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#4482384 - 07/11/19 11:43 AM "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve  
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I'm really starting to get pumped about this film which will be coming out November 2020.

Here are some key details about the production that have been released to the public so far:


Confirmed cast:

Timothee Chalamet - Paul Atreides
Rebecca Ferguson - Lady Jessica
Oscar Isaac - Duke Leto Atreides
Josh Brolin - Gurney Halleck
Stellan Skarsgard - Baron Vladimir Harkonnen
Dave Bautista - Rabban
Zendaya - Chani
Charlotte Rampling - Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam
Javier Bardem - Stilgar



Shooting Locations: Jordan and Hungary.
Music by Hans Zimmer

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 07/11/19 11:46 AM.

“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
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#4482385 - 07/11/19 11:58 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I have some faith in Villeneuve, he got Blade Runner right which was no small achievement. I also enjoyed Arrival, it was very thoughtful. I enjoyed the Lynch version but it suffered from being a contained movie IMO.


"They might look the same, but they don't taste the same."
#4482386 - 07/11/19 12:11 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: DM]  
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Originally Posted by DM
I have some faith in Villeneuve, he got Blade Runner right which was no small achievement. I also enjoyed Arrival, it was very thoughtful. I enjoyed the Lynch version but it suffered from being a contained movie IMO.



I really love both "Arrival" and "Blade Runner 2049" so I have high hopes for Dune.


I'm also a huge fan of the David Lynch film even though I concede it has its own set of flaws but I blame the producers for those flaws since Lynch did not have full creative control over the project.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4482410 - 07/11/19 03:30 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I'm skeptical. The saving grace here is Villeneuve will have to follow Herbert's book and plot, which will help him avoid contrived plot devices that ruined Arrival. I didn't like Arrival at all, btw. It paled in comparison with Contact. Sagan's genius dramatically out staged Villeneuve's stylistic flourish. I do need to see Blade Runner 2049, though.

Oh, and I almost forgot--I did enjoy his 2013 film "Enemy," with Jake Gyllenahaal.

Last edited by Mr_Blastman; 07/11/19 03:35 PM.
#4482437 - 07/11/19 08:32 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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It all depends on how close they follow the lay and gist of the story.

Lynch's Dune looked great, but was an utter disgrace regardings the story.
Syfy's mini-series captured the story great, but had much lower production value. But I still prefer it over Lynch's Dune.

I'm not holding my breath about it being faithful to the original story.

#4482441 - 07/11/19 09:28 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Was Lynch's Dune that bad? It's been awhile since I've read the book and seen the movie, but I remember him following the book fairly well, the first half of the book anyway. Then he ran out of movie running time and had to condense the last half of the book into about 15 minutes of screen time. It's not perfect, but as far as book adaptations go, it's definitely above average.

#4482443 - 07/11/19 10:03 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I loved that movie! Saw it in the theater. Some major additions straying from the book, but I enjoyed it.


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#4482444 - 07/11/19 10:45 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Book is a political drama set in space..Making that look pretty on the big screen is always going to be hard.

#4482500 - 07/12/19 10:07 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I enjoyed the Lynch movie as a quick notes version of the book...


Looking forward to the movie, but I feel to do this real justice they need to go full on game of thrones production. Maybe a season a book, but more like 2-3 seasons a book....

#4482503 - 07/12/19 10:26 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Khai]  
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Originally Posted by Khai
I enjoyed the Lynch movie as a quick notes version of the book...


Looking forward to the movie, but I feel to do this real justice they need to go full on game of thrones production. Maybe a season a book, but more like 2-3 seasons a book....




If this first film does well at the box office, the studio (Legendary) plans on making more.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4482505 - 07/12/19 10:30 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: wormfood]  
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Originally Posted by wormfood
Was Lynch's Dune that bad? .



The major complaint leveled against the film is that it left out a lot of stuff from the novel and it made some major changes. For example, all of the intrigue with Feyd on Giedi Prime was cut out and the "Weirding Way" of the Bene Gesserit was radically changed from being something more akin to martial arts in the novel to being a sound controlled hand held weapon in the movie.


The fundamental problem as I alluded to before is that Lynch did not have "final cut" on the movie. He had to compromise with the producers on the creative direction of the film.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4497806 - 11/21/19 12:35 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Kenneth McMillan is my fan-boy choice as best actor for the character of Baron Vladimir Harkonnen. He made me almost physically ill in his portrayal as the Baron Vladimir Harkonnen in the Lynch version of Dune. smile Somebody special needs to take this role for the new version.


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#4497828 - 11/21/19 11:30 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: letterboy1]  
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Originally Posted by letterboy1
Somebody special needs to take this role for the new version.



This guy is playing the Baron in the new Dune film,


https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001745/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_0


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4501508 - 12/25/19 05:09 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Oh WOW!!! I wish I had checked back here sooner! Stellan is awesome!!! I like how you casually typed "this guy." biggrin I can hardly wait to see Stellan's version of the Duke! If I was excited before, I am even more so now!


The issue is not p*ssy. The issue is monkey.
#4501589 - 12/25/19 11:11 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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In case you were curious LB, principal photography is done. From now until next December it will be all post production stuff. Special effects, music, editing, etc.

I am not expecting the soundtrack for this film to top what Toto did for Lynch’s film but Hans Zimmer will turn in a worthy effort I’m sure.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4508623 - 02/27/20 11:39 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Instead of redoing Dune they should be continuing the series like Chapterhouse or Sandworms of Dune..

#4508636 - 02/27/20 01:31 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: 453Raafspitty]  
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Originally Posted by 453Raafspitty
Instead of redoing Dune they should be continuing the series like Chapterhouse or Sandworms of Dune..


I see your point but the problem with that is most of the audience will be lost if this new film doesn’t start from the beginning. The Lynch film came out 36 years ago and is mostly remembered only by hardcore fans.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4508654 - 02/27/20 05:18 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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And the TV miniseries for Dune and Children of Dune came out 20 and 17 years ago and are only barely remembered by hardcore fans.

#4516149 - 04/13/20 11:38 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4516598 - 04/15/20 11:24 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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#4516646 - 04/16/20 10:51 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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OMG Liet Kynes is a woman!!!! WOW ole Frank would be spinning in his grave..Looks like the "wierding way" is going to be going back to its roots as a martial arts..Jason Momoa looks weird without a beard though..
Its funny how reporters are sort of trying to make things look mysterious though..We all know who Chani is.Must be a Millennial thing...

#4516650 - 04/16/20 11:12 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: 453Raafspitty]  
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Originally Posted by 453Raafspitty
OMG Liet Kynes is a woman!!!! WOW ole Frank would be spinning in his grave..Looks like the "wierding way" is going to be going back to its roots as a martial arts..Jason Momoa looks weird without a beard though..
Its funny how reporters are sort of trying to make things look mysterious though..We all know who Chani is.Must be a Millennial thing...



I would make an educated guess and say most Millennials don't even know what Dune is.


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#4516923 - 04/17/20 04:00 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Liet Keynes a woman?

meh. don't care either way, wasn't a huge character in the book.

#4516927 - 04/17/20 04:21 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Sorry, but the actor playing Paul looks too effeminate. More manliness, please.

#4516928 - 04/17/20 04:25 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Mr_Blastman]  
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Originally Posted by Mr_Blastman
Sorry, but the actor playing Paul looks too effeminate. More manliness, please.



Kyle McLachlan didn't exactly exude Chuck Norris levels of manliness either. biggrin


As for Liet Keynes being a woman, I really don't see it being a big deal since Keynes is a secondary character who dies relatively early in the story.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4516934 - 04/17/20 04:46 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Yeah but at least Kyle has a defined facial structure and a manly square chin. He also carried himself better. He had a quirky nerdiness to him--still does, but he never seemed like a wuss, especially in Dune.

#4517008 - 04/18/20 01:13 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Kyle and a lot of the original cast had screen presence.Will be interesting to see how the new cast perform in the movie.Liet had a lot more to do in the prequels I think.Im still trying to finish the rest of the books at the moment.Not long started House Atredies and last one I read was Sandworms of Dune..Even as a Gola he had a minor part in the after books.

#4517354 - 04/20/20 05:28 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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If you are a fan of David Lynch and Dune you'll find this article interesting:


https://www.indiewire.com/2020/04/david-lynch-zero-interest-villeneuve-dune-1202225984/


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4517515 - 04/21/20 09:45 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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The Directors extended cut did bring the movie back closer to his vision but yes it was still a shambles to him..It was going to be so much better..

#4526014 - 06/17/20 10:00 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Just finished reading the Prequels..I hope the movie hits a big enough note to go down the road of more movies.I can see it as a cross between Star Wars and Game of Thrones for Millennials..
Liet is the "son" of Pardot Kynes who was the original planetoligist to the Emperors father.It was Pardot who saw the dream that Dune could become a green paradise seen in the later books.His vision and dream won over the Fremen and Liet took over that dream .
Duncan is a Ginaz swordmaster as bladed weapons have a much more pronounced impact in the books than in the movie.If your thinking hey its far in the future where are the Laser guns?Apparently lasers and shields have the bad ability to cause a nuclear chain reaction when crossed..Lasers are used to slice and dice but used warily. High tech was heavily scrutinized after the Butlerian Jihad with the war against the Thinking Machines...

#4526024 - 06/17/20 10:50 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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The whole Dune universe is little more than Fantasy without the context of Butler's Jihad. The whole Navigator's Guild and the total dependency on Spice hinges on the plausibility of the absence of sophisticated computers.

#4526096 - 06/18/20 08:52 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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True but his loopholes of the Mentats and Bene Tleilax,Bene Geserate who could do the same work as sophisticated computers..Cant forget about the grey area operations on Ix..

Last edited by 453Raafspitty; 06/18/20 08:54 AM.
#4526112 - 06/18/20 10:39 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Everything I've read about the new upcoming Dune film indicates to me that it will be a VERY well done adaptation. About the only aspect that I'm pretty sure will not be matched is the musical score. That soundtrack by Toto and Brian Eno for the Lynch film is simply brilliant.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4526232 - 06/18/20 09:54 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Yeah with Zimmer he has a very dark sort of tone with soundtracks..I dont think he has the reach that Eno and Toto pulled off.Big shoes to fill...
Very limited info out there about the movie so far except its finished principle filming.Havent even seen a full cast call yet so a lot of questions on who is playing the Emporer or Feyd and a few others..Stalked the artists and found only a small amount of info on how the Sandworms will pan out.One thing I did see was the Fremen Chrysknife has changed from the Lynch organic tooth design to a more imperial short sword type.Look at the shots of Chani online and you will see it on her belt.

#4536314 - 09/08/20 07:39 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Teaser for the trailer that arrives tomorrow, wednesday.

#4536358 - 09/09/20 03:21 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Now trailers have their own trailers? I don't understand this world anymore.

#4536384 - 09/09/20 10:51 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: wormfood]  
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Originally Posted by wormfood
Now trailers have their own trailers? I don't understand this world anymore.


With the current pandemic, the studios and movie theaters have to pump up the excitement any way they can.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4536434 - 09/09/20 04:55 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Whiners biggrin

Here is the full one.


#4536435 - 09/09/20 05:01 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I just saw it a few minutes ago. Assuming this film keeps the December release date I WILL go see it in the theater.

I always knew this film would be utterly fantastic. I just hope enough people go out to see it.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4536436 - 09/09/20 05:23 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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The actor playing Paul seems like a wussy douche, the kind I'd want to punch growing up. Overall, I got a general feeling of typical Hollywood pretentiousness from the trailer, such as when he was asked to place his hand in the box and Sister Bene Gesserit stylishly flourished the gom jabbar to his neck.

I am aware of my own irony. Yes, seeing thousands of movies perhaps makes myself a pretentious critic, and I'm fine with that. smile

#4536439 - 09/09/20 05:33 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Mr_Blastman]  
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Originally Posted by Mr_Blastman
The actor playing Paul seems like a wussy douche, the kind I'd want to punch growing up. Overall, I got a general feeling of typical Hollywood pretentiousness from the trailer, such as when he was asked to place his hand in the box and Sister Bene Gesserit stylishly flourished the gom jabbar to his neck.

I am aware of my own irony. Yes, seeing thousands of movies perhaps makes myself a pretentious critic, and I'm fine with that. smile



Paul in the book goes through a major character arc to say the least so I have no problem with the casting of an actor who may not quite look the part. If the actor already looks like a bad ass galactic revolutionary with superior fighting skills then there's not much change to show is there?

As for the gom jabbar reveal, it was virtually identical to the way it was done in the Lynch film. The gom jabbar design was the only major difference.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4536441 - 09/09/20 05:36 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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trailers dropped!

and ... I think this may be good.. hoping!!

#4536442 - 09/09/20 05:53 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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But it wasn't the same. In the original film, the gom jabbar doesn't make a cartoonish zing when she brings it to Paul's neck, nor does it do a dramatic zoom in with multiple camera angle changes over the span of a couple of seconds, nor is the background blurred out to give the room a pretentious minimalist Steve Jobs Apple feel.

I feel as if Villeneuve needs to have his balls placed in a vice and cinched tightly until he knows himself the true meaning of pain, yet have the procedure be done in an oaken beer lacquered bar in the seediest part of town with rusty pointy teeth in the vice until he cries mercy. For all the surrealism that Lynch imbedded in his version of Dune, he kept the important scenes frank and honest to the viewer and didn't violate sensibilities with cartoonish absurdity, save for perhaps that floating ghast Harkonnnen, who, I'll admit, was farcically comical with his floating pustulence.

Villeneuve needs to spend a day with John Spartan. He'll straighten him out. smile



p.s. I made "pustulence" up. I think it is fitting, strong, and visual.







Last edited by Mr_Blastman; 09/09/20 05:55 PM.
#4536447 - 09/09/20 06:50 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Eh, the original movie was as true to the novel as a two-dime rag.

Lynch chose style over staying true to the story. It'll be the benchmark for the visual style, but most definately *not* on how well it represents the book.

#4536489 - 09/10/20 11:30 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: EAF331 MadDog]  
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Originally Posted by EAF331 MadDog
Eh, the original movie was as true to the novel as a two-dime rag.

Lynch chose style over staying true to the story. It'll be the benchmark for the visual style, but most definately *not* on how well it represents the book.



You are half correct on this.

The Lynch film was indeed a significant departure from the novel. However, Lynch did not have full creative control over the project. All creative decisions were jointly made between Lynch and the De Laurentiis family who were the executive producers. I have no doubt that the film would have turned out very differently had Lynch had full creative control.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4536491 - 09/10/20 12:08 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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It looks big with the sweeping camera angles and big CGI scenes..Its the details we will be looking at..Not sure I like the sandworm teeth yet..

#4536497 - 09/10/20 01:11 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I heard that at the last minute they decided against a Gom JarJar. "Meesa givin you big moy-moy pain." So, let's consider ourselves lucky with the syringe.


The issue is not p*ssy. The issue is monkey.
#4536600 - 09/11/20 10:31 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Throw that abomination to the desert..

#4536761 - 09/12/20 06:30 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: letterboy1]  
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Originally Posted by letterboy1
I heard that at the last minute they decided against a Gom JarJar. "Meesa givin you big moy-moy pain." So, let's consider ourselves lucky with the syringe.


rofl

#4539639 - 10/06/20 06:27 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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#4539648 - 10/06/20 11:12 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: EAF331 MadDog]  
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Yeah I saw that last night. I knew the film was going to be pushed back to 2021 but I didn’t think it would be so far into the year. Oh well.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4539782 - 10/07/20 09:07 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Post production work no doubt.Just hoping its not scene retakes and they start muddling with the script this late in the piece...

#4539799 - 10/07/20 12:59 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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No, this is just not wanting to release a movie in the current situation with a lack of audiences willing to risk a movie show.

It's happening to most blockbuster movies right now.

#4539800 - 10/07/20 01:09 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Correct MadDog. The film has already been completed and "in the can" for a while now. However, it is possible that the director/producers could start getting second thoughts and might decide to change something with the special effects, editing, music, etc.

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 10/07/20 01:10 PM.

“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4539985 - 10/08/20 07:35 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Hollyweid is affected by the Virus. It hit them in the wallet. What with the Movie houses closing down so they will have to do a Paradigm change. Maybe, minimum budget films for TV or have 1 camera films instead of multi-camera or No-name stars. Until a cure or vaccine.

#4540049 - 10/09/20 11:33 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: carrick58]  
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Originally Posted by carrick58
Panzer:

Hollyweid is affected by the Virus. It hit them in the wallet. What with the Movie houses closing down so they will have to do a Paradigm change. Maybe, minimum budget films for TV or have 1 camera films instead of multi-camera or No-name stars. Until a cure or vaccine.



More specifically the movie theater chains/exhibitors are hurting and they are hurting badly. The film studios themselves are in a much better position since they can just sell their films directly to streaming services. Sure, the pandemic has meant that shooting films takes longer now due to the precautions but the film studios will be just fine. And besides, the studios won't have to divide the revenue from ticket sales with the movie theaters. When they license a film to a streaming service the studio gets 100% of the money.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4541482 - 10/19/20 07:10 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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#4541489 - 10/19/20 07:43 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I have always found the Fermi paradox very amusing because it unintelligently assumes that alien life would try and communicate with us through conventional means such via the electromagnetic spectrum by means of radio waves, microwaves or even visible light. Then, he went on to assume that because there is life on Earth, then there should be life elsewhere, and given the known age of the Universe at the time he made his posit(we now know it is much older), the surely life must have evolved elsewhere and thussly expanded in such a manner to flourish and emit such EM signals as to show they exist.

Thus the basis for the Paradox--we don't see, so there must not be.

I have long been at odds with Fermi, for a few reasons,

1) Assumption that life evolved elsewhere is foolish, when those who believe life spontaneously evolved from nothing on Earth can't even reproduce such biochemical spontaneity on Earth. Alternately see: panspermia and religion. All are faith based assumptions, when you boil the soup and look at what is left over.

2) Assumption that life would use conventional EM means to communicate. As I see it, any sentient, spacefaring civilization capable of interstellar travel would likely have found a means of communication vastly superior to linear transit of information on a 3+1(space+time) Minkowskian bound method. If they DID use a 3+1 means, then it would be a directed tight beam to either relays or planets which themselves would use tight beams. Regardless, the scatter would be minimized beyond our traditional acceptance of the inverse square law and EM particle/wave dispersion. Likely, if they possessed the technology to populate distant solar systems en masse, then the same method they use to traverse these systems rapidly would imply directly they found a way through 3+1, either by means of tunneling or higher dimensional channels--that to us, a Tier 0.7ish on the Kardashev scale, would seem Godlike and impossible. And, nicely enough, would be completely imperceptible by us, even if we were right next to the transmitter, nevertheless light years away as we may be.

FRBs(fast-radio bursts) are one potential example of perturbations of space time and spontaneous releases of huge amounts of energy, but they are a new item of study and thus far, conclusions have been against these being of ET origin.

Consider that we have only had radio communications for a century, and how quickly we have moved past much of this--and one can see quickly how any burgeoning civilization may approach this, like us, as a stepping stone to greater technologies and methods.


3) That we would be able to see evidence of their civilizations through telescopes because they would be all around us. I find this presumption false, as well, for one only needs to look so far as the history of life as we know it on Earth, and the numerous extinction events and setbacks life has had to face. We may very well be the only life alive in the Galaxy right now, or we may not. I realize this is the crux of the paradox--that because we don't see any evidence, it may not be whatsoever, but considering that life has gone through so many events on our own world, the absence of evidence does not disprove the existence. It is only the absence of evidence...

Given the enormous distances between stars, the seemingly impossibility for life to spontaneously burst into existence from our own studies, and the relatively young age of our Universe @ 13.77 billion or so years, what life there is may be spread so far apart, or have occurred with such infrequency that there's no wonder we haven't detected it--or, that it is so advanced that our sensors aren't capable of detecting their evidence because they've surpassed our technology by many orders and our comprehension.


Arthur C. Clarke's Third law: "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

At least the article concedes that Sandworms are aliens. smile The spacing guild and the bene gesserit's technologies, from a reader's perspective in Dune, are magic.


Granted, there is the KIC 8462852 "Alien Megastructure Anomaly," of which incidences of variable dimming patterns have been detected from two different stars, that also is not proof of or against. They are very interesting data points for further observation.

Last edited by Mr_Blastman; 10/19/20 07:47 PM.
#4541525 - 10/20/20 01:27 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Fermi paradox discussions are always interesting smile if you like to get many viewpoints, and assuming you don't already know of him, a guy called Isaac Arthur has a very interesting Youtube channel where he talks about almost everything you've mentioned there.

It's not 100% that because life spontaneously started on Earth, then it must have also happened elsewhere. But given the size of the environment and numbers of systems, it would be likely that if it happened once, it can happen more than once. The book "The Selfish Gene" was an eye-opening book for me, making the link between self-replicating accidental molecules to complex life as a very simple process: the thing that replicates most efficiently replicates the most.

Although it's not 100% that any advanced alien species would definitely use electricity, it would be a reasonable assumption that most would go through an electricity phase of their progress. Maybe electricity has a 500 year use, so even we will move on to some other form of power in another 300 years or so. That means that, if we only look for EM signals, we're hoping to be inside a 500 light-year thick expanding "shell" of opportunity to detect any specific alien species' signals. Not great odds. But if electricity is used for longer, even if it's not comms, there will be an EM signal, because any electricity use produces an EM signal. Whether or not aliens are predisposed to want to find or communicate with other species is also not guaranteed, but if there are more than a handful of species in existence then surely some of them will. There are frequencies that can be judged as more likely to be monitored, the frequency associated with hydrogen is the most obvious, and is the most monitored. Any species trying to find or broadcast their existence would come to the same conclusion.


"They might look the same, but they don't taste the same."
#4541560 - 10/20/20 11:09 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: CyBerkut]  
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Originally Posted by CyBerkut



This is a non-factor. Why? The people who are already fans of Dune and who will be watching the movie upon release have already read the books or at the very least read the first book. Casual fans who happened to catch the trailer online for the most part won't be inspired to read the books except for maybe a small minority.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4541561 - 10/20/20 11:10 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Interesting posts Blastman and DM but of course you know that none of that stuff matters to 95% of Hollywood script writers. wink


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4543158 - 11/02/20 10:09 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Who thinks the Prequel books are better written than Franks original series.To me they do fill in a lot of the back story.Although found the last book felt rushed.

#4543217 - 11/03/20 11:48 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: 453Raafspitty]  
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Originally Posted by 453Raafspitty
Who thinks the Prequel books are better written than Franks original series.To me they do fill in a lot of the back story.Although found the last book felt rushed.


The first 3 Frank Herbert books (Dune, Messiah and Children) are absolute classics and represent the pinnacle of his writing. God Emperor was pretty good but still a notch down in my opinion. Heretics and Chapterhouse I found to be highly confusing reads. I'll have to revisit those some day.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4543238 - 11/03/20 02:37 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: 453Raafspitty]  
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Originally Posted by 453Raafspitty
Who thinks the Prequel books are better written than Franks original series.To me they do fill in a lot of the back story.Although found the last book felt rushed.

There are no prequel books, only the original ones.

#4545714 - 11/22/20 04:06 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: EAF331 MadDog]  
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Originally Posted by EAF331 MadDog
Originally Posted by 453Raafspitty
Who thinks the Prequel books are better written than Franks original series.To me they do fill in a lot of the back story.Although found the last book felt rushed.

There are no prequel books, only the original ones.



Dune: House Atreides, Dune: House Harkonnen, and Dune: House Corrino were the first 3 prequels written, taking place a few decades before Dune. A series about events leading up to and including the Butlerian Jihad was also written.


Phil

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#4545792 - 11/23/20 04:23 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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So now we get to wait until the Fall of next year to see the movie. Ugh.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4545823 - 11/23/20 04:29 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: EAF331 MadDog]  
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Originally Posted by EAF331 MadDog
Originally Posted by 453Raafspitty
Who thinks the Prequel books are better written than Franks original series.To me they do fill in a lot of the back story.Although found the last book felt rushed.

There are no prequel books, only the original ones.



https://dunenovels.com/chronological-order-of-dune-books/

#4545833 - 11/23/20 06:49 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I suspect MadDog doesn't acknowledge the prequels existence.


One day the West will fall. But if the Liberty for which we fight is taken up by the world then the West will not have failed.
#4545838 - 11/23/20 07:23 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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To be fair, the prequels were written by Herbert's son, so, in a way, they are fan fiction.

#4545855 - 11/23/20 10:22 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Wasn't his son also working on a sequel or two that takes place after Chapterhouse Dune?

#4546080 - 11/25/20 10:00 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Just a few...

Frank Herbert:
Dune (1965)
Dune Messiah (1969)
Children of Dune (1976)
God Emperor of Dune (1981)
Heretics of Dune (1984)
Chapterhouse: Dune (1985)
Brian Herbert/Kevin J. Anderson:
Prelude to Dune series:
House Atreides (1999)
House Harkonnen (2000)
House Corrino (2001)
Legends of Dune series:
The Butlerian Jihad (2002)
The Machine Crusade (2003)
The Battle of Corrin (2004)
Hunters of Dune (2006)
Sandworms of Dune (2007)
Heroes of Dune series:
Paul of Dune (2008)
The Winds of Dune (2009)
Great Schools of Dune series:
Sisterhood of Dune (2012)
Mentats of Dune (2014)
Navigators of Dune (2

#4573220 - 06/29/21 10:52 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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#4573255 - 06/30/21 10:40 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I looked at the entire release schedule for this year and there are only 2 films that I'll be seeing in the movie theater: Dune and No Time to Die.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4573279 - 06/30/21 01:48 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
I looked at the entire release schedule for this year and there are only 2 films that I'll be seeing in the movie theater: Dune and No Time to Die.

Add Top Gun to that list and that's me. Couldn't wait for theaters to open back up and now that they are I don't want to see anything they've got.

#4573353 - 07/01/21 01:00 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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PanzerMeyer is spot on the 1st 3 books were the high point of the writings.

#4577645 - 08/18/21 11:18 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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#4577677 - 08/19/21 10:35 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: 453Raafspitty]  
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Dune will mark my return to the movie theater and while I doubt the film will bomb, it will also not be a huge blockbuster.

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 08/19/21 10:36 AM.

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#4577749 - 08/20/21 04:48 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer



Dune will mark my return to the movie theater and while I doubt the film will bomb, it will also not be a huge blockbuster.


Same here, we have 2 great theaters nearby, The dine and watch and typical.

Not done since we got here 2 years back.


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#4579166 - 09/05/21 12:55 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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This is just kind of peripherally related, but it's an interview with Francesca Annis from the first Dune movie about her experience making it:

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/dune-1984-francesca-annis-original-131121023.html


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#4579202 - 09/05/21 02:56 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Arthonon]  
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Originally Posted by Arthonon
This is just kind of peripherally related, but it's an interview with Francesca Annis from the first Dune movie about her experience making it:

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/dune-1984-francesca-annis-original-131121023.html



I read that interview on Friday and it’s really a fantastic insight into her experiences during the making of the film. One thing that did surprise me is when she said she has only seen the film once which was at the premiere which I assume she was obligated to attend.

I guess the finished film didn’t leave much of an impression on her. lol.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4579382 - 09/07/21 12:39 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Going back to the interview, I'm still curious to know which actor it was who went all ballistic on her while they were on the set? I have my suspicions it was the actor who played the Baron.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4579400 - 09/07/21 05:18 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Yeah, it would be interesting to know. I also thought it could have been Dean Stockwell.


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#4579402 - 09/07/21 05:49 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Arthonon]  
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Originally Posted by Arthonon
Yeah, it would be interesting to know. I also thought it could have been Dean Stockwell.



That would really surprise me since all of the interviews and commentaries I've seen for Battlestar Galactica which mentioned Dean were all very positive.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583540 - 10/25/21 04:06 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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So, I watched the movie on HBO Max, and while it was a well-made movie, it didn't really grab me. I kept waiting for things to get moving and it just seemed a little slow. I didn't realize it was "Part 1" so maybe that's why, and more interesting things will happen in Part 2.

Full disclosure, I have not read the book, and have only seen the 1984 movie. Having seen that, and significant parts of the story, might have made it seem a little slow-moving to me, since it's stuff I already knew.


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#4583557 - 10/25/21 10:57 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Arthonon]  
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Originally Posted by Arthonon
I didn't realize it was "Part 1" so maybe that's why, and more interesting things will happen in Part 2.

.



Judging by the preliminary opening weekend box office numbers, it's unclear right now if Part 2 will even be made. It will all depend on how well it does internationally and how much is made from streaming rights.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583561 - 10/25/21 11:34 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583583 - 10/25/21 01:52 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer

Thanks for the link! I am hoping that this means there's a better chance of part 2 getting made, but I wonder how long it will be before it's out, even if it's approved:

In an interview with Variety this week, WarnerMedia chair Ann Sarnoff said plans for the sequel will be based on “the entirety of what ‘Dune’ can do for the company, including HBO Max.” She added, “The story in itself sets up for a sequel. The production is so amazing and the storytelling is so compelling that it’s not going to be judged on box office alone.”


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#4583584 - 10/25/21 01:58 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Arthonon]  
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Originally Posted by Arthonon
that it’s not going to be judged on box office alone.”[/i]



This is absolutely correct and it reflects on the fact that this is now a "new normal" when it comes to whether or not a film is financially successful. How a film does on streaming is actually more important than how it does at the box office because unlike the box office, the studio doesn't have to split the revenue with any other party.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583599 - 10/25/21 05:35 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Sometimes less is more.

As a writer one of the hardest lessons I have had to learn is compressing scenes and dialogue. Every writer goes through this. We lover our characters and their voice and want to see them animated and lively, what they have to say and share and play out the scenes in great detail. The readers and watchers, however, want to see the plot and story move forward and continue to behold interesting and intriguing events. So what we find is there's a balancing act--when to cut dialogue and when enough has been shared or even too much as to cue when to move on. I love slow burn movies, but even in these sorts of films you'll notice a commonality among them in that they do not linger too long.

Over the weekend I saw a 70s horror movie that committed many crimes of stretching a scene. Say, for example, two characters are speaking of meeting somewhere and are in the process of signing a document. In the dialogue one asks for a pen, the other fumbles through their pockets or purse, produces a pen and we focus on the implement as the signature is signed and the paper is passed and then they say they'll meet up later, of which directions are shared to the location and the address and other intricate details and then they share pleasantries and walk out of the room, carefully closing the door behind them. Sounds exhausting, right? Then, picture the same scene with maybe a quick shot of a hand signing a document and then one says, "See you at 8 at Acme Hotel," scene fades out and then a new shot merges in with one of them opening the door to the the hotel. In fact, you could even drop them saying "Acme Hotel" and leave it at "See you at 8," and when the camera pans(or the writer describes) them opening a door there's a sign above or even inside the lobby that says Acme Hotel.

See what I did there? We turned an exhausting sequence into something compressed, full of information and kept the plot moving while omitting the mundane.

When a filmmaker chooses to turn a single film into a two-part or three-part series, there's usually one reason:

1) More money

The audience seldom benefits, especially when the material is written for a one film journey. "Fellowship of the Ring" is about 187,000 words. Frank Herbert's "Dune" is also about 180,000 words. "Fellowship" was a film unto itself and while pretty close to the book, there actually were some scenes omitted, albeit minor in effort to fit it all in Peter Jackson's three hour picture. They did a pretty good job. Jackson's "Hobbit," on the other hand, was a disaster.


To me, there's only one reason to turn a single film into a two-part or three-part series:

Because it is absolutely necessary!

If a follow-up to Villeneuve's "Dune" is never made, then we all lose. I don't have HBO Max so I have not watched yet. When I can and pay fairly to watch, I will. Perhaps this artificial lengthening of film is hurting us more than helping. Far too many modern films approach or pass the two-hour mark and often they're filled with senseless action fluff or padded with slog. From the scant few posts I've read about this new film, to me it sounds like they could have condensed much and moved things along for the benefit of the audience.

I still struggle with shrinking and cutting scenes, by the way. It ain't easy.



p.s. That long run-on sentence was written as such to express my point. smile




Last edited by Mr_Blastman; 10/25/21 05:39 PM.
#4583601 - 10/25/21 05:47 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Mr_Blastman]  
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Originally Posted by Mr_Blastman


When a filmmaker chooses to turn a single film into a two-part or three-part series, there's usually one reason:

1) More money

The audience seldom benefits, especially when the material is written for a one film journey. "Fellowship of the Ring" is about 187,000 words. Frank Herbert's "Dune" is also about 180,000 words. "Fellowship" was a film unto itself and while pretty close to the book, there actually were some scenes omitted, albeit minor in effort to fit it all in Peter Jackson's three hour picture. They did a pretty good job. Jackson's "Hobbit," on the other hand, was a disaster.






How many pages does the Tom Bombadill plotline take in the book? I've not read it so I'd be curious to know and as I'm sure you are well aware, Peter Jackson completely took that plotline out of the movie.

I don't know what the running time is for this new Dune film but even a 3 hour film is not enough to do justice to Herbert's book. The SyFy Channel Dune miniseries is very faithful to the novel and that had a total running time of 295 minutes (so almost 5 hours).

So in short, I disagree with your notion that "Dune" can be faithfully adapted into one film unless of course you make it a 5 hour film which for obvious reasons would not be practical.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583603 - 10/25/21 05:54 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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My point was what happens if the sequel is never made?

Often less is more. If only the producers didn't screw over Lynch...

#4583606 - 10/25/21 06:02 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Mr_Blastman]  
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Originally Posted by Mr_Blastman
If only the producers didn't screw over Lynch...



Oh, I am 100% convinced his film would have been even better if he had full creative control. Unfortunately Dino De Laurentiis didn't have a reputation for giving up control. In many ways he was the Italian George Lucas.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583627 - 10/25/21 10:47 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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The new movie is visually amazing but its heavy on very Frank Herbert style dialogue.

#4583646 - 10/26/21 10:35 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: 453Raafspitty]  
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Originally Posted by 453Raafspitty
but its heavy on very Frank Herbert style dialogue.



So in other words, people who are fans of the novel will like the movie but people who have never read it might find the movie boring.

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 10/26/21 10:36 AM.

“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583648 - 10/26/21 10:43 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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My oversimplified guess at opinions:

people who haven't read the book - too long & overly complex.
People who read the book - not long enough & too much missed out.

smile

But back on topic, I haven't seen it yet and I have not seen trailers or watched reviews, but from the titles & headlines from people that I enjoy, it gets a good rap so far.

Last edited by DM; 10/26/21 10:44 AM.

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#4583649 - 10/26/21 10:46 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I WAS going to see it this past weekend but my wife had to work so I'll be seeing it this coming Saturday. I really NEED to see this on the big screen.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583651 - 10/26/21 11:09 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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It is definitely worth seeing on the big screen.
I saw it last week, and found it amazing. The 1984 film is fun, but this one is much better - it does leave out some bits from the book, but I think they were fine to leave out. In my group were a couple of people who had seen the 1984 movie but not read the book, and someone who hadn't read the book (but is smart and doesn't need things to be super fast). They all enjoyed it a lot, and understood what was going on.

#4583717 - 10/27/21 05:48 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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‘Dune: Part 2’ Officially Greenlit, Release Date Set for 2023
https://variety.com/2021/film/news/dune-part-2-sequel-1235094974/


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#4583724 - 10/27/21 10:30 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Arthonon]  
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Originally Posted by Arthonon
‘Dune: Part 2’ Officially Greenlit, Release Date Set for 2023
https://variety.com/2021/film/news/dune-part-2-sequel-1235094974/



This is certainly great news. Apparently the streaming numbers were good enough to offset the mediocre box office performance.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583728 - 10/27/21 12:53 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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It was the biggest box office success for Warner Brothers in 2021, so not particularly mediocre. It's also number 13 worldwide in box office takings, and has only been out for a short time (variable based on location).

https://www.boxofficemojo.com/year/world/

Interesting that the biggest movie there seems to be a Chinese only release.

#4583730 - 10/27/21 01:45 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: FlyingToaster]  
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Originally Posted by FlyingToaster
It was the biggest box office success for Warner Brothers in 2021, so not particularly mediocre..



That's a relative metric so it doesn't mean much. You have to look at the hard numbers:


production budget for Dune: 165 million + at least 50 million for marketing.

US box office so far: 41 million
International box office so far: 182 million

Keep in mind that the studio doesn't get all of that money. In the US the studios split the ticket sales with the movie theaters. It's usually about a 50/50 split or a 55/45 split. For international movie theater operators, they get a significantly higher cut of the ticket sales.

So yes, it's a mediocre box office performance.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4583736 - 10/27/21 03:19 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I don't think it has been released everywhere yet. Wasn't it due for a November release in Australia and a few other countries?

#4583740 - 10/27/21 04:24 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I think the bottom line here is that the success on HBO Max saved this franchise and opened the door for the second part to be made.

Just read this online,

"Samba TV statistics acquired by Variety state that Dune was viewed on HBO Max's platform by a whopping 1.9 million US households during its opening weekend period. This is all the more impressive considering Dune's streaming performance across its opening weekend beat releases with a (supposedly) wider audience cache, such as Zack Snyder's Justice League which was viewed by 1.8 million."


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4586269 - 12/01/21 08:08 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4586446 - 12/05/21 02:31 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I read Dune for the first time about 4 months ago. I don't get what all the fuss is about.

I am currently watching the 1984 movie. it seems fine, I don't get the sonic stuff and it has some 80's camp, but so far it is a fine movie. A bit heavy on the Princess Irulan voiceovers.

I will probably watch the new one when it is available to rent for less.

PS: It is cool to see all the actors that got a lot bigger over the late 80's and 90's in other types of roles in the film.

Last edited by Azshal; 12/05/21 02:32 AM.
#4586447 - 12/05/21 02:51 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I am about an hour into the movie.

It is a little heavy on ALL the voiceovers hahaha

The second half of the movie is moving too quick, in comparison to the book.

That was a weird ending duck

Last edited by Azshal; 12/05/21 04:04 AM.
#4586449 - 12/05/21 04:04 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Azshal]  
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Originally Posted by Azshal


It is a little heavy on ALL the voiceovers hahaha

The second half of the movie is moving too quick, in comparison to the book.



The voiceovers bug some people but I never had a problem with it.

Concerning the second half, keep in mind that the theatrical release of the Lynch film is just barely over 2 hours of running time so it's not surprising at all that the pacing was rushed compared to the book. The new Dune film has a running time of 2.5 hours and it only covers the first half of the book.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4586450 - 12/05/21 04:07 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Azshal]  
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Originally Posted by Azshal
I don't get what all the fuss is about.




Different strokes for different folks and all that jazz but one thing that can't be disputed is that the novel has made a deep impression with many readers over the world since the 1960's. If it hadn't it simply would have become just another long forgotten sci-fi novel along with the rest of the great majority of scifi novels that have been written.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4586509 - 12/06/21 09:51 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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It was a lot closer to the books than Lynchs.Weirding way was an advanced Martial arts and sign language in the new movie like the books.Lynch,s was the voice modules to produce weaponry..

#4586516 - 12/06/21 11:32 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: 453Raafspitty]  
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Originally Posted by 453Raafspitty
.Lynch,s was the voice modules to produce weaponry..



I don't know if it is 100% confirmed but based on some sources I've read, the "Weirding Way" as portrayed in the Lynch film was an attempt by the producers to make the movie more like Star Wars with the use of "laser guns".


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4589864 - 01/22/22 03:13 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: FlyingToaster]  
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Originally Posted by FlyingToaster
It is definitely worth seeing on the big screen.
I saw it last week, and found it amazing. The 1984 film is fun, but this one is much better - it does leave out some bits from the book, but I think they were fine to leave out. In my group were a couple of people who had seen the 1984 movie but not read the book, and someone who hadn't read the book (but is smart and doesn't need things to be super fast). They all enjoyed it a lot, and understood what was going on.


I just watched it (finally) and was very impressed. The casting was excellent and I liked how it stayed much closer to the book’s guidelines than the Lynch film (especially!) and the 2000 SciFi miniseries. A few scenes I would have liked to have seen were the Heighliner spacefolding, the ceremonial hand-washing, and the banquet at the palace in Arrakeen. The first just to see the visuals, the second because it was one of the few where Jessica took center stage, and the last because it showed how much Leto hated politics but realized the necessity, and depended on Jessica’s guidance. Plus, I always liked the “Review, friends - troops long past review” poem he recited.


Phil

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#4589920 - 01/23/22 11:40 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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To me the most glaring omission were the Guild Navigators..Missing the Emperors initial meeting with them as in Lynches was also a weird one.

#4589975 - 01/24/22 11:40 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: NH2112]  
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Originally Posted by NH2112


the Heighliner spacefolding,.



There's no competition here at all. In the Lynch film, it's a magnificent sequence that exudes mystery and awe with not only the Lynchian visuals but also the brilliant music by Toto.

Quite frankly I was really disappointed with how short and understated that same sequence was in the Villeneuve film.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4589977 - 01/24/22 11:50 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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If I hadn't seen the Lynch version, I would have thought that the Spice was just a drug that got you a little bit high. There's not much to criticise about Villenueve's Dune, but this IMO is one of them.


"They might look the same, but they don't taste the same."
#4590050 - 01/24/22 08:02 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I still haven't seen this film--cannot find a way to stream legally without paying less than 20 bucks yet. frown I think the drug thing is to resonate with the current generation who thinks drugs and getting high is cool, which is sad--because it isn't--but more so because this sounds like this deprives the audience of essential lore.

#4590052 - 01/24/22 08:12 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Yes, I find it quite ironic that the Lynch film was much shorter but yet explained in much better detail the importance of melange in the empire than the Villeneuve film did.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4590199 - 01/26/22 10:01 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Here are my thoughts on some of your comments about the movie and why I think Villeneuve downplayed or omitted them.

Originally Posted by 453Raafspitty
To me the most glaring omission were the Guild Navigators..Missing the Emperors initial meeting with them as in Lynches was also a weird one.


Because the meeting really wasn’t important to moving the story along. Does it really matter WHY Shaddam IV set Leto up to fail and made sure that he did? The book itself gave at least 3 reasons - the Guild’s unease over the availability of spice, the Emperor’s fear of Leto’s growing popularity in the Landsraad, and the thought of a Fremen fighting force that rivaled the Sardaukar under the command of a man with the backing of the Landsraad.

Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Originally Posted by NH2112


the Heighliner spacefolding,.



There's no competition here at all. In the Lynch film, it's a magnificent sequence that exudes mystery and awe with not only the Lynchian visuals but also the brilliant music by Toto.

Quite frankly I was really disappointed with how short and understated that same sequence was in the Villeneuve film.


It would have been nice to see it, but like the previous quote I just don’t think it was important when it came to the big picture.

Originally Posted by DM
If I hadn't seen the Lynch version, I would have thought that the Spice was just a drug that got you a little bit high. There's not much to criticise about Villenueve's Dune, but this IMO is one of them.


Originally Posted by Mr_Blastman
I think the drug thing is to resonate with the current generation who thinks drugs and getting high is cool, which is sad--because it isn't--but more so because this sounds like this deprives the audience of essential lore.


I’m betting that there will be no mention of the Water Of Life in part 2 - no drowning a stunted Maker to get it, no Sayyadina changing the Water from a deadly poison to the psychoactive drug the Fremen partake of after the changing ritual, and also gaining the racial memories of all the previous Sayyadinas. The Spice will take the place of the Water Of Life, and Paul reacted to it the way he did because of who he is and who he’ll be.

Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Yes, I find it quite ironic that the Lynch film was much shorter but yet explained in much better detail the importance of melange in the empire than the Villeneuve film did.


The movie was made for people familiar with the book so I think a lot of things that were explained in the previous attempts at telling the story were left out because they already know it. Those who don’t can either ask someone who does or read it themselves. 😁


Phil

“The biggest problem people have is they don’t think they’re supposed to have problems.” - Hayes Barnard
#4590220 - 01/27/22 10:08 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Quote
The movie was made for people familiar with the book so I think a lot of things that were explained in the previous attempts at telling the story were left out because they already know it. Those who don’t can either ask someone who does or read it themselves

Yes there are things that were included that wasnt in the origianl film.The various points to the Bulls that killed Letos dad for one..
We did see some Guild representatives when the official party arrived to pass on the contract.Navigators and the Guild had a huuuge interest on Spice production as they were the ones who could transport the various planets around the known universe..Playing just on Pauls journey is one dimensional if it doesnt show the full story on "why" the Spice was important to all the houses.

#4590222 - 01/27/22 10:49 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I disagree with the notion that the movie was made for people who read the book. Most people, by a long way, have not read the book. I think the oversights were just that. Oversights brought on by the people doing the writing being so familiar with the ideas that they kind of assumed the ideas somehow are there without explanation.

Testing it on people not familiar with the book is useless because they don't know there is anything to "get".

Last edited by DM; 01/27/22 10:52 AM.

"They might look the same, but they don't taste the same."
#4590229 - 01/27/22 11:45 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: 453Raafspitty]  
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Originally Posted by 453Raafspitty
Playing just on Pauls journey is one dimensional if it doesnt show the full story on "why" the Spice was important to all the houses.


It is in a way, especially if the movies end with part 2. If the franchise keeps going, there’ll be some backsplaining necessary when God Emperor Of Dune gets here. Unless they just leave out the whole Tleilaxu working on synthetic spice angle.


Phil

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#4590230 - 01/27/22 11:50 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: DM]  
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Originally Posted by DM
I disagree with the notion that the movie was made for people who read the book. Most people, by a long way, have not read the book. I think the oversights were just that. Oversights brought on by the people doing the writing being so familiar with the ideas that they kind of assumed the ideas somehow are there without explanation.

Testing it on people not familiar with the book is useless because they don't know there is anything to "get".


Your points are sound. Yeah sure, Dune is one of the best selling science fiction novels of all time so many people have indeed read it but compared to the overall general population I would be very surprised if more than 5% of the general population has read it.

My wife saw the movie with me and she has never read the book and she told me that she was pretty much "lost" and felt the movie was "slow" until the surprise attack on Arakeen.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4590339 - 01/28/22 10:18 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Quote
Unless they just leave out the whole Tleilaxu working on synthetic spice angle.

Thats the problem theres such a deep back story to a lot of the characters that were bought out in the prequal books.Plus the sequels what are they going to do keep bringing back all characters in Golem form again and again?

#4591741 - 02/15/22 11:40 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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This is really well made and funny as hell.



“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4591772 - 02/16/22 12:56 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4592698 - 02/24/22 09:11 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Azshal]  
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Originally Posted by Azshal
I will probably watch the new one when it is available to rent for less.


So I finally saw it. I enjoyed it.

#4592734 - 02/25/22 11:33 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Azshal]  
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Originally Posted by Azshal
Originally Posted by Azshal
I will probably watch the new one when it is available to rent for less.


So I finally saw it. I enjoyed it.



Good to hear! Have you read the book? If you haven't and you still enjoyed the movie that means that Villeneuve did a great job with his adaptation!

Having said that, I can totally understand why someone who has not read the book might find the movie to be "slow".


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4592780 - 02/25/22 04:34 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Yah, I read the book and watch the 1984 version back in December. I am going off my memory, the basic "feel" of it all. I only read the book once.

I actually found this movie much more enjoyable than that version. The lack of any type of special effects regarding the space travel is a bummer, but I never got a vibe off the book that any of that was important. Only the fact that is was possible, and why it was possible.

There was more "pre-Harkonnen takeover" in the book, and I felt they could have done more with that. Wasn't there a discovery of a special garden in the book that was thought of as a great waste of water, that was tied into later with the desire to bring lush life back to Arrakis? They only had that one guy watering the palm trees in the movie, so I thought that was a missed opportunity.

I read an article or two about the actor playing the Baron, like he was all "Moar nekkid Baron!". But he was barely in the movie. It was a non-issue for me.

I felt the pacing was about right, It didn't feel like it was dragging or rushed.

#4592788 - 02/25/22 05:11 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Azshal]  
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Originally Posted by Azshal


I read an article or two about the actor playing the Baron, like he was all "Moar nekkid Baron!". But he was barely in the movie. It was a non-issue for me.



I think Stellan Skaarsgard did a great job as the Baron and his portrayal is much more faithful to the book compared to the way the Baron was portrayed in the David Lynch film. The Baron there behaved more "over the top" for cinematic effect.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4599553 - 05/13/22 05:26 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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#4599558 - 05/13/22 06:09 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: Arthonon]  
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Originally Posted by Arthonon


Yeah I read that yesterday. I know Walken will be great as he always is.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4643644 - 03/11/24 05:04 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer

Yeah I read that yesterday. I know Walken will be great as he always is.


His performance was adequate for the material he was given.


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#4643646 - 03/11/24 10:22 AM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: wheelsup_cavu]  
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Originally Posted by wheelsup_cavu
Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer

Yeah I read that yesterday. I know Walken will be great as he always is.


His performance was adequate for the material he was given.


Wheels



His role was really tiny. He didn't have much to work with to be honest. Having said that, Jose Ferrer was more memorable as Shaddam IV in the Lynch film.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4643697 - 03/12/24 07:14 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
Having said that, Jose Ferrer was more memorable as Shaddam IV in the Lynch film.


Everything about the Lynch film is memorable - in that it was so bad it's hard to forget it. wink

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#4643871 - 03/16/24 12:26 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Dune 2nd part was pretty good, nice picture, good sound, good acting.

It made me quite uncomfortable sometimes though, when I realized Paul was half Muhammad, Half Gaddafi.

I hadn't seen how much medieval inspiration was in the story when reading the books.

What still baffles me though, is having chosen Chalamet as the hero of an action movie. It's pretty hard to believe this matchstick is a feared knife fighter tbh, even if his acting is great.

Last edited by rollnloop.; 03/16/24 12:35 PM.
#4643878 - 03/16/24 01:35 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: rollnloop.]  
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Originally Posted by rollnloop.

It made me quite uncomfortable sometimes though, when I realized Paul was half Muhammad, Half Gaddafi.

.



You obviously have not read the book because you would have known that from the start had you read it!


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4643979 - 03/18/24 12:08 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I have read the books. 35 years ago though.

Somehow it didn't make me as uncomfortable at the time, most likely because muslims weren't bombing and beheading us in our own cities by then.

#4643980 - 03/18/24 12:12 PM Re: "Dune" by Denis Villeneuve [Re: rollnloop.]  
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Originally Posted by rollnloop.


Somehow it didn't make me as uncomfortable at the time, most likely because muslims weren't bombing and beheading us in our own cities by then.


Yes, I think that is an excellent point you bring up.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
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