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#4444924 - 10/23/18 12:44 AM Joystick recommendation  
Joined: Jul 2006
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mugwump Offline
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mugwump  Offline
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My Sidewinder 2 FFB is acting up so I'm in the market for a new system. I've got an X-55 Rhino (like the throttle a lot, dislike the stick more), and a CH Products Fighterstick and Pro Throttle (nice but I don't have and can't use pedals so it's of little use). I was looking into getting a Thrustmaster T16000M FCS stick and throttle. Does anyone have experience with these? Reviews I've seen all seem pretty positive but they all seemed focused on DCS and/or Elite Dangerous. It looks like the lack of rotaries and axes could be a bit limiting when it comes to water/oil shutters, fuel mixtures, RPM, trim, etc.

Decent HOTAS for IL-2 or is there a better choice? I might just use the stick and keep the X-55 throttle as well.


S = k ln W
#4445104 - 10/23/18 11:12 PM Re: Joystick recommendation [Re: mugwump]  
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Sokol1 Offline
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Alternatively VKB Gladiator "vanilla" is an very good stick for control WWII games planes.

Cost $99 is available in X-plane.org web store, as plus over T.16000M is the use of contactless sensor (VKB MARS) in "twist rudder" axes.

#4447522 - 11/08/18 05:56 AM Re: Joystick recommendation [Re: Sokol1]  
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imaca Offline
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Originally Posted by Sokol1
Alternatively VKB Gladiator "vanilla" is an very good stick for control WWII games planes.

Cost $99 is available in X-plane.org web store, as plus over T.16000M is the use of contactless sensor (VKB MARS) in "twist rudder" axes.

I Had a T16000M, it lasted about a year before the handle twist internals broke,
I bought a Gladiator in the hope it would be more rugged, but the hat switch lost 1 direction after about a month. The trigger also seems very flimsy, I don't expect a long life for this thing.
Also the Gladiator hat switch has poor ergonomics, The right hand side is difficult to operate because it is close up against the handle. It would be better if they swapped the hat swtich to the top.

#4447590 - 11/08/18 03:50 PM Re: Joystick recommendation [Re: mugwump]  
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Sokol1 Offline
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Worth notice that CH PRO Throttle "mini-stick" left/right can be used for yaw (rudder) control.

About VKB Gladiator grip "few buttons", VKB promise (probable for 2019) a $20 kit that allow install $99 MCG grip in then.This grip has the same number of buttons than Warthog grip and more in MCG PRO.

#4447607 - 11/08/18 05:20 PM Re: Joystick recommendation [Re: mugwump]  
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rollnloop. Offline
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Rotaries are not necessary for BoX, the only real confort it gives is for 109 trim (other aircraft's trim don't even support rotary).
You don't need to change mixture very often, when you want to lean it you need only to check that you don't lose rpm and if it allows you to suppress that "too rich mixture smoke effect" which is easily done without looking down. when you need full just press the fricher mixture" for 10 secs without looking down. For rpm the gauge is well visible on main panel for every craft so again you don't need to look at the position of the lever, just its effect.

In short, use whatever HOTAS suits you, my only advice being that it's better if the joystick is not too stiff, since those prop planes have no autotrim unlike the F16 or space sims, and trim variations are nearly constant. IIRC x55 joy is force sensed so it won't be easy to use it with props (or is it x65 ? ).

#4447675 - 11/09/18 12:00 AM Re: Joystick recommendation [Re: mugwump]  
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Frogyy2 Offline
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The Saitek X45 HOTAS can occasionally be found in new or “like new” condition. It would have all the buttons and rotaries you would need for BoX. Rotaries are perfect for operating radiators and cowl shutters, especially in VR. That said, the VKB Gladiator is a nice unit and I have just started using it in BoX. It seems on another level from the X45 stick in terms of fine control movements, most noticeable to me in scissor fights near ground as there is little room for error there. I also have recently started using a custom throttle and Thrustmaster TPR rudder pedals. The throttle increments on the custom unit seem finer than on the X45 and of course the TPR pedals are in a different class from my old CH Pro pedals. The VKB wants to be operated with both hands. To make this easier I have mounted it on a board and place the board in my lap. Did same with my X45’s long ago so they don’t take up desktop real estate and can be stored out of the way when not in use. Once you realize how nice it is to have access to higher resolution sensors in your HOTAS components it’s difficult to go back. Of course I cannot speak to the durability of the VKB unit as of yet.
On X45 I have oil radiator and prop pitch on throttle rotaries, inlet shutters on throttle mouse cursor hat and engine outlet shutters on front throttle 4-way switch. I am also using VoiceAttack which definitely decreases the number of HOTAS buttons needed.

Last edited by Frogyy2; 11/09/18 03:29 AM.
#4447781 - 11/09/18 04:16 PM Re: Joystick recommendation [Re: mugwump]  
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Sokol1 Offline
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Yes, VKB gladiator is not designed to be used in right side of keyboard on desktop, but in center position, because grip is "twist/tilt" for left - like in Bf 109 grip in what is based, and thus buttons and throttle disk on base require use left hand, what a right position make awkward, unless left this buttons for low used functions and use an standalone throttle in left hand.

BTW - Saitek Force Sense is (discontinued long time ago) X-65F - what contrary to Force Sense control on real planes or in Real Simulator mod for Cougar/Warthog, grip don't move a millimeter in X-65F.

One that want rotaries levers for WWII planes games should look at GVL224 custom throttle or "button/rotaries" box, is the best option in this matter. Options available in traditional brands have not been thought in WWII planes controls.

http://SimHQ.com/forum/ubbthreads.p...ntrol-unit-and-mechanization#Post4140505

Or Kantotrin "throttle consoles".

http://SimHQ.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4435799/kanttorin-kone-throttle-console#Post4435799




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