US. Rather, Hollywood takes the best foreign films and simply shoots them again, usually making them worse in most aspects - but English-speaking actors, no legal trouble with "who has the rights to the production", etc.; you pay a one-time fee for the script and then some for the original producers, and then it is as if this was completely your own production (because legally, it is), so you can market it in exactly the tried and true ways how you market all your other productions.

Or you make something ultra-cheap like a few years ago in Germany the "Star Diaries" series after Stanislaw Lem's book. Quirky, fun, with a certain hand-made charm and lots of original and witty dialog - in German. Good luck dubbing it. Maybe subtitles will mercifully distract from the poor special effects, but how many shows were you willing to watch that had subtitles, maybe aside from "Narcos"?

Last edited by Ssnake; 07/10/19 07:49 PM.
#4482307 - 07/10/19 07:54 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: NH2112]  
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Originally Posted by NH2112
I guess if you’re willing to consider Battle of the Planets, Star Blazers/Space Battleship Yamato, etc, as sci-fi series, Japan is represented.


thumbsup

Don't forget Macross, Robotech, Mazinger-Z, Mazinkaiser, Shin Getter Robo, Captain Harlock(especially good serial series from the 70s), Cowboy Bebop and more.


The Japanese are HUGE fans of sci-fi, and have even influenced my own writing style.


Also, the Russians have a fair bit, Panzer, with classics such as Tarkovsky's Solaris(not the crappy Clooney remake) and Stalker. Both of those were released in the 70s, though. frown

Last edited by Mr_Blastman; 07/10/19 07:57 PM.
#4482310 - 07/10/19 08:46 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Specifically TV series is an area that's substantially different from a science fiction film. A foreign SF film is easier to produce (even though more costly) if you find enough people willing to believe that it will do well in cinemas (e.g Valerian, to name a relatively big non-US production of recent years, irrerspective of its merits). A TV series however creates bigger challenges WRT to how you finance the whole thing, as outlined above.

#4482312 - 07/10/19 09:26 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Most Japanese anime that were mentioned above were series, Ssnake. Animated, but series. In the US, we have few true sci-fi films in the cinema these days, save for the lame super hero poseur films such as the last Star Trek movie. There are exceptions in the indie arena that are pretty good, but these aren't produced by Hollywood and they are made on limited budgets. Point taken on series budgets. Gone are the days shows can get away with plastic models such as those used in Space 1999.

I think Panzer has a point on series outside of Japan and UK, though, and maybe France. I don't know of many sci-fi series elsewhere, save for the one popular show that aired in Australia back in the day that I forget the name of.

#4482316 - 07/10/19 10:12 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Yeah, it’s my mistake for leaving out Japan for their extensive anime but how many live action sci-fi tv series are currently being aired there?

And you made an excellent post Ssnake concerning the marketing challenges in making a non-English language sci-fi series.
Oh and I found out there is a German sci-fi series currently on Netflix called “Dark”.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_(TV_series)

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 07/10/19 10:15 PM.

“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4482318 - 07/10/19 10:31 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Norway has made a couple of sci-fi shows, back in the 80s.

France has done several shows, both animated and others.
Animated ones include "Once upon a time.. Space" and "Spartakus and the Sun Beneath the Sea". Live action they have one running now called "Missions".

#4482319 - 07/10/19 10:39 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: Mr_Blastman]  
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Originally Posted by Mr_Blastman
Most Japanese anime that were mentioned above were series, Ssnake. Animated, but series.

Sure.
a. Science fiction is quite popular in Japan, which is already a big incentive to invest in such productions
b. When you make an animated series, the genre is almost negligible (except that spaceships and robots with angular shapes require less effort in (hand) animation whereas, say, a Western animated series would involve a lot of horses that require more effort). Therefore, an animated science fiction series has no bigger commercial hurdles to overcome than an anime series of any other genre. This is in marked contrast to a live action show (even if mocap and green screen are helping to reduce costs).

So, I stand by my assessment.

#4482353 - 07/11/19 04:49 AM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Also, I think it's easier to dub over animation, so they still have the possibility to market it to English-speaking countries without a large investment and without subtitles.


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#4482361 - 07/11/19 06:33 AM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Yes.

#4482799 - 07/14/19 06:06 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Yeah, it’s my mistake for leaving out Japan for their extensive anime but how many live action sci-fi tv series are currently being aired there?

And you made an excellent post Ssnake concerning the marketing challenges in making a non-English language sci-fi series.
Oh and I found out there is a German sci-fi series currently on Netflix called “Dark”.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_(TV_series)


Dark is one of the best things ever to happen to TV/movies. I have to admit that my German cultural background makes me a bit biased, but still, Dark rocks. I like that some people have called it the German "Stranger Things." I understand the comparison but understand also that the first scene of the first episode starts with a man and woman buck naked having sex on a bed . . . this would never happen in Stranger Things. Oh sure, it would be alluded to, but it would never be graphically shown. biggrin


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#4482805 - 07/14/19 06:52 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Id' also note the Danish series "the Rain"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rain_(TV_series)

(a created supervirus counts to me as SF...)

#4482932 - 07/15/19 06:25 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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#4482934 - 07/15/19 06:33 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: rollnloop.]  
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Originally Posted by rollnloop.


Thanks for posting this! "Section Zero" looks very interesting to me!


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4497255 - 11/15/19 01:13 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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War of the Worlds an Anglo French collaboration between Fox and Canal+ is pretty darn good I started watching it by mistake and got hooked on it. Great acting and some action, so far we have not come across the tripods yet but the "drones" they send out to look for what ever it is that they are looking for are very like tech that is used already by the military.
Not sure what channels it is on in other countries but it is on Fox here.


Edit: From Rollnloop's linked list it is this one:
https://www.cinetrafic.fr/serie/58835/la-guerre-des-mondes

Last edited by Alicatt; 11/15/19 01:15 PM.

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#4497471 - 11/17/19 03:22 PM Re: An observation about science fiction shows/series [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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one thats popped up for me on Netflix

El ministerio del tiempo "The Ministry of Time" a spainish production... just dipping my toes in now on.. the only annoyance for me atm is, subtitles only, no english soundtrack... but I'm a sucker for anything with Time Travel...


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