#4457897 - 01/19/19 02:38 AM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: Mr_Blastman]
|
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 15,786
Haggart
I Fought Diablo
|
I Fought Diablo
Veteran
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 15,786
The Lone Star State
|
Step 2 would be to build roads all over Mars, shopping centers and concrete on which to park those cars and dump all our wastes and plastic into any existing water well we find
"everything lives by a law, a central balance sustains all"
|
|
#4457899 - 01/19/19 03:04 AM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: Haggart]
|
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 24,712
Dart
Measured in Llamathrusts
|
Measured in Llamathrusts
Lifer
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 24,712
Alabaster, AL USA
|
Step 2 would be to build roads all over Mars, shopping centers and concrete on which to park those cars and dump all our wastes and plastic into any existing water well we find Hell, yeah, sounds like a solid plan to me.
The opinions of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events. More dumb stuff at http://www.darts-page.comFrom Laser: "The forum is the place where combat (real time) flight simulator fans come to play turn based strategy combat."
|
|
#4457930 - 01/19/19 01:35 PM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: Mr_Blastman]
|
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 13,735
F4UDash4
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 13,735
SC
|
The self hate some feel for their own species is astonishing to me.
"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
|
|
#4458337 - 01/23/19 02:13 AM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: CyBerkut]
|
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 13,735
F4UDash4
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 13,735
SC
|
Yep. Totally non intuitive but I would never bet against him.
"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
|
|
#4458339 - 01/23/19 02:28 AM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: Dart]
|
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,402
Zamzow
Member
|
Member
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,402
|
Once we look at the water, we should do what somehow is unthinkable - introduce life.
If there is a lot of liquid water, we have several forms of life that can live in it.
And if we can ever come up with a way to either emulate a magnetic shield or find some way to kick start the planet's own weak one, step one to terraforming is done.
+ 1,000,000,000! We ought to be sending spores, seeds, algae, fungi, whatever, and seeing if any of it will take. Then there's a shot at getting an ecosystem going. Give it a billion years (even on it's own) and you might have a self sustaining habitat (you could hunt for food...) If we're still kicking a billion years from now on Earth we'll be needing it......
|
|
#4488866 - 09/09/19 03:00 PM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: Mr_Blastman]
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,569
Mr_Blastman
Hotshot
|
Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,569
Atlanta, GA
|
Silica aerogel is amazing stuff... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sw1tNeJ0RwBut despite how cool it'd be to terraform Mars and give it an atmosphere, the planet lacks a stable, coherent magnetosphere to preserve and protect any atmosphere from stellar radiation and blow-off. This is a interesting proposition, but I fear that most any of us living on Mars long-term will be confined to those domes we often hear and read about in science fiction. We could pour a ridiculous sum of money into carbonizing the atmosphere from outside sources such a surface bombardment, etc., but long-term whatever we put there won't stick around. That said, I think Mars is a critically important stepping stone to mankind colonizing interstellar space. The technology and methodologies we learn by going there may serve us well for generations to come. [edit: moderators, youtube imbedding is broken now on SimHQ]
Last edited by Mr_Blastman; 09/09/19 03:00 PM.
|
|
#4488867 - 09/09/19 03:01 PM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: Mr_Blastman]
|
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 24,712
Dart
Measured in Llamathrusts
|
Measured in Llamathrusts
Lifer
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 24,712
Alabaster, AL USA
|
From the article: “The main risk is associated with planetary protection,” Wordsworth continued. “We haven’t yet found any life on Mars, but it could still be conceivably hidden in some subsurface niches. When we build habitats on Mars, we need to be careful not to interfere with this life in any way if it does exist.” That is some straight up bovine excrement. One can't say "terraform," meaning to make it Earth-like, and also say we shouldn't alter or change any indigenous life. They're incompatible goals.
The opinions of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events. More dumb stuff at http://www.darts-page.comFrom Laser: "The forum is the place where combat (real time) flight simulator fans come to play turn based strategy combat."
|
|
#4488870 - 09/09/19 03:10 PM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: Dart]
|
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,383
PanzerMeyer
Pro-Consul of Florida
|
Pro-Consul of Florida
King Crimson - SimHQ's Top Poster
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,383
Miami, FL USA
|
One can't say "terraform," meaning to make it Earth-like, and also say we shouldn't alter or change any indigenous life. They're incompatible goals.
Bingo. That struck me as well when I read the article. Illogical and contradictory statements seem to be par for the course though with these types of speculative articles concerning either human space exploration or alien life.
“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
|
|
#4488899 - 09/09/19 07:32 PM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: Dart]
|
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 9,619
CyBerkut
Administrator
|
Administrator
Hotshot
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 9,619
Florida
|
From the article: “The main risk is associated with planetary protection,” Wordsworth continued. “We haven’t yet found any life on Mars, but it could still be conceivably hidden in some subsurface niches. When we build habitats on Mars, we need to be careful not to interfere with this life in any way if it does exist.” That is some straight up bovine excrement. One can't say "terraform," meaning to make it Earth-like, and also say we shouldn't alter or change any indigenous life. They're incompatible goals. Ayup. "Habitats" is probably a good bit less ambitous than truly terraforming, and therefor more attainable. I think concern for any possible microbes, etc. native to Mars is overwrought, and should be discarded after some suitably short period of time. Perhaps after a long enough period of building (aerogel or whatever) protected areas, some could be turned to the task of raising the planet's atmospheric pressure. Maybe, if enough of that can be built (we are talking a loooong time down the road) it could overcome the lack of a magnetosphere. Maybe in conjunction with harvesting asteroids, etc. Creating enclosed habitats would be a good start though. I think any early efforts at making a permanent presence on Mars is going to require a layer of soil for shielding from radiation. It would be interesting to know more about what aerogel crosssections to various radiation types is.
|
|
#4488923 - 09/10/19 02:59 AM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: Zamzow]
|
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 13,215
NH2112
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 13,215
Jackman, ME
|
I still say if you can't manage to establish a true self sustaining colony in Antarctica (and I'm talking deep into the continent, not an "easy" location like McMurdo) then you can forget about doing that on Mars.
Antarctica is covered by what, a layer of ice 2 miles thick? You’d have to drill that far just to reach soil & rock, into which you’d have to drill deeper to mine anything. Mars doesn’t have 2 miles of ice in the way.
Phil
“The biggest problem people have is they don’t think they’re supposed to have problems.” - Hayes Barnard
|
|
#4488929 - 09/10/19 05:11 AM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: Mr_Blastman]
|
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,704
Rick_Rawlings
Senior Member
|
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,704
|
Not only that, but anyone living on Mars for a long time would struggle to return to Earth unless we figure out how to prevent muscle loss.
The older I get, the more I realize I don't need to be Han, Luke or Leia. I'm just happy to be rebel scum...
|
|
#4488932 - 09/10/19 07:08 AM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: NH2112]
|
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 7,747
Ssnake
Virtual Shiva Beast
|
Virtual Shiva Beast
Hotshot
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 7,747
Germoney
|
I still say if you can't manage to establish a true self sustaining colony in Antarctica (and I'm talking deep into the continent, not an "easy" location like McMurdo) then you can forget about doing that on Mars. Antarctica is covered by what, a layer of ice 2 miles thick? You’d have to drill that far just to reach soil & rock, into which you’d have to drill deeper to mine anything. Mars doesn’t have 2 miles of ice in the way. I think he was more hinting at the need to establish a habitat with self-sustaining life support in an environment that, while being the most hostile on this planet, is still more benign than Mars (because it has a breathable atmosphere, a magnetosphere, and (near the coast) animals to hunt for food. "Ecosphere 2" didn't work out too well, we'd need a couple more of those experiments to establish something that reliably works the first time you set it up in near vacuum conditions and sub-zero temperatures. Drilling rock is the least of your problems on Mars.
|
|
#4488935 - 09/10/19 09:30 AM
Re: Water found on Mars
[Re: The_Admiral]
|
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 9,619
CyBerkut
Administrator
|
Administrator
Hotshot
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 9,619
Florida
|
Beyond the marvels of science and the future perspectives it brings us, I find sort of ironic and very presumptuous that Mankind feels bold enough to even talk about the best course on how to change the atmosphere and the environment of another planet, when our own experience (whether we're climato-sceptic or not I guess it's a given, it's not just a matter of temperature) show that we're pretty incompetent at preserving the habitat and the atmosphere of our own planet... I'd rather have us putting a little more energy into making sure that we keep what we have livable on the long term, before worrying about making other places livable at all... 1. The goals for each planet are not mutually exclusive. 2. When it comes to ecological stewardship of the earth, "Mankind" is not a monolithic block. The U.S., for all of its industrial development, etc., has cleaner air and water now, than when I was a child. We can do fine. We don't control the rest of mankind's behavior on earth. Let's not take this to PWEC, though. 3. If one finds Mankind to be inadequate at preserving the earth's habitat, then pursuing development of another habitat as an insurance policy is arguably a logical and worthy goal. For many years (at least), it will be far fewer people on Mars to screw up whatever gets accomplished there.
|
|
|
CD WOFF
by Britisheh. 03/28/24 08:05 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|