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#3991745 - 08/06/14 04:26 PM New players wanting to make ED like Eve!  
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Mace71 Offline
Dread pirate Mace
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Look at the official forums and its full of posts and polls by new Standard beta players who want to get rid of the solo play and group/friends play and only have online! One even, who just bought today, had the audacity to say we should 'learn to play' and stop being carebears.

I have faith that FD will ignore these Eve players as I do not want Elite becoming anything like Eve, hate the game.


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#3991747 - 08/06/14 04:34 PM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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meh
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I like the way it is now. The game is not about pvp and never has been really. The main focus is on SP and coop with other humans thrown in to keep it exciting (if you want). I doubt ED caves in to those people.


And we as its creators don't feel ready to hear your annoyed jabber about it.
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#3991753 - 08/06/14 04:50 PM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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Peally Offline
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They're just having a hard time understanding why someone wouldn't want to play with them and their idiotic superiority complex.


Scully: Victim died of multiple stab wounds.
Mulder: *throws her a file* Ever heard of the knife alien?
#3991765 - 08/06/14 05:29 PM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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Moses Offline
I have a Rather Large
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roflol


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#3991784 - 08/06/14 06:15 PM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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DaveKelly Offline
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Buckley North Wales
I have every faith that Frontier will not change to suit them after reading Mike Evens reply to the "Yaw is nerfed" thread see below

Originally Posted by Mike Evans
Indeed, a request is just that. We don't have to do anything if we don't want to but that doesn't mean we didn't read and consider the request. Suffice to say a low yaw rate is a fundamental part of our games aesthetics and a corner stone to our flight model that we at frontier like the way it is. We're not changing it, for to do so would be to compromise our own vision for what Elite: Dangerous is and what it's going to be. I don't give a damn what all the other space games have done in the past, nor do I care that our yaw rates are apparently even slower than a plane's is (though every time I've tried doing a pure yaw turn in IL-2 I've stalled my plane before I got anything that even resembled a steady and fast turn rate). Fast yaw and pitch in a space game is a video game trope of the highest order along with banner arrows sliding around the screen and compasses telling you where to fly all the time. I'm almost certain that other developers just implement those features because they've been so prevalent rather than actually reassessing whether the game needed them or could be even better without them! We found for example that the compass that pointed you towards your target at all times made combat too easy to end in stalemate of circling. As soon as we tried removing it all of a sudden it was more exciting to fight someone because they could give you the slip whilst you weren't glancing at your sensors and even if you did pay attention to the sensors the difference in the way the information is presented can still mean you don't quite stay on the target's tail perfectly, again providing more opportunities for them to turn the tide of the battle.

Suffice to say we wanted Elite to feel like star wars in terms of how the ships move by banking/rolling and pitching through manoeuvres opposed to the yaw and pitch based FPS style movement most other space games offered (where roll plays little or no part). That limitation to having to do your main directional change manoeuvring by pitching makes the flight path taken to be more cinematic and means a skilled player can predict the manoeuvres of an opponent in advanced by observing their current roll position relative to themselves only. So long as they match the roll quickly enough they can always follow through the inevitable pitch manoeuvre effectively and maintain the chase. If the target could yaw or pitch effectively then it's much harder to assess what they're going to do as they're current roll position doesn't really matter any more.

Finally realism has played no part whatsoever in any of our design discussions about the flight model. We don't care what would be realistic as we only care what the game play experience is when flying these ships and so far we feel we're hitting the right notes for the majority of our audience.


DD_crash
#3991785 - 08/06/14 06:22 PM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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bisher Offline
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That's an interesting read Dave. Thanks

#3991804 - 08/06/14 06:59 PM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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Peally Offline
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Mike seems to have his head on straight. The "I don't give a damn" is refreshing coming from a developer; they have an overall idea of what they want and they're sticking to it, with tweaks here and there.


Scully: Victim died of multiple stab wounds.
Mulder: *throws her a file* Ever heard of the knife alien?
#3991847 - 08/06/14 09:09 PM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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Raw Kryptonite Offline
Beat the Kobayashi Maru
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Beat the Kobayashi Maru
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MS
Quote:
"Suffice to say we wanted Elite to feel like star wars in terms of how the ships move by banking/rolling and pitching through manoeuvres opposed to the yaw and pitch based FPS style movement most other space games offered (where roll plays little or no part). That limitation to having to do your main directional change manoeuvring by pitching makes the flight path taken to be more cinematic and means a skilled player can predict the manoeuvres of an opponent in advanced by observing their current roll position relative to themselves only. So long as they match the roll quickly enough they can always follow through the inevitable pitch manoeuvre effectively and maintain the chase. If the target could yaw or pitch effectively then it's much harder to assess what they're going to do as they're current roll position doesn't really matter any more.

Finally realism has played no part whatsoever in any of our design discussions about the flight model. We don't care what would be realistic as we only care what the game play experience is when flying these ships and so far we feel we're hitting the right notes for the majority of our audience."




One step closer to dropping money on this thing. That's the attitude I want to hear. IMO, fun should come before realism.


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#3991986 - 08/07/14 04:40 AM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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TheBlackPenguin Offline
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They had a Twitch stream today, and one remark was that they designers have to go to David Braben for final sign,this is much, much more than just a game to fill the pockets and make a profit, but rather one borne from passion and care.

#3992053 - 08/07/14 11:18 AM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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Mace71 Offline
Dread pirate Mace
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Yep, FD are the only Devs of a game I have faith in to make a game that they want to play themselves and not just look at a list of demographics and pander to the one that will make them the most money.

And the kids who are crying cos it isn't Eve or it's too hard (yeah seriously) and demanding their money back if it isn't changed will get told to sit and swivel biggrin makes me smile.


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"There is only one way to avoid criticism: do nothing, say nothing and be nothing." Aristotle
#3992165 - 08/07/14 04:02 PM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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Para_Bellum Offline
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I have to admit I won't shed a tear when the hardc0re PvPer realize ED might not actually be their dream game after all. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against PvP per se, it's just not the focus of the game for me.

I don't need the feeling of just having wrecked someone's day to feel good in a game. I much more enjoy working together with other players.


"...late afternoon the Air Tasking Order came in [and] we found the A-10 part and we said, "We are going where!? We are doing what!?"

Capt. Todd Sheehy, Hog pilot, on receiving orders during Operation Desert Storm

#3992431 - 08/08/14 01:57 AM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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Gruug Offline
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Let EVE be EVE; Star Citizen be Star Citizen and Elite Dangerous be Elite Dangerous. The biggest reasons games fail is that every other game is like the one that goes before it. There is no reason to even try a new game if it is not different.


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#3993715 - 08/11/14 02:43 AM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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Deacon211 Offline
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This is good to hear. I was as worried as everyone else that the game would be a grief fest with uber pay to win gankers like so many other games.

I'd love to see some good co-op play or just the chance to explore the deep black and not have ten thousand other players jumping me like they do in Eve.

I recall my first wormhole experience in Eve.

"I've just discovered this amazing wormhole. I can't wait to see what exotic location it takes me to!"

"WTF? Who is firing at me? Where did this gank squad come from? I thought I just discovered this thing!"


It's like, Armstrong first setting foot on the Moon...and the first thing he sees is a Taco Bell.

#3993956 - 08/11/14 05:15 PM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Deacon211]  
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meh
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meh
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Originally Posted By: Deacon211
It's like, Armstrong first setting foot on the Moon...and the first thing he sees is a Taco Bell.


And then that Taco Bell robbed him and then podded him.


And we as its creators don't feel ready to hear your annoyed jabber about it.
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#3994044 - 08/11/14 08:16 PM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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Aero Offline
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I think it's unlikely I will ever be much into the public play servers. I'm mostly in in to immerse myself in the universe and work out the traumatic period in my childhood when I learned it wasn't actually possible to grow up to be Han Solo. It's unfortunate, but the ratio of sociopaths to well-adjusted folk in public gaming scenarios isn't really credible from a suspension of disbelief angle.

I'm sure part of this is that the well adjusted people tend to feel the same way I do, so they end up under-represented on the public servers. I do wonder how group play will ultimately work. Will we be able to, for instance, have a SimHQ group with a couple hundred or more people in it? I don't mind, and even welcome piracy, PVP and such, so long as it's done seriously and it's not just 20% of the player base attacking every other human player they see on sight because they're human.

It's not a small problem Frontier are trying to tackle in balancing all that for everyone. I can see the lore and bounty mechanics of Elite possibly allowing a good solution, but there are limits to how many sociopaths you can realistically manage.

#3994100 - 08/11/14 10:30 PM Re: New players wanting to make ED like Eve! [Re: Mace71]  
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komemiute Offline
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It has already been stated that Frontier is not going to balance everything for everyone. That is a fact and a good one too. There are ships that ARE bigger and better than others.

There are going to be pilots that are better jocks than others.

And ultimately THAT is going to be the big equalizer.
To kill another human it's going to take skill and preparation.

The fast ganker looking for a cheap kill is going to find himself caught in a web of game mechanics unheard before in MMORG in space.

From the heat management to the protection offered by stations and the combination of police and bounties- I think, the emergent gameplay WILL be co operation. With the 'good' piracy and the usual lone wolf that believes to be a hotshot who's going to post acrid comments about the gameplay when he realize that he can't gank and grief like in the past.

Frontier is made of smart cookies, not willing to give up their vision for a fast buck.
And the history of development so far is quite eloquent.

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But I'm striving to improve.

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