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#4493209 - 10/16/19 07:28 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Sokol1]  
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NineLine Offline
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Welp, I think that pretty much answers that.

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#4493225 - 10/16/19 09:01 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Sokol1]  
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Yep, sure does. The not so funny thing about it was that the community was up in arms about heavy handedness from the mods on the forum, this was the very first time this had happened. I had posted something about letting cooler heads prevail and I got a PM from Wags asking me to call him. After he told me he didn't care what the squadrons thought I pissed him off by telling him that was a dick thing to say. The next day I posted that I wanted my account removed because of what Wags said, he called me a liar and I threatened to post the audio.

I didn't go looking for problems. He sought me out and acted like a jerk. I don't suffer people like that very well.

Last edited by LOF_Rugg; 10/16/19 09:02 PM.
#4493230 - 10/16/19 09:22 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Sokol1]  
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I dunno what to say, there are two sides to everything, and it's between you and him. All bans on the forum have been lifted, but this seems to go well beyond that.

#4493350 - 10/17/19 08:40 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Sokol1]  
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#4493384 - 10/18/19 02:06 AM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Sokol1]  
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So...now the Viper is getting TWS before the Hornet gets its.... you literally can't make this stuff up nope


https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=244404&page=3

ED takes a small step forward and 15 backwards when it comes to their customers...

#4493385 - 10/18/19 02:30 AM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Sokol1]  
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It was decided to keep the Radar dev put, for now, it was more efficient in the long run, and much of the TWS work on the Viper is transferable to the Hornet.

#4493459 - 10/18/19 12:56 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: LOF_Rugg]  
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Originally Posted by LOF_Rugg
Yep, sure does. The not so funny thing about it was that the community was up in arms about heavy handedness from the mods on the forum, this was the very first time this had happened. I had posted something about letting cooler heads prevail and I got a PM from Wags asking me to call him. After he told me he didn't care what the squadrons thought I pissed him off by telling him that was a dick thing to say. The next day I posted that I wanted my account removed because of what Wags said, he called me a liar and I threatened to post the audio.

I didn't go looking for problems. He sought me out and acted like a jerk. I don't suffer people like that very well.



A phone call? The plot thickens

#4493534 - 10/18/19 09:19 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: reconmercs]  
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Originally Posted by reconmercs
So...now the Viper is getting TWS before the Hornet gets its....


Good. Keep the bugs out of our bug, they can work them out in the viper smile



#4493567 - 10/19/19 05:05 AM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: NineLine]  
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Originally Posted by NineLine
That is your opinion, and you are welcome to it, all I can tell you is what I know. And I know that isn't good enough until you see results.


I was banned by you for asking the VEAO 3rd party contractor with ED where my P40 was and when it would be finished and released. They never did release it and anyone(like myself) that pre purchased the P40 never saw a product released. They never E-mailed me to let me know there was a refund available(1 week only) so I was the victim of what had every appearance of being a fraudulent transaction. When I posted the question to ED on the Forums about what they were going to do to compensate these customers I was banned again. Please don't tell me that is my opinion and I am welcome to it. What I just stated is fact and when I expressed my opinion on the ED Forum all you did was Ban me. I still own a lot of modules from DCS World and I was just looking at the Rata on sale for 19.99$, but then I said to myself, no F-ing way will I buy anything from them. I would love to own the F14, F18, F16, Viggen, AV8B, Mig19, Fw190A8, not to mention the Straight of Hormuz Map, but I WILL BE DAMMED(miss spelled on purpose) IF I WILL SPEND ANYMORE MONEY WITH ED OR DEAL WITH YOU ON THE FORUMS. Hell I haven't even received the P47 or Me262 from the WWII debacle. ED and Ed's Forums haven't been listening to their customers for well over a decade, what would make anyone think that they or you will start all of a sudden now? Add all of those modules up, what is that over 400$ worth? I hope new customers get both sides of the story as you mentioned earlier. There is the rosy picture you paint of how ED has now woken up and really wants to listen to the customers and then there is the actual truth of how they (Ed and you) have run a disorganized, disreputable , disrespectful , borderline possibly fraudulent company and Forum. If Ed finished one half of the Modules they already have sold and released, you guys would probably be the top Sim producing developer out there, but then there is reality. Reality shows a bunch of half finished products that will never see a customer approved finished state. Those are just the facts, I won't state my opinion as Force10 would just have to ban me because even for SimHQ standards it wouldn't be pretty.

S!Blade<><

#4493630 - 10/19/19 02:50 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Sokol1]  
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New interview with "Wags" from Mudspike:

https://www.mudspike.com/mudspike-ama-with-eagle-dynamics-senior-producer-matt-wagner/

I've got to say honestly, I think ED is a sinking ship at this point. Some of the things he claims they are working on...they were supposedly working on years ago.... Basically the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing. Ground radar was a promised feature of the Hornet and they have no clue when it'll actually be available from the looks of the interview, they haven't even figured out how to render it yet nope Meanwhile a free mod (A-4E) has it as does the Heatblur Viggen. I don't know if it just complete incompetence or ego that ED just wont seek help from their 3rd Party Developers. Same issue with Multi-crew and the UH-1, they claimed they were "close" years ago. This is also the same organization that couldn't even deliver trains, cows, SCUD etc on time:
https://www.digitalcombatsimulator....Sri3TnRq5UsVU3kKvIEmYQFRcqGbzXMStIzFzLQw

Also their dynamic campaign will supposedly be ready for "beta" in 2021.... 2020 isn't even here yet and they are still no closer to one of the most requested items for DCS.... How is it Falcon 4.0 was able to furnish a dynamic campaign back in the 90's but these morons still can't figure it out???? Updates to ATC...."down the road"...Weather..."down the road"...Fix the night lighting "down the road"... Fix the Yak-52, literally the most uncomplicated aircraft in the game.."down the road".... Is ED full of the folks not qualified enough to get jobs over 1C Game Studios????

I'd be surprised if ED is even around by 2022 at this rate, even the fanboys are gonna eventually start seeing these folks for what they are, frauds.

#4493640 - 10/19/19 03:45 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Sokol1]  
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bisher Offline
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Morons and frauds, eh? 2022 can't come soon enough for some I'd imagine



#4493643 - 10/19/19 04:02 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Sokol1]  
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rollnloop. Online content
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Quote
One of the toughest aspects of game development is setting priorities.


At least wags has a clue on where they failed the most.

#4493671 - 10/19/19 07:01 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Winfield]  
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Originally Posted by Winfield



A phone call? The plot thickens

45 minutes worth. He was trying to do damage control. I was part of the SIMMOD A-10 team, a mod at LOF as well as CombatAce and I'd released numerous skin packs and a series of missions for LOMAC and I was associated with CH Products when they'd do their live stuff such as at E3.. So in that instance I was fairly well known, I guess he thought I was gonna be a fanboi. But you can't talk smack about people in the community that I care about and expect me to not call you on it. At one point I almost had my attorney send a cease and desist letter to Wags. I was fed up with how he pulled some strings with Thrustmaster to keep me from being one of the reps from CombatAce sent to review it before it's release. The other guy that was going with me to E3 told Eric at CombatAce that if Rugg doesn't go he doesn't either. So TM didn't get any representation from one of the websites dedicated to the flight sim community. I've been out of it for a while but at one point CombatAce was the place to go besides SimHQ and Frugals. Then I got busy at work (I'm a contractor) and I just let sleeping dogs lie. I decided it was best for myself and for Wags just to let him get away with what he did. I was quite a bit younger and with a temper and that never plays well.

Last edited by LOF_Rugg; 10/19/19 07:02 PM. Reason: spelling (speeling) LOL
#4493692 - 10/19/19 09:29 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: reconmercs]  
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Originally Posted by reconmercs

Also their dynamic campaign will supposedly be ready for "beta" in 2021.... 2020 isn't even here yet and they are still no closer to one of the most requested items for DCS....


I think that's quite telling as I don't believe for a single minute that ED has a detailed roadmap through to 2021......simply because they change the goalposts so often and allow feature-creep to take hold of a lot of their development. To me, it says more about a dynamic campaign simply not being a priority and a backburner activity if it even is one at all. Combine this with whatever work ED have stacked up through 2020, they are also updating the KA50 cockpit and the A10 cockpit which in all honesty should not even be featuring as an priority whatsoever. There's still no impetus in finishing platforms and fixing the biggest issues.

To be frank, I don't believe a word ED say. They've proved their incompetence so many time in planning, development and testing and I don't believe they have the minerals within their team to actually turn this around. As for improving their communication, we've heard that a million times too, and the increase and quality of updates over a period of time lasted all of 2 months. Ultimately, ED have had 10 years to try and improve things and they haven't shown they're remotely capable. I've given up on the entire shambles but will wait with an open ear for notification that they've actually completed something they've started.


On the Eighth day God created Paratroopers and the Devil stood to attention.
#4494066 - 10/22/19 02:36 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Blade_Meister]  
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Borsch Offline
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Originally Posted by Blade_Meister

I was banned by you for asking the VEAO 3rd party contractor with ED where my P40 was and when it would be finished and released. They never did release it and anyone(like myself) that pre purchased the P40 never saw a product released. They never E-mailed me to let me know there was a refund available(1 week only) so I was the victim of what had every appearance of being a fraudulent transaction. When I posted the question to ED on the Forums about what they were going to do to compensate these customers I was banned again.
From this description it certainly sounds like you should not have been banned. As for 3rd parties... Did anyone sue Microsoft over problems with 3rd party software designed for their FSX platform? Honest question, my understanding is that as as customer you too have an obligation to do due diligence before spending your hard earned.Thus, trusting VEAO was likely your own fault, sorry.

Originally Posted by Blade_Meister
Hell I haven't even received the P47 or Me262 from the WWII debacle.

Mistakes do happen, but you can probably still write to support if you are eligible. I have put $1 towards Ilya Shevchenko's kickstarter and I got a Fw-190 Dora out of it. how much did you pledge?
Originally Posted by Blade_Meister

There is the rosy picture you paint of how ED has now woken up and really wants to listen to the customers and then there is the actual truth of how they (Ed and you) have run a disorganized, disreputable , disrespectful , borderline possibly fraudulent company and Forum.

With regards to ED forums, it is almost like there are two parallel universes - the English ED forums and Russian ED forums. Russian forums are super tolerant, you are talking to the devs directly with community managers being there for just as a sideshow. My feeling is that the Russian core of the team did not even know about the ins and outs of English forums politics, and having found out, they are trying to make things better.


Originally Posted by Blade_Meister

If Ed finished one half of the Modules they already have sold and released, you guys would probably be the top Sim producing developer out there, but then there is reality. Reality shows a bunch of half finished products that will never see a customer approved finished state.

Come on! smile Ka-50, A-10C, P-51, Dora, Mig-15, F-86, F-5, Huey Uh-1, Mi-8, L-39, F-15C, Su-27, Su-25, Su-25T, Mig-29A/C/G - are ALL finished. That is not to say that there aren't some issues (temporary or semi permanent) wish some of them, but hey! A model of reality is always inferior, almost by definition and can be improved ad infinitum. But that does not mean that those models are not "finished"!
I own a lot of the aircraft above and they are all simply superb - their aerodynamic modelling is second to none, campaigns like "The enemy within" or "Georgian War F-15C" are an absolute blast.

I implore you to forgive ED's poor management of the English forums politics (hey, they are just a bunch of Russian aeronotics engineers, aviation geeks and programmers - that is pretty much exactly what became ED in the 1990's, and what remains ED today. ( BTW An Petrovich, the author of RiseOfFlight AFM-showcased in your avatar- was also originally from ED and his ground breaking Su-25 AFM is still amazing to this day). The Russian guys are unusually liberally minded too, english forums purges go completely against their spirit and I can only say that their language barrier was probably the main culprit in the whole situation. Wags, Nick Gray etc (with all due respect) are not what makes DCS tick.

#4494081 - 10/22/19 03:15 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: reconmercs]  
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Originally Posted by reconmercs
How is it Falcon 4.0 was able to furnish a dynamic campaign back in the 90's but these morons still can't figure it out????

Which Falcon 4? the one that was in development for 6 years, and which was 2 years past its release date? The one that was full of bugs, and a commercial fail, leading to Microprose going under? The one with on rail aerodynamics, terribad ground tiles (even by late 1990s standards) and no replays even- evidently having put all of their resources into the campaign and scripted systems?

And i am not really knocking one of the true masterpieces in flight sims - Falcon is rightly up there with best of them, but let's not lose perspective here smile Falcon 4 is not an example a flightsim company should follow.

Further, there is a question of priorities. DCS has physics first approach, and its aerodynamics algorithms were ground breaking back in 2006 with Su-25 AFM and continue to lead the pack to this day. You may not care for physics, you may question this decision and prefer no less ground braking dynamic campaign of Falcon 4, but you too should see that in this imperfect world one can not have ground breaking everything. DCS static campaigns are awesome btw, while being completely absent in Falcon 4, so there is that too.

Last edited by Borsch; 10/22/19 03:17 PM.
#4494100 - 10/22/19 04:53 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Sokol1]  
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Um, DCS is a borked mess right now. Has been for some time. As far as priorities - they've (ED) been thinking about dynamic campaign for the past 20 years. By all accounts they're going to keep on thinking about it for another 20.

ED is certainly no example of a flight-sim company. At some point these kind of apologetics just gets old.

#4494104 - 10/22/19 05:19 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: cdelucia]  
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Borsch Offline
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It is one sim that financially survived while most have perished. But of course it is run by "morons and frauds" and is no example of a flight-sim company...
Originally Posted by cdelucia
Um, DCS is a borked mess right now. Has been for some time.
When wasn't it "borked"? When was the golden age that you are harking back to?

Dynamic campaign is a complex beast. Made more complex by the ongoing development of the platform with ongoing changes to the AI, weapons logic, scripting, optimisation and so on. And yes, the dynamic campaign was never ED primary focus - by design. They chose to put their eggs into the physics and general core code development basket. And, unlike Jane's, Microporse, Oleg Maddox and so on they are still here, showering us with masterpieces like the Huey, P-51, Su-27 and so on and so forth.

Falcon4 benchmark of a campaign came out with lots of bugs and currently benefits from a static code the core of which remained constant over the past 20 odd years. modern attempts at dynamic campaigns like in IL2:1946, RoF and IL2:BOS are not a patch on Falcon and i personally prefer a good static campaign to any of them.

Last edited by Borsch; 10/22/19 05:33 PM.
#4494113 - 10/22/19 06:16 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Borsch]  
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Originally Posted by Borsch
It is one sim that financially survived while most have perished.


"Financially survived" but at what cost? Using funds from one unfinished module to pay for further developing the previous unfinished module doesn't sound like quite the runaway success story you're making it out to be. It more sounds like they're struggling to keep the lights on actually. Let's not kid ourselves here...I highly doubt a Dynamic campaign is even possible to code with the ever changing platform/modules that DCS has. You really need an "AI specialist" to code AI routines and AI has been a weak point in DCS's history IMO.

While I understand why DCS has appeal to many...there is probably just as many like myself that don't even fly the modules I payed for and instead...fly a modification to a 20 year old sim. I like feeling like a combat pilot in an immersive war scenario with a lively battlefield. DCS has a LONG way to go to get there...if it's even possible.

You have valid points about Falcon 4.0...but can you explain why so many people fly it instead of flying DCS?


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#4494127 - 10/22/19 07:09 PM Re: DCS: F-16C Viper [Re: Sokol1]  
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rollnloop. Online content
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Easy answer: dynamic campaign/atc+awacs+wingmens comms/air to ground radar/no game breaking issues that stay for months after a beta mishap.

And still, despite all this, my modern sim right now is DCS, just because F-14 (fly only this one, when my RIO buddy is available). So let's hope DCS manages its issues as best as possible.

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