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#4343790 - 03/12/17 12:38 AM Infuriating Mius Front Artillery  
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 445
VMIalpha454 Offline
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VMIalpha454  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2012
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Chattanooga, Tn
As much as I love these games I am approaching my wits end with the indirect fire weapons in this game. I had no problem using them in GTOS. I have recently undertaken the task of relearning how to do everything in the revamped Mius UI but no luck figuring this out. I am not sure if the German and Russian procedures for indirect fire are just a lot different than the American way, or what. The AI seems perfectly capable of annhilating my troops with whatever abundance of arty they have. I cant seem to get mine to fire unless some special unit has an unobstructed line of sight to the target. Doesnt seem to be a problem for the AI. Anyone have any insight into this particular problem?


"I have only two men out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold."
1stLt. Clifton B. Cates, USMC
in Belleau Wood, 19 July 1918
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#4343844 - 03/12/17 09:59 AM Re: Infuriating Mius Front Artillery [Re: VMIalpha454]  
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Floyd Offline
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Floyd  Offline
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#4343849 - 03/12/17 11:19 AM Re: Infuriating Mius Front Artillery [Re: Floyd]  
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Misty Offline
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Germany, near Freiburg
The commander (switch AI off) of the arty unit must see the enemy units. For the firing arty units the AI must be on. And there must be a comm line between the arty commander and his sub units, by wire or voice.

#4343893 - 03/12/17 05:45 PM Re: Infuriating Mius Front Artillery [Re: VMIalpha454]  
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VMIalpha454 Offline
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VMIalpha454  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 445
Chattanooga, Tn
Thanks, Floyd, for the link to that thread. No wonder I have found artillery in Mius infuriating! The developers have intentionally restricted the fire at ground function to the point that you are unable to use your indirect fire assets as they are used in real life. It also explained that in an update the developers gave the AI the ability to fire at likely enemy positions...something they have simultaneously restricted for us. That explains why the AI is always able to shell key points at will and also, I think, why they are able to do ridiculously accurate counter-battery fire.

The reason cited by developers for their restrictive action was that the fire at ground ability allowed the player to cheat, using the bird's eye view to their advantage. They're wrong. Although there are situations where it might be exploitable, they seem easy enough to remedy. The fact of the matter is that your indirect fire assets should be able to engage any ground within their maximum range, so long as it isnt precluded by their sight to crest or maximum elevation. All they would need are the proper map coordinates to fire on a given area. This whole business of using the battery commander to call for fire is completely ridiculous, as well. In the effort to fix a miniscule "problem" they have hamstrung one of the most important assets at the player's disposal. I really hope they relent and fix this problem. Its bad enough that it makes me not even want to play their game.


"I have only two men out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold."
1stLt. Clifton B. Cates, USMC
in Belleau Wood, 19 July 1918
#4344415 - 03/14/17 10:57 PM Re: Infuriating Mius Front Artillery [Re: VMIalpha454]  
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FlashBurn Offline
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FlashBurn  Offline
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Posts: 3,740
Washington State, USA
Are we talking about on or off screen arty?

I think you mean on screen arty. In mius front you need a battery commander to get eyes on the target. If this guy can see the target no issues blowing it up. Most of these sorts of units have 3 different squads that can spot for the battery. Leave one with guns and the other 2 to spot. If you need something wasted that no one has LOS too use off screen arty. That will be able to hit anywhere on the map. If the spotter has LOS it can call for fire rather quick. No LOS it might take like 10 minutes with crap accuracy, use the adjust fire command and it will eventually get on target.

While its not as easy as kill this spot with on screen arty and mortars like in GTOS, it is my no means mysterious to use well. Just use the fan fire tool or LOS checker to get to a spot where the spotter can see the area. ON this it can be vary far away and get a spot. No need to run out in front of your lines.


AS to AI murdering players with arty....

There are the 2 ways above and the AI can do those too. The 3rd is that ANY command unit in a units order of battle can do smaller calls for fire if linked by radio or land line to any unit with indirect weapons. Your guys can do this or the AI's. So there are in effect 3 ways things get calls for fire. If you set up where the enemy has LOS to your units OF course they will try and nuke you as you do them in this case. I now only set up defenses with obstructions of view to most of the map if infantry. Meaning the only way they can call for fire on my guys is pop over a rise to get LOS...if they live long enough. This works vary well in defensive situations. ON the attack it is critical to kill the enemies ON screen arty before you expose your infantry. Off screen well, hmmm its hard to know when you took out their spotters and just best to take things fast before they try and nuke you.

#4344542 - 03/15/17 01:58 PM Re: Infuriating Mius Front Artillery [Re: VMIalpha454]  
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VMIalpha454 Offline
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VMIalpha454  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 445
Chattanooga, Tn
I was referring to on screen artillery. I actually havent used off screen artillery in Mius yet, so I really cant comment on how it works. It worked fine for the most part in GTOS.

I was under the impression that only the battery commander could call for fire. Can the lesser commanders do it also? I thought they needed to be near the guns.

My problem with the way the developers have changed the artillery in this game is that it really makes it difficult to call for fire. If an enemy unit happens to be in the slightest defilade, you cannot call for fire. Sometimes it may be easy to post the battery commander up on some distant hill with unobstructed line of sight. What happens, though, when you dont have that terrain advantage? I'll tell you because I have experienced it. You end up with artillery that can only shoot at a handful of locations and a dead battery commander who, instead of seeing to the leadership of the artillery battery as in real life, is out trying to get line of sight to the enemy, perilously close to small arms fire. The truth of the matter is that your on map artillery should be able to shoot just about anywhere on the map, whether it is observed or unobserved fire. If you know the enemy is in an area, you should be able to saturate it. According to the developers, the player has godlike access to information because of the full battlefield view. For this reason, they reduced the ability of the artillery to fire at ground. I dont doubt that it may have been possible to exploit the previous system, but their solution is garbage. It is nothing like how artillery is really used. If they really want to know why people can cheat its because their fog of war is lifted by any friendly unit that spots the enemy. If they changed the criteria so that the fog of war only lifted when the battalion commander received the information, they could solve the problem and leave the artillery alone.

As far as the AI artillery is concerned, I cannot say what assets they are using to fire on me. I suspect it is off map, because I have only run across their artillery pieces a couple of times. What I have seen is that they saturate key points repeatedly with heavy artillery barrages. In my most recent battle I was struggling to get my mortars and artillery to fire at units that were only a short distance away. Finally, I was able to get them to begin firing. Immediately I received heavy and accurate counterbattery fire which silenced my guns. If they had spotters, they didnt have wire links, because they were moving. I dont know of another way they could have legitimately done that. Do you? The developers said that in a recent patch they changed the game to allow the AI to fire at suspected troop positions. I think that change has allowed them to exploit the system to an unfair advantage, just as the developers have made it more difficult for the player to use those same assets.


"I have only two men out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold."
1stLt. Clifton B. Cates, USMC
in Belleau Wood, 19 July 1918

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