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#4385912 - 10/20/17 08:34 AM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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After viewing at the code with a special search program I found out that it seems like the rudder LOD ( or stabilizer ? ) of the KA-50 as well as the KA-52 was never included in the code of Allmods. Same goes for the rotor mast.

I found this LOD entries in eech_all_mods.nsi:

KA-50:

602 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA50_HOKUM\KA_50_FUSELAGE_LOD1.EEO"
603 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA50_HOKUM\KA_50_FUSELAGE_LOD2.EEO"
604 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA50_HOKUM\KA_50_FUSELAGE_LOD3.EEO"
605 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA50_HOKUM\KA_50_LT_LOD.eeo"
611 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA50_HOKUM\KA_50_NS_LOD.eeo"
612 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA50_HOKUM\KA_50_RT_LOD.eeo"

KA-52:

621 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA52_HOKUM_B\KA52_COPILOT_DOOR_LOD1.EEO"
623 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA52_HOKUM_B\KA52_FUSELAGE_LOD1.EEO"
624 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA52_HOKUM_B\KA52_FUSELAGE_LOD2.EEO"
625 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA52_HOKUM_B\KA52_FUSELAGE_LOD3.EEO"
627 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA52_HOKUM_B\KA52_PILOT_DOOR_LOD1.EEO"
628 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA52_HOKUM_B\KA52_LT_LOD.eeo"
634 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA52_HOKUM_B\KA52_NS_LOD.eeo"
635 File "${EE_3DOBJ_DIR}\cohokum\3ddata\objects\KA52_HOKUM_B\KA52_RT_LOD.eeo"

I don't know what this exactly is for, cause I'm no coder, but as far as I'm able to construe this it looks like that different LOD-files for the rudder ( and rotor) for both helos are missing. I think that those LOD-files are still in original state and this is the reason why you get the same texture at the rudder if you zoom out for both helos.

I have no idea how I could fix this? Only way could be always to use the LOD-hack (performance?) or both helicopters have to use similar textures (not realistic).

Last edited by Viper1970; 10/20/17 08:49 AM.

Main Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X / ASRock Taichi X470 / 32GB Ram GSkill F4-2800C15Q-32GVR / Asus ROG Strix GeForce RTX 2080 OC

WSO Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 5 2600X / Asus Prime B450 Plus / 16GB Ram GSkill F4-2666C15Q-16GRR / KFA2 GeForce RTX 2060

Retro System: AMD Athlon X2 3000Mhz / ASRock AM2NF3-VSTA / 2GB Ram / Gigabyte GV-N68T256DH GeForce AGP 6800 GT 256MB DDR3 / Diamond Monster 3D II 12MB SLI
#4385914 - 10/20/17 09:26 AM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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Default objects used for that
114F
1150
1151
And yes, they are same for Ka-50 and Ka-52, what creates visual issue.

If you want to fix it, change texture and UVs of these objects, place them inside of the helicopter folder with unique name (like KA_50_STABILIZER_LOD1.EEO) and fix LOD names in the scene.


Attached Files ka52.jpg
Last edited by thealx; 10/20/17 09:34 AM.
#4385916 - 10/20/17 10:10 AM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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Thealx you are great!!! Thank's so much!!! whoohoo

Have searched for this files the whole night with an object viewer, but wasn't able to find them or have overseen them.


Main Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X / ASRock Taichi X470 / 32GB Ram GSkill F4-2800C15Q-32GVR / Asus ROG Strix GeForce RTX 2080 OC

WSO Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 5 2600X / Asus Prime B450 Plus / 16GB Ram GSkill F4-2666C15Q-16GRR / KFA2 GeForce RTX 2060

Retro System: AMD Athlon X2 3000Mhz / ASRock AM2NF3-VSTA / 2GB Ram / Gigabyte GV-N68T256DH GeForce AGP 6800 GT 256MB DDR3 / Diamond Monster 3D II 12MB SLI
#4386094 - 10/21/17 04:26 AM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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Is the KA-50 always black, or does it also have camo?

I'm just asking, as I think the sins feature added in 1.16 could be useful for this, and have a black texture used in some places, and camo in others?

#4386102 - 10/21/17 08:45 AM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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Viper1970 Offline
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I don't know it exactly. It looks like they made different versions of it. As far as I know they have experimented with a night attack version (seems that those are the black ones), but then decided to built the KA-52 instead (which shares most of the parts of the KA-50), because of a WSO was needed for controlling the systems. There exist many variations of camouflage versions also. A more beige-colored, a darker brown-colored and a blue-colored (and many others).

There are some other black versions which were shown at different airshows to find some countries for export. Those have a lot of company logos on the fuselage.

I will try to make a black (norm), a beige-colored (desert) and a blue-colored (winter) camouflage. If things work out like I have planed, it should be easy to make different camouflage versions. If I'm ready with it, I will upload the base textures also, so everyone can make his own repaint which he prefers.

I will do the same principle for the other russian helos, too. The US choppers do not have so much different schemes. Even the Apache does not use desert camos in the Irak or Afghanistan. Same goes for the Viper which is always grey (Marines).

P.S:

How complex is it to built new helos? I would like to make an AH-1F Cobra (flat canopy) which would really good fit to the Europe theater. It seems I'm able to do the cockpit model and the helicopter itself, but I have no idea how to make all the animation stuff at the moment. Maybe I will get the rotors working (if there is not much needed to write or adjust in the source code) but I'm totally lost with the systems and the instruments.

If I'm able to make a good looking model, would you then help me (only if your Blackhawk is ready of course) to integrate it to Allmods? No worry I will take time too, before I will start with this project.

Last edited by Viper1970; 10/21/17 09:25 AM.

Main Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X / ASRock Taichi X470 / 32GB Ram GSkill F4-2800C15Q-32GVR / Asus ROG Strix GeForce RTX 2080 OC

WSO Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 5 2600X / Asus Prime B450 Plus / 16GB Ram GSkill F4-2666C15Q-16GRR / KFA2 GeForce RTX 2060

Retro System: AMD Athlon X2 3000Mhz / ASRock AM2NF3-VSTA / 2GB Ram / Gigabyte GV-N68T256DH GeForce AGP 6800 GT 256MB DDR3 / Diamond Monster 3D II 12MB SLI
#4386150 - 10/21/17 05:07 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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Originally Posted by Viper1970


How complex is it to built new helos? I would like to make an AH-1F Cobra (flat canopy) which would really good fit to the Europe theater.
If I'm able to make a good looking model,

For what? rolleyes You have great rapota models with lwo files.Use the model and change only the shape of the cabin, work for a few hours.not a few weeks.the same for cockpit you can edit dfang cockpit. btw you know that eech has cobra cockpit ?

#4386155 - 10/21/17 05:30 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: XIII]  
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Originally Posted by blackshark
Originally Posted by Viper1970


How complex is it to built new helos? I would like to make an AH-1F Cobra (flat canopy) which would really good fit to the Europe theater.
If I'm able to make a good looking model,

For what? rolleyes You have great rapota models with lwo files.Use the model and change only the shape of the cabin, work for a few hours.not a few weeks.the same for cockpit you can edit dfang cockpit. btw you know that eech has cobra cockpit ?


If you're going to build a new cockpit, the best model to use in the code is the Havoc or Comanche. It's not difficult to do, just time consuming.

#4386159 - 10/21/17 05:36 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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yes I know this . Now I chceck ah1f has different cockpit than eech. Now all clear.

#4386235 - 10/22/17 10:21 AM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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I have some free models here which aren't really bad and low poly. I have to adjust some things but not too much. They are free for commercial and personal use.

The AH-1F is single turbine only. The models in EECH are Supercobras (AH-1W) or the AH-1Z Viper with a totally different fuselage and two turbines. Would be more complex to change this all as adjusting the models I have.

The cockpit is a different thing. That must be really done mostly from scratch, because the AH-1F had not much modern systems. Most was analog only and the shape of the panel is very different from the AH-1Z. It also used a standard center cyclic, not the sidestick the AH-1Z uses. Another thing are the anti tank missles. The AH-1F used a TOW-system instead of the Hellfire's. I've heared that there were some models which could use Hellfire's also, but don't know if this only was for testing purposes.

But that all is really a future plan, first I want to do as much as I'm able to do for the russian helicopters. It's only that I always loved the AH-1F (since I was a kid) and it was the backbone of the US attack helicopters before the AH-64A appeared. That's why I thought it should be in EECH too. Would fit nice as a counterpart to the MI-24V we have.


Main Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X / ASRock Taichi X470 / 32GB Ram GSkill F4-2800C15Q-32GVR / Asus ROG Strix GeForce RTX 2080 OC

WSO Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 5 2600X / Asus Prime B450 Plus / 16GB Ram GSkill F4-2666C15Q-16GRR / KFA2 GeForce RTX 2060

Retro System: AMD Athlon X2 3000Mhz / ASRock AM2NF3-VSTA / 2GB Ram / Gigabyte GV-N68T256DH GeForce AGP 6800 GT 256MB DDR3 / Diamond Monster 3D II 12MB SLI
#4386543 - 10/24/17 04:01 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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Had not much time to work at the KA-50 the last days. Today I have made some rework of the surfaces at the 3D model to be better prepared for the texturing work.

The model itself isn't the problem, but the LOD-models are a lot of work I think. All has to align with the base model or the insignia and other things will jump to slightly different places if you zoom out.

A question to the more experienced modders here, is there an easy way or a trick to do the LOD-models, or must every model be done like the original (UV-mapping etc.)?

This week not much will happen, because RL catched me, but I hope that the next week I have a little more time to work on it.


Main Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X / ASRock Taichi X470 / 32GB Ram GSkill F4-2800C15Q-32GVR / Asus ROG Strix GeForce RTX 2080 OC

WSO Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 5 2600X / Asus Prime B450 Plus / 16GB Ram GSkill F4-2666C15Q-16GRR / KFA2 GeForce RTX 2060

Retro System: AMD Athlon X2 3000Mhz / ASRock AM2NF3-VSTA / 2GB Ram / Gigabyte GV-N68T256DH GeForce AGP 6800 GT 256MB DDR3 / Diamond Monster 3D II 12MB SLI
#4386545 - 10/24/17 04:19 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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From what I remember there are two plugins for automatic lod making.i never used.

#4386581 - 10/24/17 08:09 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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plugins are - qemLOSS and Simplify Mesh
when you completely finished with main model, you can generate copy of it with decreased amount of polygons. No UV changes required, if you have no UV problems that will appear after simplification.

#4386591 - 10/24/17 09:11 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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Thank's for your help!

The top texture is aligned, now I have to do both sides and the bottom.

I extra made left and right separate surfaces (KA-50 has a asymmetric fuselage), but after using the lwo2eeo convertion and back again with eeo2lwo both sides are put together to only one surface. I test this convertion sometimes before making new fixes, to see if it's still possible to convert and all is working like it should.

I once had done a lot of hard work and wanted to convert it but there was a 2-point polygon in the model and I wasn't able to find the surface which was mentioned by the converter. After 5 hours of trying to fix it I gave up and started from scratch again.

Must have been a supersmall surface somewhere inside the model, and there was no way to find it for me with my knowledge.

But with only one surface I have to manually separate the both sides again before I can make the UV-mapping for the textures banghead



Main Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X / ASRock Taichi X470 / 32GB Ram GSkill F4-2800C15Q-32GVR / Asus ROG Strix GeForce RTX 2080 OC

WSO Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 5 2600X / Asus Prime B450 Plus / 16GB Ram GSkill F4-2666C15Q-16GRR / KFA2 GeForce RTX 2060

Retro System: AMD Athlon X2 3000Mhz / ASRock AM2NF3-VSTA / 2GB Ram / Gigabyte GV-N68T256DH GeForce AGP 6800 GT 256MB DDR3 / Diamond Monster 3D II 12MB SLI
#4386598 - 10/24/17 09:37 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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What just came to my mind as I was writting: Does it even make sense to make two different textures for the left and the right side if the converter uses only one side-view texture, or is there a way to prevent this?

I wanted two split this one surface, which the converter created, in two parts (left and right) for the UV-mapping and align the left and the right to separate textures, but I don't know what happens then after back-convertion for the game.

Does not make sense to do this whole work if in the end only one side is used.

I wanted to make this , because the KA-50 has two different sides (the right one looks a bit different, cause of the intergrated machine gun).


State at the moment (not fully textured of course, no camo etc. / only the details at the top):


Attached Files Image1.jpgImage2.jpg
Last edited by Viper1970; 10/24/17 10:21 PM.

Main Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X / ASRock Taichi X470 / 32GB Ram GSkill F4-2800C15Q-32GVR / Asus ROG Strix GeForce RTX 2080 OC

WSO Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 5 2600X / Asus Prime B450 Plus / 16GB Ram GSkill F4-2666C15Q-16GRR / KFA2 GeForce RTX 2060

Retro System: AMD Athlon X2 3000Mhz / ASRock AM2NF3-VSTA / 2GB Ram / Gigabyte GV-N68T256DH GeForce AGP 6800 GT 256MB DDR3 / Diamond Monster 3D II 12MB SLI
#4386607 - 10/24/17 10:38 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Version ready now [Re: Viper1970]  
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to find 2 point polygon enable Polygon Mode and press W key - 2 vertices is what you need.

it shouldn't be a problem to have two different surfaces, even if they will use same UV map. Converter can combine two surfaces if they has same UV and texture, but maybe it's different case. But I would make single texture for both sides instead, and use same surface/texture for whole fuselage.

#4386612 - 10/24/17 11:10 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Reloaded [Re: Viper1970]  
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Thank's for your help Thealx! Without you I would be totally lost sometimes!

I think I will make it the way you descripted. There isn't so much difference between the left and the right side. The details at the right front are hidden by the 3D model of the gun and the cockpit side window is anyway changed by the separate model of the cockpit door on the left side.

I also think that it does not make sense to do so much work at this details. I still have to make the painting itself (black and two different camouflage) which then should be used as a second layer under the details, so a lot of graphic work for those textures have also to be made.

I also wanted to make the Havoc and the Alligator the same way and I wanted to make this work before the next 10 years, if possible hahaha

It's more work than I thought at first. In theory it was clearly simple but the practical experience is always bit different biggrin


Main Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X / ASRock Taichi X470 / 32GB Ram GSkill F4-2800C15Q-32GVR / Asus ROG Strix GeForce RTX 2080 OC

WSO Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 5 2600X / Asus Prime B450 Plus / 16GB Ram GSkill F4-2666C15Q-16GRR / KFA2 GeForce RTX 2060

Retro System: AMD Athlon X2 3000Mhz / ASRock AM2NF3-VSTA / 2GB Ram / Gigabyte GV-N68T256DH GeForce AGP 6800 GT 256MB DDR3 / Diamond Monster 3D II 12MB SLI
#4386613 - 10/24/17 11:15 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Reloaded [Re: Viper1970]  
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you use only 3dcrafter? no lightwave?

#4386615 - 10/24/17 11:34 PM Re: KA-50 AIO Reloaded [Re: Viper1970]  
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I use a combination of different programs. It's simpler for me to make it this way. I also use Blender for some things, because it was the program I restarted my first steps with 3D now.

Before this I have also made some first attempts to create models for the FS98 back those days using GMax, but those weren't very successful. They really looked more like flying potatoes hahaha

I'm still not able to make models from scratch and I think I will be never able to do so. All I can do is to make some adjustments to existing models, because that isn't so complex.


Main Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X / ASRock Taichi X470 / 32GB Ram GSkill F4-2800C15Q-32GVR / Asus ROG Strix GeForce RTX 2080 OC

WSO Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 5 2600X / Asus Prime B450 Plus / 16GB Ram GSkill F4-2666C15Q-16GRR / KFA2 GeForce RTX 2060

Retro System: AMD Athlon X2 3000Mhz / ASRock AM2NF3-VSTA / 2GB Ram / Gigabyte GV-N68T256DH GeForce AGP 6800 GT 256MB DDR3 / Diamond Monster 3D II 12MB SLI
#4386635 - 10/25/17 06:56 AM Re: KA-50 AIO Reloaded [Re: Viper1970]  
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Originally Posted by Viper1970
I also think that it does not make sense to do so much work at this details. I still have to make the painting itself (black and two different camouflage) which then should be used as a second layer under the details, so a lot of graphic work for those textures have also to be made.


Not sure we are on the same page. I am thinking about placing both parts (left and right) on the same texture, but on different parts of it so they will be not symmetric. You can do whatever you want with left and right parts, but still they are same surface. It can be more complicated with Ka-52 model, but you always can increase resolution of the texture and manage UVs to fit everything on it.

Attached Files mi24.jpg
#4386638 - 10/25/17 08:32 AM Re: KA-50 AIO Reloaded [Re: Viper1970]  
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Ah, now I understand.

What is the maximum resolution you should use? I mean in terms of the games engine and the performance.


Main Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X / ASRock Taichi X470 / 32GB Ram GSkill F4-2800C15Q-32GVR / Asus ROG Strix GeForce RTX 2080 OC

WSO Cockpit System: AMD Ryzen 5 2600X / Asus Prime B450 Plus / 16GB Ram GSkill F4-2666C15Q-16GRR / KFA2 GeForce RTX 2060

Retro System: AMD Athlon X2 3000Mhz / ASRock AM2NF3-VSTA / 2GB Ram / Gigabyte GV-N68T256DH GeForce AGP 6800 GT 256MB DDR3 / Diamond Monster 3D II 12MB SLI
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