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#4100642 - 04/02/15 12:27 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: Allen]  
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Originally Posted By: Allen
What little rumor I've read about the new AMD X86 APU product (CPU+GPU on a die), makes it seem like they've tried to "move past" Intel's current and near future products.

Now, as a practical thing, Intel will probably stay in the lead on the CPU end. But, AMD has always lead Intel on the GPU. Overall, it could turn out to be an "evenly matched fight".

I hypothesized several years ago, that by roughly 2020, AMD and Intel would be effectively "tied" and have similar performing products at similar prices (much like AMD and Nvidia do now). That "prediction" was based on the fact that normal semiconductor materials are reaching their limits -- only a few die shrinks left -- so, on paper, Intel cannot stay ahead forever.

Maybe Zen actually will "close most of the gap" with Intel. If so, fun for an AMD fan and good for most Consumers (competition is good).

"Zen" does have to be released "on time", however (nominally 2016). We'll see.


(emphasis mine)

Actually, I think that plays to Intels favor. When smaller NM tech is no longer part of the chip evolution cycle, two options remain:

1. Change "the game", ie look to develop a radically new architecture taking us away from x86. This will require close partnership with lots of the major players out there, including MS and Apple, and various hardware manus. And lots of cash. Intel seems to have a marked history of doing this (USB anyone?). AMD, not to the same level.

2. Develop new materials (nano tech ftw!). This will require a massive investment, to both research the materials and to drastically revise the manufacturing process. Again, advantage Intel.

To be clear: I've nothing against AMD. I switched back to Teal (Blue/Green) after a red build simply because that combo works better for FSX. For a more normalized "workhorse" gaming build, I'd consider shopping red again. I do like how easy AMD made it to OC ye olde Phenom II though yep

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#4100743 - 04/02/15 03:21 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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AMD licenses x86 from Intel anyway, so they would likely license the new standard as well.

This is why AMD being bought = bad news for everyone.

If AMD is bought, they lose the x86 license from Intel, which means no more desktop CPUs or APUs they would have to stick with ARM / Mobile.

Which means Intel will have no direct competitor, which means high prices.

Last edited by SkateZilla; 04/02/15 03:31 PM.

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#4100821 - 04/02/15 05:36 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: AggressorBLUE]  
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Originally Posted By: AggressorBLUE
...Actually, I think that plays to Intels favor...


Agree that, in the long run, we should expect a "breakthrough" that leads to a new direction. As you surmise, most likely, the "breakthrough" will be from a company that can "afford to make a breakthrough" -- and that's unlikely to be AMD.

Still, practically speaking, a genuine "circuit material or technology" breakthrough that improves normally priced consumer products may be two or more decades away.

Looking farther: At about the two or three decade mark (or maybe 5 decades), like many, I hypothesize the "singularity" (or something close enough). At that point, sentient (or virtually sentient) computer AI will begin to take over for all human thought and technical progress will be quicker. Hopefully, that will ultimately be good for humans -- but, I hypothesize it won't be at first and possibly never given the inherent nature of politicians -- whoops, wrong forum for Politics smile

Anyhow, I won't be here to see it -- darn smile


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#4100895 - 04/02/15 07:48 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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Originally Posted By: SkateZilla


Which means Intel will have no direct competitor, which means high prices.


The real news is that the market is starting to contract enough that two companies in competition can't survive sufficiently well. Intel will raise prices as volumes decrease, regardless of competition.

The future of the PC was never going to be x86/x64 forever, but costs may force it to turn sooner rather than later.



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#4100910 - 04/02/15 08:21 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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AMD has warehouses full of FX chips and APUs, companies are refusing shipments as they are overstocked and not selling.

These chips will likely find their way to oem for extremely low prices.


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#4100929 - 04/02/15 08:49 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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Originally Posted By: SkateZilla
AMD has warehouses full of FX chips and APUs, companies are refusing shipments as they are overstocked and not selling.

These chips will likely find their way to oem for extremely low prices.



...or be tossed into locked dumpsters to be disposed of. nope


Often, companies will just 'burn' (sometimes literally) excess inventory, rather than shoot the replacing product in the foot with fire-sale pricing on the previous generation.


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#4100960 - 04/02/15 09:35 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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I know Intel litterally has a warehouse space full of older core2duo through pentium MMX chips..

So if skynet comes, they have older tech to fall back on.


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#4101383 - 04/03/15 07:44 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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New rumor:

AMD Zen x86-64 will support both SMT and CMT.

Ie Each Module will be 4cores, 2 of which will be laege high powered cores (higher IPC in Single thread and HyperThread/SMT), while the other 2 will be smaller integer cores. (For use with CMT.


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#4102212 - 04/06/15 01:24 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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Why would AMD support Country Music Television? Talk about a waste of time...




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#4102241 - 04/06/15 02:44 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: Jedi Master]  
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I just built a new machine using a Intel Core i5-4690K. When I was shopping for a cpu, I tried to look at every comparison, benchmark and testimonial I could find. I'm not brand loyal in any way so my perspective was strickly the most stable, high performance cpu that fit within my budget. I ended up going with the i5 and I'm very happy I did. It oc'ed stable @ 4.5ghz and ran cool there with only a DeepCool Lucifer V2 air cooler (although it appears to work as well as liquids twice it's price). In Arma 3, Assetto Corsa, IL-2, Falcon 4.0 and so on it runs all games at ultra settings using a Gigabyte GeForce 970 and the cpu @3.5ghz brilliantly and I really don't even see a need to oc it for what "I" do. It doesn't stutter, choke or slowdown and I'm running it at factory clock until I have a reason not to.

Conversely, my BIL is an AMD loyalist and never in the past would even consider a Intel cpu EVER. He was over visiting and I let him run through the games I currently have installed and he was astounded at the level of performance versus the money I spent. This has always been AMD's mantra, giving it's customers the most "bang for the buck" and I don't believe that applies anymore. In the past the AMD machines I had lived up to that standard, but Intel has really hurt them with the "K" chipsets. They oc easy, they run cool and they perform at a relatively low cost. I think Amd still has a decent foothold in the low budget gaming world, but in middle to high end builds their presence there seems to be fading away. Just my humble opinion ofcourse, your mileage may vary. cheers

#4102321 - 04/06/15 06:49 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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If you want to spend under $150 on any given component, I think AMD can be good bang for the buck compared to what Intel gives. If you're willing to spend over $250, AMD can't match it. Your BIL probably spent less on his by far, and I'm betting that if he spent the same amount on Intel he'd get even worse performance than he does now.

If cost is your overriding concern, you can get good performance from AMD for what little you spend. If smooth gameplay is equally important, and you upgrade bits and pieces as opposed to doing the whole thing at once, you can get much better out of Intel.

Of course, if you insist on having multiple PCs to pay to maintain, then AMD becomes even more attractive because saving $75 on one CPU isn't nearly as big as saving it on 3 or more. However, in a single PC scenario, Intel will win unless you're unwise about where you buy stuff from and what you're buying.




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#4102387 - 04/06/15 09:21 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: Jedi Master]  
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Originally Posted By: Jedi Master
If you want to spend under $150 on any given component, I think AMD can be good bang for the buck compared to what Intel gives. If you're willing to spend over $250, AMD can't match it. Your BIL probably spent less on his by far, and I'm betting that if he spent the same amount on Intel he'd get even worse performance than he does now.

If cost is your overriding concern, you can get good performance from AMD for what little you spend. If smooth gameplay is equally important, and you upgrade bits and pieces as opposed to doing the whole thing at once, you can get much better out of Intel.

Of course, if you insist on having multiple PCs to pay to maintain, then AMD becomes even more attractive because saving $75 on one CPU isn't nearly as big as saving it on 3 or more. However, in a single PC scenario, Intel will win unless you're unwise about where you buy stuff from and what you're buying.

The Jedi Master


I generally agree with all this, but regarding the point on the last item about multiple PCs; if you need to buy and setup multiple machines I agree. But as AMD is likely to see you needing an upgrade before intel, but mainly because I've found Intel CPUs have a longer useful life as gaming workhorses, so when they retire they're "service life" (including that of the mobo and other support components) is often more used up.

Case in point, when I was building my first DIY desktop with a Phenom II X4 back around 2010, My little brother was still happily using his DT with an Intel Q660, which he bought from iBuypower in 2008. That rig lasted through 3 or 4 GPU upgrades (the last GPU being carried over to a new rig I built for him) and kept him happy. Eventually he started getting odd heat spikes on the cores, and decided it was time to upgrade the whole kit in 2013. It probably just needed a new CPU cooler (the liquid one IBP put on was well past due for an upgrade, considering the thing never got it's dust filter cleaned).

The same year, I decided to upgrade my Phenom, which just wasn't cutting it in my CPU intensive games. (I also was getting tired of the driver headaches that came with the AMD cards around that time, and didn't want to run an nvidia card with an AMD CPU, which made the choice easier). The Phenom just didn't have the legs of the Intel CPU. That said, my current intel rig is still going strong, and I feel no reason to upgrade any of my kit, save for the power supply (it's about that time). The kit of the AMD still sits in my basement.

The point here being, your likely to find yourself in a multi-device house hold with AMD, as you'll want to upgrade before the machines service life is up, but you're more likely to hang in for the long haul.

Of course, I also have a laptop that sees service as a backup PC from 2008 with a core 2 Duo, which could still do daily office work if my DT wasn't around. So I guess that shoots down my theory smile


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#4102403 - 04/06/15 10:24 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: Jedi Master]  
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Originally Posted By: Jedi Master
Why would AMD support Country Music Television? Talk about a waste of time...




The Jedi Master


SMT = Simultaneouw Multi-Threading (ie Intel and Hyperthreading).
CMT = Clustered Multi-Threading (ie AMD FX Modules)


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#4103762 - 04/09/15 03:17 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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Reviews on Intel's Core M are not so good so far,

If AMD can put out a decept CHIP this year, they can have a nice boost.


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#4104923 - 04/11/15 08:41 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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So More "Leaks"/Rumors
-16 Zen Cores
-SMT for 32 Threads
-Greenland GPU Stream Processors
-Up to 16GB HBM for Graphics Memory
-DDR4 Quad Channel 3400MHz
-256GB Per Channel
-8 MB of L2 Cache (512kb Per Core)
-32 MB of L3 Cache
-64 PCIe Gen 3 Lanes
-14 SATA Lanes


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#4105546 - 04/13/15 02:17 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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You can never have too much cache.






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#4107687 - 04/17/15 01:03 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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As expected AMD reports significantly low Q1 finacials...
Ends conract with Seasonic abd leaves dense server market.


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#4109746 - 04/21/15 07:21 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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Server Market CPU without Greenland GPU will have 32 Cores...


Ahhhhhhhh I wants it now....

2016...boooooo


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#4112392 - 04/27/15 04:13 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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R9-390X 8GB will use Dual Link Interposer to stack 8GB of HBM,

No dual GPUs :-)


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#4112512 - 04/27/15 08:46 PM Re: The Future And Current Status of AMD... [Re: SkateZilla]  
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So apparently only the 390 and 395 are new architecture and the 380 and others will be rebranded 2xx?

I wasn't thrilled when nvidia released the 770 as an OC'd 680, to do the same thing...




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