Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
Hop To
#3855769 - 10/29/13 10:43 PM WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!....  
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
Gunnyhighway Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Gunnyhighway  Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Member

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
San Diego, CA
I dedicate this post to the Ignorant that ignore that they ignore, to those that believe they know it all, and to the SunB's, the Clives, and the likes, may they choke eating their jockeys:

Read Carefully Now:

"SeaSpider
Anti Torpedo Torpedo"

"Submarines and surface combatants are able to protect themselves even against modern torpedoes. With the SeaSpider, ATLAS ELEKTRONIK has developed a technology that can detect and destroy the attacking torpedoes. This hard-kill solution is independent of the torpedo type and therefore highly superior to conventional approaches, which use decoys and similar effectors.

The SeaSpider system is unique worldwide and demonstrates the technological excellence of ATLAS ELEKTRONIK in the field of torpedo countermeasure."

Damn, so many were wrong then! rofl



BTW, I salute John W Ratcliff and Tom Clancy


Fluctuat Nec Mergitur

This is not the bars that keep the Tiger in the cage, this is the space between the bars.
Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#3855776 - 10/29/13 10:49 PM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,929
Herman Offline
Member
Herman  Offline
Member

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,929


ScenShare Guidelines :

1) Enjoy creating it
2) Enjoy playing it
3) Enjoy sharing it

The PlayersDB - The Harpoon community's #1 choice

Harpoon3 Frequently Asked Questions
#3855813 - 10/29/13 11:35 PM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Herman]  
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
Gunnyhighway Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Gunnyhighway  Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Member

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
San Diego, CA
I know!...But nobody believed what I had to say, and I could not quote my sources!...It has been around for a while!...It is also available on Submarines neaner


Fluctuat Nec Mergitur

This is not the bars that keep the Tiger in the cage, this is the space between the bars.
#3855846 - 10/30/13 12:51 AM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,929
Herman Offline
Member
Herman  Offline
Member

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,929
The crux of the matter is that Harpoon allows you to set up Anti-Torpedo weapons like this because it includes a database editor for this purpose.

I have not tested this particular function, but the database editor has flags and fields included so that it can be tried. This means that you are not forced to accept someone else's perception of reality (the way you are with games like MNO.) You can freely modify the Harpoon databases to suit your own purposes and perceptions.


ScenShare Guidelines :

1) Enjoy creating it
2) Enjoy playing it
3) Enjoy sharing it

The PlayersDB - The Harpoon community's #1 choice

Harpoon3 Frequently Asked Questions
#3855851 - 10/30/13 01:06 AM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,475
strykerpsg Offline
Member
strykerpsg  Offline
Member

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,475
Land of the Morning Calm
Conceptually, pretty bad a** concept. I haven't seen the aforementioned argument but don't see why it couldn't be incorporated into any database whether it's managed externally via modders or internally via a design team.

Will be interesting to see what the counter-counter measure may become. Gotta love technology!


Laptop:
Alienware M17 R3
i7-6820MQ
32 GB DDR3 1600Mhz memory, Win10 Pro 64 bit, DX11,
24GB GTX 980M video
Alienware Graphics Amplifier w GTX 1080 Strix Edition 8GB
A-10 Warthog HOTAS Joystick w/ Pedals
#3855852 - 10/30/13 01:15 AM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
Gunnyhighway Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Gunnyhighway  Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Member

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
San Diego, CA
Harpoon is the game of the 21rst century!

Herman, I would have appreciated your support on Subsim, when people were so resistant to the idea of a Torpedo anti-torpedo, if you knew then!


Fluctuat Nec Mergitur

This is not the bars that keep the Tiger in the cage, this is the space between the bars.
#3855919 - 10/30/13 05:11 AM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,929
Herman Offline
Member
Herman  Offline
Member

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,929
IIRC, your argument for Anti-Torpedo defense was promulgated upon the idea that the Mk48 torpedo was used in that capacity. I have no idea if the Mk48 can be used in that manner. A former professional submariner disagreed with the use of the Mk48 in such an instance. In such cases, I would probably give the benefit of the doubt to a former professional since I have no personal experience in the matter. However, the new weapons systems noted in this thread are not the Mk48 torpedo. They are entirely new weapons.

Because Harpoon has openly public databases and a readily available database editor included, you can go ahead and experiment with the creation of such a weapon for your personal use. In Harpoon, you can make your own weapons without ever needing to wait for someone else to do it for you.


ScenShare Guidelines :

1) Enjoy creating it
2) Enjoy playing it
3) Enjoy sharing it

The PlayersDB - The Harpoon community's #1 choice

Harpoon3 Frequently Asked Questions
#3856063 - 10/30/13 02:37 PM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
Gunnyhighway Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Gunnyhighway  Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Member

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
San Diego, CA
The guys said he was a retired sonar operator on a LA class, and did not state when he retired from the navy.

You could be a sonar operator on a Submarine and working from land as all the Sonars Operators are not working in subs at the same time. He could have been a certified sonar operator on a LA class and be a teacher at the academy for the last 10 years.

Besides, the navy in terms of advanced tactics does not share with all it's members, the technology, tactics, trial, etc...

Finally, he said he was a retired sonar operator from a LA class, by what I have read from many forums, everybody is a king but no one ever sat on a throne except in their bathrooms.

I have a tendency to go by the ideas exchanged and concept instead of going by the credentials which always seem exaggerated to me, or exactly on point at the moment of the discussion, like the best timing in the world.

Then historically, the use of a weapons is stretched at first to fulfill a need for which that weapons was not specifically designed, then a new weapons is designed dedicated to fulfill that need. i.e from a regular car rigged with a heavy machine gun, to the same car rigged with a light canon, you end up with a tank.

A MK48 makes perfect sense since it is a heavy torpedo, and big under-water blast is necessary to create a large shockwave that will disable the incoming torpedo, since the aiming is not very accurate.

But you can do it also with a Chinese YU-6 based on the Mk-48. YU-6 delivers sodium powder upon explosion which elevate the temperature of the water. A rapid change of temperature that can influence the incoming torpedo if the blast did not do enough.

A wired torpedo which uses the brainpower of the sending sub, can do a lot more than a free roamimg torpedo.

The "new" torpedoes can do alone without a wire and then some, what certain "old" torpedoes could do when they were wired.

In the absence of data, people who knows well a field can easily imagine between what is possible now, what will be possible and what could be impossible.

If I was a former Sonar operator or a Weapon System Officer or a Skipper, I would not need to cite my credentials, to make a point as I would have the necessary technological intelligence, experience to explain something. Names dropping and credentials erecting are like a cloud of black ink spewed by a fleeing squid, it hides something!....Countermeasures!




Fluctuat Nec Mergitur

This is not the bars that keep the Tiger in the cage, this is the space between the bars.
#3856097 - 10/30/13 03:52 PM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: strykerpsg]  
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
Gunnyhighway Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Gunnyhighway  Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Member

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
San Diego, CA
@STRYKERPSG:
Ask Sunburn.


Fluctuat Nec Mergitur

This is not the bars that keep the Tiger in the cage, this is the space between the bars.
#3856289 - 10/30/13 10:26 PM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,929
Herman Offline
Member
Herman  Offline
Member

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,929
In direct response to a request for assistance from:
Quote:
ORIGINAL: Gunnyhighway

And the so called specialist said it was impossible!

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/3855769/WAS_IST_DAS_And_the_so_called_#Post3855769


The 'impossible', in under 24 hours. smile

A new video for Creating Anti-Torpedo Defense systems in HUE v3.10 has been added to the YouTube Harpoon for Dummies channel to help Harpoon players navigate the complexities of the game and to deliver the best possible playing experience.

This video will demonstrate how Harpoon players can create their own weapons systems according to their own desires without any need to contact a developer, database manager, or video creator to do it on their behalf due to the openness of the publicly available Harpoon databases and the database editor program included with the game.

You can watch Creating Anti-Torpedo Defense systems in HUE v3.10



"Harpoon for Dummies" channel * FAQ * Facebook * HarPlonkHQ

Harpoon3.6.3 users can get the Complete PlayersDB Harpoon 3.6.3 Library
Harpoon ANW users can get the Complete PlayersDB Harpoon ANW Library
Harpoon HUE users can get the Complete PlayersDB Harpoon HUE Library


ScenShare Guidelines :

1) Enjoy creating it
2) Enjoy playing it
3) Enjoy sharing it

The PlayersDB - The Harpoon community's #1 choice

Harpoon3 Frequently Asked Questions
#3856343 - 10/30/13 11:45 PM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
Gunnyhighway Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Gunnyhighway  Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Member

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
San Diego, CA
Well, that demonstration was very efficient.

You demonstrated the flexibility of HARPOON and it's edge on the 21 first century technology!

Awesome!


Fluctuat Nec Mergitur

This is not the bars that keep the Tiger in the cage, this is the space between the bars.
#3856353 - 10/31/13 12:14 AM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,929
Herman Offline
Member
Herman  Offline
Member

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,929
Originally Posted By: Gunnyhighway
You demonstrated the flexibility of HARPOON and it's edge on the 21 first century technology!

You are describing it as somehow one game system over another. I believe this is too narrow-minded. The real triumph is between openly modifiable systems over closed systems.

The games which have proven commercial success and longevity are usually those who permit modifications. (Scenarios, images, icons, and sounds are not Mods as they do not modify the behaviour of the underlying game system; they are Add-ons.)

The list of proven successes due to open mod capabilities are long and include:
The Operational Art of War
Fleet Command
Harpoon
Skyrim
ARMA II
Total War series
War in the Pacific

The games with closed systems are not even worthy of mention.


ScenShare Guidelines :

1) Enjoy creating it
2) Enjoy playing it
3) Enjoy sharing it

The PlayersDB - The Harpoon community's #1 choice

Harpoon3 Frequently Asked Questions
#3856372 - 10/31/13 12:49 AM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
Gunnyhighway Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Gunnyhighway  Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Member

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
San Diego, CA
I was expressing how I was impressed by your demonstration and the ease with which it was done. I was not comparing. I was simply impressed!

Mk48 have proximity fuses and it certainly worked in that demo, as the first of your torp exploded in proximity of the incoming torpedo. The blast killed the incoming torpedo and your second torpedo coming right behind the first one. The physics of it is on point.

Just like in Tom Clancy SSN or Seawolf SSN 21 (and those 2 games are old) and some professional software.

I don't see in Harpoon what you see since my level of skill for Harpoon is not very high.

I just saw something that happened in Harpoon that everybody told me for a month, that was impossible to happen and that I did not know what I was talking about, when I knew it was already happening in the real world for a while.

Replication of what is happening in the real world in PC games, impresses me!...It means for me that the physics is right!

Now, the argument in relation to open game systems, is perfectly understood, and I agree. I also think that could be added in your list VBS2-VTK which is the father of ARMA2.

Thank you for the video!


Fluctuat Nec Mergitur

This is not the bars that keep the Tiger in the cage, this is the space between the bars.
#3856376 - 10/31/13 12:51 AM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,475
strykerpsg Offline
Member
strykerpsg  Offline
Member

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,475
Land of the Morning Calm
So creating whatever your heart desires makes it a more realistic database? While I thoroughly enjoyed Fleet Command/NWP with their modded base, there was much turmoil when newer patches, nay, updates came out with the older scenarios and/or others modded scenarios with their own version of reality. It can get very frustrating when trying to troubleshoot CTDs. How do you mitigate mismatched databases when playing multiplayer?


Laptop:
Alienware M17 R3
i7-6820MQ
32 GB DDR3 1600Mhz memory, Win10 Pro 64 bit, DX11,
24GB GTX 980M video
Alienware Graphics Amplifier w GTX 1080 Strix Edition 8GB
A-10 Warthog HOTAS Joystick w/ Pedals
#3856448 - 10/31/13 06:18 AM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 923
Dimitris Offline
Member
Dimitris  Offline
Member

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 923
Greece
Originally Posted By: Gunnyhighway
I dedicate this post to the Ignorant that ignore that they ignore, to those that believe they know it all, and to the SunB's, the Clives, and the likes, may they choke eating their jockeys:

Read Carefully Now:

"SeaSpider
Anti Torpedo Torpedo"

"Submarines and surface combatants are able to protect themselves even against modern torpedoes. With the SeaSpider, ATLAS ELEKTRONIK has developed a technology that can detect and destroy the attacking torpedoes. This hard-kill solution is independent of the torpedo type and therefore highly superior to conventional approaches, which use decoys and similar effectors.

The SeaSpider system is unique worldwide and demonstrates the technological excellence of ATLAS ELEKTRONIK in the field of torpedo countermeasure."

Damn, so many were wrong then! rofl

BTW, I salute John W Ratcliff and Tom Clancy


So now we have a real-world example. That's great!

In accordance with what I said earlier:

Quote:
BTW If I am wrong and this capability is described anywhere out there (outside the SSN game), please do correct me. I would be interested in learning more about it. Thanks!


...we can now look into implementing this capability properly in Command.

BTW, thanks for confirming my suspicion that it takes brand-new 2010s sonar technology and special mini "interceptor torps" to do this, and you can't do it with old conventional sonars and any traditional torp and certainly not a Mk48. You just confirmed the Clancy-SSN implementation was arcadish biggrin. Thanks man!

#3856486 - 10/31/13 10:22 AM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Gunnyhighway]  
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,929
Herman Offline
Member
Herman  Offline
Member

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,929
Originally Posted By: Dimitris
we can now look into implementing this capability properly in Command.

BTW, thanks for confirming my suspicion that it takes brand-new 2010s sonar technology and special mini "interceptor torps" to do this, and you can't do it with old conventional sonars and any traditional torp and certainly not a Mk48. You just confirmed the Clancy-SSN implementation was arcadish biggrin. Thanks man!

Actually, anyone planning to replicate the function already found in Harpoon should know that the anti-torpedo sonar is the same one as found on the ADCAP when it came out in the 1970s or so. No special advances in either sonar or torpedo technology were needed or used. This anti-torpedo function even works with old conventional sonar and a traditional torpedo for those wanting to simulate it in that manner. However, it would be great if this anti-torpedo function did not exhibit the same Pac-man behaviour shown by the Phoenix missiles in MNO.



Originally Posted By: Julhelm
You don't need 2010-era tech to do it. It's just the USN needs to think about these things now that they no longer have ASW frigates to put in the wake of a carrier if someone launches a torpedo at it.

And it's not like the ability to detonate a weapon on command is some fantasy invention. The old Mk45 ASTOR had this very functionality and I'd be surprised it it weren't retained for later weapons.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2135648&postcount=6

Exactly right; we just demonstrated the ability to create anti-torpedo defense systems with technology from the 1970s.


ScenShare Guidelines :

1) Enjoy creating it
2) Enjoy playing it
3) Enjoy sharing it

The PlayersDB - The Harpoon community's #1 choice

Harpoon3 Frequently Asked Questions
#3856599 - 10/31/13 03:34 PM Re: WAS IST DAS?...And the so called specialist said it was impossible!.... [Re: Dimitris]  
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
Gunnyhighway Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Gunnyhighway  Offline
Move, Strike, Protect
Member

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,175
San Diego, CA
Dimitri or Sunburn, which one are you really, both of them?

You are a computer programmer not a submariner and you are not in the gods secrets.

And I am not in charge of your education, I am under no duty to share anything with you.

If you can't even read between lines, don't try to show that you have the initiative!...

You don't have a system of collection of information in regards to gather and organize real world data for your game, you just wait for other people's charity. I have to say something for you to re-actualize your game?...You are the poster boy for intelligence efficacy!

Just let it go. "A man got to know his limitations" and you are just a programmer not a weapon system analyst. Keep hitting keys and forget about me, you've got a PC game to maintain at high labor costs!

So long beauty and gods wind!


Fluctuat Nec Mergitur

This is not the bars that keep the Tiger in the cage, this is the space between the bars.

Moderated by  RacerGT 

Quick Search
Recent Articles
Support SimHQ

If you shop on Amazon use this Amazon link to support SimHQ
.
Social


Recent Topics
CoD MW Article
by Rick_Rawlings. 10/21/19 06:15 PM
Time marches on
by No105_Archie. 10/21/19 03:02 PM
Why Looney Tunes is great for history buffs
by PanzerMeyer. 10/20/19 11:05 PM
IJN Kaga found.
by NH2112. 10/19/19 10:32 PM
Grouch (Joker Parady)
by Arthonon. 10/19/19 02:19 PM
Nike vs B-17
by KraziKanuK. 10/18/19 08:30 PM
Grouch
by Chaz. 10/18/19 01:49 PM
How to pi$$ off Londoners...
by Chucky. 10/17/19 12:16 PM
Video game map size comparison
by DM. 10/17/19 09:45 AM
Copyright 1997-2016, SimHQ Inc. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0