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#4531137 - 07/24/20 12:28 AM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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Is that the same kit as yours


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#4531278 - 07/25/20 12:05 AM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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No, it's an older brother.

The Graham Lee kits are truly scratch built, and were a big leap in the tube-and-gusset aircraft world. Indeed, Robert Baslee from Airdrome Airplanes refused to make a 7/8ths scale Nieuport 11 kit until after Graham died and his family pretty much abandoned the business (though they will still sell plans, there is zero support).

There are some differences between the Lee and Airdrome kits that are notable:

Airdrome kits are the plans and the materials (though the tubes are roughly cut and have to be bent and coped), with the gussets prepared and all the hardware included.
Airdrome planes have push-pull controls for ailerons and elevator, with cables for the rudder. Lee kits are wire throughout.
Airdrome planes are heavier, with more robust tubing; Robert completely through the notion of building it as an ultralight out the window (none of the Lee planes, regardless of advertisement, were ever built light enough for that).
Airdrome planes have a thicker airfoil - heck, it's a Cub airfoil. This makes the plane more sedate in the air.
The Lee plans are more text than pictures, including techniques for building the aircraft, where Airdrome plans are JUST pictures.* This is a big plus on the Lee plans.

[edit]
The Lee planes have the elevators separate, with each controlled by their own cables, while in the Airdrome kits they're joined with one long tube and one push-pull tube to control them. This is a big plus for Airdrome's design, as there's been at least one incident wreck where the elevators weren't in total agreement and flutter set in one Lee planes. A lot of guys with Lee planes have taken to joining them together because of this.
[/edit]

In practice, there is very little difference in performance. They're both light tricky little short coupled tail draggers with no vertical stab.

Don't get me wrong - in the air they are very analogous to piloting a Champ. Landing is a straight forward wheel landing (for me - there are some aces out there that can actually three point them, but most everyone wheel lands). Take off is tail low, letting it lift away from a near three point stance. One just has to be very attentive during take off and landing is all. It's an airplane, after all. There's nothing really magical about flying stick-and-rudder.

* Apparently there is now an instruction book that comes with Airdrome kits. This is largely due to the realization that there are nuts out there that will take Robert at his word that anyone can build his planes in the space of a one car garage with simple hand tools, and maybe it would be a good idea. I found out about it at Sun N Fun, when we were talking about leading edges (which the plans have a page saying "use these sheets for your leading edges" and nothing else) and he said "Wow, no, you did that the hard way. Just put them on the top of the leading edge, riveting into the front of the spar. It's in the book."

"What f'ing book?" I replied pointedly.

"The one I made up after you built your airplane," he replied sheepishly with a grin, "Some folks really need it, I guess."


Last edited by Dart; 07/25/20 12:09 AM.

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#4531280 - 07/25/20 01:51 AM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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"What f'ing book?" I replied pointedly.

"The one I made up after you built your airplane," he replied sheepishly with a grin, "Some folks really need it, I guess."


Many times in life things have seemed so simple to me while others just scratched their head.

Not that I was smarter, I had just done it enough that it was a no-brainer.


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#4531320 - 07/25/20 01:50 PM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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Lifer

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In my case, nobody told me it was supposed to be difficult, so I didn't know it and just built the airplane.

smile


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#4536946 - 09/14/20 12:27 PM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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How is the rebuild going ?


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Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4537066 - 09/14/20 10:43 PM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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Lifer

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Fuselage structure is done. Now it's just gear, turtle deck stringers, seat & restraints, controls, panel, fuel tank, firewall, brakes, cover and paint. So, pretty much done.

I took a stab at repairing the cowling, which was bent up on one end like a stomped on beer can. Incredibly, results were good. A little more tweaking, a bit of filler, sanding, and she's good to go.

I also repaired the fuel tank, which is neat. I'm going to make my own float this time out of thin copper sheeting that will be a puck, and put a fuel filler neck on the side where I can get at it.

Attached Files cowl_repair.jpg

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#4537106 - 09/15/20 11:52 AM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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That came out quite well considering how crumpled it was. Once again I am amazed at what you will do in terms of fabrication. I’d have looked at that and said “nope, that’s done”.

Too bad you don’t have it flying yet. You are going to miss some wonderful flying weather in the next few days.


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Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4537134 - 09/15/20 02:49 PM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: oldgrognard]  
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Originally Posted by oldgrognard
You are going to miss some wonderful flying weather in the next few days.


Yeah, free pressure washing.


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#4542464 - 10/28/20 01:18 AM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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Dart, how about an update.


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#4544020 - 11/08/20 01:16 PM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: oldgrognard]  
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Originally Posted by oldgrognard
Dart, how about an update.


Dart hasn't posted since 9/30. Hope he's ok.


"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
#4544300 - 11/10/20 02:45 AM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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He probably finally got nabbed by the Google text-speech IRS/FBI from Florida.

#4544304 - 11/10/20 03:07 AM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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Except he’s in Ambalamba.


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Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4544429 - 11/10/20 11:02 PM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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Lifer

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Naw, I've just be absorbed by work and stuff.

Fuselage is done, and she's on the main gear.

The tail wheel requires a lot of thought, as I ditched the goofy swishing tail wheel that come standard on Airdrome Aircraft was a goofy swishing mess (in all of my landing videos there's fishtailing at the end of every landing - that's the tail wheel flexing from side to side).

I went with a steel spring tail wheel setup, which required some back of the envelope engineering. Thick gussets sandwich the bottom longerons, with bushings around the bolts going to the spring. I also had to fabricate a piece for the rear saddle around the spring.

Working on it last Saturday, I was all done drilling and leaned down to put on the fender washers and nuts on the bolts - nothing special. But a gust of wind happened to decide to come into the hangar at that moment, and I got two eye fulls of dirt and debris, which probably included aluminum shavings. I quickly rinsed my eyes out with water, shut everything up, and carried my sorry butt to the eye doctor, who spent ten minutes fishing out what I didn't flush. He didn't see any metal, and, feeling a bit like a hypochondriac or a wuss asked if I had wasted his time.

No, he said, as though I probably could have kept rinsing them out and be okay, a scratched cornea is not something I wanted to experience - and I had done the right thing.


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#4544856 - 11/13/20 11:49 PM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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Yep, for sure you did the right thing.

About 10 yrs ago, I got some tiny metal pieces in my right eye (grinding on my boat with WITH safety glasses), wind blew them in.

Bottom line, I have a permanent little black dot, usually out of my FOV, but it's there.

Glad all is good with you Dart.

edit: Oh, I was about 60 miles offshore, we had two like pint bottles of eyewash onboard. Plus I used about a gallon of bottled spring water. The last chunk ended up working it's way out THRU my eyelid, in my sleep.

Last edited by Nixer; 11/13/20 11:53 PM. Reason: Occasionally Coherent

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#4544877 - 11/14/20 02:15 AM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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Americas top ace of WWI, Eddie Rickenbacker, had a spot in his eye caused by an ember from a passing train. He never told the army.


"In the vast library of socialist books, there’s not a single volume on how to create wealth, only how to take and “redistribute” it.” - David Horowitz
#4544918 - 11/14/20 03:56 PM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Nixer]  
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Originally Posted by Nixer
Yep, for sure you did the right thing.

The last chunk ended up working it's way out THRU my eyelid, in my sleep.


So...you're sort of a pirate then.


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#4544971 - 11/14/20 11:38 PM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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Sort of I guess.

Semi-retired from plundering, drinking and wenching, finally accepting the fact that not many young hotties are interested in a almost 79 yr old guy living on social security. yep

Once in a while I forget though... charge


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Look for me on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook or Tic Toc...or anywhere you may frequent, besides SimHq, on the Global Scam Net. Aka, the internet.
I am not there, never have been or ever will be, but the fruitless search may be more gratifying then the "content" you might otherwise be exposed to.

"There's a sucker born every minute."
Phineas Taylor Barnum

#4545139 - 11/16/20 02:37 PM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Nixer]  
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Originally Posted by Nixer
Sort of I guess.

Semi-retired from plundering, drinking and wenching, finally accepting the fact that not many young hotties are interested in a almost 79 yr old guy living on social security. yep

Once in a while I forget though... charge

I feel you, we all forget.
I'm almost 61 and I think of Women my age as being grandmotherly (most of them), just not interested


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#4545310 - 11/18/20 12:40 AM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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I always liked older women; but I found that marrying a woman who looked much younger than she was has paid off as the years have gone by. smile

Finalized the tail wheel and mounted the horizontal stabilizer and elevator this last weekend.

Pretty cool, they lined up just right with the fuselage (meaning I did that right), and I got a little surprise.

When we built the original fuselage five years ago, there was a twist in it. Not much, but enough to where we had to shave one of the spacers that hold it up down to make it level with the front (and therefore the wings). Well, I had kinda put that out of my mind and when it was in place the whole thing was waaayyy off level.

Much cursing for a minute, until I remembered the troubles last time. Pull it all off, laugh at myself, throw three washers on the shortened spacer, put it all back together and she's level. The fuselage is true from firewall to tail, confirmed.

smile

Of course it all gets pulled off, as I have some repairs to make. The horizontal stab got dinged just a tad, and one of the tip bows needs some attention, as well as all four plates that hold the support tubes that come up from the fuselage. The rivnuts there ripped out of the stab and elongated the plate holes.

It's just weird that there was that much going on back there in the wreck and both the horizontal stab and elevators and straight and true (of course I stripped them of fabric for inspection). But the rivnuts were already wiggly, and replacing them was on my list of things to do before the wreck.

[edit]

I also cleaned and primed the gear and forward portion of the fuselage so I can paint them this weekend. Going blue for the inside of the fuselage, and a sort of woodish tan for the gear legs, with the fittings being black. She's going to look like a very different airplane when I'm done.

I think I'm going to march on with the fuselage, working the turtle deck, fuel tank, controls, seat, etc., and put the wings down the list.

Last edited by Dart; 11/18/20 12:42 AM.

The opinions of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

More dumb stuff at http://www.darts-page.com

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#4549464 - 12/22/20 11:11 PM Re: 7/8 scale Nieuport 11. [Re: Dart]  
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Been over a month. We need an update


Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
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