I think all Pots are basically voltage dividers , so I think they will all be "linear" will they not ? I guess I am not quite sure what you are trying to do with them if not using them for Axis Control , perhaps you need Rotary Switches and can then assign a particular % to each switch position in game for example? I hope to do this in CAP2 with the Nozzle Angles which is why I am messing with Rotary switches . (above)
KB
Kbird, not all pots are linear, may be logaritmic too. But for our sim purpouses we need linear.
Last edited by erichos; 04/21/1704:53 PM.
#4352613 - 04/21/1704:40 PMRe: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller
[Re: Sokol1]
Other thing to consider is if the game allow use axis for given control (e.g the CAP2 nozzles), for example IL-2:BoS don't allow use axis for trim tab purpose.
#4352615 - 04/21/1704:42 PMRe: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller
[Re: erichos]
[/quote] I think all Pots are basically voltage dividers , so I think they will all be "linear" will they not ? I guess I am not quite sure what you are trying to do with them if not using them for Axis Control , perhaps you need Rotary Switches and can then assign a particular % to each switch position in game for example? I hope to do this in CAP2 with the Nozzle Angles which is why I am messing with Rotary switches . (above)
KB
Kbird, not all pots are linear, may be logaritmic too. But for our sim purpouses we need linear. [/quote]
In regards to "linear" I think he is talking about how they show in Sim or VKB JoyTester (vs the type of Pot) in that they show as a steady curve as you move or turn them ...
but Barra will need to clarify or add pics etc so You or Others can help him more.
KB
*** website is slow today I see Sokol has added some info above me while I posted this....and now below too...
But do I have wrong type of pots for using with Surface Trims, as these are linear!!
As in Sliding Pots ? like used in the CH Throttles? not a Rotary Pot ? there is a Slider Setting for Axis's for using with those type of throttles/axis but I think you can only use the setting once?
They are rotary and in sim seem to produce a linear effect - just like throttle
A bit confuse...
For trim purpose you should use a linear response pot - that can be rotary or sliding type, like in any other joystick axis. *
What is advisable use for trim is multi-turn - ideally 3 turn type pot, for allow fine adjust of trim. This kind of pot use gears to reduce the knob rotation over pot axis, allowing the desired precision.
* BTW - CH Throttle is "sliding" throttle, but use rotary pot instead a linear (motion) potentiometer their movement suggest.
But do I have wrong type of pots for using with Surface Trims, as these are linear!!
As in Sliding Pots ? like used in the CH Throttles? not a Rotary Pot ? there is a Slider Setting for Axis's for using with those type of throttles/axis but I think you can only use the setting once?
They are rotary and in sim seem to produce a linear effect - just like throttle
A bit confuse...
For trim purpose you should use a linear response pot - that can be rotary or sliding type, like in any other joystick axis. *
What is advisable use for trim is multi-turn - ideally 3 turn type pot, for allow fine adjust of trim. This kind of pot use gears to reduce the knob rotation over pot axis, allowing the desired precision.
* BTW - CH Throttle is "sliding" throttle, but use rotary pot instead a linear (motion) potentiometer their movement suggest.
Thanks for the Clarification Sokol ...I thought I had seen a custom built Throttle using the electronics from a CH Pro Throttle that used a Sliding or Linear Pot like this Sparkfun one:
...I thought I had seen a custom built Throttle using the electronics from a CH Pro Throttle that used a Sliding or Linear Pot like this Sparkfun one: https://www.sparkfun.com/products/9119
Yes, this is a "sliding" pot, B Taper (datasheet), but a rotary pot B Taper (like the one inside CH Throttle) will give the same linear electric response.
#4352689 - 04/21/1711:07 PMRe: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller
[Re: Sokol1]
But do I have wrong type of pots for using with Surface Trims, as these are linear!!
As in Sliding Pots ? like used in the CH Throttles? not a Rotary Pot ? there is a Slider Setting for Axis's for using with those type of throttles/axis but I think you can only use the setting once?
They are rotary and in sim seem to produce a linear effect - just like throttle
A bit confuse...
For trim purpose you should use a linear response pot - that can be rotary or sliding type, like in any other joystick axis. *
What is advisable use for trim is multi-turn - ideally 3 turn type pot, for allow fine adjust of trim. This kind of pot use gears to reduce the knob rotation over pot axis, allowing the desired precision.
* BTW - CH Throttle is "sliding" throttle, but use rotary pot instead a linear (motion) potentiometer their movement suggest.
Pots are 270degree linear 10k (purchased very early when I knew a lot less) and was seeing a nice wave in tester. Intention was to use for Rudder, Elevator and Aileron Trim Tabs. When I tried a test in Cliffs of Dover I could not see any movement in tabs and wheel in cockpit is not animated so I thought maybe not the right type.
Anyway I tested last night in DCS Spitfire and they work ok - how they do in a fly session we will see!
The tabs do seem to be very slow in their reaction to the timing of the turning of the pot shaft - would that be normal?
#4352694 - 04/21/1711:45 PMRe: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller
[Re: Sokol1]
So all that is 36 buttons which I know is 4 more that windows recognises and to use in sim I will need a key mapper if I continue down that track. All are working as they turn red in MMjoy software.
For MMjoySetup or VKB Button Tester or games like DCS, IL-2:BoS the button limit is not 32, is up to 128 (64 in BoS).
Windows Game Controllers (old) DImput is that "see" only 32 button - in fact see 32+4 (POV HAT 4 buttons, since (4) diagonals on POV HAT don't use physical buttons).
Can use HAT position for wire ordinary 4 buttons (and even for 8 with diodes between two buttons for add the extra button for (4) diagonals) resulting in 36 buttons for old games (obvious if don't use POV HAT).
Sokol I took your hint and placed some buttons that were spare onto the Hat positions and they work as a POV. Maybe I can change POV allocation in game.
However,I still seem to have issue with buttons past the 32 number.
In MMJoy software the 2 Encoder push buttons were buttons 3 and 5 which I re-designated as buttons 41 and 42 so that I could get the other more important toggle switches into the 1st 32 buttons. Also a couple of mom switches are 35 and 36. None of these show as presses when testing in VKB Button Tester. Is that the way it happens?
When I tried button allocation in Cliffs of Dover nothing above button 32 was recognised.
I then tried DCS (Spitfire) and I could see button 3 and 5 in list and pressing the Encoder buttons do not automatically allocate button 3 or 5. So I tried setting buttons 3 and 5 as a press for an action via selecting from list. They were saved ok in controls but they did not work (I tried to set Magnetos - which is modelled so I can see them move or not) in aircraft.
What am I missing?
#4352731 - 04/22/1703:51 AMRe: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller
[Re: Sokol1]
Buttons with special characteristics, including encoder need be in the first 32 (that Windows Dinput limit).
Above 32 you can use normal buttons and are not able to set mode, shift timer... so can't use encoder in this positions.
Use of buttons above 32 depends on games support, DCS allow up to 128, IL-2:BoS up to 64, but IL-2:46 and CloD is limited to 32, so for use this buttons is need keyboard emulator, e.g. SVMapper, Joy2Key, Xpadder... to send keypress for this games.
Quote
Pots are 270degree linear 10k (purchased very early when I knew a lot less) and was seeing a nice wave in tester. Intention was to use for Rudder, Elevator and Aileron Trim Tabs. When I tried a test in Cliffs of Dover I could not see any movement in tabs and wheel in cockpit is not animated so I thought maybe not the right type.
Anyway I tested last night in DCS Spitfire and they work ok - how they do in a fly session we will see!
The tabs do seem to be very slow in their reaction to the timing of the turning of the pot shaft - would that be normal?
In what plane you test in CloD and for what trim function? In this game not not all planes have the trim wheels in cockpit animated (as "bug" is their codename ) and trims are specific for each plane, some has only in elevator, other in elevator, rudder and some bombers include ailerons and G.50 hve more trim than you should have - It's CLoD!.
In DCS Spitfire, elevator trim is very slow, rudder is more fast (a bit too fast).
#4352740 - 04/22/1704:47 AMRe: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller
[Re: Sokol1]
All Buttons should show in MMJoy or VKB (assuming you have VKB set for 128 buttons not 32 ? see button)
above 32 will depend on the game ...mostly depends on how old it is... but Windows Game Controller (joy.cpl) will only see 32 as well.
You mean the (2) Encoders Push Buttons correct not it's Rotary assigned buttons .....so the Push buttons should show in VKB and MMjoy , the Encoder assigned buttons need to be in the 1st 32 as you need the Timer and encoder Mode for those to work.
*** In the PIC you have 35 and 36 assigned to the HAT under HW Buttons , not to one of the 1st 32 buttons.... also in the Pic you have designated MMJoy button 41 and 42 as button 3 and 5 , isn't that backwards from what you stated above?
Under H/W Button you need to assign the physical button seen in the MMJoy Panel to the Joystick button (LH most column) you want it to be...
Buttons with special characteristics, including encoder need be in the first 32 (that Windows Dinput limit).
Above 32 you can use normal buttons and are not able to set mode, shift timer... so can't use encoder in this positions.
Use of buttons above 32 depends on games support, DCS allow up to 128, IL-2:BoS up to 64, but IL-2:46 and CloD is limited to 32, so for use this buttons is need keyboard emulator, e.g. SVMapper, Joy2Key, Xpadder... to send keypress for this games.
In what plane you test in CloD and for what trim function?
OK Understand the 32 limit and I suspected as much with CLOD. I will adjust Encoder buttons as I thought they were treated as normal buttons - wrong again:) I tested trims in Spit in CLOD. Just finished another test in CLOD and while the pots I got may be not best they sure are better than button movement.
I did notice a sudden skip to one side so maybe there is still some jitters in them at times?
@Kbird
Originally Posted by Kbird
All Buttons should show in MMJoy or VKB (assuming you have VKB set for 128 buttons not 32 ? see button)
You mean the (2) Encoders Push Buttons correct not it's Rotary assigned buttons .....so the Push buttons should show in VKB and MMjoy , the Encoder assigned buttons need to be in the 1st 32 as you need the Timer and encoder Mode for those to work.
*** In the PIC you have 35 and 36 assigned to the HAT under HW Buttons , not to one of the 1st 32 buttons.... also in the Pic you have designated MMJoy button 41 and 42 as button 3 and 5 , isn't that backwards from what you stated above?
Under H/W Button you need to assign the physical button seen in the MMJoy Panel to the Joystick button (LH most column) you want it to be...
Did not understand the significance of 32/128 in VKB Button Test. Now I do! 35 and 36 were spare so not worried but so may put them back above 32 - I will think about that I have set 3/5 back to correct numbers. I was hopeing to not use the push buttons and/or keep them above the 32 number. That does not work so a bit more to work through.
Anyhow all work which I am well please with -rapt in fact -thanks to all your help.
Last edited by Barra; 04/22/1709:10 AM.
#4352787 - 04/22/1702:51 PMRe: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller
[Re: Sokol1]
Hi~guys!Need some help here! I have modified the cougar HOTAS with TLE5010 ,and it works fine until i meet this odd problem:when i plug in the throttle,the TLE5010 value row show "0" and processed number show "16383" and the software does not respond my throttle movement, other pots and buttons works fine. i use the 20150727 version mmjoy2,i heard a rumor: this software has a self-protection to prevent any commercial use, is that true ？now how to fix that?！thx a lot!
#4352802 - 04/22/1704:42 PMRe: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller
[Re: Sokol1]
@ Barra ..curious what the issue with the encoder Push buttons is ? they should act like any normal button eg a tac switch , at least that was my thinking / understanding.
set the filtering to 12 or 14 and see if you still get the Trim Pots spiking , it sounds like you have one that is bad , sometimes you can open the pot and clean it and it will work better , lots of info online how to do that , like this old post at Cougar World, the FLCS pots are very easy to open actually , not sure about what you have...
Hi~guys!Need some help here! I have modified the cougar HOTAS with TLE5010 ,and it works fine until i meet this odd problem:when i plug in the throttle,the TLE5010 value row show "0" and processed number show "16383" and the software does not respond my throttle movement, other pots and buttons works fine. i use the 20150727 version mmjoy2,i heard a rumor: this software has a self-protection to prevent any commercial use, is that true ？now how to fix that?！thx a lot!
@ Barra ..curious what the issue with the encoder Push buttons is ? they should act like any normal button eg a tac switch , at least that was my thinking / understanding.
KB
When I worked out what buttons I wanted I really din't need the encoder buttons and decided to just not wire them into the matrix. However could not seem to get encoders working unless I actually wired buttons as well.
It's all good. I just missed being able to use 1 On-None_On toggle switch that I had originally planned. I may look into a key mapper to handle that and 2 other mom switches that I added just because I had the space for them.
#4352865 - 04/22/1711:31 PMRe: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller
[Re: Sokol1]
Use of buttons above 32 depends on games support, DCS allow up to 128, IL-2:BoS up to 64, but IL-2:46 and CloD is limited to 32, so for use this buttons is need keyboard emulator, e.g. SVMapper, Joy2Key, Xpadder... to send keypress for this games.
Sokol is there one particular key mapper you can recommend?
Currently I could use 1 to map a On-None-On toggle switch and 2 mom switches.
I have made button box with 2 On-None-On toggle switch to handle Flaps and Gear for On/Off. This will work for most aircraft but I know it will be a problem for the Hurri and 109 I think. I may need to revert to keyboard press for them or is there a way to handle it with the On-None-On toggles or the key mapper?
#4352867 - 04/22/1711:41 PMRe: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller
[Re: Sokol1]
I don't have a dedicated room so need to setup in living space. Hence need to reduce footprint! The box had to be used as support and be collapsible as well. The chair is a little heavier than I hoped - over engineered:)
-thanks to all your help.