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#4495955 - 11/04/19 03:49 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC ***** [Re: WangoTango]  
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https://www.pcgamer.com/red-dead-re...its-mouse-controls-that-make-it-special/

"Exploring in first-person is much better on PC thanks simply to well implemented mouselook. Pad controls are borderline sluggish, seemingly to give your actions a sense of heft that fits Red Dead Redemption 2's methodical pacing. It's great to be able to quickly look where I want to without dragging my view around with a stick. It also means you can play the game as a legitimate FPS. Naturally, the game switches off the pad's auto aim when you start playing with a mouse, and you can switch freely between mouse and pad if you prefer riding a horse with a controller.

The combination of 60fps performance and mouselook significantly changes the way the game feels to play, which to me matters more than visual improvements to a game that looked great already. As a PC player I'm used to being able to dart around with my view and react to the game world with almost unconscious flicks of the mouse. Pad look creates a small amount of friction between my intention and the way the game responds to that intention. Removing that friction simply makes the game feel better to me.

The controls are customisable too, as you'd expect. You can alter FOV settings to your taste and rebind keys. The radial item selection menus will take some getting used to, and for the sake of my fingers I'd rebind the slow-mo 'dead eye' trigger from middle mouse button to a side button. Otherwise Red Dead seems to have transitioned to PC nicely. Performance is the big unexplored issue. Rockstar says the game is highly scaleable. We look forward to testing it on a few different rigs."

Sounds good to me!


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#4496043 - 11/05/19 01:40 AM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: WangoTango]  
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I imagine all around the PC version with mouse and keyboard plus higher fps will create an even better experience. I forgot about the FPS mode which definitely would be better on PC. I never used it much on PS4 save for getting a good look at things, taking a picture or enjoying the weapon modeling, aim down sight modes.

#4496048 - 11/05/19 02:18 AM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: WangoTango]  
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First person mode being added to GTA 5 was the thing that made me try it, and I ended up loving it. Played through the whole single player in first person, with switching to that mode the first thing I did. Then I played to level 120 in GTA Online all in first person. The flying, the driving, all of it. I knew it was at a disadvantage in PvP but I didn't care. I mean, if you're crouched behind a car in first person, you see nothing but car. In third person you see everything beyond it. A lot less SA for sure, and true whether on foot, in a vehicle or an aircraft. But for me it makes such a difference in how much I get in to it. The difference between being my character or controlling it. I hadn't read first person is an option in RDR2 PC until I saw the above quote. I assumed it would be, but hadn't seen it. That's, like, really good. biggrin

I decided to get the game through Humble, as I had some credit there. If it were out at release on Steam I would have gotten it there no doubt. Needed to create an Epic Games account, and jump through all of the registrations, and how many crosswalks, link accounts and confirmation e-mails, and do you see any traffic lights, and good grief, I'm past this stuff. For those of you with all of these accounts already it's a breeze, but I didn't particularly want an Epic Games account, but there ya go when you don't read the fine print and just add the credit card details. On the plus side, I will now finally pull the trigger on Exodus, which I've wanted for years and Metro is one of my favorite series eva. Silver lining.

Looking forward to RDR 2 PC. Happen to have the day off so can probably get a good start.


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#4496140 - 11/06/19 12:28 AM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: WangoTango]  
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So PC launch is plagued by bugs, crashes, CTD and horrible unoptmized performance with free stutter for everyone as pre order bonus........LFMAO

#4496141 - 11/06/19 12:31 AM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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#4496154 - 11/06/19 02:16 AM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: WangoTango]  
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#4496179 - 11/06/19 11:22 AM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: WangoTango]  
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I never pre-order a game unless I get some kind of significant bonus or discount.


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#4496187 - 11/06/19 12:33 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: WangoTango]  
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Only had one CTD during a MP session which I think was the server I was on crashing. Everything else has been butter smooth for me. Performance isnt quite what I wanted but it runs a bit better than GTA5 did and I am running 2560*1080. I was running 3840*1280 but the performance at that resolution wasnt optimal lol. So I backed it back down to a standard sub4k 21:9

Im enjoying it and once they patch it a bit more Im sure it will just get better.


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#4496192 - 11/06/19 02:06 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Originally Posted by Blade_RJ
LFMAO


It takes on a whole new, presumably unintended, meaning when you write it that way.

I played quite a bit yesterday and my impressions are very favorable, but not without a few caveats.

Graphically, it's fantastic. Looks great, runs great, and that's on modest hardware, a Ryzen 2600 and a GTX 1660 Ti @1920x1080. Like Master said it's butter-smooth. Not a hint of any stutter at all. I don't doubt some may be experiencing this, but it clearly doesn't affect everyone. For what it's worth I made zero changes to the default graphics settings and did not update my video driver, still using one from April. I had some stutter in GTA 5 single player on occasion, but interestingly not in GTAO. But here in RDR 2 it's really nice. Fog, clouds, snow, sunlight, smoke, star-filled night skies and those sorts of effects all look fantastic. The first chapter is in snow country and it's nicely done. Tracks in the snow, or the depressions in it made by a falling body are convincing. View distances are immense, stunning vistas.

My issues were technical. Specifically, inputs and menu choices can seem unresponsive at times. For instance, something's wrong with the main menus, they are very sluggish, clicking options for example takes 10 seconds or more to switch screens. Once I've loaded a save game these menus work fine. But accessing them from the main menu has the problem. Selecting choices in the menus doesn't always work. The 'focused' choice needs to have a red highlight around it or it doesn't respond. You need to drag the mouse around to wake it up, go red, and then click. Minor, and mildly annoying, but the sort of thing a patch should fix.

Horses are given a lot of attention in this game, and rightfully so. On par with Kingdom Come Deliverance, with the additional focus on the relationship through the bonding mechanic. I bought a beautiful mottled grey horse who I named Storm Cloud. My partner in crime.

I started playing in first-person once I worked out how to do it. On foot this is the way I will play. But I wasn't comfortable on the horse in first-person, so I've reverted to third-person for that. It's all configurable, so that it automatically switches between first and third person as I get on and off the horse. If I could work out a wider POV mounted I might go back, but the hybrid method is fine and a little more cinematic anyway and easier to maintain formation when riding with the posse. One of the issues, aside from the too-narrow POV, is that when you get near a cliff edge or similar drop-off the first person camera angle is too limited to see it, and my horse and I slid off of one, taking damage. I also had one CTD when navigating the inventory screen.

At this stage I'd rate the controls as awkward. How much of that is down to me is TBD. It's always the case that when changing games and moving from one control scheme to another it will feel alien for a bit, like when you drive your friend's car and fumble for all the switches when you can do it without thinking or looking in your own car, your fingers landing precisely on the volume knob every time. Like GTA 5, you can switch between KB&M and the controller seamlessly, with the on-screen prompts changing to whichever input type was last detected. I felt at times the unresponsive problem also happened in game, actions seemingly not responding right away to my inputs, but maybe I'm not lined up right or something and after some time a considered re-map could help make it more intuitive.

I wanted to post some screenshots, and I use FRAPS for this, but for some reason it did not capture any. Not sure why really.

Nothing show-stopping though and I was able to complete Chapter One and get as far as Valentine. I had a good time with it and looking forward to more. The problems I saw are the sort of technical troubles I expect to be patched out. As far as the gameplay I'm digging it.


Animals flee this hell, the hardest stones cannot bear it for long. Only men endure
#4496230 - 11/06/19 06:48 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: WangoTango]  
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Oh yeah, I meant to say this in the last post....

So after completing what I suppose amounts to the prologue, I hopped on my trusty steed and set off to explore the environs. Headed south out of the Overlook camp and came across a train station, where you're to find the Reverend. As I walked around the outside of the building I spotted an open door, with three men seated at a table playing poker. I stepped inside and one proved to be the Reverend, drunk as a skunk. My character stated in no uncertain terms that the Reverend was not capable, given his current condition, of properly playing the game. So he gets up, falls down and stumbles out of sight, leaving an empty place at the poker table.

"Why don't you take his place?" one of the other men says.

So I did, there'll be time for the good Reverend later I reckon. Poker is one of my favorite card games ever. Actually, it might be my ONLY favorite card game ever. Not expecting to be impressed with RDR's version of Texas Hold 'em, I began to play, and just loved it. I didn't notice exactly how much money I started with, but it was around $1.50, which may not seem like much, but it's the 1890s don't forget. Ante's like 2 or 4 cents. I played for over an hour and by the end I had turned that buck-fitty in to four dollars and change. I was down, then up, then up some more.

But it was fun, and my examples for comparison might be few, but this is easily my favorite poker I've played on the computer. The AI players bluff, and fold and basically play like real players. The only negative I saw was the AI players folding on a check before the flop was down. That makes no sense with no cost to see 'em. But otherwise it was a heck of a lot of fun and I will be playing a lot of RDR 2 poker.

During one hand where I won a massive $1.32 it was down to two of us. I had two pair, which is a solid hand in seven card stud, Jacks over Nines. The other guy kept raising and calling, so I began to worry. Maybe he's a straight, or a full house or whatever. Felt just like playing with people, but without the cigar smoke. 18 cents here, 20 cents there, the pot kept growing. When we laid them down he had two pair, Nines over Fours. Pot's mine boys.

Another hand I had two pair too, and one AI player kept raising and calling. When we laid 'em down he had king-high. Bluffing. Cool.

I kept half-expecting a shoot-out to break out at any time, it's the wild west innit? But when it was time to go all I got was a mild protest. I'll be back. Probably around sundown.


Animals flee this hell, the hardest stones cannot bear it for long. Only men endure
#4496256 - 11/06/19 10:48 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: WangoTango]  
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Supposedly the menu issue has to do with dx12 and win10 mouse. There is a work around for it but honestly I've just used the arrow keys with enter to select and esc to go back. You have to remember it was all originally designed for a console and I also keep a controller plugged in to do horse stuff so a lot of the problems people are running into I dont see since I'm use to how gta5 did the menus (the same way)

So if you want to bypass the menu issue use the up/down/left/right arrow and enter


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#4496262 - 11/06/19 11:27 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: WangoTango]  
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DBond and Master, you guys don't have stutter or micro pauses ? it seems to be related to processor cores, and from what reddit found out, the game use the most draconian DRM ever made, it uses routines in the mother board bios to create triggers in real time, that is why many users had to update their bios before playing.
They also found that for 10xx series older drivers are better, like much better, with the current one 1080ti loses to 2060, they recomend to go back to 39xx and the preference seems to be the 378xx

Last edited by Blade_RJ; 11/06/19 11:30 PM.
#4496333 - 11/07/19 01:24 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Originally Posted by Blade_RJ
DBond and Master, you guys don't have stutter or micro pauses ?


None for me. It's as smooth as any game I've played. And looks gorgeous. Spent some time in town yesterday getting in to brawls and pursuits, and the game looks fantastic. Not only does it run well, the textures and effects are amazing. The buildings, the terrain, the sunsets!, everything. Muddy roads look like muddy roads. I thought KCD did a great job here (and it does), but RDR 2 takes it up a notch. And all of this detail is combined with ridiculous view distances.

As I said I didn't touch the graphics settings, just left them at default. Not sure if it sets them based on an auto-detect routine, so it's different for each player based on his specs? So surely there are graphical features that I don't have enabled. Honestly I don't want to even open the settings to look as I'm afraid I might jinx it. Can't say why it runs so smoothly for me and not for others, but perhaps my unambitious settings are part of it? I took a look this morning and I am running driver 419.35 in case it might matter. My specs are modest, a Ryzen 2600, GTX 1660 Ti and 16 gigs 'o RAM. Game is installed on a mechanical drive.

And when I say it's smooth, I mean perfectly. Not ignoring or excusing random or infrequent hiccups or slowdowns. It runs perfectly, aside from the crashes. I've now had 3 CTDs in about 10 hours of play.

Master, what I've done is just start using the X Box controller for the menus and that works perfectly. It makes things like shopping and inventory management so much better. Upgrading the horse's equipment for example was nearly impossible with the mouse/menu problems. I'm sure they will work it out, but for now the controller overcomes the problem for me.




Animals flee this hell, the hardest stones cannot bear it for long. Only men endure
#4496375 - 11/07/19 07:21 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: Blade_RJ]  
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Originally Posted by Blade_RJ
...and from what reddit found out, the game use the most draconian DRM ever made, it uses routines in the mother board bios to create triggers in real time, that is why many users had to update their bios before playing.


Wow, did a quick google, and indeed...

Thanks for saving me from a 150GB download. I certainly won't support a company like that. I mean, seriously...

#4496378 - 11/07/19 07:43 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: WangoTango]  
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Wow, that is ridiculous indeed. It makes the old "Starforce" DRM not seem so bad by comparison!


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#4496492 - 11/08/19 02:31 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: WangoTango]  
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Nah, starforce was bad because it bricked hardware. Sofar this hasnt brick anything afaik.

I do get micropauses every now and then but normally its after the game crashed and it is fixed by doing a system restart. It's far from ideal and I can understand anyone not buying it because of how #%&*$# this company is being. Which is so funny because they started out as a rebellious company making games that laughed in the face of the bigger publishers... then they got bought out and sold out. Who would have thought a Rockstar game would be like this.

Also, it is extremely fun and Im enjoying it immensely.


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#4496512 - 11/08/19 04:26 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: Master]  
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Originally Posted by Master


Also, it is extremely fun and Im enjoying it immensely.


+1

I'm having trouble with frequent CTDs, but performance remains like liquid glass. The game is so big and beautiful with those crazy draw distances that it surprises me actually that it does run so well on my rig. I'm enjoying it so much that I'm willing to soldier on through the crashes. I'm confident that R* will sort it out. Hopefully they will get a patch out soon.

I've praised the graphics, and I'd be posting screenshots if I could work them out. I suppose I have to use the built-in F6 camera mode? But what appeals to me about this game goes beyond how it looks. It's paced exquisitely, like it was designed by me. I always go easy in these sorts of games, taking time to do nothing but sit and observe, or partaking in the obscure, non-essential things like fishing, or darts or poker, or just going for a ride to nowhere. Pursuing the story is important, but I usually approach it like 'all in good time' as I absorb all there is to do and see. When I read in a review that a game's story is 40 hours long or whatever, I know that will double for me.

RDR 2 is designed to be played this way, and it delivers. There are action sequences of course, but in the main it's all about "moseyin' ". A game to be savoured, not devoured.

I've grown more accustomed to the control scheme, and re-mapping some things to make it better suited to me. Still not perfect in that instinctive, reflexive way that makes it all second nature. I fumble a bit still. Better, but still a bit awkward for me. All in good time smile

With the prologue Chapter One out of the way, having explored near camp and in to town, and buying a fine saddle for my horse, I was ready to start getting down to business. Got up at the crack of dawn, ate some breakfast, chopped some wood for camp, fed and brushed my horse, and then rode in to town and decided to see the sheriff. Got a fun bounty mission there, which didn't take long to complete. Paid in cash, good money. Around the corner I go in to the saloon for a drink. At the bar I meet a man who wants me to go speak to some notorious gunslingers around the map for a book he is writing. I decide to help him, I mean why not right? Gunslingers carry fine weapons you'd think, and if it all goes wrong maybe I'll still end up with some fine kit.

For each of these gunslingers you're given a photograph to recognize him, and flipping it over reveals some details about where he might be found. One named Flaco was holed up near a town called Coltyn, which is where the game began, so I knew where it was and some of the map in that area had been revealed by passing through it on the way to the Horseshoe Overlook camp. It was up in the Grizzlies, akin to the Rockies. Deep snow, mountains, sheer rock faces and frozen lakes.

I made sure to pack a cold-weather outfit on the horse, then rode in to town for provisions at the general store, making certain I had ample food and medicines. And then off I went, heading back in to the snow-covered mountains to talk to Flaco. It isn't that far really, I could have galloped there in a day. But I took my time, exploring trails to nowhere, hunting whitetails with the bow, then setting up camp. Cooked some venison, scored some bullet tips to make them fragment on impact, and brewed up some anti-venom potion just in case. As I ascended the temperature started dropping and the snows fell. To prevent the weather debuffs I changed in to my cold weather gear and continued on my way, and spotted Flaco's camp near a lake on the third morning.

Dismounted a ways off to not be spotted and began making my way toward their camp. I stopped to watch them for a while, see if I could spot any patrol patterns or the like. I drew my bow when one ambled off on his own and put an arrow through his forehead and he dropped without a sound. I moved closer and spotted a second guard with his back to me, and a narrow window through the trees to fire my arrow. But it was a bit high and deflected off a tree branch, alerting the others. They came for me, but seemed to struggle in the deep snow. Using my double-action revolver I dodged among the trees, popping off rounds whenever I got a glimpse of one. Before long they had all fallen and I approached the building where I could hear Flaco calling out to his men.

I called him out, and he would come out but only if I holstered my weapon. As he came out of the door he took the classic gunfighter pose, with his feet apart and his right hand hovering over his revolver's grip in it's holster. It was a duel. I died right away because while I was reading the on-screen prompts to figure out what to do, he shot me dead. But I have a million quarters, and reloaded the checkpoint. This time I got it right and sent a round right through his forehead before he even drew. Sorry Flaco, I just wanted to talk.

I then policed-up the area, looting the guards for ammo, cash and gold and took a photograph of Flaco as proof. And on the ground next to him was his fine revolver, which I slipped in to my holster. The sun was falling so I made camp there for the night, eating supper before sacking in. At dawn, I broke down camp and hopped on Storm Cloud and headed back down the mountains to town.


Animals flee this hell, the hardest stones cannot bear it for long. Only men endure
#4496519 - 11/08/19 04:40 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: RSColonel_131st]  
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Originally Posted by RSColonel_131st
Originally Posted by Blade_RJ
...and from what reddit found out, the game use the most draconian DRM ever made, it uses routines in the mother board bios to create triggers in real time, that is why many users had to update their bios before playing.


Wow, did a quick google, and indeed...

Thanks for saving me from a 150GB download. I certainly won't support a company like that. I mean, seriously...


Kinda lame companies still feel they need to treat their customers like criminals.

Reminds me of going to the grocery store to buy a small pack of batteries because I couldn't even get inside my car due to the FOB not working. The batteries were easy to buy, but holy hell, getting them out of the package I almost stabbed myself several times. What a nightmare.

#4496524 - 11/08/19 05:05 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: DBond]  
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Originally Posted by DBond
Originally Posted by Master


Also, it is extremely fun and Im enjoying it immensely.


+1

I'm having trouble with frequent CTDs, but performance remains like liquid glass.


So a mix of liquid glass and broken glass.

#4496526 - 11/08/19 05:15 PM Re: Red Dead Redemption 2 Announced For PC [Re: WangoTango]  
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Haha, a good way of putting it Lieste smile


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