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#4338344 - 02/17/17 04:25 PM Normandy Terrain *****  
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Quote:
When we started the DCS World War II series, we realized that one of the most important aspects of the series will be a great set of period maps to support the aircraft. Our first effort in this direction has been the Normandy 1944 map. Although originally scoped to just include the immediate area around the Normandy landing areas, the product has grown based on customer feedback and to create a great single player and multiplayer environment. This has taken the us in the following directions:

While not planned from the start, we have now added a portion of southern England, directly opposite of Normandy. This area includes the RAF airfields of Tangmere, Ford, Chailey, Funtington, and Needs Oar Point. While not at the detail level of Normandy, we believe these airfields will add valuable gameplay options.

Another map task we are working on is the inclusion of Le Havre city and port and providing all the cities and towns many types of every-day objects to make the urban areas look lived-in. This includes cars, carts, bicycles, tractors, laundry lines, etc. Along the Normandy coast, our team is also creating the "Atlantic Wall" with coastal batteries and pill boxes.

The team is also working realistic road and rail traffic that includes the option for period trains and auto-generated road traffic. In addition to the map, a very important aspect to create an immersive experience is to have the option to populate it with period air, land, and sea units. Many such units are being created now, and one of these new units includes the AI B-17G bomber. We are happy to share the first images of the B-17G in the game. Inclusion of the B-17G will provide more interesting gameplay options for the P-51D and Fw 190 D-9.

The Normandy 1944 map is rapidly coming together and we hope to have it in your hands soon.


I was reading today's newsletter and it all sounds so good. I guess for the newcomer to the ED scene, it's full of promise and bright hope. For those of us who've been here a while..... well, personally, I wish them the best and I'll be watching with interest from the sidelines. My message: Please don't fail on this one!

How long does it take to create a new theatre, really?


- Ice
Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#4338414 - 02/17/17 08:53 PM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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Yep. This map better have all kinds of awesome. I already see a couple of uk airfields missing, and that's without any research.

#4338417 - 02/17/17 09:00 PM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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The coast of the UK is not meant to be detailed, accurate or complete. It exists, mostly, for the sole purpose of providing places to launch missions from. The airfields that are present, in the UK, are not intended to be replicas of actual airfields as they existed in 1944 either.

Last edited by cichlidfan; 02/17/17 09:00 PM.

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#4338419 - 02/17/17 09:13 PM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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That's a sound decision, as DCS customers have proven themselves flexible and open to ignoring realism in favor of just getting something in there that will work for gameplay reasons.

There is no way whatsoever that there will be a large number who protest any deviation from historical accuracy at all.



The Jedi Master


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#4338436 - 02/17/17 10:11 PM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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Considering that the original plan did not include any part of the UK, in any form, this is better than what it could have been.


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#4338446 - 02/17/17 10:31 PM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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Seeing as it wasn't in the plan at all, we should be grateful if we get 20% or 50% of an airfield... really??

"Well, they did not intend to have this feature initially so be happy with whatever they give you."

Why make something sub-par? Because ED.


- Ice
#4338451 - 02/17/17 10:46 PM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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I'm sure the modding community picks up the slack from ED and comes with historical texturing. There are plenty of people with the knowledge to turn it into something realistic.

Having said that, wasn't Southern England always meant to be included in Normandy? Normandy is a really small area to fly in, even for the aircraft of that day.

The AI B-17 is what peaks my interest, Escort missions should be a lot of fun with the WWII and Korean War fighters cheers

Last edited by Vaderini; 02/17/17 10:47 PM.
#4338463 - 02/17/17 11:48 PM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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Originally Posted By: - Ice
Seeing as it wasn't in the plan at all, we should be grateful if we get 20% or 50% of an airfield... really??

"Well, they did not intend to have this feature initially so be happy with whatever they give you."


Amazing misquoting skill you have. Please source your quotes since I don't recall saying any of that. Besides, you won't be buying it (it's not a jet) so you aren't impacted at all.


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#4338467 - 02/18/17 12:23 AM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: cichlidfan]  
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Originally Posted By: cichlidfan
Amazing misquoting skill you have. Please source your quotes since I don't recall saying any of that.


These. It's not a direct quote or a misquote, but a paraphrasing of what you've said.
Originally Posted By: cichlidfan
The coast of the UK is not meant to be detailed, accurate or complete. It exists, mostly, for the sole purpose of providing places to launch missions from. The airfields that are present, in the UK, are not intended to be replicas of actual airfields as they existed in 1944 either.


Originally Posted By: cichlidfan
Considering that the original plan did not include any part of the UK, in any form, this is better than what it could have been.



Originally Posted By: cichlidfan
Besides, you won't be buying it (it's not a jet) so you aren't impacted at all.

Does one need to buy a product to express one's negative opinion of it? Moot question, in ED's case, fanboys think that even customers who have paid for a product isn't entitled to express a negative opinion.

Besides, I'm not even expressing a negative opinion.... in fact, well, read the first post.


- Ice
#4338472 - 02/18/17 01:06 AM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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I never said you were expressing a negative opinion, nor did I say, or imply, that the airfields would be incomplete. How you came up with '20% or 50% of an airfield' is beyond me. Unless, you work for Fox News in which case I understand.

Last edited by cichlidfan; 02/18/17 01:07 AM.

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#4338496 - 02/18/17 02:55 AM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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I wonder if Tigers and Shermans will be added to Combined Arms.

#4338498 - 02/18/17 03:18 AM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: Vaderini]  
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Originally Posted By: Vaderini

Having said that, wasn't Southern England always meant to be included in Normandy?


No, right from the start it was emphasised that it was France only. Particularly so. A special effort made to say so.

Nate

#4338518 - 02/18/17 05:41 AM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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It is going to be post Overlord and during Operation Cobra, right?

#4338532 - 02/18/17 09:57 AM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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Remember, the map was originally planned and designed by Luthier. He wanted to have a quick modern version of his old IL2 Normandy map to have DCS: WW2 1944 ready for release in autumn 2014.



A realistically sized channel and non detailed southern England is thousand times better than the fake island with airfield approach on the alternate Il2 map.

DCS Normandy should also be great for some cold war era campaigns featuring the Helicopters or the upcoming Harrier.

#4338538 - 02/18/17 11:29 AM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: Antoninus]  
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Originally Posted By: cichlidfan
I never said you were expressing a negative opinion

You didn't, but you did try to negate what I'm saying based on your assumption that I won't be buying it. Try reading the previous post again... I even quoted you to show what I was responding to.

Originally Posted By: cichlidfan
How you came up with '20% or 50% of an airfield' is beyond me. Unless, you work for Fox News in which case I understand.

How you can't understand what "paraphrasing" is is beyond me, but go ahead and start on the personal attacks early as you've obviously ran out of ideas by now.


Originally Posted By: Vaderini
Having said that, wasn't Southern England always meant to be included in Normandy? Normandy is a really small area to fly in, even for the aircraft of that day.

Originally Posted By: Nate
No, right from the start it was emphasised that it was France only. Particularly so. A special effort made to say so.

Originally Posted By: Antoninus
A realistically sized channel and non detailed southern England is thousand times better than the fake island with airfield approach on the alternate Il2 map.

Didn't aircraft back in the day have good range? Normandy-only map would be pretty "small" even for these fighters, right?


- Ice
#4338540 - 02/18/17 11:35 AM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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[/quote]
Didn't aircraft back in the day have good range? Normandy-only map would be pretty "small" even for these fighters, right? [/quote]

I think the BF109 at least was notoriously short legged .. I read somewhere once over england they had about 10-15 min combat time before having to return ... could be wrong ...


Dont think of it as being vastly outnumbered ... but just having a large target selection.

The only thing more accurate than incoming fire, is incoming friendly fire

Tracers work BOTH ways...

" I have a cunning plan my lord "
#4338549 - 02/18/17 12:14 PM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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I guess that depends where the "return" airbase was located. According to the Wikipedia page for the 109, it had a range of 528 miles or 621 miles with a droptank. Then here's a pic from Google Maps...



The range from outside one end to the other end is 198 miles, which the BF109 could easily do. The distance from Chailey to the furthest point south of Normandy is around 200 miles.


- Ice
#4338555 - 02/18/17 12:31 PM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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Paraphrasing means to say the SAME thing in different words. Since I never said anything about half built airfields, your statement does not qualify. I also never said anything to indicate that ED's thoughts about the matter, that part also does not qualify as paraphrasing.


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#4338556 - 02/18/17 12:40 PM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: cichlidfan]  
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Originally Posted By: cichlidfan
Paraphrasing means to say the SAME thing in different words. Since I never said anything about half built airfields, your statement does not qualify. I also never said anything to indicate that ED's thoughts about the matter, that part also does not qualify as paraphrasing.

Just can't let it go, can you? Did you really think I meant "half built airfields"?? What use is a runway that is 50% of it's intended length? Or 50% of it's intended width? And how are we going to model the hangars? Are we going to split them vertically or horizontally? Did you really, REALLY think that's what I meant by 20% or 50%?




If the first line bothers you so much, try the second line. It was in quotes for a reason.
Originally Posted By: - Ice
"Well, they did not intend to have this feature initially so be happy with whatever they give you."


- Ice
#4338560 - 02/18/17 01:15 PM Re: Normandy Terrain [Re: - Ice]  
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Originally Posted By: - Ice
Didn't aircraft back in the day have good range? Normandy-only map would be pretty "small" even for these fighters, right?


Yes, but flying day long missions in a P-51D to escort bombers from east Anglia to Berlin and back to empty all fuel tanks would be not mean much fun for me. And I don't want to estimate how many years it would take ED to develop a full western Europe map for DCS. Normandy will allow for some historical and realistic ground attack focused missions that can be flown in a limited amount of time without some kind of time skip feature. Not to mention that good tactical combat and ground support campaigns can be done in DCS now and we don't have to wait again until they manage to implement proper WW2 mass bomber raid tactics.

Last edited by Antoninus; 02/18/17 01:15 PM.
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