BoS generally still uses a model that is too light in some aspects, those planes are 2 tons upward, not 500kg.
The FM may feel right to some, but that doesn't mean that is is correct.

Perhaps a result of being built upon a WWI flight sim, who knows.

This complain has been raised a few times during EA. But I have the opposite feeling. I feel the "weight" of the planes in BoS more than in other sims. I have been flying lots of types (from ultra light up to the 747) in my career. And most sims (for example FSX) pretend to model inertia by making the plane less responsive to control inputs. Such a 747 would never ever have been airworthy.

If you consider f.e., that a 109 could be rolled in 4 secs just with two fingers at the stick, how do you judge the correctness of the FM in regards to "weight/inertia" ? The control forces in a 172 are higher, the roll rate is slower, although it is much lighter. What do you think, a PC sim could do, that you "feel" that the 109 is heavier than the 172 ? There was lots of complaints about the "rubber band" symptom. For me it was the combination of inertia and the wind vane effect, that made me feel the weight (and what is missing in most other sims).

I don't have an idea myself, how to test, what is right or wrong. I can just trust my feelings, and they are definitly "pro" the RoF/BoS FM. I can't proof anything, but I have about 15000 RL hours my "feelings" are based upon. At least I have fun with those 777 sims, what I don't have with others. ...and I guess I tried all of them

Don't get me wrong. I don't say the BoS FM is more realistic than this or that other sim. It just "feels" more realistic to me.

Thanks Juergen, it's always interesting to get the opinion of someone with thousands of hours in the real thing.

Personally, I was a passenger in a small helicopter for the first time last week and was amazed at how familiar the sights and sensations felt to me because of so much time in simulators.

Yes...because laws of physics and aerodynamics changed a lot between 1918 and 1940...

As a multi thousand hour pilot with some experience of WWII aircraft, I lean in the opinion of Juergen as far as weight and inertia

Cheers Dakpilot

I agree completely.

The largest military helicopter I flew was the UH-60A which had a max gross weight of 20,250 pounds-over 10 tons. The aircraft was capable of +3.5 G's all day long and could roll into a 90degree angle of bank in "one Mississippi" second. Both it and the AH-6 Little Bird would bounce your helmet off of the door in a hard turn-if the door was actually installed....

I have a serious computer with an AMD 7990 Crossfire so I have everything set to Max in both ROF and BOS. I still remember the first time I ran ROF I flew A Pfalz DXII down a river running through some trees and got a MAJOR flashback of river running in the military. It was the most powerful sense of actual flight in ANY device that didn't actually move that I've experienced.

Just barely started to play with BOS a few minutes and it looks pretty darned good to me...

Good to know...

The FM has been debated to death in the beta years and beyond. The consensus of opinion from those that had/were RL fliers was that BoS had a realistic 'feeling' of flight with good inertia and weight characteristics.

A lot of people get caught out in BoS when they dive for the first time and crater because they're not used to the pick up in speed.
Literally the only thing in BoS which is lacking is a credible campaign to do justice to the sim.

The only consensus in flight models in sims is that there will never be a consensus. Every sim does something better than the rest, every one does something worse that the others got right, everyone says "A is better than B" and "no, B is better than A!"

The FMs aren't BoS' weak point, as mentioned. It's equivalent to every other decent flight sim out there overall. Likewise the gunnery, DMs, graphics, AI, and so on. Each has strengths and weaknesses that differ from competitors/predecessors and enable endless value-based judgement arguments about which is better and why. If that was all, BoS would be just as successful as the others.

The limit of content for these planes is the issue. There is literally nothing I can do in BoS that I can't do in other sims, but there are things in other sims I can't do in BoS. That is where it falls short.

In Il-2 1946 or ROF or DCS I can fire up a server on my own PC and have a few friends join me as we fly coop against enemy AI planes on A2A or A2G missions. In all but DCS I can randomly generate an MP mission (DCS does offer it SP) using one tool or another in addition to flying premade ones. I won't bother repeating the SP campaign points, those are known to all by now.

For another example of a sequel losing features its predecessor had, read up on F1 2015 from Codemasters. They improved the racing (ie driving in the car) at the cost of multiple features in 2014, 2013, and earlier. Totally blasted by the community for it.




The Jedi Master

JM, you can do that in BoS. It's more convoluted than it needs to be (you have to run a separate .exe ['DServer'] from the install folder), and of course, you have to have a suitable mission.

But the mission builder is great fun and very powerful (weird too, though - ROF-weird - until you get the hang of it!).

In addition, the update before last introduced certain changes to key 'commands' (MCUs) in the mission builder, which mean that it should be much easier to adapt SP missions to MP use - which in turn suggests the Devs might (this is my pet theory) soon implement for MP exactly the kind of random mission generator they use for the much maligned (but actually pretty sophisticated) SP campaign. Thus - viola! - a powerful MP "coop" mission generator! Fingers crossed, eh!

It'll be great IF (IF!!!) it happens!

Also, in the light of today's update I'm not sure that comment about shedding features is fair. The new ground handling seems to add a whole lot more potential for mayhem to the BoS mix!

Simple fact: ROF has more features than BoS despite being the same underlying engine.

I suppose I'm one of those outlier few in ROF who fly coop and not dogfight, but that's what I wanted in my next Il-2 sims. Cliffs of Dover fell on its face and didn't offer that. BoS decided getting off the floor was too much trouble and wallowed next to it.

Oh, and I've had more fun with ingrown toenails than with ROF's MB! My brain isn't wired the way it needs to be to understand that thing.





The Jedi Master