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#4077879 - 02/13/15 03:11 AM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots ***** [Re: FlashBurn]  
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Good to see SABoW will be getting some improvements, still disappointed that outside of the Iran/Iraq campaign it's all about the T-62 though, was hoping for a little more.
Cheers


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#4078016 - 02/13/15 01:01 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: FlashBurn]  
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Al-Ṭāif, Mekkah Go...
its great!!!

but if the cheiftain becomes only play-worthy...

and maybe more vehicles are integrated

like bmp for both side

t62 and t55 for both side

small vehicles and others

it would be great!

#4078280 - 02/13/15 08:46 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: FlashBurn]  
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I really don't think anything large will happen. Even if sales of this exploded.

Would be much better to clean the slate. Take what works from sabow and do something BETTER. HMMMM ww2 tank sim? Been awhile....

#4078369 - 02/14/15 12:11 AM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: FlashBurn]  
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SABOW will support Ultra Wide monitors












#4078515 - 02/14/15 01:03 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: FlashBurn]  
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Great screens. SABOW is excellent.

Thanks for posting

Regards


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#4078520 - 02/14/15 01:25 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: FlashBurn]  
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Back in the '80's' I was a Chieftain Tank Commander for several years... If someone ever makes a proper game that truly represents that vehicle I'd buy it tomorrow.

#4078527 - 02/14/15 01:57 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: Trooper117]  
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Originally Posted By: Trooper117
Back in the '80's' I was a Chieftain Tank Commander for several years... If someone ever makes a proper game that truly represents that vehicle I'd buy it tomorrow.


Chieftain cockpit is like space ship cockpit hard to modelling with limited resources.

#4078599 - 02/14/15 05:01 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: andrey12345]  
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Originally Posted By: andrey12345
Originally Posted By: Trooper117
Back in the '80's' I was a Chieftain Tank Commander for several years... If someone ever makes a proper game that truly represents that vehicle I'd buy it tomorrow.


Chieftain cockpit is like space ship cockpit hard to modelling with limited resources.


Do you mean limited resources in cash, information or both?

Andrey,
SABoW has always had the potential to become a true classic like SFK42 or even Steel Beast Pro. We all understood not much could be done in the early going because of UIG's involvement, but if that is coming to an end why not try to do just a little more then what was announced so far? I think 90% of SABoW players would agree that at the minimum 1 if not 3 vehicles already in SABoW need to become user playable if no addition campaigns are going to be added. Now two of these vehicles have already been started by community members (BMP and M113) but for various reason have stalled. So if I may inquire how much work do you feel it would take to use what's already been done by the modders, add whats missing, add it to the game code and get it into the game as user playable vehicles? I'm sure the makers of these vehicle mods would be okay with you adding their work to yours to get these vehicles into SABoW. By adding the BMP and M113 in addition to having the Chieftain/Olifant would really open up Operation Hoopper and the Khuzestan Offensive campaigns in SABoW. As for funding why not make these vehicles paid DLC's? If charging for the BMP or M113 is questionable since community members have already worked on them I understand but it should be fine for the Chieftain or Olifant (both?). Or let us know what's needed funds wise and maybe we can make it happen with private donations? As far as the needed vehicle information I'm sure it can be obtained, Graviteam managed to do it with the M60 right?

All I can say is if this could happen I know I would repurchase SABoW at full price and buy the DLC's. If you want to float a test ballon there's always the poll option here at SimHQ.


"It's the man, not the machine" Gen Chuck Yeager
#4078647 - 02/14/15 06:30 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: godzilla1985]  
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Originally Posted By: godzilla1985
Do you mean limited resources in cash, information or both?

Who will do and who will pay for it. info is minor problem, does not arise until the previous two questions answered.

Originally Posted By: godzilla1985
SABoW has always had the potential to become a true classic like SFK42 or even Steel Beast Pro.

Do you mean philosophy or profit? smile

If phylosophy - SF and SB ways I do not like. I think both ways not have perspectives and SABOW way too, but we can change it.
If profit - SF and SABOW equal on sales (in those sources that we know).

Originally Posted By: godzilla1985

We all understood not much could be done in the early going because of UIG's involvement, but if that is coming to an end why not try to do just a little more then what was announced so far? I think 90% of SABoW players would agree that at the minimum 1 if not 3 vehicles already in SABoW need to become user playable if no addition campaigns are going to be added. Now two of these vehicles have already been started by community members (BMP and M113) but for various reason have stalled.

We do not plan to do a user-controlled vehicles with less quality than M60 and T-62. If you have a cockpit, animation, and the vehicle what is not made worse, and you're ready to give it to us (or know where to get this smile ) - there is something to talk about. If not, the fact is not yet to discuss now.



Originally Posted By: godzilla1985

So if I may inquire how much work do you feel it would take to use what's already been done by the modders, add whats missing, add it to the game code and get it into the game as user playable vehicles?

At first - right choice for vehicles.
Centurion and T-55, T-34 or M4 or PzIII is good, BT-5 and HaGo very good, T-72 and Chieftain is good but expensive, BRDM-2 is good but limited purpose. APCs is bad choice smile

Originally Posted By: godzilla1985

I'm sure the makers of these vehicle mods would be okay with you adding their work to yours to get these vehicles into SABoW. By adding the BMP and M113 in addition to having the Chieftain/Olifant would really open up Operation Hoopper and the Khuzestan Offensive campaigns in SABoW.

Where is Chieftain and Olifant with cockpits? smile
I agree that to be healthy and rich is better than poor and sick smile

Originally Posted By: godzilla1985

As for funding why not make these vehicles paid DLC's?

Where is funding? This is a first, main and alone question which destroys all dreams smile

Originally Posted By: godzilla1985

All I can say is if this could happen I know I would repurchase SABoW at full price and buy the DLC's. If you want to float a test ballon there's always the poll option here at SimHq.


I remind you that funding should be before work, but not after smile

Last edited by andrey12345; 02/14/15 06:32 PM.
#4078654 - 02/14/15 06:38 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: FlashBurn]  
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I can say in the case of my m113 playable it needs the interior model finished, the entire mesh needs a going over to update it (which I all ready did 2 years ago but is not unwrapped or textured), needs animations, and rigging to actually work right in game. Never could figure out all that stuff. Just got it sort of drivable with the recoiless rifle version got the M40 to be able to shoot right. The .50cal MG never worked right.


But I am doing the wait and see. I vary well may reopen my M38a1 jeep and see if I can get the damned thing playable. That would mean being aloud to command other forces when no tanks around. BUT animations, well there would not be any that would fit the actual model. But if it did work, doing something like a gaz jeep or land rover would be logical for the same reasons. As would perhaps something simple like a BTR152 etc. Not even going to think about tanks interiors...see below.

The conclusion I came too after working for months on the RO2 vehicle mode teams KV1...now totally defunct after TWI sort of took a big poop on the core of the team and since it was a group effort I can not really do anything with that model. Although it was looking DAMNED good despite some issues. Is that it is better to do smaller vehicles while working toward the big boys. Tank insides are incredibly complex (same for BMP1). They are hard to model without being able to get in the thing. A pain to unwrap the bits and pieces plus texture. And then the animations and rigging. So unless incredibly good reference material or being able to get in the vehicle with pictures and measurements its asking for mega pain. Simple APC's and jeep like vehicles are much more possible being as they are WAY more simple. Oh and really cool in their own right.

Final thought. My skill level vastly improved since I first set out to mod crap into SABOW. A round 2 does have a certain appeal.

#4078656 - 02/14/15 06:43 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: FlashBurn]  
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While playable apc's IS a poor choice in a tank sim, sabow is a bit different. Apc's fighting apc's is a different sort of crazy. biggrin




Just talking out loud. If a mod crazy pants round 2 does happen, assuming there is enough interest from old and maybe new players. Well maybe this time I try and form more a small modding team. If Andrey is saying he will stick in models into the game it removes a large barrier.

Last edited by FlashBurn; 02/14/15 06:49 PM.
#4078685 - 02/14/15 07:45 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: FlashBurn]  
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Originally Posted By: FlashBurn
While playable apc's IS a poor choice in a tank sim, sabow is a bit different. Apc's fighting apc's is a different sort of crazy. biggrin


This need little bit different gameplay and support in combat-interface for infantry management.
This is not impossible, but at the moment as it is - tanks better than APCs smile

#4078809 - 02/15/15 12:40 AM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: andrey12345]  
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Hi Andrey,
I think you missed this part of my post (or maybe you didn't?):

"Or let us know what's needed funds wise and maybe we can make it happen with private donations"

Now I'm not talking about vehicles not already in SABoW (T-72, Centurion etc) but ones that already are like the Chieftain and Olifent for reason's I've already presented. In the end it's up to you guy's at Graviteam what you do or don't do with SABoW. Well back to lurker mode, good luck guys smile .
Cheers.

Last edited by godzilla1985; 02/15/15 12:41 AM.

"It's the man, not the machine" Gen Chuck Yeager
#4078920 - 02/15/15 11:58 AM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: godzilla1985]  
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Originally Posted By: godzilla1985
Hi Andrey,
"Or let us know what's needed funds wise and maybe we can make it happen with private donations"

This way not worked.
For example a hundred times more than a simple matter - different voices for tank crew, from 2011 there is no progress in this direction.

In our case I do not believe. And in my opinion is wrong. Money from player side necessary to pay upon purchase, and not before. Otherwise inevitable disappointment that I gave the money - and got not what I wanted.


Originally Posted By: godzilla1985

Now I'm not talking about vehicles not already in SABoW (T-72, Centurion etc) but ones that already are like the Chieftain and Olifent for reason's I've already presented.

The presence in the game is not the most important issue.
For example to make a model and cockpit of BT-7 tank, it's easier than just the only cockpit to the already present Chieftain.

Originally Posted By: godzilla1985

In the end it's up to you guy's at Graviteam what you do or don't do with SABoW. Well back to lurker mode, good luck guys smile .
Cheers.

Thanks smile

#4080714 - 02/18/15 11:01 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: FlashBurn]  
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Readable texts in cockpit

#4080727 - 02/18/15 11:33 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: FlashBurn]  
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#4081455 - 02/20/15 04:47 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: godzilla1985]  
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Originally Posted By: godzilla1985
Hi Andrey,
I think you missed this part of my post (or maybe you didn't?):

"Or let us know what's needed funds wise and maybe we can make it happen with private donations"

Now I'm not talking about vehicles not already in SABoW (T-72, Centurion etc) but ones that already are like the Chieftain and Olifent for reason's I've already presented. In the end it's up to you guy's at Graviteam what you do or don't do with SABoW. Well back to lurker mode, good luck guys smile .
Cheers.


The Centurion is definitely in there.. :P

#4081600 - 02/21/15 01:01 AM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: whukid]  
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godzilla1985 Offline
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Originally Posted By: whukid
Originally Posted By: godzilla1985
Hi Andrey,
I think you missed this part of my post (or maybe you didn't?):

"Or let us know what's needed funds wise and maybe we can make it happen with private donations"

Now I'm not talking about vehicles not already in SABoW (T-72, Centurion etc) but ones that already are like the Chieftain and Olifent for reason's I've already presented. In the end it's up to you guy's at Graviteam what you do or don't do with SABoW. Well back to lurker mode, good luck guys smile .
Cheers.


The Centurion is definitely in there.. :P


Hi whukid,
Your right, but no offence as it doesn't seem to matter what's in there or not. Graviteams position seems pretty clear as far as extra armor content or new maps go for this version (upgrade?) of SABoW. Only hope is maybe this version will attract some modder or modding group who can figure it out, do the grunt work and offer up the completed work for Andrey to implement it into SABoW. Keeping my fingers crossed and probably hoping beyond hope smile
Cheers


"It's the man, not the machine" Gen Chuck Yeager
#4081627 - 02/21/15 02:06 AM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: godzilla1985]  
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Originally Posted By: godzilla1985
Originally Posted By: whukid
Originally Posted By: godzilla1985
Hi Andrey,
I think you missed this part of my post (or maybe you didn't?):

"Or let us know what's needed funds wise and maybe we can make it happen with private donations"

Now I'm not talking about vehicles not already in SABoW (T-72, Centurion etc) but ones that already are like the Chieftain and Olifent for reason's I've already presented. In the end it's up to you guy's at Graviteam what you do or don't do with SABoW. Well back to lurker mode, good luck guys smile .
Cheers.


The Centurion is definitely in there.. :P


Hi whukid,
Your right, but no offence as it doesn't seem to matter what's in there or not. Graviteams position seems pretty clear as far as extra armor content or new maps go for this version (upgrade?) of SABoW. Only hope is maybe this version will attract some modder or modding group who can figure it out, do the grunt work and offer up the completed work for Andrey to implement it into SABoW. Keeping my fingers crossed and probably hoping beyond hope smile
Cheers



I do not see that really happening as far as tanks go. Well if you mean with good quality interiors. Where talking at least 500 man hours here for 1 tank. Probably a lot more. BUT... if this shows a realitic tank sim is viable again. Which IMO is probably the best we can hope for. Well who knows..

More realistic maybe something like a new map/campaign DLC? That certainly seems possible to me. HMMMM M60? biggrin

#4081774 - 02/21/15 04:19 PM Re: SABOW Steel Armor Blaze of War screen shots [Re: FlashBurn]  
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Originally Posted By: FlashBurn
More realistic maybe something like a new map/campaign DLC? That certainly seems possible to me. HMMMM M60? biggrin


Exactly FB thumbsup

In the beginning when it became apparent we wouldn't get any new user playable armor in SABoW from Graviteam to use, many of us floated the ideal of at least more campaigns and more maps to use the M60 and T-62 in (some actually tried like you FB and whukid and I for one appreciated the effort). I was for this because of the M60 in particular since you could only use that piece of armor in one campaign. Nothing against the T-62 but I really purchased SABoW for the M60 experience (with some exceptions explained here in a bit). In all honesty why would you develop a tank sim featuring the M60 and T-62, do all the research and modeling for both, then only have one playable for all the campaigns and maps? Graviteam could have saved a lot of money and time by not wasting their resources on the M60 and just made a T-62 simulator like their T-72 simulator (T-72: Balkans on Fire). Would I have purchased SABoW if it only had the T-62 playable? Very probable since tank sim's are just rare and I enjoy them. If the savings from not doing the M60 would have been used for more content like maps and campaigns and an easy to use editor I know for sure I definitely would have bought SABoW san's the M60. We will probably never know if having the M60 user playable was Graviteams ideal or was UIG's requirement.
But back on topic, the response we got from Graviteam was more or less these reason's:
1). Because of UIG's involvement (and non-payment) Graviteam had no interest in doing anything further with SABoW (understandable but that shackle is apparently about to come off).
2). It wouldn't be historically correct to have the M60 in the other campaigns or the M60 and T-62 in "what if's" (the orc's and elves speech, sorry Andrey couldn't resist wink ) .
3). Money
Now anyone who has followed SABoW since the beginning remembers that game clip with the M60 and T-62 slugging it out on a European map (probably from K43 or Operration Star), and I know there was a lot of buzz about it (good not bad) but it was only later we found out the map was just used as a place setter frown
But in all honesty why not give SABoW some new maps from Operation Star? Offer up the DLC maps that followed for OP:Star as DLC's for SABoW, why not? As far as "Historically Correct" who actually cares if it's a "what if" ? As long as the combatants are using what was actually available to them at the time does it really matter where? Point and case is Steel Beast Pro, almost all their missions are "what if's" and I don't see any of their hardcore tread heads complaining (I know I don't). To a layman like myself I don't see how this could be "expensive" unless you go way overboard, keep it simple to start with, use what you already have then you could add more content as your making money from new SABoW sales and the DLC's or don't but give an editor that allows modders to make and add the gingerbread. The old but tried and true business adage applies here, you have to spend a little money in order to make (hopefully lot's of) money. Speaking just for myself if Gravi would do this I would:
1). Repurchase the new version of SABoW at full price.
2). Buy all the DLC's that were done for Operation:Star (or any others) that could be used in SABoW at full price.
3). Buy a separate, dedicated easy to use full mission editor that would allow me to craft my own missions and campaigns off the maps in the DLC's (reference Strike Fighters 2 for this one).
Am I made out of money, hell no. But I do allow myself a budget for my hobby and it goes to whomever is offering up what I want. Case and point I have $100.00 set aside in my hobby budget that is going to be used to buy DCS Bf109-K4 and MiG-21. Now if Gravi would offer up anything that I just suggested anyone want guess where that $100.00 would be used for instead?
Okay I'm off my soap box now.
Cheers

Last edited by godzilla1985; 02/21/15 05:23 PM.

"It's the man, not the machine" Gen Chuck Yeager
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