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#4018286 - 10/05/14 06:21 AM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaing for BoS? [Re: Sokol1]  
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Charlie_SB Offline
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Originally Posted By: Sokol1


He 111 has a bug in Campaing, they are looking at it.

Reminder - All unlock progress done this month will be reseted at release date, to allow new non-founders buyers start the game in equals conditions.

Sokol1


I'm looking forward to it getting fixed but if I don't get to fly it from the proper airfield then I'll stick with the Stuka. If you only get to fly lead for a flight and never have to do any formation flying then there is not much fun in flying a big bomber.

I don't care about the unlocks, I'm only going to fly the axis bombers and they will be unlocked in the first hour of play. I'll just storm through the tutorial to get a feel for my setup and then I'll be ready for phase one in my 111 or 87.

-C-

#4018302 - 10/05/14 08:31 AM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaing for BoS? [Re: theOden]  
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Originally Posted By: theOden
Originally Posted By: Rivet
..
It was hard work. No, not the missions - the will to keep playing. The big yellow messages popping up all the time are a big turn off. Then there is the "GO TO NEXT WAYPOINT" messages. Uh well ok, duh! Thanks for telling me. I'd never have worked that one out for myself. Turning to the "next" waypoint here it goes again - "GO TO NEXT WAYPOINT"
..

smile

I honestly don't think we who flew IL2-46 are the intended customer group for this.


I've been thinking about this after playing the first 6 missions of the new SP Campaign, and as Rivet points out a lot of this billboard stuff and messaging is really pretty bad. I got my pilots license at the age of 16 IRL and I would have found this BoS stuff juvenile even at 16. It really seems like its aimed at the 10-12 age bracket which surprises me for this type of game (notice I didn't say "sim"). I figured their youth movement would be aimed at teens and young adults, but this is really bordering on the kiddie market, yet the subject matter is clearly not kiddie market material. Oh well, go figure...


Dogfighting is what you do "after" you drop your bombs and blow something up!
Can you say "JABO!" thumbsup
#4018392 - 10/05/14 03:05 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaing for BoS? [Re: Sokol1]  
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Rivet Offline
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Exactly right Bucksnort. Juvenile is the right word. And yes, it is difficult trying to figure out what they envisaged as their intended market isn't it? dizzy


Originally Posted By: Sokol1

Reminder - All unlock progress done this month will be reseted at release date, to allow new non-founders buyers start the game in equals conditions.

Sokol1


Thanks for that snippet of info. It saves me a lot of wasted time. So it's not worth playing until release and it's very doubtful after that unless they see reason (also doubtful) and scrap this imbecilic arcade stuff.


Newsflash!
A reliable source has obtained leaked information which reveals that discussions are taking place about a possible merger between a certain Flight Combat game development house and the well established Fisher Price toy company. I can today, reveal if the merger is successful plans have already been tabled for the development of a new Uber fighter which, it is promised will be authentic in every detail and will be included in the existing campaign as long as you have the experience points to unlock it.

Sources say that it will be very twitchy to fly but extremely maneuverable due to it's miniscule wing surfaces. However, it's huge landing gear makes it a breeze to land. Armament? That's still classified so in the meantime you'll just have to use harsh language to down your opponents. It is unclear as yet what LEVEL of pilot you will have to level up to but because of its twitchy nature level 48 is expected to be a minimum requirement.

Here is the first leaked image of the new proposed uber fighter.


Shhhhhh! It's supposed to be secret. hahaha

Last edited by Rivet; 10/05/14 03:21 PM.
#4018399 - 10/05/14 03:48 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaing for BoS? [Re: Rivet]  
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Originally Posted By: Rivet





Sadly that sums up what 777 did with the IL2 name. :/

#4018401 - 10/05/14 03:55 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaing for BoS? [Re: HeinKill]  
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Rivet Offline
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Exactly my point. It's a truly sad state of affairs for us flight simmers and the future of good combat flight sims.

#4018424 - 10/05/14 05:53 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaing for BoS? [Re: Rivet]  
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I really feel ripped off. I paid $90 for this garbage under the assumption it would be at least on par with ROF

#4018428 - 10/05/14 06:03 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaing for BoS? [Re: HeinKill]  
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Originally Posted By: HeinKill
Originally Posted By: 777 Studios - Jason
Let me make something clear. There is NO free version of BOS planned. Correct your post here and on your blog Heinkill.

Jason


Uh, No.

Your video: "In the future we can say we probably plan to make a version with only two planes unlocked from the beginning, and all other planes, like six of them, need to be opened by the gameplay..."

Your other title, Rise of Flight, also comes in a version with two planes, and is free to play. So, what price will the BoS game with two planes be? Happy to change my post when you clarify.

PS, not my blog anymore. Hasnt been for months. Suggest you make a request to James on the blog. You might want to try the 'please' word. Just a tip.



That's how jason is...
I asked this question and got a response basically asking me if I'm an idiot.

#4018432 - 10/05/14 06:15 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaing for BoS? [Re: HeinKill]  
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Personally I find the sim to be good fun, great looking visually, without view distance problems, great sounding ... I mean really great. It feels good to fly, it has a good selection of aircraft, consistent cockpit quality, good damage modelling. Not to mention the excellent development project they have run. I'd bet a high number of anyone who ever worked in a development project would have said this would be impossible. Really a first rate job all the way no matter what, that is a fact.

Sure we might disagree with some design decisions but to call this a sad state of affairs for flight simmers is a lie. It's rather a great platform to add content to for many years to come.

Now I'm off to bomb something in my new paintjob and unlock the mexican horn for my Stuka.



Adios muchachos!

-C-

#4018436 - 10/05/14 06:16 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaign for BoS? [Re: HeinKill]  
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Rivet Offline
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It may not be much consolation, but you're not alone in that respect shadylurker.

The decisions they've taken with this one, well.......... I think this song sums it up pretty well if you just substitute my slightly altered lyrics.




You took the Wrong Step Months Ago Or The BOS song

Think about the things that you should have done before
The way things are going the game is about to fall.
You took the wrong step months ago
You took the wrong step months ago
You took the wrong step months ago

Look around and see the warnings close at hand
Already players are writing their scriptures in the sand
You took the wrong step months ago
You took the wrong step months ago
You took the wrong step months ago

The morning sun is rising, casting rays across the land,
Already players are calling, take heed of our warnings,
You took the wrong step months ago
You took the wrong step months ago
You took the wrong step months ago

Think about the things that you should have done before
The way things are going the game is about to fall.
You took the wrong step months ago
You took the wrong step months ago
You took the wrong step months ago


With apologies to Hawkwind.

Last edited by Rivet; 10/05/14 06:24 PM.
#4018442 - 10/05/14 06:35 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaign for BoS? [Re: HeinKill]  
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Rivet Offline
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You're entitled to your opinion of course Charlie. However, I did not say that the sounds, aircraft, graphics, flight model or view distance for that matter are in any way less than a great achievement. For me at least and likely many others, the decision to go the arcade route for a highly anticipated gameplay element i.e. single player campaign, is extremely disappointing.

Anyway, enjoy your game. salute

P.S. Disagree with me by all means, but please don't call me a liar. Right or wrong I just stated my opinion just as everyone else is free to do. Yes I'm disappointed and it probably shows.

#4018445 - 10/05/14 06:39 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaign for BoS? [Re: shadylurker]  
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HeinKill Offline
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Originally Posted By: shadylurker
Originally Posted By: HeinKill
Originally Posted By: 777 Studios - Jason
Let me make something clear. There is NO free version of BOS planned. Correct your post here and on your blog Heinkill.

Jason


Uh, No.

Your video: "In the future we can say we probably plan to make a version with only two planes unlocked from the beginning, and all other planes, like six of them, need to be opened by the gameplay..."

Your other title, Rise of Flight, also comes in a version with two planes, and is free to play. So, what price will the BoS game with two planes be? Happy to change my post when you clarify.

PS, not my blog anymore. Hasnt been for months. Suggest you make a request to James on the blog. You might want to try the 'please' word. Just a tip.



That's how jason is...
I asked this question and got a response basically asking me if I'm an idiot.


Yes, when I think of the 1C/777 PR approach to their customers I think 'Honey Badger'.



But not in a funny way.

H


[Linked Image]
#4018457 - 10/05/14 07:17 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaign for BoS? [Re: HeinKill]  
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Though there are plenty of issues and lack of features to ROF/BOS, the main problem has always been the game engine it was built upon.

Just as I suspected from those that did try the campaign, the atmosphere is completely lifeless with one the highest plane count I've heard of thus far being 4 planes in a campaign mission.

The game engine simply cannot support many objects and AI planes. I've harped on this for years as this is backbone for mission building, campaigns, and MP alike. So now you're left with the same type of baron wasteland you had in ROF where the only objects at all are in pre-defined flight paths with little or no action.

There's campaign missions that have been made for IL246/IL2COD that have well over 100 planes and thousands of objects. They are down right immersive in that regard.

So regardless of what they do with the unlocking, grinding, XP points, power-ups or whatever until the core engine of the game can at least handle 1/10th of what a flight sim did back in 2001, it will always remain this way.

I remember telling everyone the Mission Builder would not be released to the puplic (and this was long before the game could even be purchased) until long after release. With the reason being those old hands and mission builders from IL2 that tried it would find out the same very thing early.

I've asked every single one of foks with the blinders on that say I'm wrong to make a mission like the one below (just one single mission) in ROF/BOS, to show me I'm wrong, and not a single person has been able to do it in over 5 years.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mg8fC3APmfA

And Cliffs since it's based of 46 can obviously handle the same.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBa2Tl8NtT8&list=UUeR4h3wGW9XFa5S57kxThgA

So even with these major gripes people are having now, I'm sorry to say you're going to be in for a rude awakening when you finally do have access to the mission builder and see just how limited it all is. One of these days the devs are going to realize part of the reason for success is longevity and one of the biggest reason's for IL2's longevity, and in turn the people that created all the content for it, was because of it's ability in the 1st place.

It has the ultimate sandbox and people could do and create w/e they wanted. It sold more copies in the CFS market than any other sim ever made. And the devs think their marketing strategy is to go after the complete opposite of that with restrictions and unlocks? While good farkin' luck with that idea. They haven't listened to me in 5 years, so I don't expect them to start doing it now.

Hell, in MP we have more people on a single team on our server than BoS even allows for the entire server in the 1st place. It just means this is just so backwards in virtually everything we're used to as core flight simmers.




Last edited by ATAG_Bliss; 10/05/14 08:29 PM.
#4018488 - 10/05/14 09:57 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaign for BoS? [Re: HeinKill]  
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Well I still hope they can tweak and optimise after launch. There's a good game buried in there.

Had a fling in BoS MP tonight. Very easy to get into, get airborne and get to the action. Simpler and more user friendly interface than CoD. But only about 80 players online at 1900 CET, globally, across all servers during what should be prime time. There were regularly 200 or so before the last patch which p'd people off so much. Hope they come back.

The SP campaign isn't much, but again better than what shipped w CoD. I bow to your knowledge if RoF, havent spent much time on it myself...but can only hope BoS is not RoF.

H


[Linked Image]
#4018529 - 10/05/14 11:42 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaign for BoS? [Re: HeinKill]  
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Lipfert Offline
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Hail,

I will repeat my post of the BoS forum, I have zero interest in this unlock concept.

Regards,


JG1 Lipfert - Jagdgeschwader 1 "Fritz Schmenkel" "Oesau" "Richthofen"
#4018554 - 10/06/14 12:48 AM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaign for BoS? [Re: HeinKill]  
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Bliss, have you guys fixed the problem with planes flying through trees like they don't exist?

#4018568 - 10/06/14 01:16 AM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaign for BoS? [Re: HeinKill]  
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Originally Posted By: HeinKill
Well I still hope they can tweak and optimise after launch. There's a good game buried in there.

Had a fling in BoS MP tonight. Very easy to get into, get airborne and get to the action. Simpler and more user friendly interface than CoD. But only about 80 players online at 1900 CET, globally, across all servers during what should be prime time. There were regularly 200 or so before the last patch which p'd people off so much. Hope they come back.

The SP campaign isn't much, but again better than what shipped w CoD. I bow to your knowledge if RoF, havent spent much time on it myself...but can only hope BoS is not RoF.

H



They can't tweak and optimize the faulty foundation of it all. At least 1/2 of the problem is the ET phone home master browser that is essentially the umbilical cord of the whole thing. When it's data transfer has a hickup or is at max capacity, it all goes to hell in a handbasket. Even at 50 players, I'm already reading all the reports of all the server hanging and crashing etc, which almost always were directly related to the master browser. It's why all the ROF servers had to run a batch file to keep the servers up.

But regardless, they haven't changed the engine. It's essentially ROF in WWII clothing. That's why trim isn't even able to be on an axis etc. Same existing fundamental issues that ROF had basically.

I would imagine their game plan is to get as many people buying it during and after release before they finally hand out the mission editor to the masses, all the while keeping a tight ship on performance on the MP servers that are already there. That way when the proverbial sh!t hits the fan, they've collected as much as they can from it already.

#4018575 - 10/06/14 01:34 AM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaign for BoS? [Re: HeinKill]  
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KodiakJac Offline
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Originally Posted By: HeinKill
There's a good game buried in there.


Even with all my moaning and groaning, I absolutely agree with this. I hope 1C sees the sim market as lucrative enough to build an interface for the age 16+ crowd at some point. The graphics, sound, and FM's are there already, so it's not like they have to start over. There's no reason a grown up version can't co-exist with their current game version.


Dogfighting is what you do "after" you drop your bombs and blow something up!
Can you say "JABO!" thumbsup
#4018582 - 10/06/14 01:42 AM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaign for BoS? [Re: HeinKill]  
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Originally Posted By: KrustyvonKlown
Bliss, have you guys fixed the problem with planes flying through trees like they don't exist?


Ah, that dammed ghost trees!!!

I hear that this "bug" is unfixable - a fired programmer destroyed the relative code (Mr. M?) - so the practical solution is "Turn OFF trees" option in menu. No trees, no ghost. biggrin wink

Due these ghost the MOD team will make in future some Mediterranean scenery, you know, all sand and no (ghost) trees, and will use some telephone poles disguised as palm trees. Be careful with them. wink

Actually some guys use fly above these ghost trees, but despite fool - after all if they are ghost, why fly above? - this is not "historically" since in BoB the majority of flights were made below 10 feet altitude, and even under 3 in CAS missions... Due this the British and Luftwaffe planes use some dark green in their camouflages. wink

BTW - One guy say that near Dover are a place in the Cliffs that is possible start fly under the trees roots, but despite blow dozen of planes in a supposed railroad tunnel entry I am not able to find the right spot... nope

I suppose this is the "never seem before" feature that Mr.Shevchenko ("RiP") promised at one time. cool

#4018801 - 10/06/14 05:04 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaign for BoS? [Re: KodiakJac]  
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Itkovian Offline
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Originally Posted By: Bucksnort
Originally Posted By: HeinKill
There's a good game buried in there.


Even with all my moaning and groaning, I absolutely agree with this. I hope 1C sees the sim market as lucrative enough to build an interface for the age 16+ crowd at some point. The graphics, sound, and FM's are there already, so it's not like they have to start over. There's no reason a grown up version can't co-exist with their current game version.


To be fair, the GUI in general is very slick and very well designed. You can tell there's been some real effort to develop a modern design (and clearly has touch screens in mind, for some reason)... the main issue is not the interface design itself, but how our exposure to the "nuts and bolts" is limited.

For example, we need to be able to select waypoints and see more info about them (speed, altitude, and so on), and get more details on the debriefing. These are all things that could be added to the current design (much like an expert campaign mode could be).

That said, the core of the simulator is about as slick as I've ever seen on release. Everything just worked out of the "box", once I got my controls configured. Graphics/FM/DM are excellent... I've rarely felt as confident about a simulator's stability as I do with BOS.

I certainly DO hope that plans for a more immersive campaign are in the works, but I'm betting it'll have to wait for user-generated content (like PWCG for RoF). It's not like there's _any_ simulator out there which did better (CloD is just a mess, and requires years and Gigs of community work to make it a good sim, and it's single player content is still lacking, for example).

Personally I'm satisfied that things will improve and more details added in time. Sims tend to depend on post-release improvements a lot, as well as user generated content.

#4018857 - 10/06/14 07:29 PM Re: Poll: What do you think of the Single Player Campaign for BoS? [Re: Itkovian]  
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Originally Posted By: Itkovian
Originally Posted By: Bucksnort
Originally Posted By: HeinKill
There's a good game buried in there.


Even with all my moaning and groaning, I absolutely agree with this. I hope 1C sees the sim market as lucrative enough to build an interface for the age 16+ crowd at some point. The graphics, sound, and FM's are there already, so it's not like they have to start over. There's no reason a grown up version can't co-exist with their current game version.


To be fair, the GUI in general is very slick and very well designed. You can tell there's been some real effort to develop a modern design (and clearly has touch screens in mind, for some reason)... the main issue is not the interface design itself, but how our exposure to the "nuts and bolts" is limited.

For example, we need to be able to select waypoints and see more info about them (speed, altitude, and so on), and get more details on the debriefing. These are all things that could be added to the current design (much like an expert campaign mode could be).

That said, the core of the simulator is about as slick as I've ever seen on release. Everything just worked out of the "box", once I got my controls configured. Graphics/FM/DM are excellent... I've rarely felt as confident about a simulator's stability as I do with BOS.

I certainly DO hope that plans for a more immersive campaign are in the works, but I'm betting it'll have to wait for user-generated content (like PWCG for RoF). It's not like there's _any_ simulator out there which did better (CloD is just a mess, and requires years and Gigs of community work to make it a good sim, and it's single player content is still lacking, for example).

Personally I'm satisfied that things will improve and more details added in time. Sims tend to depend on post-release improvements a lot, as well as user generated content.


Did you not read anything above your post? People hoping for player made content might be slapped in the face when they realize the engine cant handle anything over a quick mission builder. Read man, read. Aside from 777 controlling what mods can put out there (since everything is controlled from their server), you also have a lot of people who made/make content for flight sims, getting frustrated with decisions being made. You really seem to have glossed over a lot.

And are you seriously saying the player made content for CLoD is still lacking after you just stated that gigs of community (i.e. player made content) made it worth it? Ever hear of the Team Fusion campaign? Just like PWCG. Ever heard of the brilliant Redux campaign by Heinkill? Ever hear of Malta? Did you not see the preivew of the next TF patch? I assume you have no idea what you are talking about here.

As far as BoS working right out the gate, sure. Then again so did the Ford Pinto, but that didnt make it fun to drive. I agree the basic game of BoS works, but thats about all I can say. Everything else is patch-work, from the sound engine, to the graphics settings, to the MP and to the "campaign". Basically saying everything works is relative to what you look for in a game I guess.

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