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#4423721 - 05/31/18 04:23 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: BigDuke6]  
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To what level are carrier ops modeled in the early access? That is one area that might have me purchase somewhat early. You can practice traps without any worries of AI, missiles, AG etc.


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#4423725 - 05/31/18 04:28 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: Force10]  
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Originally Posted by Force10
To what level are carrier ops modeled in the early access? That is one area that might have me purchase somewhat early. You can practice traps without any worries of AI, missiles, AG etc.


The IFLOLS is bright and working, the cables are 3D and animated. I dont know if hook skip physics are in because I havent tested it, but the suspension on the gear is very well modeled. Cat shots are amazing with the steam and sound effects rumbling down the deck. You have to taxi up pretty close to the shuttle, put the bar down and then press "U" and it will take over. It doesn't magically "stick" you on the shuttle, instead it slowly drives forward and connects the launch bar. If you contact the tower and request take off, the JBD comes up. Launch sequence happens once you go full throttle. As far as bugs go, currently the Port elevator somehow has the collision model missing, so you cant drive on it or you'll fall through.

#4423735 - 05/31/18 04:52 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: BigDuke6]  
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Originally Posted by BigDuke6
Well when yall get done with the lovers quarrel, I highly suggest trying out the F-18.

Put a few hours on it yesterday evening, and all I can really say is wow. Really glad I decided to purchase it. I can definitely see this thing being the benchmark for future combat flight simulations. The flight model, visuals and sound are the best i've experienced in a pc game.

I'm sure some will say I'm fanboying right now, and honestly, I am because this thing is awesome. Got a grown ass man excited about a video game. Business practices aside, I don't see how anyone could dislike this module.


Except that real life pilots has already reported a few discrepancy in the flight model. Which means airplane doing the opposite of what it does in real life, so it all depends on what do you mean as best flight model ever...

That being said this airplane is in EA so there is plenty amount of time to get it fixed before hitting gold, which i hope and honestly even now it provides an enjoyable FM.

Don't get me wrong, i'm pretty confident this airplane will be a success.

Last edited by xXNightEagleXx; 05/31/18 05:08 PM.
#4423739 - 05/31/18 04:56 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: BigDuke6]  
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Originally Posted by BigDuke6
Originally Posted by Force10
To what level are carrier ops modeled in the early access? That is one area that might have me purchase somewhat early. You can practice traps without any worries of AI, missiles, AG etc.


The IFLOLS is bright and working, the cables are 3D and animated. I dont know if hook skip physics are in because I havent tested it, but the suspension on the gear is very well modeled. Cat shots are amazing with the steam and sound effects rumbling down the deck. You have to taxi up pretty close to the shuttle, put the bar down and then press "U" and it will take over. It doesn't magically "stick" you on the shuttle, instead it slowly drives forward and connects the launch bar. If you contact the tower and request take off, the JBD comes up. Launch sequence happens once you go full throttle. As far as bugs go, currently the Port elevator somehow has the collision model missing, so you cant drive on it or you'll fall through.


Thanks for the info!


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#4423757 - 05/31/18 05:23 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: xXNightEagleXx]  
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Originally Posted by BigDuke6
No doubt its no where near complete, like you said, that's what has me excited. What is there is amazing though. The flight model is extremely believable.

And I do not doubt you are enjoying it immensely. In a way, I am jealous smile However, the stuff I'm interested in with the Hornet is not yet implemented, so I would not enjoy the module outside of just practicing A-A refueling and carrier traps. I'm still excited for the future of the module, only tempered by my knowledge of ED's past performance.


Originally Posted by xXNightEagleXx
Except that real life pilots has already reported a few discrepancy in the flight model.

Link please?


- Ice
#4423766 - 05/31/18 05:34 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: - Ice]  
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One of them can be found in bms forum https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynUj60zicDw

#4423777 - 05/31/18 05:56 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: BigDuke6]  
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Thank you. If he is indeed a current or ex-Hornet pilot and that's what he can say about the module, then it is very good indeed. I hope that ED listens to him. I love how at 6:50 he says "don't take my word for it, talk to your subject matter experts, review this". If we end up with stuff that only RL pilots would notice and only in very minor, nitpicky situations, then that is very good news.

10:31 he estimates another year before ED nails the Hornet. I should have $80 saved up by then smile Might even have a Hornet+Hormuz bundle too and, if I am pushing my luck, new carriers!!


- Ice
#4423786 - 05/31/18 06:08 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: - Ice]  
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Originally Posted by - Ice
Thank you. If he is indeed a current or ex-Hornet pilot and that's what he can say about the module, then it is very good indeed. I hope that ED listens to him. I love how at 6:50 he says "don't take my word for it, talk to your subject matter experts, review this". If we end up with stuff that only RL pilots would notice and only in very minor, nitpicky situations, then that is very good news.

10:31 he estimates another year before ED nails the Hornet. I should have $80 saved up by then smile Might even have a Hornet+Hormuz bundle too and, if I am pushing my luck, new carriers!!


Matt Wagner has already acknowledged the problem which is great (hoping that it is not the start of the list of many acknowledged issues never fixed like many in DCS). Although i would never ever be able to say whether or not that behavior was real for the F-18, i would actually find strange that as soon as you open the flaps to full the aircraft dive instead of rise.

#4423914 - 06/01/18 10:13 AM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: xXNightEagleXx]  
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Originally Posted by xXNightEagleXx
Although i would never ever be able to say whether or not that behavior was real for the F-18, i would actually find strange that as soon as you open the flaps to full the aircraft dive instead of rise.


I find your comment interesting. I own both a 2004 Fly Synthesis Texan and more recently a 2015 Texan. IRL both aircraft being Ultra Light's, when lowering the flaps to 15 degrees, the nose drops slightly yet the aircraft climbs, 30 degrees, the nose drops further yet the aircraft gains altitude.

I wouldn't have a clue about jet aircraft but that is how it is in GA. Warriors are the same, as is Cessna aircraft, nose drops yet gains altitude.

#4423920 - 06/01/18 11:03 AM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: BigDuke6]  
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The reason is that the flaps change the wing chord, moving the center of lift backwards. This results in a forward pitching moment. At the same time, it increases the lift, so the AoA decreases. The effect may be too pronounced in the Hornet right now, but in principle, it is correct.

Last edited by Sobek; 06/01/18 11:21 AM.
#4424043 - 06/01/18 08:00 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: BigDuke6]  
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There's a difference between a pitching moment and the sum of all the pitching moments. There are aerodynamic effects that produce opposite tendencies.

#4424063 - 06/01/18 09:49 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: BigDuke6]  
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Ok so I've put about 6-8 hours into the hornet now. Verdict still the same, great buy. I have reached the point of exploring all available features though. Dumb bombs and rockets are only so fun, especially when the only spotting device is Mk1 eyeball, and I dont see too well. Also without the TDC axis mapped, its bothersome using the A/A radar with my HOTAS because I'll have to basically remap that hat to the ministick (not a warthog) once its implemented, thus causing me to relearn stuff. Not to mention, it is really a pain in the ass to fly online and fight Air to Air because you have no form of IFF, awacs declare doesn't work either. Plus the EW page, unless i just dont know how to work it, shows contacts, but the symbology does not change when they are locking. You get a tone, but you have no clue what direction and which contact it is. Your best bet is to get on a SRS server and hope they have a good GCI.

WITH ALL THAT BEING SAID:

I'm still enjoying just starting up and flying around. I think this stage in development was the perfect time for early access, there is just enough to do to still have fun. I will be satisfied enough with a TDC axis and a IFF system. I can wait on the mud moving stuff. The plane is a straight up blast to fly around in. Cat shots and traps make this module worth the coin for now.

#4424073 - 06/01/18 10:46 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: BigDuke6]  
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Originally Posted by BigDuke6
I have reached the point of exploring all available features though. Dumb bombs and rockets are only so fun, especially when the only spotting device is Mk1 eyeball, and I dont see too well.

Originally Posted by - Ice
I don't mind having an "incomplete elephant" at first just like I don't want to have entree, main, and dessert all at once when eating out. However, I expect all three within a reasonable timeframe, ie, all during that evening at some point. This is very likely not going to be the case for ED. How long do you "walk" with limited A-A capability and dumb bombs before you can "run" with AIM-120s, JHMCS, TGP, LGBs, JDAMs, HARMs, etc.? I bet people will be tired of "walking" and ED won't have any of the "running" anywhere near ready.


Now to see how long before ED gives you more features to explore.


- Ice
#4424119 - 06/02/18 06:18 AM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: BigDuke6]  
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I would buy if they were not grossly overpriced.

#4424131 - 06/02/18 10:06 AM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: Sobek]  
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Originally Posted by Sobek
The reason is that the flaps change the wing chord, moving the center of lift backwards. This results in a forward pitching moment. At the same time, it increases the lift, so the AoA decreases. The effect may be too pronounced in the Hornet right now, but in principle, it is correct.


what about inertia? Is that DCS World issue or Hornet specific FM issue?

Im asking this as missile might get better performance after missile used up its fuel to burn

#4424181 - 06/02/18 03:24 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: nadal]  
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Originally Posted by nadal

what about inertia? Is that DCS World issue or Hornet specific FM issue?


It's all Hornet specific. The induced drag for the Hornet when dirty is crazy progressive right now, it is extremely hard to maintain constant speed on approach.

#4424184 - 06/02/18 03:35 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: BigDuke6]  
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Aha... it did seem difficult compered to other aircraft.

Nate

#4424199 - 06/02/18 05:47 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: rezerekted]  
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Originally Posted by rezerekted
I would buy if they were not grossly overpriced.

dont know what you're talking... a steal at 100$ CAD for early access... rolleyes


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#4424204 - 06/02/18 06:08 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: Nate]  
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Originally Posted by Nate
Aha... it did seem difficult compered to other aircraft.


I'm not saying it is wrong, but compared to other aircraft the back of the drag curve gets you into trouble *really* fast. I'm sure they'll go through another few rounds of tuning the FM, so we'll see.

Last edited by Sobek; 06/02/18 06:08 PM.
#4424247 - 06/02/18 10:36 PM Re: Purchase F-18/Persian Gulf? [Re: BigDuke6]  
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Got them both...beta is an understatement . However and I can't put my finger on it, but it's fun. Yeah there is work to be done but I haven't had this much fun with a plane in years and years. So here is the break down. If you arent in to flying betas, wait. If you want to mess around, get familiar with it or just want a new place and plane to fly then go for it.


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