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#4459300 - 01/30/19 01:06 PM Eagle 2  
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Haukka81 Offline
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Kemij�rvi,Finland
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ya-BsyYwh0


Not so hyper realistic like they always like to say in dcs forums ...


And that critic is from pilot that fly eagle in real world.


I5 8400 , 16gb , GTX 1070 oc , Win10 64bit . Virpil T-50 27" monitor with 2560x1440 rez ... DCS + Oculus CV1 + Samsung Odyssey . (odyssey is better for flight sims)
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#4459313 - 01/30/19 03:52 PM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Haukka81]  
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GrayGhost Offline
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1. P-factor appears to be too small or otherwise inconsistent. DCS certainly has shown P-Factor, so the devs need to take care of it
2. Too much lift from the fuselage. Not exactly the hardest thing in the world to fix.
3. 4-point roll may be caused by sim controls vs real controls, but some of the aero may also be an issue. Same thing with hammerheads. Probably fixable but more complex to resolve aero issues that result from blended controls.
4. His comment on the red-out. The sim doesn't hurt you. You get a red-out instead, that is the compromise. Further, aero pilots are far more amenable to -g, fighters pilots are simply not, nor are their aircraft.
5. Like he pointed out, they need time to get it right. This is complex stuff.

He did a good review and the devs should take it to heart.


--
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#4459386 - 01/31/19 02:14 AM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Haukka81]  
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Winfield Offline
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If the developer can't get the flight model right for a biplane.....what hope is there for
A realistic representation of the flight model in the tomcat.

Based on the youtube review, an EFM version of the Wright Flier would be unrealistically modeled if released by magnitude.
Even if it included a weight driven catapult modeled on the nimitz or whatever carrier is being modeled for release

#4459406 - 01/31/19 08:02 AM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Haukka81]  
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Vaderini Offline
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1) Magnitude has nothing to do with the flight model for Heatblur's Tomcat

2) Biplanes can have a lot harder to develop FM because biplanes are more subject to aerodynamic forces, which isn't the forté of DCS. DCS is great as a systems simulation and for "out-of-envelope" flight modelling, but horrible at aero flight models.

3) It's a pre-release, barely 2 weeks old, errors in the FM are to be expected.

I just hope they see this video and take the criticism for what it is, instead of hostility.

#4459416 - 01/31/19 11:29 AM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Vaderini]  
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Winfield Offline
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Originally Posted by Vaderini
1) Magnitude has nothing to do with the flight model for Heatblur's Tomcat

2) Biplanes can have a lot harder to develop FM because biplanes are more subject to aerodynamic forces, which isn't the forté of DCS. DCS is great as a systems simulation and for "out-of-envelope" flight modelling, but horrible at aero flight models.

3) It's a pre-release, barely 2 weeks old, errors in the FM are to be expected.

I just hope they see this video and take the criticism for what it is, instead of hostility.


As I respect your opinions in these forums.....I will respond respectfully this way.

1. Ok, yep thank you for pointing that out. I was merely having a crack that
They were once under the same team before they split into Magnitude/Heatblur. A subtle dig at the
Leatherneck era

2. I agree with this statement.......the flight model created on paper by Orville and Wilbur will
Be far better than anything modelled in a flight simulation. You can simulate a model based
On a real life flying machine but it will never fly like a real life aircraft in any simulation.
No computer simulation software back in the Wright Flier days.

3. I choose to politely decline to comment on this statement.

I would like the developer to look at the video as well.....
Cobra and his LN cohorts never could handle criticism with the Mig.....maybe with the split and
new developers, this team may see critique as a good thing.







#4459426 - 01/31/19 01:43 PM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Haukka81]  
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ST0RM Offline
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Altus, Ok
Not a fan of the CEII. I'm on the side of not having civilian aircraft in a combat sim and felt this was a wasted effort to support the concept. Mil trainers are not in the same category.

Recently saw a video of a guy using a grenade mod for the CEII, evading SAMs and then knocking out the launchers. Why not just use an actual mil aircraft?
So far, the 3rd party devs are about 40/60 split for content released. Allot of hype, but meh results.

#4459442 - 01/31/19 05:29 PM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: ST0RM]  
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Dondy Offline
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Originally Posted by ST0RM

Recently saw a video of a guy using a grenade mod for the CEII, evading SAMs and then knocking out the launchers. Why not just use an actual mil aircraft?
.


This video was meant as a joke. There is no mod, he just played around with triggers etc. He mentions it at the end of the video.


In memory of the JaboG34 "Allgu" Memmingen 1959-2003
Last take-off: 17.12.2002 10:06am

Legends may sleep but they'll never die
#4459471 - 01/31/19 08:17 PM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: ST0RM]  
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Winfield Offline
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Originally Posted by ST0RM
Not a fan of the CEII. I'm on the side of not having civilian aircraft in a combat sim and felt this was a wasted effort to support the concept. Mil trainers are not in the category


I don't own CEII either and have no intention to buy it. I am happy for that square to be in black and white and not colour on the main screen as far as I'm concerned.

I see it as a wasted investment of time which could have been spent elsewhere. A pc-9 or pc-21 trainer perhaps would have caught my attention.

#4459477 - 01/31/19 09:37 PM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Dondy]  
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ST0RM Offline
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Originally Posted by Dondy

This video was meant as a joke. There is no mod, he just played around with triggers etc. He mentions it at the end of the video.


I laughed, but not for his intended reason. I never finished the video, so I missed that explanation.

#4459514 - 02/01/19 08:18 AM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Haukka81]  
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Winfield Offline
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Does anyone here actually own this module and care to review it themselves?

I'm thinking of hitting the devs up for a free copy and write a review for the SimHQ
Homepage, but it might deter potential sales. Never hurts to ask, not something
I would buy myself and I have my doubts in getting my hands on the 'press release' version

Perhaps I'll wait before it is out of beta and give a non watered down review, hey you never
Know, it may actually be a decent module.

Anyone care to share a review and actually own it?




#4459518 - 02/01/19 10:55 AM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Haukka81]  
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Winfield Offline
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So no one owns it?

Ok I'll do a review of the module with out the actual module
Pretty much like the review I did of the hawk.....i owned that module but
It will never be finished so it is not much different to the state of
CEII now. Perhaps It will be finished....perhaps it won't.

#4459536 - 02/01/19 04:05 PM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Haukka81]  
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Vaderini Offline
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I feel like a reviewer shouldn't have an opinion either way beforehand. Obviously, you don't think much of the CE2 and Magnitude can always say "yeah, but its early access!!!11!!" like DCS devs always do right before abandoning their module.

Anywho, that's why i'm so psyched about reviewing the MiG-19P when it launches. I can't remember the last time a finished DCS module was launched, and finally a dev can't hide behind the "early access" sticker. Really looking forward to it. smile

#4459560 - 02/01/19 07:43 PM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Vaderini]  
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SinCityJet Offline
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I'm guessing the Russians don't need any help trying to simulate 55 year old technology, especially their own.

#4459615 - 02/02/19 12:59 AM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Vaderini]  
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Winfield Offline
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Originally Posted by Vaderini
I feel like a reviewer shouldn't have an opinion either way beforehand. Obviously, you don't think much of the CE2 and Magnitude can always say "yeah, but its early access!!!11!!" like DCS devs always do right before abandoning their module.


Least I'm not a spin doctor that will hype a module no matter what my personal feeling are.
I may actually surprise myself. Can a reviewer not have mutual feeling before a review?
Both good and bad, it would be a mixed review.....something practically unheard of in the land of
DCS with a score of 5 out of 10.....50/50. Not an outright 10 "buy this module, it's still in early access but is
Seriously worth buying" like practically every review that has come before me

#4459633 - 02/02/19 04:54 AM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Haukka81]  
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Vaderini Offline
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Oh well, at least I would be interested in your findings smile

Just bought the C-101 by the way in the Lunar Sale, and so far I find it a really good module! The production values are a lot higher than in the other DCS modules, even than those from ED (weirdly). Took them 5.5 years to get to where they are now, and there still are some issues that need to be adressed (the plane can pull infinite G's without a problem, even when the manual states a +7.5 / -3.9 G-limit), but it is already the most finished DCS module in years. Definitely worth a buy if you're looking for a new module.

By the way, the mods were having a banning spree on the forums for the past week. I can't open a topic without a yellow/red cross behind their name, and even all-around great guys like Frederf are falling victim now. What has happened in the past week that I haven't been aware of?

#4459963 - 02/04/19 10:33 PM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Haukka81]  
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LC Offline
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Its not a purchase for me either but none of the civilian aircraft are my cup of tea. I just use DCS for combat even if it does need some work in the single player aspects of it, i.e. campaigns being my wish list. I just bought the F-18 after saying I wasn't going to, flew around with it for a bit and I can actually say it surprised me how fun it was. Havent even touched the carrier or combat parts yet so here I am being a hypocrite for saying I only do combat smile Will be excited when we do get the ground radar but until then I take it as is.

If you guys would recommend one non combat aircraft would this one be it? Or a different trainer etc?


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#4460001 - 02/05/19 05:07 AM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Haukka81]  
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mdwa Offline
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Way over in Perth, Western Aus...
I can't recommend it as I don't have it, but I'm not interested in getting is. If I wanted to do civ stuff then I would go FSX, Xplane or p3d. Same for WW2 I would gor Blitz, BOS/BOM and Wings over the Reich. I agree they wasted their time (even if it was some test for WW2 plane FM or engine), they should have stuck with the military theme and made a Herc, C-2 COD, Caribou, PC-9 or even an O-1 Birddog or something like that.


mdwa
#4460003 - 02/05/19 09:04 AM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Haukka81]  
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Vaderini Offline
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I actually don't do any combat in DCS, with the AI flight model and damage model being what they are. My advice would be:
- if you have rudders, the UH-1 Huey: It requires constant stick and rudder input, making it a very fun module to fly
In the same category fall the Bf-109 and Spitfire, although they only require a lot of rudder input on take-off/landing. Beware that they do require a lot of dials on your HOTAS for systems management. And the Spitfire is quite broken atm that the Bf-109 is really the only choice in this department. You also need to watch your G's in the 109 or you'll lose your wings, which adds to the flying challenge.
- The MiG-15 and C-101 are a lot of fun in the engine management department, with the MiG-15 throttle being quite lazy (which requires pre-planning which level of power you want a couple of seconds before you actually need it) and the aircraft mustn't go transonic or its flight surfaces stop working. The C-101EB turbine temperature musn't go over 796°C or you risk breaking it, with higher temperatures allowed only for a short while. The C-101CC doesn't have this temperature limitation and is more powerful as well, so you can go full throttle all the time. Yesterday I did some low-level flying with it and the speed and manouvrability are a lot of fun. It felt like that scene where they fly inside the Death Star towards the power core. Great fun smile

#4460008 - 02/05/19 10:53 AM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Haukka81]  
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Winfield Offline
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Imagine when some clown releases a CEII campaign....
It would have to be on par with "the museum relic" not that I cared to invest in that POS make believe

#4460010 - 02/05/19 10:58 AM Re: Eagle 2 [Re: Vaderini]  
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Winfield Offline
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Originally Posted by Vaderini
I actually don't do any combat in DCS, with the AI flight model and damage model being what they are. My advice would be:
- if you have rudders, the UH-1 Huey: It requires constant stick and rudder input, making it a very fun module to fly
In the same category fall the Bf-109 and Spitfire, although they only require a lot of rudder input on take-off/landing. Beware that they do require a lot of dials on your HOTAS for systems management. And the Spitfire is quite broken atm that the Bf-109 is really the only choice in this department. You also need to watch your G's in the 109 or you'll lose your wings, which adds to the flying challenge.
- The MiG-15 and C-101 are a lot of fun in the engine management department, with the MiG-15 throttle being quite lazy (which requires pre-planning which level of power you want a couple of seconds before you actually need it) and the aircraft mustn't go transonic or its flight surfaces stop working. The C-101EB turbine temperature musn't go over 796°C or you risk breaking it, with higher temperatures allowed only for a short while. The C-101CC doesn't have this temperature limitation and is more powerful as well, so you can go full throttle all the time. Yesterday I did some low-level flying with it and the speed and manouvrability are a lot of fun. It felt like that scene where they fly inside the Death Star towards the power core. Great fun smile


Thank you for sharing. That's the kind of stuff that interests me with the C-101.
Honestly I had that shelved but recently reading your posts I printed the manual and have been
Refreshing myself with the systems.

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