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#3996043 - 08/15/14 04:16 PM Re: Military Monday - 11th August [Re: Meatsheild]  
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,389
Taosenai Offline
Arma 3 Stuff Maker
Taosenai  Offline
Arma 3 Stuff Maker
Member

Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,389
U.S.A.
Good comments all around. Let me write up an AAR on Mortargate from the leadership position so everyone can have a full perspective.

It was not my intention to lead from the Strider on Mortargate -- it was my intention to drive the Strider. As the squad-level leadership slot was not filled, I volunteered to lead from that slot so we could move past mission select.

After staging the fire teams and engaging targets in the open with the Strider from the saddle in the hills, I moved the vehicle up to provide fire support and deployable smoke cover for the infantry as we assaulted down the road into the first house complexes on the southern edge of town. A technical raced in and the Strider HMG hosed it down. That went fine. I ordered infantry to clear the southern complexes and set up to return fire into the main part of town while the vehicle provided smoke to cover their movement and heavy gun support. At about that time the Strider nearly took an RPG-42 hit and I was forced to move it into cover where I had no visibility of the fire teams moving through my smoke.

When I brought the Strider back out, infantry had already assaulted deeper into town even though my order was to hold and engage at range from the complexes nearby, which I'm not sure were ever swept and cleared. (At least I'm fairly sure I gave those instructions.) Since I didn't see a need to order a retreat, I cautiously moved the Strider up to provide extra firepower down the long streets, relying on infantry to protect me from AT weapons.

We suddenly started to take indirect fire, with increasing accuracy. I assessed the situation, determined that the nearby mosque complex would probably not be shelled (for role-playing reasons), ordered the fire teams to take cover inside its high walls and defend the position until the mortars were found and neutralized, and asked that Bravo team immediately send me two men to go in the Strider as rapid-response to the mortar site, which had been marked via counter-battery (role-playing).

I should have been given two men nearly instantly, but the Bravo fire team leader must have been dead/wounded or not heard/understood my intent, since it took a long time for me to get a dude in the Strider, and even then I only got one man. Other fire teams seemed hesitant to go in the mosque complex in spite of my command. I decided that, with mortars still falling and closing, one man would have to do, and left town with the Strider to make an assault on the mortar site. We approached with a hill between us and the tubes. I dismounted infantry behind the hill then moved the Strider up the rise, allowing the MG to clear defenders outside the walled complex.

After "a brave charge employing cold steel" and without a battle buddy the lone Bravo volunteer died, but not before killing the mortarmen. I dismounted and cautiously found and killed his assailant, then brought the Strider back to the town.

At this point infantry had not only left the highly defensible mosque without their fire support vehicle, but had split up and assaulted into different parts of the town. Without infantry to protect the Strider in an urban environment I drove it into a narrow courtyard and called for a rally. The rally eventually happened, but not before the last bad guys were killed and the mission resolved.

Leading from the Strider driver seat was not ideal, but neither was sitting at the mission select screen until someone stepped up. I think I gave well-formulated commands in any case. The problem was that without me personally being there to show the forward limit of the push, they weren't carried out. My commands were clear -- especially about holding inside the walls of the mosque, which wouldn't be shelled (an obvious and, AFAIK, respected hint to the Zeus) -- but they weren't followed by my FTLs. Certainly that creates a feeling of disorganization.


----

Some other insights. On the mission which I first joined, I took the Zeus slot. I used it to order around a few enemies who I thought had taken up cheesy positions and clean up some prone guys in bushes. When the Marid moved out into the open, I took command of the gunner so that every single human player didn't get slaughtered. It had thermal sights, a .50cal, a 40mm AGL, and a perfect line of fire. You all had an RPG-42 and about one minute of blessed life remaining without my loving intervention against the AI. After a minute or two, when I heard that no AT engagement was going to made against the Marid, I fired the HMG and walked some 40mm shells up near friendly positions, then shelled those positions with 40mm once everyone was clear. Once everyone had moved out of the Marid's kill zone, I was able to back out and watch until you went to make an attack on it, then I took the gunner seat again so you didn't all get instantly 40mm'd straight to heck on the road's edge. I also made those eagle-eyed dudes up on the windmill fire their guns more and launch an ill-aimed RPG so you could find them sooner. I took control of the officer dude at the very end, intending to do a full player-controlled last stand -- then I stuck my head out on a balcony and got domed instantly. Some last stand by him.

Arma 3's combat vehicles are unfun garbage. They all have the same boring weapon loadout with thermal sights and no vulnerabilities to anything except AT weapons. If you're going to include anything that can't be destroyed by underslung 40mm or rifle fire, IMO players should have the Titan or the TMR NLAW so they just hose those things and move on. Otherwise there needs to be CAS or Zeus artillery available.


Taosenai, TMR Modular Realism Developer
"It is necessary to develop a strategy that utilizes all the physical conditions and elements that are directly at hand. The best strategy relies upon an unlimited set of responses."
-- Ueshiba Morihei
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#3997034 - 08/17/14 03:00 PM Re: Military Monday - 11th August [Re: Fridge]  
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,085
fatty Offline
Senior Member
fatty  Offline
Senior Member

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,085
Brussels, Belgium
Originally Posted By: Fridge
2) We need to restrict the combined arms missions. In my view, the only combined arms missions we should be doing is where the vehicle or armor elements are support, like the medics - there when you need them. In my view, and I am not trying to compare this to how things are done in real life, having infantry supporting the armor means having 10+ guys following along while 1-2 get all the kills. I know this is not about the kills but having an infantry team sit isn't much fun gameplay wise. Support elements, like medics, should expect to get few kills ... the fun is in how you help out your team and help them do good. I don't want to remove combined arms but I think that infantry and gameplay needs to be the focus;

Let me say upfront that I haven't played ArmA3 for a long time, particularly not since Zeus and a few other goodies were released. You raise a good point about balancing, but I'd like to chime in about how awesome the experience is in a combined arms mission when all elements are mutually supportive and the challenge is steep.

The magic formula for balance was, as I recall, sort of a rock-paper-scissors model; air had AA to worry about, armour had fortified or concealed ATGMs and other armour, et cetera. Whenever I get nostalgic for this experience, I like to watch these videos. This was a large-scale scenario by SimHQ standards: a Marine rifle squad seizing a town with M1A2, AV-8B, and sniper team support. I'm blowing my own horn a bit as I designed this scenario, but this was one of the best executed missions and epic experiences in my Military Monday memories. A lot of credit goes to Magnum for his tight leadership and coordination of the different elements. The tank definitely made a decisive difference (look at Jedi's score at the end), but you can see no one element is running away and dominating the mission.




"...for who are so free as the sons of the waves?"
#3997950 - 08/19/14 02:30 PM Re: Military Monday - 11th August [Re: Meatsheild]  
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 49,716
Jedi Master Offline
Entil'zha
Jedi Master  Offline
Entil'zha
Sierra Hotel

Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 49,716
Space Coast, USA
The tank always gets a high score against inf because it can mow them down without having to duck. smile

However, without inf support it can't see 360 and can take hits from AT weapons that are quite deadly. Just last night that happened with the tank almost being lost (right tread and both crew severely injured) when the tank was hit from behind by a rooftop SPG-9 the infantry missed. Plus tanks are naturally hindered in an urban environment anyway.




The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
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