#4378834 - 09/10/17 02:32 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: Bumfluff]
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Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 772
Johnny_Redd
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Member
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They've introduced a $15 GPS so you can navigate between the various installs easier.
Last edited by Johnny_Redd; 09/10/17 02:32 PM.
DCS Kickstarter Wags July 2014 "In this July 2014 update, the primary news is in regards to the restructured backer rewards. After a careful review of the older system under RRG, we found it financially unattainable." Wags October 2017 "the investment vs. generated revenue has been excellent for the World War II aircraft. In fact, the P-51D Mustang has twice the cost effectiveness of the A-10C Warthog."
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#4378848 - 09/10/17 04:34 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: Bumfluff]
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 723
jens198
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Member
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Nuremberg, Germany
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Bumfluff, you're missing all the fun here ...
Jens
"It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue."
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#4379100 - 09/12/17 08:35 AM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: Bumfluff]
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,130
EagleEye[GER]
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Germany
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It might not be so long until the merge arrives. Some caucasus comparisation shots from a person you do not like here , but: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=193214 I hope it also shows why keeping DCS profitable though new modules, DLC and 3rd Parties is so important. So that they can afford the ability to create things like this for free and keep them free. This might be a point to discuss, though we have yet to see another companie who is doing the sim-stuff ED is doing. `
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#4379139 - 09/12/17 01:09 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: Bumfluff]
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,082
- Ice
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These comparison shots for me really sink home the amount of effort going into a free map for DCS, that ED is committed to providing a awesome looking starting point for new players, and giving us older players a completely new experience from what we have all lived in for years now.
I hope it also shows why keeping DCS profitable though new modules, DLC and 3rd Parties is so important. So that they can afford the ability to create things like this for free and keep them free. 1. What were the exact specs of the PC on which this was run on? What were the framerates? Even SiTh doesn't seem to know. 2. The Black Sea is the Black Sea. Sure, there may be more trees and finer terrain elevation mesh, so the visual experience may be new... not sure about this "completely new experience" bit though. 3. So what if it's free? You can't do much on the map without buying the modules. It's like going to a restaurant and being thankful that the water is free.... 4. It's not really free either. We got that map when we bought LOMAC, then again for FC1/2/3, then again for BS1, then again for DCS A10C. They've just removed the map, paired it up with an Su-25, and offered it as a free demo. Assuming they'll continue to do the same once 2.5 is released, then it's not really free... it's part of the marketing strategy. It's like going to a car dealer and they throw in some stuff for free.... you know those things were built into the final payment for the car and are not really free. 5. Profitable? Dragging out a project over 3-4 years is not the fault of the customer and I doubt anyone can make a convincing claim that this is a "profitable" way of doing things. The one guy that dared speak up was immediately banned/suspended after posting.... looks like things haven't changed yet in the ED forums. Also note on that thread that nobody seems to be asking hard questions.... all praise be unto ED!!
- Ice
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#4379140 - 09/12/17 01:11 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: EagleEye[GER]]
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,082
- Ice
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]This might be a point to discuss, though we have yet to see another companie who is doing the sim-stuff ED is doing. So what if we are being ripped off, lied to, and treated like stupid? Nobody else is doing what they're doing so we should be thankful they're treating us like doormats!
- Ice
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#4379161 - 09/12/17 02:29 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: - Ice]
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,130
EagleEye[GER]
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1. What were the exact specs of the PC on which this was run on? What were the framerates? Even SiTh doesn't seem to know.
He wrote that map performance should be the same like NTTR and Normandy. So if NTTR runs good on your system new Caucasus should also run well. 2. The Black Sea is the Black Sea. Sure, there may be more trees and finer terrain elevation mesh, so the visual experience may be new... not sure about this "completely new experience" bit though. Trees are now obstacles, they also blocking line of sight for AI units. So yes, for some ppl it is new experience. Sure a new looking Caucasus map isn`t a substitute for a DC. 3. So what if it's free? You can't do much on the map without buying the modules. It's like going to a restaurant and being thankful that the water is free.... People where afraid of to have to pay for that map. So they make clear it comes without an extra charge. Sure, you buy that base with the modules. 4. It's not really free either. We got that map when we bought LOMAC, then again for FC1/2/3, then again for BS1, then again for DCS A10C. They've just removed the map, paired it up with an Su-25, and offered it as a free demo. Assuming they'll continue to do the same once 2.5 is released, then it's not really free... it's part of the marketing strategy. It's like going to a car dealer and they throw in some stuff for free.... you know those things were built into the final payment for the car and are not really free. Yes, DCS is the base for all their modules, so normaly they should cover the costs for developing the base with their modules. Again, the say free just to make sure all ppl know they will get it without being extra charged for it. 5. Profitable? Dragging out a project over 3-4 years is not the fault of the customer and I doubt anyone can make a convincing claim that this is a "profitable" way of doing things. Yeah, don´t know why it takes so long. It might be because the people (who bought A-10C) waited for NTTR so long, so they finished this map before. Then they had to bring out Normandy map, otherwise WWII would`t make much sense. The one guy that dared speak up was immediately banned/suspended after posting.... looks like things haven't changed yet in the ED forums. I absolutely disagree with how they handle the forums. I cannot understand why they shut off all the negativ postings.
Last edited by EagleEye[GER]; 09/12/17 02:30 PM.
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#4379167 - 09/12/17 02:45 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: - Ice]
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,130
EagleEye[GER]
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Germany
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]This might be a point to discuss, though we have yet to see another companie who is doing the sim-stuff ED is doing. So what if we are being ripped off, lied to, and treated like stupid? Nobody else is doing what they're doing so we should be thankful they're treating us like doormats! There isnt a company who is doing modern era combat aicraft with such flight dynamics, damage modelling, clickable cockpits and so on. I really would like to have some competition on this sector. There must be reason not doing the same sim content like ED is doing, though. I would think it is about the cost for such a development. I really would like to see a remake of EECH or Falcon. Why no one is doing that? I love to have aicraft modules which behave like the real world counterparts (in what is possible on personal computer, you know).
Last edited by EagleEye[GER]; 09/18/17 08:03 AM.
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#4379168 - 09/12/17 02:47 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: EagleEye[GER]]
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 4,804
ST0RM
Senior Member
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Posts: 4,804
Ten Mile, Tn
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I absolutely disagree with how they handle the forums. I cannot understand why they shut off all the negativ postings.
That guy (Sh*tSpawn) lurks on every forum that has anything to say about DCS and abuses his power. He'll get his one day. And Vincent was actually very civil and well spoken in his reply. Followed the rules. And was spot on. ED acts like Santa and is doing this work from the kindness of their heart. Pfft... Over at another forum, some kid was asking about the next sale so he could buy a new aircraft, because he didnt want to pay $60. No mention of wanting to buy NTTR or Normandy. Seems to be a trend.
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#4379174 - 09/12/17 03:08 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: EagleEye[GER]]
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,654
trindade
Mach2 Club
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Mach2 Club
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,654
Portugal
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I absolutely disagree with how they handle the forums. I cannot understand why they shut off all the negativ postings.
+ 1
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#4379200 - 09/12/17 03:52 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: - Ice]
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 2,477
HomeFries
Air Dominance Project
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Air Dominance Project
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 2,477
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[The one guy that dared speak up was immediately banned/suspended after posting.... looks like things haven't changed yet in the ED forums. Also note on that thread that nobody seems to be asking hard questions.... all praise be unto ED!! I won't defend ED's forum management, but in all fairness this wasn't this post that got him banned. There is another deleted post on the next page and the forum rules violated are cited in the deletion. We still don't know how ticky-tack the ban is, but it wasn't the quoted post that did it.
Last edited by HomeFries; 09/12/17 03:53 PM.
-Home Fries
"Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty." - Robert A. Heinlein
The average naval aviator, despite the sometimes swaggering exterior, is very much capable of such feelings as love, affection, intimacy, and caring. These feelings just don't involve anyone else.
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#4379206 - 09/12/17 03:59 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: Bumfluff]
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Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 337
Art_J
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Oh yes, the most amusing Sith's reply in that thread was the one about Normandy being "on par" with NTTR perfromance-wise (except for known units-related bug), when both ot these maps, even with player being the only unit, are so blatantly far away from each other in this aspect it's not even funny. That's on everyone's computer... except his apparently . Oh well, some dark sith power magic here I guess! The question whether the updated map will be closer to NTTR or Normany (clearly not both at the same time) remains very much valid then. That being said, positive feedback about gfx quality is justified I'd say. The Caucasus map just released for Il-2 BoK raised the bar A LOT, both quality and fps-wise. Suddenly the old, DCS rendition of the same area looks to be in a dire need of a in-depth make-up and the visual side (at least) looks promising on all the WIP shots. So it must, being a free "demo" for newcomers thinking about trying out DCS for the first time.
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#4379213 - 09/12/17 04:16 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: EagleEye[GER]]
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,082
- Ice
Veteran
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He wrote that map performance should be the same like NTTR and Normandy. So if NTTR runs good on your system new Caucasus should also run well. That wasn't what I was asking though. One guy even wrote "Which of those 2? The frame-rates I get in NTTR are pretty much the same compared to current Caucasus, whereas the frame-rate in Normandy is less than half of that."Trees are now obstacles, they also blocking line of sight for AI units. So yes, for some ppl it is new experience. Sure a new looking Caucasus map isn`t a substitute for a DC. So it's not really a "completely new experience" but more like "an experience you'd expect from RL tactics and common sense"..... something like "it should've been this way in the first place."People where afraid of to have to pay for that map. So they make clear it comes without an extra charge. Sure, you buy that base with the modules. I think they may be afraid that asking people to pay for the new map will be like asking people to pay for Black Shark 2... if this is true, then at least ED learned ONE lesson! Yes, DCS is the base for all their modules, so normaly they should cover the costs for developing the base with their modules. Again, the say free just to make sure all ppl know they will get it without being extra charged for it. Fair enough. If so, then people should stop saying "free" like it was worth something but then ED was kind and generous and thus offered it for free. If it's just to distinguish Black Sea 2.5 as "free" compared to Nevada, SoH, and all other "pay" maps, then people should stop using it like it's proof of ED's generosity and we should all be thankful. Yeah, don´t know why it takes so long. It might be because the people (who bought A-10C) waited for NTTR so long, so they finished this map before. Then they had to bring out Normandy map, otherwise WWII would`t make much sense. It took so long because of feature creep, no prioritization, no road map. Then SiTh makes it sound like we should buy modules so that ED stays profitable enough to be in business? Nope! If ED's bad decisions and project delays means they have to close up shop, then it'll be a sad day for the simming community but the fault lies squarely on the shoulders of those in management of ED. It's not the customer's responsibility to keep a company afloat, it's the company's responsibility to offer a good product at a good price at a good timeframe to keep itself afloat. I absolutely disagree with how they handle the forums. I cannot understand why they shut off all the negativ postings. Because of snowflakes and abuse of power. There isnt a company who is doing modern era combat aicraft with such flight dynamics, damage modelling, clickable cockpits and so on. I really would like to have some competition on this sector. There must be reason not doing the same sim content like ED is doing, though. I'm sure some would see this coming from a mile away, but BMS. It doesn't do multiple aircraft like DCS, but for flight dynamics, damage modelling, clickable cockpits, dynamic campaign, and sense of immersion, well, I'd like you to try it to make your own mind about it and compare it to DCS. The Falcon Collection is currently £7.89 on GoG. BMS is free. You get three dynamic campaigns included. There are at least 2 other stable theatres available to download, Balkans and Israel, and other theatres that are in various stages of WIP. Did I mention £7.89? That's about half-a-Garmin! There is a reason some people say DCS is an airframe simulator and not a combat flight simulator. I would think it is about the cost for such a development. I really would like to see a remake of EECH or Falcon. Why no one is doing that? Probably low ROI? People have argued that it's only ED's military connections and funding that allowed it to stay afloat. I do not like how much time they need to finish things at ED, and the sometime weird decissions or modules (NS 430) which suddenly appear of nowhere. On this we see eye-to-eye.
- Ice
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#4379216 - 09/12/17 04:25 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: Art_J]
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,082
- Ice
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,082
Philippines / North East UK
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And Vincent was actually very civil and well spoken in his reply. Followed the rules. And was spot on. ED acts like Santa and is doing this work from the kindness of their heart. Pfft... Over at another forum, some kid was asking about the next sale so he could buy a new aircraft, because he didnt want to pay $60. No mention of wanting to buy NTTR or Normandy. Seems to be a trend. If not this Friday, then next Friday, there should be another sale! I won't defend ED's forum management, but in all fairness this wasn't this post that got him banned. There is another deleted post on the next page and the forum rules violated are cited in the deletion. We still don't know how ticky-tack the ban is, but it wasn't the quoted post that did it. Where? How do you know there's a deleted post? Oh yes, the most amusing Sith's reply in that thread was the one about Normandy being "on par" with NTTR perfromance-wise (except for known units-related bug), when both ot these maps, even with player being the only unit, are so blatantly far away from each other in this aspect it's not even funny. That's on everyone's computer... except his apparently . Oh well, some dark sith power magic here I guess! The question whether the updated map will be closer to NTTR or Normany (clearly not both at the same time) remains very much valid then. Answering the question without really answering the question... such great skill!
- Ice
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#4379231 - 09/12/17 05:25 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: - Ice]
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 46
Mokkeri
Junior Member
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Junior Member
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I'm sure some would see this coming from a mile away, but BMS. It doesn't do multiple aircraft like DCS, but for flight dynamics, damage modelling, clickable cockpits, dynamic campaign, and sense of immersion, well, I'd like you to try it to make your own mind about it and compare it to DCS.
The Falcon Collection is currently £7.89 on GoG. BMS is free. You get three dynamic campaigns included. There are at least 2 other stable theatres available to download, Balkans and Israel, and other theatres that are in various stages of WIP. Did I mention £7.89? That's about half-a-Garmin!
There is a reason some people say DCS is an airframe simulator and not a combat flight simulator.
Yes, Falcon 4.0 is good example how to make business.
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#4379238 - 09/12/17 06:03 PM
Re: My annual check in. Are we there yet?
[Re: Mokkeri]
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,082
- Ice
Veteran
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Veteran
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Posts: 16,082
Philippines / North East UK
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Yes, Falcon 4.0 is good example how to make business. And your statement is a good example of dishonesty. Or is it ignorance? Because this "Falcon 4.0 killed MicroProse" bit has been discussed and disproven many times now. But even so, I'll bite --- are you a flight sim enthusiast? A customer? Or are you a businessman looking for ways into the flight sim market? Even if you were a businessman, is ED's way the way to "make business"? Another way of putting it: Are you looking for a good simulation with good flight dynamics, damage modelling, clickable cockpits, dynamic campaign, and sense of immersion? Or are you looking to keep paying game dev's salaries?
- Ice
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Exodus
by RedOneAlpha. 04/18/24 05:46 PM
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