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#4471491 - 04/22/19 04:14 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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If you plan on using it as a boom n zoomer, the issue I see is “time on target” as I said above. Death by a thousand cuts is how I see you killing ships. Small ones should be no issue; it’s the bigger, tankier ones that I can see causing you issues.

#4471492 - 04/22/19 04:35 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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I agree and acknowledged same

" I was killing ships, but I don't like it's one v one ability. If I use it's high speed, it's hard to do much damage. If I turn it in to a knife fight, the shields won't stand up too long. The frags have to be fired in tight like Wingy just mentioned so if using the high speed it's just snapshots, not sitting there pounding the target with repeated volleys. And that high speed carries you away to turn around and come back, giving the target a little time to recharge, slowing it all down.

However, in any RES other than haz or in a CZ it's going to be really good. Insane acceleration and high end means I can be gone in a blink, or close the target at will and dictate terms. Having allied NPCs means slashing attacks are viable. Don't have to kill it all by myself, which is when this build seems weak."

It's great when there are allies about, but not one v one against good shields.


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4471500 - 04/22/19 05:22 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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Agree that it’ll be fantastic in a Res. Ping the bad guy once or twice in a slash and then move on to the next. Rinse n repeat ad nausem. A perfect niche for it.

#4471507 - 04/22/19 05:57 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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Yes indeed. We should go hunting in a thunder Vette -- lightning Courier team.

I'll be there mostly to zip around smile

I want to fly this ship with a friend who then exclaims how fast it is haha.


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4471508 - 04/22/19 06:15 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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It’d almost be like my own SLF, except faster and beefier! Better yet, get James in his vette, Wingy with Mr. Skittles, and you and I. All would look upon us and despair!

#4471511 - 04/22/19 06:26 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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I'm game.

Quote
It’d almost be like my own SLF


If your SLF ignored orders and didn't help much smile


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4471514 - 04/22/19 06:39 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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Since I’m so miserly with money and xp, I’d only hire a harmless pilot. That would probably do exactly that til he ranked up. yep

#4471531 - 04/22/19 08:28 PM Re: Courier build [Re: Bohemond]  
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Originally Posted by Bohemond
I’d only hire a harmless pilot.



I qualify smile

Maybe we can hit up a RES or CNB Thursday night if anyone's up for it and doesn't mind me not helping much.


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4471534 - 04/22/19 08:45 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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Alas, I’m workin 2 jobs a day M-Thurs this week then goin up the Adirondacks for the weekend.

#4471535 - 04/22/19 08:51 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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Enjoy the crisp air.

I bought Out of the Park Baseball 20 last night and my Fightin' Phils started 4-0. Gotta keep the hot streak going.

When you're back and working one-a-days let me know if you want to hit some bounties.


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4471537 - 04/22/19 08:55 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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Hell yeah! It’d be next week, but I’ll hit you up and we’ll spank some baddies.

#4472255 - 04/29/19 02:47 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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I built this ship to be just what I wanted. It's very fast, has good jump, a decent scoop, good shields and integrity, runs cool enough.

But the weapons are a problem. I made a mistake going for frags. I should have tried them first, before engineering them. Frags are fun, and can be very effective. But that's a weapon for close-range slugfests, not for a slasher. If I had known how spread the shot is I would have gone for something else. My mistake.

So I still need a solution. I'm thinking of moving the corrosive MC to the center hardpoint and putting efficient thermal vent beams in the wings.

This does three things

-- Increases my actual DPS. It's easy to look at the Coriolis numbers with a frag cannon and say ooh, lookee at all that DPS! But only some shots are going to hit with all submunitions and even then the frequency with which you are firing with frags is something less than every second biggrin

-- Adds 7t to the build. This chops off 80 m/s of speed.

-- Reduces effective range. My idea for this ship was to fight it at full speed. I've done this now and it's awesome as I knew it would be. So maybe I can be content with 'having done it'. Changing to efficient beams means the effective range is drastically lowered over an all-kinetic build. So I would have to change the way I fight it, making it more conventional and losing some of what I was gunning for at the outset. At this stage I have to say fair enough and change tack. This armament would allow continual fire for as long as I hold the trigger. But of course that means less slashing and more saddling up.

This configuration also fits in the current power profile. I will finish the PD and change the experimental to Super Conduits to support the beams.

The trump card is it is still blazing fast and very agile. Just not as much as before. So attaining and maintaining advantageous positioning is easy. But it increases vulnerability, and the protection is good, but not capable of taking too much sustained fire. Against NPCs this isn't really much of an issue, but something to consider anyway.

Has anyone used cannons in their builds? These have no falloff and are fully effective to 3.5 km if I understand it correctly. Can't put corrosive on them though.


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4472268 - 04/29/19 04:09 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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Have you given any thought to PA’s? The main downside is their shot speed which can be compensated by modding them for long range. Makes it easier to hit due to the velocity buff. I run them sometimes on my Krait. Power draw and mass may be an issue on your speed racer, though.

#4472275 - 04/29/19 04:30 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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I have yes, but have never used them. Power fits and mass can be lightweighted, so they are viable.

I can't afford to engineer for trials. Can only run it through Coriolis and see what's what.

Rails are another option.


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4472288 - 04/29/19 05:17 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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Both rails and PA’s have thermal issues, I’ve found.

#4472298 - 04/29/19 06:00 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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Indeed, but thermal vent beams should correct that easy enough.

I think I'll go with the corrosive MC/dual thermal vent beams option for now. It's tried and true, works in the build, and no heat or power issues.

Eventually I might look for other configs, but for now I think that'll do.

Honestly, I can't be fussed to worked it all out any longer. I just want to be done and shoot stuff with it.

Here's what it will look like with the weapons change

Velocity Final?

The fairly low resists are concerning, and could be improved but only with some compromise elsewhere. Not too worried at the mo. I dropped the fuel tank one size to get the speed back up, but that's a mighty small tank.


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4472565 - 05/01/19 01:46 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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I flew it for a couple of hours in a high RES yesterday and it's just awesome. Firepower is now good enough. Speed and agility are excellent. Protection is sufficient. NPCs are no worry, it's collision that is my biggest threat, and I had a few of those.

But fighting in this ship is fantastic, most fun I've had in combat in a long time. The responsiveness is great. You don't spend much time flying backwards in this thing. I commented at the Frontier boards that killing ships in the FDL feels like business. In the Courier it feels like art smile

The main motivation behind this project was to make the slog to combat Elite fun. I will be flying a lot of combat in my quest to reach triple Elite. Doing it in a death machine would have been more effective, but less fun. Many ships explode after shooting at them for 5 or 10 seconds in the FDL. The Courier doesn't have that issue haha. The beams can be fired all day and give me good, effective shield stripping ability. The corrosive multicannon is there just to fire a burst and keep the beams getting a bonus.

Range isn't as much of an issue as I feared. Sure, the beams aren't doing a whole lot of damage at 2.5km or whatever. But they can get the tags in so I get credit. The absolute performance superiority I enjoy over every NPC ship means that I can gain control position in a blink, or evade/escape at the press of a button.

Switching out two lightweight weapons for efficient thermal vent beams added a net 7 tons of mass. This reduced speed by nearly 80 m/s, which was then halved with the smaller fuel tank, so it's 575/780 now. Still blazingly fast, but short of my stated target. No worries. Actually it makes it a little easier in dockside ops. Ultra-fast ships have err, excellent throttle response and the fine adjustments to throttle position are tricky, so a little less speed isn't a total loss.

Yesterday I finished the power distributor, one of the weaknesses of the Courier. G5 charge enhanced with super conduits now. I don't have the proto whizbangs needed to complete G5 on the beams yet. So they are still G4 point 6 or so. Still, I can fire almost forever, but the capacitor will drain if I stand on it.

I'm enjoying this ship so much I wanted to buy a paint job, but they are all sh!t. Would love the ability to paint it myself.


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4472582 - 05/01/19 04:08 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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Good to hear you’re enjoying the build and got the weps sorted out. As an aside, are you seeing any of the reported bugs or issues with the new patch?

#4472584 - 05/01/19 04:28 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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Yes I am, especially the module priorities one. I know now to check it first, but this one has the potential to ruin your day.

I lifted off from the pad on one hop, and because my landing gear and hardpoints are on the same four-way switch, I accidentally deployed hardpoints while raising my gear and shields went offline. I very gingerly made my exit expecting to be rammed. It happened again after relogging in a RES. This one's dangerous.

I am not having the performance issues some are reporting, nor log-in troubles.

I have however had some trouble when clicking continue, and it takes me straight to Open, skipping the 'choose mode' screen. This made for some tense moments when I was repeatedly relogging at Jameson's Cobra and Dav's yesterday.

Which other ones am I forgetting?


No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
#4473769 - 05/11/19 05:57 PM Re: Courier build [Re: DBond]  
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Originally Posted by Bohemond
Maybe something like this?

Bo's Build

Heat spikes would prolly be an issue firing.



Nice looking Courier. I don't know how well the Imperial Hammers would work as I have yet to use them (or even qualify to buy them). Like you said heat could be a problem. But if so, perhaps a single Hammer in the center and something else on the outboard hardpoints? Hammers produce nearly triple the heat of standard rails right? Would have to build it to see I suppose.The TTD on that build concerns me, but maybe with Hammers it's fine since you fire them selectively?

The shields are outrageous! Those are some super shields for such a small ship. Far more of everything than my Courier.

I took your build and ran it through my head, and came up with this alternative. In order to do what I did I had to make a small sacrifice to shielding (more on that in a mo) and dump the chaff. What I was looking to do was retain your weapons choices, optional choices and at the same time lower the mass so it was much faster. Mass dropped from 101t to 77t. Smaller fuel tank too, which is what I am using, but I can swap it out for travel.

Here's what I came up with. Might have been better if I were not at work smile

Jackhammer


As you can see it's considerably faster. Speed went from 404/549 to 521/707. Of course you may not want it to be faster.

I changed the sensors. I know you and Wingy like the A's, and that's cool, but I was looking to cut weight and that seemed a good spot. 7 km scan range versus 11 km scan range, but much lighter. Going full G5 long-range puts it over 8km at the cost of about 3 m/s. In practice I find you get more effective range than what Coriolis says. I'm using D's with a little long range and find it's plenty. YMMV.

And the shields. Swapped to 3A. At first glance you see the mj is sharply reduced. But the resistances of this build actually make it more effective against explosive and kinetic, though thermal is worse (but equal to what I am rocking). Recharge is much faster. The main benefit is it's half the weight of the Prismatics. Pure mj though is the best defense against collision damage. But my Courier is 551 mj and I hit your Vette doing 660 m/s, cartwheeled over and over and lost half a ring biggrin I'm using a 2A in mine.

Armor was changed to G5 heavy duty/deep plate on the lightweight alloy, and as you can see it's actually better and a little lighter.

All of this mass reduction gives it a nice boost to jump range, and allows the Enhanced Performance Thrusters for the extra smash. It would run a little cooler too as it's only G3 overcharged on the PP, but maybe the EP thrusters negate the thermal drop. Alternative build requires 1.7 MW less power. Perhaps the newfound speed and jump would allow you to swap the Guardian FSDB for another MRP/HRP or Guardian shield booster or SCB or whatever.

You didn't ask my opinion Bo, but I like doing this and discussing it so hope you don't mind and I hope to hear your thoughts. I've flown my Courier alot now and the bottom line for me is that as amazing as the shields are on your build, they are more than you'll need in PvE. So I traded a little of their capability for much more speed and jump. Integrity's a little better too. I feel like chaff isn't needed at these speeds, and with this agility against the NPCs, but that's a matter of opinion.

My Courier for comparison

Velocity




Last edited by DBond; 05/11/19 07:04 PM.

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