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#4132107 - 06/10/15 09:11 PM Re: Offical BoS forum ***** [Re: lokitexas]  
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using the 'silent majority' to back up an argument is just so weak, they are silent whether they care or not.

#4132110 - 06/10/15 09:22 PM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: Force10]  
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Originally Posted By: Force10
So then how do you explain the 750,000 owners of DCS World through Steam?

What would interest me is how many of them do own DCS WWII planes.... do you know?
(it's only a question, I would be really interested to know). Maybe it would show me I'm wrong about the drop of interest about the WW2 CFS, which I would be glad to be.

Quote:
Let's just say...
It's not the subject. I tried to talk about something different than the "BoS/BoM good/bad/neutral" subject, which is becoming to be a bit boring.
It was a try to get out the manichean and useless pro/con debate.... that obviously failed as far you're concerned.


Last edited by Rama; 06/10/15 09:23 PM.
#4132112 - 06/10/15 09:23 PM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: SharpeXB]  
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Originally Posted By: SharpeXB
... Regardless the truth is that most players don't care. The majority only play this or any game for a few hours. They don't post on forums or care about any of these issues. The enthusiast who has a hundred hours in the game is in a bracket of less than 1% of the players....


Do you make this stuff up as you go?


"For I know the plans that I have for you," declares the Lord, "plans for welfare and not for calamity to give you a future and a hope." Jeremiah 29:11

Blessed are you when people insult you and persecute you, and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of Me. Matthew 5:11

Indeed we call blessed those who have persevered. You have heard of the perseverance of Job, and you have seen the purpose of the Lord, because “the Lord is compassionate and merciful. James 5:11
#4132113 - 06/10/15 09:25 PM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: Extreme_One]  
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Originally Posted By: Extreme_One
Originally Posted By: SharpeXB
... most players don't care. The majority only play this or any game for a few hours. They don't post on forums or care about any of these issues...


Spoken like somebody who really doesn't understand gaming or gamers. Or simming and simmers. Or forums and their users.

Keep it up like this and slowly but surely every last shred of credibility you thought you had, you'll destroy all by yourself with analyses like the above.

You don't believe most players don't post on the forums?
Ok here's some real data from Rise of Flight, a healthy current game and in the same genre.
There are 285,720 members on the forum. Myself I have 460 posts there. Not really too active, wow I have more posts here...

Doing a search of the members there, the number who have more than 460 posts is: 257

257 out of 285,720!

On BoS I'm a real fanboy I have 1403
How many people have that many? 24! Out of 54,000!

How many people on RoF have more than 10 posts? 2,981 out of 285,000! That's 1%!

And you guys think forum activity is relevant?!

Last edited by SharpeXB; 06/10/15 09:40 PM.

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#4132119 - 06/10/15 09:42 PM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: SharpeXB]  
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Originally Posted By: SharpeXB

Doing a search of the members there, the number who have more than 460 posts is: 257

257 out of 285,720!

On BoS I'm a real fanboy I have 1403
How many people have that many? 24! Out of 54,000!

I rest my case




Over the years I don't think I have ever posted on the developers own forum. I own ROF with 20 some odd planes and don't think I have posted over there once. I've posted plenty here though. Developers tend to censor their forums more then an objective forum...so they get less traffic overall (most of the time).

Pat Wilson's PWCG thread has over 1.8 million views here at SimHQ alone.


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#4132122 - 06/10/15 09:44 PM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: SharpeXB]  
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Originally Posted By: SharpeXB
Originally Posted By: Bucksnort
Originally Posted By: SharpeXB
Originally Posted By: Extreme_One
But considering the current outrage,

There's no "current outrage" just the mad postings here of a dozen or so people on this site.


...and the vast majority who have purchased BoS on Steam and have stopped playing it:



They're playing it more hours on average per person than CoD. That chart is showing players not hours. CoD has been selling for 4 years so of course it has more players.



So, whats the difference between a 1000 players playing for 5000 hours and 5000 people playing for a 1000 hours?

Enlighten me.

#4132124 - 06/10/15 09:49 PM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: Force10]  
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Originally Posted By: Force10
Originally Posted By: SharpeXB

Doing a search of the members there, the number who have more than 460 posts is: 257

257 out of 285,720!

On BoS I'm a real fanboy I have 1403
How many people have that many? 24! Out of 54,000!

I rest my case




Over the years I don't think I have ever posted on the developers own forum. I own ROF with 20 some odd planes and don't think I have posted over there once. I've posted plenty here though. Developers tend to censor their forums more then an objective forum...so they get less traffic overall (most of the time).

Pat Wilson's PWCG thread has over 1.8 million views here at SimHQ alone.

Yeah but the subject here is that activity on the BoS forum related to the sucess of the game. It's clearly not.

Only 7% of the members on the BoS forum have made more than one post. That number on RoF is 2%

This conspiracy theory is busted!

Last edited by SharpeXB; 06/10/15 10:14 PM.

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#4132131 - 06/10/15 10:14 PM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: SharpeXB]  
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Originally Posted By: SharpeXB
...
You don't believe most players don't post on the forums?
...



Irrelevant.

A game with a healthy community (that means active and engaged) shows far more activity on its official forum.

I'm done trying to explain it.
It unnecessary, I'm not playing with graphs and figures - I don't need to its fairly obvious.

Just imagine, for one moment, if the developers had actually made a true successor to IL-2 - would the official forum be as lacking in activity.
I think not.

It's pointless trying to convince me that this brand is as successful as it should be.

They have taken a successful brand and made it far less significant than it used to be.
That's a real perfect example in how-not-to ...

#4132132 - 06/10/15 10:18 PM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: Extreme_One]  
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Originally Posted By: Extreme_One

A game with a healthy community (that means active and engaged) shows far more activity on its official forum.

RoF is about the most sucessful and healthy game in this market. Look someone just said one of its threads here has 1.8 million views
So there are a lot of people playing it for sure.

On the RoF forum only 2% of the forum members have made more than one post.

Unless you have a better example with actual data then your theory is wrong.


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#4132134 - 06/10/15 10:29 PM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: SharpeXB]  
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Originally Posted By: SharpeXB


Unless you have a better example with actual data then your theory is wrong.


It definitely seems you spend more time on the forums then playing this masterpiece. How does that fit in to the theory?


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#4132136 - 06/10/15 10:36 PM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: Force10]  
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Originally Posted By: Force10
Originally Posted By: SharpeXB


Unless you have a better example with actual data then your theory is wrong.


It definitely seems you spend more time on the forums then playing this masterpiece.

And there's definitly something wrong with that...


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#4132138 - 06/10/15 10:40 PM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: lokitexas]  
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Ok, so the newest, "dev supported", IL2 continuing legend, "modern" flight sim, having a slow official forum, a dead steam forum, and dead SimHQ forum (apart from this section) should not worry anyone. Got it.

No need for concern. No need to make the devs re-think their product. No need to worry about the fact if BoM does poorly it will be the last installment. No way.

Your charts and skewed observations are ridiculous.

If that isn't telling, why are you still on your crusade? How many posts you up to now Sharpe? All defending BoS. ALL of them.

#4132183 - 06/11/15 02:01 AM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: lokitexas]  
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Originally Posted By: lokitexas
Ok, so the newest, "dev supported", IL2 continuing legend, "modern" flight sim, having a slow official forum, a dead steam forum, and dead SimHQ forum (apart from this section) should not worry anyone.

Ok let's look at some forum statistics from another similar game, WarThunder
There are 3,260,000 players*
The official forum has 576,100 members. Which is only 18% of the player base.
The number of members there who have made 1 or more posts is 59,499. Or 10% of the members.

Put those statistics another way:

82% of the players are not on the official forum.

90% of the forum members have not made a single post.

So given the above statistics which are similar to BoS. Why do you think forum activity is any indication of a games sucess?

And regarding official forums:

47 people are viewing the DCS World section at SimHQ
135 people are viewing the Eagle Dynamics forum

Why do you think SimHQ forum participation is more relevant than an official forum?

*despite being a free game those players all have a median playtime of 5 hours which is typical. So they're active real players.

Last edited by SharpeXB; 06/11/15 02:21 AM.

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#4132190 - 06/11/15 02:31 AM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: SharpeXB]  
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Originally Posted By: SharpeXB
Originally Posted By: lokitexas
Ok, so the newest, "dev supported", IL2 continuing legend, "modern" flight sim, having a slow official forum, a dead steam forum, and dead SimHQ forum (apart from this section) should not worry anyone.

Ok let's look at some forum statistics from another similar game, WarThunder
There are 3,260,000 players
The official forum has 576,100 members. Which is only 18% of the player base.
The number of members there who have made 1 or more posts is 59,499. Or 10% of the members.

Put those statistics another way:

82% of the players are not on the official forum.

90% of the forum members have not made a single post.

So given the above statistics which are similar to BoS. Why do you think forum activity is any indication of a games sucess?

And regarding official forums:

47 people are viewing the DCS World section at SimHQ
135 people are viewing the Eagle Dynamics forum

Why do you think SimHQ forum participation is more relevant than an official forum?

Personally speaking bos forum is irrelevant. Any post in anyway showing dissatisfaction is deleted, the poster is banned from posting for various amounts of time so the only folk left posting are the happy crowd. This forum is more relevant in regards to the general consensus of bos. There is no censorship here. Same goes for the dcs forum. If I was a cynic I'd be thinking Soviet style propaganda.


DCS Kickstarter
Wags July 2014 "In this July 2014 update, the primary news is in regards to the restructured backer rewards. After a careful review of the older system under RRG, we found it financially unattainable."
Wags October 2017 "the investment vs. generated revenue has been excellent for the World War II aircraft. In fact, the P-51D Mustang has twice the cost effectiveness of the A-10C Warthog."
#4132195 - 06/11/15 02:53 AM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: Johnny_Redd]  
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Originally Posted By: Johnny_Redd

Personally speaking bos forum is irrelevant. Any post in anyway showing dissatisfaction is deleted, the poster is banned from posting for various amounts of time so the only folk left posting are the happy crowd. This forum is more relevant in regards to the general consensus of bos. There is no censorship here. Same goes for the dcs forum. If I was a cynic I'd be thinking Soviet style propaganda.


Wow... where do these guys get this stuff from..


Start where you are. Use what you have. Do what you can.
#4132198 - 06/11/15 03:16 AM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: Force10]  
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Originally Posted By: Force10

It definitely seems you spend more time on the forums then playing this masterpiece. How does that fit in to the theory?


Preach!

#4132200 - 06/11/15 03:18 AM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: Bearcat99]  
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Originally Posted By: Bearcat99

Wow... where do these guys get this stuff from..


It's easy, if you follow Sharpe's reasoning using the following formula you can extrapolate average sim time hours and what the proletariat desires, including the definition of what constitutes a sim, including a "combat flight sim," which by the way is a variable depending on the current status and characteristics of BOS (for example, today that includes a manual in .pdf form):

(cos x + i sin x)^n = cos (nx) + i sin (nx),


"For I know the plans that I have for you," declares the Lord, "plans for welfare and not for calamity to give you a future and a hope." Jeremiah 29:11

Blessed are you when people insult you and persecute you, and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of Me. Matthew 5:11

Indeed we call blessed those who have persevered. You have heard of the perseverance of Job, and you have seen the purpose of the Lord, because “the Lord is compassionate and merciful. James 5:11
#4132203 - 06/11/15 03:27 AM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: Airdrop01]  
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Originally Posted By: Airdrop01
Originally Posted By: Bearcat99

Wow... where do these guys get this stuff from..


It's easy, if you follow Sharpe's reasoning using the following formula you can extrapolate average sim time hours and what the proletariat desires, including the definition of what constitutes a sim, including a "combat flight sim," which by the way is a variable depending on the current status and characteristics of BOS (for example, today that includes a manual in .pdf form):

(cos x + i sin x)^n = cos (nx) + i sin (nx),

Well since you all know I'm 12 years old, that means my sixth grade math skills are still fresh.


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#4132204 - 06/11/15 03:40 AM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: lokitexas]  
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So I guess Sharpe is saying really popular games have no "buzz" on the interweb wink


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#4132211 - 06/11/15 03:59 AM Re: Offical BoS forum [Re: lokitexas]  
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For myself being a long time simmer, I know what a forum feels like when it's excited about a freshly released sim. There's definitely a buzz in the air with activity in all forms...whether it's rivet counters debating, FM folks discussing (not allowed on BOS forums), screenshots being posted, folks talking about an exciting mission they just flew...etc.

1C/777 with it's handling of BOS on many issues...is the first time I felt that the developer genuinely hated me as a customer. It's even more bizarre in these times since we now have early access programs. We basically pay full price for an alpha/beta with the understanding that it may be rough and unfinished, but they will use the "good faith" money we give and use that extra capital to finish the game.

Then we get threats to shutdown the game by the developer having a fit. Some didn't like the unlocks and were AP x16 compression to get through it...so they removed auto pilot and time compression. We also were on the receiving end of a beatdown with the universally hated graphics presets that came out of nowhere.

All this hangs like a black cloud over this game and the forums for it. It's not exactly the flightsim developer/customer relationship we are used to seeing on a game that is brimming with excitement.

Just IMO of course.


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______________________________________________________

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