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#4388722 - 11/07/17 10:32 PM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: messyhead]  
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thealx Offline
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I had always use DX9, at least DX7 libraries caused errors since I came here (Jan '14). That shouldn't be a reason of compilation errors, as you didn't applied changes to the rendering code. But it can be Watcom compatibly issue, or even hardware compatibly. Still trying to find some time for experiments.

#4389787 - 11/15/17 10:37 AM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: messyhead]  
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I have checked torque indicators code - I am not sure how exactly you expected it can work, draw_havoc_engine_bar uses 2D draw functions that no longer longer work with the 3D cockpit. You can't just copy old code, it should be modified for sub objects manipulation, or texture animation.
I have changed trq_gauge object and added function to control it's scale->y value, that's the way how usual instruments works. You just need to set in the scene parent's position, and object rotation (to fit cockpit surface), other indicators can be added same way.
And, are you sure you have used exactly the same function as in the 1.15.0? as this particular bar behave differently.

#4389792 - 11/15/17 11:30 AM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: thealx]  
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messyhead Offline
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Originally Posted by thealx
I have checked torque indicators code - I am not sure how exactly you expected it can work, draw_havoc_engine_bar uses 2D draw functions that no longer longer work with the 3D cockpit. You can't just copy old code, it should be modified for sub objects manipulation, or texture animation.
I have changed trq_gauge object and added function to control it's scale->y value, that's the way how usual instruments works. You just need to set in the scene parent's position, and object rotation (to fit cockpit surface), other indicators can be added same way.
And, are you sure you have used exactly the same function as in the 1.15.0? as this particular bar behave differently.


Thanks for having a look at that, and the advice.

I'm confused though. Why does the Comanche and Apache MFD gauges work, as they use the 2D draw functions to draw the bars on the engine pages.

I was trying to basically use the same functions as they use to draw the bar on a texture. Almost like the engine gauges were unique MFDs. That's why I reused some code from those.

I had discussed a while ago with Firebird about doing it using a 3D subobject, but wasn't sure how to approach it.

Also, this experiment was also to learn how to do it so I can later use it in my Blackhawk. In the Blackhawk bars, the colour changes as the bar increases, so I'd have to work out how to do that. With the way the comanche torque bar works, it changes colour if it's over torque.


Just to add, I don't have a problem with doing them as 3D objects, as I'm pretty familiar with that. But I'd like to know why the 2D draw functions work in some places, i.e. MFDs, but can't be used in others.

Last edited by messyhead; 11/15/17 11:39 AM.
#4389801 - 11/15/17 12:23 PM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: messyhead]  
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thealx Offline
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Rendering on texture applied to the texture name, not sub object. I think surface field "Comment" also used, but not really remember details. So to make it work, "eng_trq_texture_screen" has to be linked with this texture both in the Modeler and code (not scene editor), so function "draw_havoc_engine_bar" will render data somewhere.

#4389803 - 11/15/17 12:58 PM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: messyhead]  
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Ok thanks. I did mean to check the texture comment, but not had time to work on it recently. Home improvements and DIY have taken all my time recently.

#4399943 - 01/14/18 07:03 PM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: messyhead]  
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XIII Offline
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Your new lamp textures have an incorrect size.and this version NOT have the new lighting other cockpits.

#4399945 - 01/14/18 07:06 PM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: XIII]  
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Originally Posted by XIII
Your new lamp textures have an incorrect size.and this version NOT have the new lighting other cockpits.


This is still based on the old EEAH cockpit models, so it won't have the lighting applied.

Can you explain what you mean about the textures having an incorrect size?

#4399954 - 01/14/18 07:40 PM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: messyhead]  
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I wrote once in your blackhawk wink
texture should be divided by two for ex 128x64 128x32 1024x512 type textures 162x48 can cause ctd.

#4399961 - 01/14/18 07:54 PM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: XIII]  
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Originally Posted by XIII
I wrote once in your blackhawk wink
texture should be divided by two for ex 128x64 128x32 1024x512 type textures 162x48 can cause ctd.


Ok, well I'll rework them when I have time. I usually end up cropping the image to only what's needed, so end up with those sizes. I suppose I'll just need to make the canvas size correct, and have blank space around the image.

#4399965 - 01/14/18 08:15 PM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: messyhead]  
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maybe just try to resize, they are not big differences.

#4399969 - 01/14/18 08:46 PM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: XIII]  
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messyhead Offline
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Originally Posted by XIII
maybe just try to resize, they are not big differences.

Resizing wouldn't work for all of them, unless I make them quite a bit bigger than they are. So 164 x 48 would need to be 256 x 128 to avoid it being cropped, but would leave some blank space around the image.


Is the rule just that the proportions can be divided by each other equally? I see some textures are 256 x 256 and 512 x 512, but also 256 x64.

Which one were you seeing that was 164 x 48?

#4399972 - 01/14/18 08:57 PM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: messyhead]  
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from what I know can be (examples, not all)
128x16 128x32 128x64 128x256 128x512 and so on . 164x48 it's not good.
yes, resize to a larger size is the simplest.
or to a smaller, rather, there should not be any change on the model
making white space is a lot of work.

#4436466 - 08/30/18 05:00 PM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: messyhead]  
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The engine status gauges are not in the description up front, so I don't think they have been hooked up. Maybe messyhead will add that in later. I seem to remember a discussion on how to do the engine gauges in another thread for the Blackhawk, so maybe they haven't figured that out yet.

#4436568 - 08/31/18 08:32 AM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: messyhead]  
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Sorry, I meant to reply to this. It was tricky for me to get the engine bars working. I tried out a few ideas, but couldn't quite get them to work. I think someone was also talking about building a new modernised cockpit for it, as the one in game is from the MI28A, but the model is designated MI28N, which had more digital displays in the cockpit.

#4436591 - 08/31/18 03:38 PM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: messyhead]  
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Javelin Offline
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Yes, it was upgraded and has 2 MFD's. It looks like this:
Mi-28N Cockpit

The Mi-24 was also upgraded with 2 modern MFD's and renamed the Mi-35, it looks like this:
Mi-35 Cockpit

#4478400 - 06/16/19 07:00 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Reloaded [Re: Viper1970]  
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Hi Messyhead, I took a look in LightWave at your Mi-28 needles file. I see a slightly different model for every needle. Can't we do it with one needle model copied and renamed 20 times, then inserted into the scene file? I can handle the start position and movement with one equation, resulting in one simple rotation command. A little easier than altering the model for every gauge. And how do you place the needles into the scene file in the correct spot? It seems to me that would take either a lot of trial and error, or some way to insert the textured cockpit in as a reference.

#4478444 - 06/17/19 03:13 AM Re: KA-50 AIO Reloaded [Re: Javelin]  
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I moved your post into this thread.

Originally Posted by Javelin
Hi Messyhead, I took a look in LightWave at your Mi-28 needles file. I see a slightly different model for every needle. Can't we do it with one needle model copied and renamed 20 times, then inserted into the scene file? I can handle the start position and movement with one equation, resulting in one simple rotation command. A little easier than altering the model for every gauge.


I had to use separate needle objects. If you used one object, copied it, then renamed and moved it to the right position, then when it loads, it would have given the single object the new position. I think I might have tried that and found problems. If you can work out how to do it with a single object, then that would be better.

Originally Posted by Javelin
And how do you place the needles into the scene file in the correct spot? It seems to me that would take either a lot of trial and error, or some way to insert the textured cockpit in as a reference.


To get the needles in the right place, I opened the cockpit model, then added each needle to the cockpit in a new layer, and positioned it in the right place. I then saved each needle as a separate object in the rigt position. Then when I loaded them into the scene, they were in the right place. I also loaded the cockpit model into the scene to check, and then removed the cockpit model before saving the scene. I find the scene editor quite tricky to use, in terms of being able to move things around. I keep meanig to try and find a good tutorial on using the scene editor.

#4478590 - 06/18/19 02:48 AM Re: KA-50 AIO Reloaded [Re: messyhead]  
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Thanks, I doubt I'll find a better way than you have, just asking the question.

That makes sense, use the cockpit model. Of course.

I need to find some basic LightWave tutorials myself. I know Inventor, Autocad 3D, and Solid Works from work, but LightWave is very different.

#4478602 - 06/18/19 04:35 AM Re: KA-50 AIO Reloaded [Re: messyhead]  
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Some useful keys I tend to always use;

Space bar - switches between selection modes: point, line, polygon. I tend to stay on polygon
/ - deselect current selection
- (as in minus key) - hide selection: this is useful to remove surfaces that you don't need to see, or if a surface is behind another.
\ - unhide all
Shift \ ( | pipe) - hide inverted: this shows what's been hidden, and hides what's visible. So switches hidden.
] - select all connected polygons
Shift a - fit selected polygon
Ctrl a - fit all
" (quote mark: Shift 2 on UK keyboards) - invert selected. So selects everything not selected, and deselects what you selected. This can be useful to quickly hide everything. Select a surface you want to work on, invert everything, and hit the hide key.

In the perspective viewport
Alt and L mouse - rotate around view: this rotates around a centre point of your current view, not the current selection
Ctrl Alt and L mouse - zoom in / out
Shift Alt and L mouse - Move view about

Modify tab
t - move the selection
y - rotate the selection
h - stretch selection
Shift h - size selection

You can also hold Ctrl before using a modifier, and constrain the movement to one direction.

You can select a modify mode, then hit n to bring up the numeric panel, and change something using values instead of moving the mouse.

If you're in a modify mode, hitting Space bar will get you out of it.

Texture related
q - Change surface: used to assign or create a surface
F5 - surface editor (this is probably where you'll need to look up some tutorials)

In the bottom right, you'll see 5 letters W, T, M, C, S. T is textures. If you select that, then the dropdown shows all the existing UV maps.

Each viewport has some dropdowns at the top that can be used to change a view. If you set one of the viewports to UV, then select a UV map from the dropdown in the bottom right of the screen, then the UV map will be shown in the viewport. You can also show the image for the UW map, so you can see how the textures are mapped.

Other stuff
i - information on the current selection: can be useful to find the surface that is assigned to the selection
w - statistics: you can use this to select different surfaces by their characteristics. For example, all polygons with a certain surface

At the top right, next to the name of the model there is a number, then some boxes, split diagonally. These are the layers. Everything is usually loaded into layer 1, unless the model is saved in layers. You can split an object to layers, but selecting some polygons, cutting them (Ctrl x), then selecting an empt layer, and pasting. You can then select individual layers, or Shift L mouse click to select multiple layers. If you click in the bottom half of the split layer box, it will show the layer as an outline.

Layers can sometimes be useful if you're working on smaller details.

end - collapse all layers to one layer. You'll need to do this before trying to convert to an EEO or it won't load in game properly, if at all.
home - delete a layer
insert - inserts a layer
F7 - shows the layers panel. Useful if you end up with a lot of layers, and you can name them as well. For my Blackhawk cockpit, I had 15 layers.


I hope that's some help.


Last edited by messyhead; 06/18/19 04:48 AM.
#4478608 - 06/18/19 06:13 AM Re: Mi-28 Working Instrument Needles [Re: messyhead]  
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messyhead notworthy THANKS!

This makes things so much easier to remember after two years of abstinence biggrin

The last evenings looked more like this mycomputer

Last edited by Viper1970; 06/18/19 06:14 AM.

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