Joined: Apr 2001 Posts: 121,489PanzerMeyer
Pro-Consul of Florida
PanzerMeyer
Pro-Consul of Florida
King Crimson - SimHQ's Top Poster
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,489
Miami, FL USA
Originally Posted by RSColonel_131st
Adjacent compartments flooding because of design issues... not nice.
Didn't the Titanic have the same design flaw?
“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)
#4451171 - 11/30/1802:47 PMRe: Helge Ingstad: Warship collides with tanker in fjord
[Re: Patrocles]
I believe she did Panzer. Possibly excusable in 1911 as she was one of the first 'unsinkable' ship designs but a ship launched in 2007? There's no excuse for that.
EV's are the Devils matchbox.
#4451175 - 11/30/1803:14 PMRe: Helge Ingstad: Warship collides with tanker in fjord
[Re: Chucky]
I believe she did Panzer. Possibly excusable in 1911 as she was one of the first 'unsinkable' ship designs but a ship launched in 2007? There's no excuse for that.
Especially not for a warship.
"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
#4451176 - 11/30/1803:15 PMRe: Helge Ingstad: Warship collides with tanker in fjord
[Re: Patrocles]
Oh and that design is/was in the running for the US Navy's new frigate.
"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
#4451295 - 12/01/1808:44 AMRe: Helge Ingstad: Warship collides with tanker in fjord
[Re: PanzerMeyer]
Continuing a not very glamorous couple of weeks in Norway’s rich maritime history, a floating dry dock built in 1911 sank outside Bergen a week ago. It was ordered by Winston Churchill when he was First Lord of the Admiralty, and survived both world wars. Amazing that it was still in use! I really hope it will be raised again.
In all my years I've never seen the like. It has to be more than a hundred sea miles and he brings us up on his tail. That's seamanship, Mr. Pullings. My God, that's seamanship!
#4453117 - 12/13/1804:17 PMRe: Helge Ingstad: Warship collides with tanker in fjord
[Re: Patrocles]
"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
#4453264 - 12/14/1805:58 PMRe: Helge Ingstad: Warship collides with tanker in fjord
[Re: Patrocles]
Joined: Dec 1999 Posts: 6,779EAF331 MadDog
XBL: LanceHawkins
pathetic how this keeps happening. the design flaw was a ridiculous oversight. is this not yacht building 101 - every hole you put in the hull must be sealed or have a very reliable valve to seal it.
#4469844 - 04/10/1907:31 PMRe: Helge Ingstad: Warship collides with tanker in fjord
[Re: VF9_Longbow]
Joined: Dec 1999 Posts: 6,779EAF331 MadDog
XBL: LanceHawkins
Using the true and tested McGuyver field repair kit it's now seaworthy again!
Of course its only going to sail into the dry dock it's next to, and there it will be evaluated. In all likelyhood it will be scrapped. It was in shallow oxygen-rich water so corrosion has set in badly - it would need to utterly refurbished from top to bottom and that is probably just as expensive as bying a new ship,
Last edited by EAF331 MadDog; 04/10/1907:33 PM.
#4469853 - 04/10/1908:59 PMRe: Helge Ingstad: Warship collides with tanker in fjord
[Re: Patrocles]
Joined: Oct 1999 Posts: 15,786Haggart
I Fought Diablo
how big does the ocean have to be to keep them from running into each other
In this case it didn't happen on the ocean.
"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
#4470032 - 04/11/1910:32 PMRe: Helge Ingstad: Warship collides with tanker in fjord
[Re: F4UDash4]
how big does the ocean have to be to keep them from running into each other
In this case it didn't happen on the ocean.
Maybe the watch should be doubled when sailing in congested waters or areas of limited maneuvering room at night. There’s just no way 2 ships should EVER get close enough to collide. If it means there’s no mid rats because the cooks are on the rail with NVGs or some sailors don’t get to go to bed that night, then so be it.
Phil
“The biggest problem people have is they don’t think they’re supposed to have problems.” - Hayes Barnard
#4470039 - 04/11/1910:50 PMRe: Helge Ingstad: Warship collides with tanker in fjord
[Re: NH2112]
how big does the ocean have to be to keep them from running into each other
In this case it didn't happen on the ocean.
Maybe the watch should be doubled when sailing in congested waters or areas of limited maneuvering room at night. There’s just no way 2 ships should EVER get close enough to collide. If it means there’s no mid rats because the cooks are on the rail with NVGs or some sailors don’t get to go to bed that night, then so be it.
As I understand this collision it wasn't from a lack of seeing the oncoming ship, but a lack of correctly interpreting its course. In that case more eyes would not necessarily help any.
"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
#4470107 - 04/12/1908:10 AMRe: Helge Ingstad: Warship collides with tanker in fjord
[Re: Patrocles]
Joined: Dec 1999 Posts: 7,747Ssnake
Virtual Shiva Beast
The best skippers are to be found on the pier, of course. But several factors seem to have compounded - it was the return from a lengthy exercise, the the crew was anxious to get back to shore - the captain's decision to run through the fjord under emission control (save for radio traffic) - confirmation bias that misinterpreted the tanker's position light far too long as the lights of the oil terminal - change of watch immediately before the collision - abandoning ship way too soon rather than trying to fight the flooding
Simply reducing speed when they received the first warning that the might be on a collision course might already have helped to prevent disaster, rather than keeping barrelling at 30 knots with radars turned off through confined waters. Even if you dismiss the radio warnings as an error on the civilian ships' side, simply accounting for the possibility that they are right and you might be wrong would have helped a lot to keep an open mind about the situation. At least, that's my take on the whole incident.