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#4331024 - 01/24/17 04:37 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller ***** [Re: Sokol1]  
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erichos - stick build looks fantastic!

The TLE5010 sensors from AliExpress arrived for me last night. Turnaround time on the order was only 15 days. What arrived is a little different from the images that Sokol put up. Most interesting, the magnets are disks with proper poles 4mm in diameter.

The boards are hand soldered and have fibers on them from flux cleanup.




I would urge you to inspect your boards prior to firing them up. As I was looking at each one... found this lovely bridge. Easy fix, but don't know what it would do with 'lectricity on it.



All in all, I'm satisfied with the boards. They're populated and assembled for less than I can source boards and parts myself.

Last edited by SolderMonkey; 01/24/17 05:25 PM. Reason: Found bridge during inspection
Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#4331032 - 01/24/17 05:01 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Sokol1]  
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Interesting, this looks based in early TLE501x PCB scheme with more resistors. Good "kit".



#4331137 - 01/24/17 09:49 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: SolderMonkey]  
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Hi SolderMonkey!

Can you share the link from where you purchase it (TLE 5010 PCB)?

#4331142 - 01/24/17 10:30 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Sokol1]  
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#4331222 - 01/25/17 04:55 AM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: erichos]  
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Originally Posted By: erichos
Originally Posted By: Kbird
Nice Work Erichos... thumbsup

that proves a button matrix is programmable unless it is all Shift registers???, I just can't figure it out in MMJoy2-2016-11-01 (see above thx.)

KB


Only 2xCol and 1xRow I used for switch with LED indication (for GEAR) and another one switch. All others are connected to Shift registers. But I do not know what is problem with button matrix? I used it in my previous project w/o problem. I usually use matrix button 6x6 so it is enough for 32 buttons and HAT. I do not understand why do you set rows B3 then 8xNothing and B1???? Same problem in COL between D6 and E6. I allways set it in a row w/o gaps. Then do not forget to set buttons numbers at the table on the right side and "Save sets to device". Must work. This picture may help you:



I recommend you use last stable version of MMJoy2 so version [20160818upd1] that is w/o BUGs but button matrix must work at any version.

Due to your picture you can use 11 free pins so max you can make matrix of 5x6=30 buttons. You made only 2x9=18 buttons and I think problem is bad setings of SW MMJoy2. If you want post here picture or scheme of your connections and then I make you settings and post here picture of MMJoy2 software settings. OK?



Hi Erichos , thanks for posting , so you think I should use version [20160818upd1] not version [20161101]?

I think I have it worked out now , I had a single 1x8 matrix and a single switch above, and could not work out how to program the rest but I finally figured out I was thinking about the Matrix incorrectly (electronics Noob) and I had the wiring scheme wrong, so looking at some of Mega_Mozg's Images of his setup for a 6x6 matrix in MMjoy2 and one from someone else on wiring a F22+TQS to a Bodnar Board , I knew it was how I had it wired/linked to the Arduino not MMJoy2 ie. it was a wiring issue.

I did a scheme of my own and it seems to work now but I am not 100% sure it is "correct" .... it is posted here in my FLCS+TQS Conversion Thread if you have time to look...(link in blue)

My TQS Wiring Scheme
http://SimHQ.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4331213/Re:_F16-FLCS_+_TQS_(Original)_#Post4331213


KB.


My FLCS+TQS Conversion here on SimHQ

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4324940/1
#4331232 - 01/25/17 07:48 AM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: SolderMonkey]  
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Originally Posted By: SolderMonkey
erichos - stick build looks fantastic!

The TLE5010 sensors from AliExpress arrived for me last night. Turnaround time on the order was only 15 days. What arrived is a little different from the images that Sokol put up. Most interesting, the magnets are disks with proper poles 4mm in diameter.

The boards are hand soldered and have fibers on them from flux cleanup.

I would urge you to inspect your boards prior to firing them up. As I was looking at each one... found this lovely bridge. Easy fix, but don't know what it would do with 'lectricity on it.


All in all, I'm satisfied with the boards. They're populated and assembled for less than I can source boards and parts myself.



Mine have shipped too , what did you use to inspect them out of interest cos I guess I will need to now too .

Is this the bridge ? (red circle)




KB


My FLCS+TQS Conversion here on SimHQ

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4324940/1
#4331236 - 01/25/17 08:42 AM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Sokol1]  
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Hello

Of my two TLE5010 that I ordered by aliexpress, one of them was fine, but the second one when it caught him the sensor fell for being little welded. Luckily in my work there is a department with welders, flux and professional loupes and I could re-weld it.

Seeing the photos, I think mine were better soldiers but of course, having little tin soldering loose



Last edited by Sak75; 01/25/17 08:47 AM.
#4331273 - 01/25/17 12:30 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Kb1rd1]  
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Originally Posted By: Kbird

Is this the bridge ? (red circle)



This solder between pins 3 and 4 is OK, both are Ground.

Looks that are a unwanted "bridge" is between 2 an 3... +5V and Gnd.

#4331281 - 01/25/17 01:07 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Sak75]  
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AIRWOLFMUTLEY Offline
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Originally Posted By: Sak75
Hello

Of my two TLE5010 that I ordered by aliexpress, one of them was fine, but the second one when it caught him the sensor fell for being little welded. Luckily in my work there is a department with welders, flux and professional loupes and I could re-weld it.

Seeing the photos, I think mine were better soldiers but of course, having little tin soldering loose




Same happens with me (bad soldering). Mine boards are different of which SolderMonkey receive, and doesn't come with magnets. And, the separated holes make difficult to allign the sensor with de magnets.

#4331332 - 01/25/17 03:22 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: AIRWOLFMUTLEY]  
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yes the separated holes are a problem!!!

#4331393 - 01/25/17 06:14 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Sokol1]  
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Damn.....sounds like the level of Orders they received has meant lowered quality and a change in PCB ....mine has not arrived , stuck in Customs no doubt.

Could the holes be turned into "slots" without damaging the PCB ?


KB.


My FLCS+TQS Conversion here on SimHQ

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4324940/1
#4331400 - 01/25/17 06:38 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Sokol1]  
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Dremel™ smile

#4331422 - 01/25/17 07:38 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Kb1rd1]  
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AIRWOLFMUTLEY Offline
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Originally Posted By: Kbird

mine has not arrived , stuck in Customs no doubt.

Could the holes be turned into "slots" without damaging the PCB ?

KB.




I thought that only the brazilian IRS (receita federal) was a black hole.


I'm planning to use a normal drill. Very carefully...

#4331425 - 01/25/17 07:55 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Kb1rd1]  
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erichos Offline
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Originally Posted By: Kbird


Hi Erichos , thanks for posting , so you think I should use version [20160818upd1] not version [20161101]?

I think I have it worked out now , I had a single 1x8 matrix and a single switch above, and could not work out how to program the rest but I finally figured out I was thinking about the Matrix incorrectly (electronics Noob) and I had the wiring scheme wrong, so looking at some of Mega_Mozg's Images of his setup for a 6x6 matrix in MMjoy2 and one from someone else on wiring a F22+TQS to a Bodnar Board , I knew it was how I had it wired/linked to the Arduino not MMJoy2 ie. it was a wiring issue.

I did a scheme of my own and it seems to work now but I am not 100% sure it is "correct" .... it is posted here in my FLCS+TQS Conversion Thread if you have time to look...(link in blue)

My TQS Wiring Scheme
http://SimHQ.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4331213/Re:_F16-FLCS_+_TQS_(Original)_#Post4331213


KB.


Hi Kbird, I only recommend you use version [20160818upd1] but as I said button matrix must work at any version.

I looked at your scheme, sorry but it is not very transparent :-) so I redrew it without changes and I hope it is clearer now, maybe :-)
Here is your scheme:


Important thing is to set MMJoy2 correctly:


So connect your Arduino and click "Load sets from device". Then we start setting.
Step 1: set which pins you use for ROWS and COLUMNS
Step 2: click "Save sets to device" from now if you push any button you have to see red square with number 01-132 on the left side of MMJoy2 window (there is 01 in my picture because I pushed button connected between ROW1 and COL1 and press "PrintScreen" on keyboard)
Step 3: now you can set which H/W.Button will be displayed as button in Windows. Doesn`t matter if H/W.Button 01 will be Joystick button 05 or 25... It is up to you. But OS Windows knows only 32 buttons and 1 HAT so SUM=36 buttons.
Step 2: again send your settings to Arduino

Now you click on the left-down "Windows Joystics" and then "Properties" and must see this:


If you push the button 01 you have to see red square with number 01 on the left side of MMJoy2 window and red circle button 01 in joystick properties window.

That`s all :-) I hope you do it now.

Last edited by erichos; 01/25/17 08:29 PM.
#4331436 - 01/25/17 08:42 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Sokol1]  
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Erichos diodes missing...

#4331448 - 01/25/17 09:55 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Sokol1]  
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erichos Offline
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No Forsaken_joystick, diodes are not missing. Diodes are required if there will be 3 or more contacts activated simultaneously. I always use them but it works w/o them correctly if you have only push buttons w/o switches. You can test it. The original Kbird`s scheme was w/o diodes so I only redrew it. I know that secure solution is like this:



Some info about "ghosting" and about solution:
How a Key Matrix Work

Last edited by erichos; 01/25/17 10:09 PM.
#4331505 - 01/26/17 12:00 AM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: erichos]  
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Originally Posted By: erichos
Originally Posted By: Kbird


Hi Erichos , thanks for posting , so you think I should use version [20160818upd1] not version [20161101]?

I think I have it worked out now , I had a single 1x8 matrix and a single switch above, and could not work out how to program the rest but I finally figured out I was thinking about the Matrix incorrectly (electronics Noob) and I had the wiring scheme wrong, so looking at some of Mega_Mozg's Images of his setup for a 6x6 matrix in MMjoy2 and one from someone else on wiring a F22+TQS to a Bodnar Board , I knew it was how I had it wired/linked to the Arduino not MMJoy2 ie. it was a wiring issue.

I did a scheme of my own and it seems to work now but I am not 100% sure it is "correct" .... it is posted here in my FLCS+TQS Conversion Thread if you have time to look...(link in blue)

My TQS Wiring Scheme
http://SimHQ.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4331213/Re:_F16-FLCS_+_TQS_(Original)_#Post4331213


KB.


Hi Kbird, I only recommend you use version [20160818upd1] but as I said button matrix must work at any version.

I looked at your scheme, sorry but it is not very transparent :-) so I redrew it without changes and I hope it is clearer now, maybe :-)
Here is your scheme:


Important thing is to set MMJoy2 correctly:


So connect your Arduino and click "Load sets from device". Then we start setting.
Step 1: set which pins you use for ROWS and COLUMNS
Step 2: click "Save sets to device" from now if you push any button you have to see red square with number 01-132 on the left side of MMJoy2 window (there is 01 in my picture because I pushed button connected between ROW1 and COL1 and press "PrintScreen" on keyboard)
Step 3: now you can set which H/W.Button will be displayed as button in Windows. Doesn`t matter if H/W.Button 01 will be Joystick button 05 or 25... It is up to you. But OS Windows knows only 32 buttons and 1 HAT so SUM=36 buttons.
Step 2: again send your settings to Arduino

Now you click on the left-down "Windows Joystics" and then "Properties" and must see this:


If you push the button 01 you have to see red square with number 01 on the left side of MMJoy2 window and red circle button 01 in joystick properties window.

That`s all :-) I hope you do it now.



Hi Erichos , thanks for spending the time to do that for me ....my scheme was not too professional as I don't know electronics , it was really just for me so I got all the connections right at my bench, but I will go through your post again and check everything again.

I did not draw the 1N4148 Diodes on my original scheme as they were already in the wires and soldered in, on the Column wires with the stripe facing the Switches, SolderMonkey helped me get that part right on my conversion thread smile.

I will switch to the earlier Firmware too if it is known to be more stable...thanks for that tip too.


Thanks,

KB.



Last edited by Kbird; 01/26/17 12:19 AM.

My FLCS+TQS Conversion here on SimHQ

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4324940/1
#4331793 - 01/26/17 08:15 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Sokol1]  
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SolderMonkey Offline
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Erichos, I have to disagree with your analysis of the diode problem. I'm a proponent of diode-less single row matrices, but if you have two buttons pressed in a row, it can trigger a button in the row more distant - ghosting. The three button press problem is masking and it will occur in the column farther from the three buttons pressed, in the far row. Electricity will follow the shortest path.

If you leave the diodes out on a two or more row matrix, sooner or later, you're going to get weirdness. It might not manifest all the time, but in a world where an extra AMRAM means the difference between life and death, I'll put the diodes in. The worse case in my mind is you have a store release or staging action where not commanded. The masking issue is probably less severe in games as you might actively remember the masking issue and let up on buttons.

Diodes are cheap and they allow an immediate expansion capability to new rows. If you have a fixed form joystick like a TQS that you can wire up single row, fine. If you're making a frankenstick or a button-box, put the diodes in if there is any chance you will ever add that second row, just to save yourself the time and annoyance of soldering to already placed switches.

You're right that if you're commanding single buttons only, you won't see the problem. When I'm cranking, banking and popping flares, I don't want to see my goal popping payload go flying away into the dirt and I have to RTB just to re-arm.

#4331798 - 01/26/17 08:27 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: SolderMonkey]  
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Originally Posted By: SolderMonkey
Erichos, I have to disagree with your analysis of the diode problem. I'm a proponent of diode-less single row matrices, but if you have two buttons pressed in a row, it can trigger a button in the row more distant - ghosting. The three button press problem is masking and it will occur in the column farther from the three buttons pressed, in the far row. Electricity will follow the shortest path.

If you leave the diodes out on a two or more row matrix, sooner or later, you're going to get weirdness. It might not manifest all the time, but in a world where an extra AMRAM means the difference between life and death, I'll put the diodes in. The worse case in my mind is you have a store release or staging action where not commanded. The masking issue is probably less severe in games as you might actively remember the masking issue and let up on buttons.

Diodes are cheap and they allow an immediate expansion capability to new rows. If you have a fixed form joystick like a TQS that you can wire up single row, fine. If you're making a frankenstick or a button-box, put the diodes in if there is any chance you will ever add that second row, just to save yourself the time and annoyance of soldering to already placed switches.

You're right that if you're commanding single buttons only, you won't see the problem. When I'm cranking, banking and popping flares, I don't want to see my goal popping payload go flying away into the dirt and I have to RTB just to re-arm.



Just wanted to note for others that I am not sure a TQS could be wired directly especially if you want to add a HAT to replace the now useless Eraser Nub like I did, at least mine couldn't be, there are too many buttons for a 1x10 matrix like I had setup originally , and if you want to add a few Push button Encoders or other extra Buttons, a Matrix will be needed. **caveat...I am no expert in these matters though as noted smile


KB.




Last edited by Kbird; 01/26/17 08:28 PM.

My FLCS+TQS Conversion here on SimHQ

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4324940/1
#4331802 - 01/26/17 08:42 PM Re: MMJoy/MMjoy2 - Build your own USB controller [Re: Kb1rd1]  
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 55
Forsaken_joystick Offline
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Originally Posted By: Kbird
Originally Posted By: SolderMonkey
Erichos, I have to disagree with your analysis of the diode problem. I'm a proponent of diode-less single row matrices, but if you have two buttons pressed in a row, it can trigger a button in the row more distant - ghosting. The three button press problem is masking and it will occur in the column farther from the three buttons pressed, in the far row. Electricity will follow the shortest path.

If you leave the diodes out on a two or more row matrix, sooner or later, you're going to get weirdness. It might not manifest all the time, but in a world where an extra AMRAM means the difference between life and death, I'll put the diodes in. The worse case in my mind is you have a store release or staging action where not commanded. The masking issue is probably less severe in games as you might actively remember the masking issue and let up on buttons.

Diodes are cheap and they allow an immediate expansion capability to new rows. If you have a fixed form joystick like a TQS that you can wire up single row, fine. If you're making a frankenstick or a button-box, put the diodes in if there is any chance you will ever add that second row, just to save yourself the time and annoyance of soldering to already placed switches.

You're right that if you're commanding single buttons only, you won't see the problem. When I'm cranking, banking and popping flares, I don't want to see my goal popping payload go flying away into the dirt and I have to RTB just to re-arm.



Just wanted to note for others that I am not sure a TQS could be wired directly especially if you want to add a HAT to replace the now useless Eraser Nub like I did, at least mine couldn't be, there are too many buttons for a 1x10 matrix like I had setup originally , and if you want to add a few Push button Encoders or other extra Buttons, a Matrix will be needed. **caveat...I am no expert in these matters though as noted smile


KB.






I think you have to add one more wire for an extra row/ column

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