Some historical comparison...

1979, S-300PT Birusa (SA-10A) fielded in the Soviet Union
5V55K missile 47*km range
*Command guided only

1983, S-300PS Volhov-M6 (SA-10B) fielded in the Soviet Union
5V55K missile 47*km range
5V55R missile 75km range
*Command guided only

1984, Patriot fielded in the USA
MIM-104 Standard missile 68,5km range

1986, Patriot PAC-1 fielded in the USA
MIM-104A Standard missile 68,5 range
MIM-104B SOJC missile 160*km range
*Home On Jam only

1989, S-300PM Volhov-M6M (SA-20A) fielded in the Soviet Union
48N6 missile 150km range

1989, S-300PMU Volhov-M6 (SA-10B) exported into East Germany, Bulgaria, Czechoslovakia, China
5V55K missile 47*km range
5V55R missile 75km range
*Command guided only

1989, Patriot exported into Germany, Netherlands, Japan, Israel*(2002), Spain*(2004/2014), Korea*(2008)
MIM-104A Standard missile 68,5km range
*ExGerman system re-exported

1990, Patriot PAC-2 fielded in the USA
MIM-104C ATM missile 160km range

1990, Patriot PAC-2 exported into Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Taiwan, Greece
MIM-104C ATM missile 160km

1994, S-300PMU-1 Volhov-M6M (SA-20A) exported into China, Greece, Algeria, Vietnam
48N6E missile 150km range

1995, Patriot GEM fielded in the USA
MIM-104D GEM missile 220km range
MIM-104E GEM+ missile 220*km range
*C [ATM] missile upgrade for D [GEM] capabilities, known as GEM+


2001, Patriot PAC-3 fielded in the USA
MIM-104D GEM missile 220km range
MIM-104E GEM+ missile 220*km range
MIM-104F PAC-3 missile 30**km range
*C [ATM] missile upgrade for D [GEM] capabilities, known as GEM+
** ATBM missile

2004, S-300PMU-2 Favorit (SA-20B) exported into China
48N6E2 missile 200km range
9M96E missile 30*km range
*ATBM missile

2004, Patriot PAC-3 exported into Netherlands, Japan, Germany, Emirates, Kuwait, Taiwan, Korea, Qatar
MIM-104E GEM+ missile 220*km range
MIM-104F PAC-3 missile 30**km range
*C [ATM] missile upgrade for D [GEM] capabilities, known as GEM+
** ATBM missile

2007, S-400 Triumf (SA-21) fielded in the Russia
48N6DM missile 250km range
9M96 missile 30*km range
*ATBM missile

Each new SAM system version can use the earlier missile types, a marked difference from single digit Soviet designs.

Nice detailed reading...
https://books.google.hu/books?id=0zgYAAA...ual&f=false

Wow, nice document!

Do I detect the posibility of a new system joining SAM Sim in the near future?

This is my question too
But we have sa10 topic too
So .. One topic
isn't good reason to guess what we have in the future

Hpasp... Would u talk about mim-104 standard guiding command ?
Is it phase array ?
Or PAC series appointed to phase array ?
What different between gem and ATM ?

Guidance methods:

Traditional command guided missile (like the Volhov/Neva/KRUG)
5V55K missile 47km range

SAGG (Seeker Aided Ground Guidance) missiles
5V55R missile 75km range
48N6/48N6E missile 150km range
48N6E2 missile 200km range
48N6DM missile 250km range

TVM (Track Via Missile) missiles
MIM-104 Standard missile 68,5km range
MIM-104A Standard missile 68,5 range
MIM-104C ATM missile 160km range
MIM-104D GEM missile 220km range
MIM-104E GEM+ missile 220km range

OBHOJ (On Board Home On Jam)
MIM-104B SOJC missile 160km range

ARH (Active Radar Homing) ATBM missiles
MIM-104F PAC-3 missile 30km range
9M96 missile 30km range

namfi





think abou that hpasp

Interesting comparison of Soviet/US design...
... rather similarity.

Please write something about mim-104 c promixity fuse
Is it contact fuse ?

And...
This Missie can kill the scud A ?

Page 177-178...

Other Patriot related material on the net...

PATRIOT BATTALION AND BATTERY OPERATIONS
http://www.scribd.com/doc/12772745/fm3-3-1

PATRIOT TACTICS, TECHNIQUES,AND PROCEDURES
http://www.scribd.com/doc/12772502/fm3-01


AIR DEFENSE ARTILLERY REFERENCE HANDBOOK
http://www.scribd.com/doc/12772190/fm3-01

Good sources hpasp
May I ask something ?
Could we hopeless to see patriot in this year with these books?

I think epap can help us in this way

From current computer technology point of view, Patriot is such a charming old (end of '70s) digital computer technology (with green characters/lines on a green mono-color screen) having a redundant (dual) core 6MHz (!!!) processor and a redundant (dual) 256kbyte (total of 512kbyte) of memory...

... but by usability/war-fighting capability wise, if you compare it to the most modern Soviet SAM system (OSA) in SAMSIM, you would left only to wonder over the huge technological leap the US were capable of during the '80s leapfrogging the east beyond imagination.

"it would be the most boring SAMSIM ever"

OSA is the best modern system in samsim...
for the first prototype of modern system on samsim .. YES!
this system is a guiding tunnel to the modern edge


but on the other side..
we need high range sam's for new challenges !

it not only about modern panels or modern keys !

a system with +2 tracking challenge can make different situation on samsim !

we had many chance to choose complex system !
they arent boring at all

like GAINFUL or HAWK .. they are so so complexity system as you know


back to the sa-2 edge !
like AJAX or hercules ...


after hawk and gainfull

or s-300 pmu
or MIM-104 standard VS SADDAM missiles


one multi tracking system...

Hpasp: but you compare incomparable - Osa with Patriot. If you compare S-300 to it, there is not so huge difference (if I am correct the original S-300 had a 10Mhz CPU or something like it). And it had six target and twelve missile channels (18 altogether)....

S-300 is not in SAMSIM, the most modern simulated system is the OSA.

I just wanted to say, that the computer you are reading this forum is at least few ~100x more powerful (anybody remembering the green/black mono-color Hercules Monitor ? ) than Patriot.

Yes, I fully agree with that.

By the way, more "shocking" is AGC (Apollo Guidance Computer) which took people to Moon.
It was programmable and consisted of a few thousand of NAND and NOR gates.
There is an emulator on the web, so everybody can test it

modern sam ... its not all about fast internal computer !
its about multi channel challenge !
if hecules or ajax had multi channel tracking !
so why not!!!
we can love them too much
because they have something that SA-2 and 3 doesnt had this

as i remember from 2011 till now
im saying sa-6 please

only reason for sa-6 that i loved it .. is armed to two Simple multi channel !
of course i dont know any thing about numebr of HAWK channels

Just to illustrate how boring a Patriot sim would be...

(quick an dirty Visual Basic screen)


1, Semi Auto Engagement Mode
- the radar station is searching, acquiring, and tracking targets automatically, you can only turn it on or off.
- with the joystick select a target icon, click on it and all flight parameters are displayed.
- pushing the ENG button just puts the target into the TBEQ (Target to Be Engaged Queue)
- system will decide on what missile type, from witch launcher,and when should be launched, you have no possibility to influence the selection

2, Auto Engagement Mode
- the radar station is searching, acquiring, and tracking targets automatically, you can only turn it on or off.
- when hostile target is detected, the system puts it into the TBEQ (Target to Be Engaged Queue)
- system will decide on missile type, launcher, and when should be launched