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#3220626 - 02/28/11 07:45 PM I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of...  
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Sholtz Offline
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Ok so I understand the concept of bullseye; it's an arbitrary point in space that is used to reference location. Right. Very cool concept.

I understand the terminology, i.e. "bandits bullseye 060 50 miles, Angels 12" means there are bandits 50 miles from bullseye at a bearing of 60 degrees at 12,000 feet.

Check.

What I just am not getting in this whole picture is, how do I know what *my* location is? I understand heading, but is there someplace in the HUD or radar that tells me what my location is in reference to bullseye? The example I used is from the manual and it goes on to say that if you are bullseye 30 degrees 120 miles then you are nowhere near the bandits. Peachy. But how I do *know* that my location is 30 degrees 120 miles from bullseye?

For the record I have the highest realism settings so I dont have the easy option on for this, the one where all calls are relative to me.

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#3220654 - 02/28/11 08:21 PM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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#3220660 - 02/28/11 08:29 PM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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Southern Arizona in the good o...
From page 413 of the AF manual (talking about selecting Bullseye in the DED):

"If selected, Bullseye information is displayed [in the lower left corner of the FCR & HSD viewscreens]. If the aircraft is further than 99 miles away from Bullseye, the Bullseye circle is empty. Otherwise the actual distance is displayed [to Bullseye]. When the target is in STT, the Cursor-Bullseye readout changes to Target-Bullseye distance/bearing.

If not selected (default), an aircraft reference symbol is displayed in the FCR and the HSD screens. It's bearing/distance readout depends on current master mode:

- A-A: Bearing to the collision point (with a locked target only)
- A-G: Air-to-Ground bearing
- NAV: Bearing to current system waypoint."

Portions surrounded by "[ ]" are my edits to the AF manual text.

#3220664 - 02/28/11 08:31 PM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Falstar]  
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Sholtz Offline
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Sholtz  Offline
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Originally Posted By: Falstar


Er....is that even a Falcon?! I don't recognize any of those gauges.

#3220665 - 02/28/11 08:32 PM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: LoD_Viper]  
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Sholtz Offline
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Originally Posted By: LoD_Viper
From page 413 of the AF manual (talking about selecting Bullseye in the DED):

"If selected, Bullseye information is displayed [in the lower left corner of the FCR & HSD viewscreens]. If the aircraft is further than 99 miles away from Bullseye, the Bullseye circle is empty. Otherwise the actual distance is displayed [to Bullseye]. When the target is in STT, the Cursor-Bullseye readout changes to Target-Bullseye distance/bearing.

If not selected (default), an aircraft reference symbol is displayed in the FCR and the HSD screens. It's bearing/distance readout depends on current master mode:

- A-A: Bearing to the collision point (with a locked target only)
- A-G: Air-to-Ground bearing
- NAV: Bearing to current system waypoint."

Portions surrounded by "[ ]" are my edits to the AF manual text.


DOH! That must be it, I need to turn the flippin' thing on!

#3221131 - 03/01/11 10:50 AM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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gipodiablo Offline
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I did a little EXCEL file that converts your BE coordinates and Target BE coordinates in direct bearing and distance to the target.
I use it in a secondary screen when flying
I wonder why this little help was not implemented in Falcon's cockpit.
If u want it, just send me yor email

#3221168 - 03/01/11 01:06 PM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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xIGuNDoCIx Offline
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Sholtz,

You need to punch in Bullseye on your DED using your ICP. Here are the steps:

OK here we go, Hope I don't miss anything, and If anybody has any other questions just go ahead and post em.

The bullseye is basically a little reference point on the map. All friendly flights know where it is located, and any radio call of position is referenced to it.

Luckily for us, the f-16 already does all the calculations about bearing and distance from the bullseye on two separate locations. It displays your current range\bearing to bullseye and the position of the radar cursor. These are displayed in the HSD, the FCR, and the HUD. To see this you have to set up bullseye mode in your ICP.

On the ICP
1. Press "LIST" Button
2. "0" for MISC
3. "8" for BULL
4. "0" to highlight Bullseye ( activates bullseye mode )
5. Press the 4-way switch under the numbers on the ICP to "RTN"

Now if you look at you FCR in the bottom left corner will be 2 sets of numbers. The top pair of numbers are the location of the radar cursor. The numbers below it are YOUR range and bearing. Your range is the one that is displayed inside the circle. You cant miss it. This stuff is also displayed on the HSD. Your position from bullseye is also displayed on you HUD in the bottom left under the speed tape for quick reference. The first set of numbers is your bearing from Bullseye and the second set of digits is your range from Bullseye.

So in the example below, this pilots position from Bullseye is Bearing 216 for 46 miles.






When a mission starts, I like to set up bullseye on the ground before taxi. Then expand the HSD and locate the bullseye. This will give you an Idea of your relative position and the relation between bullseye and your target.

Most of the time if you are flight that is in formation you radars are pointed in the same relative area ahead of you so most calls are very easy to understand quickly. If somebody calls out "Contacts, 076 for 123 angels 20" (076 bearing for 123 miles 20 thousand feet) Just look at the readout for your FCR cursor and slew it to that position. At first this may seem a little difficult but trust me it just take a little practice and it becomes second nature. This goes exactly the same for finding ground targets on the FCR. If the lead gives a call, simply slew your radar cursor over until it coordinates match that position and you can locate the target.

If you are not heading the same direction from each other it becomes a little bit more tricky. I just get myself familiarized with bullseye locations of some important areas on ingress so I know if a call is relevant from sentry. Like TRGT, Homeplate, FLOT some others depending on what were doing.
IF #%&*$# hits the fan, and you dont have time to call awacs, or its not giving you the vectors you want,

1. Note location of bullseye
2. Note your position from bullseye
3. IF they are relatively close to each other, then you know the bandit is a threat. SO if you are 079 for 120 and you hear 050 for 150 they are in your area.
4. IF you know what direction you are heading and your direction from bullseye you can use the information to put your nose in the general area of the targets. I use the HSD to estimate the approx ( I just say that things close to 360 is north 090 east 180 south and 270 west ) location of the bandits and just to put my nose at their general area. With the HSD expanded even far away calls can be quickly found this way. I then use the method above and locate it with radar cursors.

In mutliplayer we use this information more to just get your weapons pointing at the target. Most of time you already know its relative position, and you just have to fine tune your search with the bullseye location and find the target. This is most helpful when taking about which target or which SAM site your talking about.

Like I said before, this isn't exactly the easiest thing to do the first time. But with a little practice it will become second nature.

Last edited by MAN76UTD; 03/01/11 02:03 PM.
#3221254 - 03/01/11 02:34 PM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: xIGuNDoCIx]  
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Sholtz Offline
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Originally Posted By: MAN76UTD
Sholtz,

You need to punch in Bullseye on your DED using your ICP. Here are the steps:


Turns out that was the only thing missing; did this change since the early days of Falcon 4.0? I dont recall ever having to manually
turn the thing on.

The rest of your post is chock full of goodies, thanks for that!

#3221294 - 03/01/11 03:26 PM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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xIGuNDoCIx Offline
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Not sure as I came into Falcon with AF. I still find neat little tricks with F4AF every time I fly. This sim never ceases to amaze me. burnout

#3221352 - 03/01/11 04:26 PM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: xIGuNDoCIx]  
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Sholtz Offline
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Sholtz  Offline
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Originally Posted By: MAN76UTD
Not sure as I came into Falcon with AF. I still find neat little tricks with F4AF every time I fly. This sim never ceases to amaze me. burnout


Aint that the truth! I have owned it since 4.0 came out and it ran like crap on my little P60 or whatever the heck I had back then. biggrin

Sheesh, you would think by now I would be an Ace or something.

#3221558 - 03/01/11 07:59 PM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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SoBad Offline
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Hook up with others for multi-play and your learning curve will skyrocket.


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#4222828 - 01/29/16 06:22 AM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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Darren Offline
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Darren  Offline
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The hardest thing to learn .
I bought F4 in '99 and still don't understand bullseye.
I am so dumb.

I've seen you tubes explaining it,I have the Bullseye trainer program but my mind goes into scrambled egg mode when trying to get the knowledge into my brain.
Noone explains it at a level I can understand.

#4222831 - 01/29/16 06:28 AM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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Darren Offline
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I'm looking for a F4 version with all the fancy graphics but plays in easy mode.
My mind goes at a third of realistic mode so I can't reach that ceiling.
Easy mode for me is exactly like playing realistic for you guys.

I'd love F4 in easy mode with the dynamic campaign but withthe update graphics.
iknow reading this will make you nracissist but for us dumbies that can't understand anything but still want to play,that would be a godsend.
That would be my idea of flight sim heaven.

Anyway ,anyone that knows how the dumb mind thinks and can explain things to us dummies like bullseye,I'd appreciate it as I was 32 when I bought the ring binder of F4 and I am nearly 50 now.
I want to get through just one campaign before I die :-(

#4222833 - 01/29/16 06:33 AM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: xIGuNDoCIx]  
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Darren Offline
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Ridiculous amount of stuff to do for a person like me.
I don't car eabout reality in regards to position.
Just put me and my wingmen on a map ffs.

Most of us will never fly the real thing so why bother with all thiss tuff that makes you want to cut your wrists?

#4222840 - 01/29/16 08:22 AM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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komemiute Offline
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Maybe after five years, he's got the hang of it! smile

(Thread is from 2011, FYI)


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#4222868 - 01/29/16 11:29 AM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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- Ice Offline
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Bullseye is easy to learn, but hard to implement. In Falcon, you can make it so that AWACS calls targets from YOUR location, not bullseye, so you can still play without worrying about bullseye so much.


- Ice
#4228254 - 02/12/16 06:22 AM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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Darren Offline
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I have the Bullseye trainer program and it is awful.
Makes learning even harder.
It doesn't give an explanation why it came to the answer so you are in deep water.

Do you have to be Einstein to play Falcon?

You need to be Einstein to use the Bullseye trainer.
Can someone please put up a video and explain how the bullseye trainer works please before I really lose the plot?

Getting me so down.
Why don't flight simmers help us dummies and just ignore us.

You're not all narcissists are you flight sim fans?

I've looked at you tubes,read manuals but just don't get the bullseye.

The bullseye trainer is just insanely hard to understand.

Last edited by Darren; 02/12/16 06:32 AM.
#4228528 - 02/12/16 08:32 PM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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As someone who does understand BE and has used the BE Trainer, it's not for learning new concepts. It made me much faster at BE but it didn't teach me anything. On the slowest pace and assuming all answers are "BFM" I got the right quadrant more and more often.

When you actually use BE operationally the pace is more relaxed with more tools at your disposal. If the stress test of BE trainer is too much, all hope isn't lost.

There are also plenty of ways to use BE Trainer that doesn't play the whole game of it in full. It's an excellent random value generator. The full BE Trainer game is:
1. Consider ownship position and heading displayed in textual/symbol format.
2. Discover bandit position by listening to verbal call.
3. Calculate own-to-bandit direction (front/rear/left/right).
4. Calculate range and select appropriate weapon or just manevuer.
5. Click solution.
That's a lot of work and not much time to do it in! You can get much value out of the tool by doing subsets of the whole game. "Lose" every time and don't worry about it.

Take a blank sheet of paper, a pen, compass, and ruler and make yourself a BE ring with azimuths marked every 30 degrees and 4-5 rings every 30nm. Put the cap back on the pen and when you run a BE Trainer game look at the paper (not the screen) and listen for the verbal callout. Put the tip of the capped pen down where you think the call was describing and hold it there. Look up at the screen and click reveal solution. Repeat until reliable. "Bandit bulls 045 sixty miles." OK, he's on the second ring half way between the 1 o'clock and 2 c'clock lines.

Then try adding ownship position by using a second pen to point at where the F-16 is by reading the ownship BE position off the screen after/instead of sorting the verbal bandit position. Reveal solution and see if both were right. "Bandit bulls 210 55 miles" "OK that's there. Now where was I? I'm south (180) 10 miles, so right there."

Then you can substitute ownship with maybe a penny with a heading felt tip mark and try to get your ownship heading right too. Then start considering range to decide the action. Then consider what quadrant from the penny ownship's point of view to make the turn. Don't worry about the timer.

#4228579 - 02/12/16 10:53 PM Re: I still don't understand Bullseye. Well, sort of... [Re: Sholtz]  
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- Ice Offline
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I'm sorry, is this about wanting to learn bullseye or wanting to fly Falcon?

If you want to wrap your head around bullseye, then do as Frederf suggests. If you want to fly Falcon, then un-tick the RADIO CALLS BULLSEYE option on the SETUP menu and you're done. AWACS will call out targets based on YOUR location, not bullseye.


- Ice

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