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#3830603 - 09/02/13 12:07 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Para_Bellum]  
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Originally Posted By: Para_Bellum
Didn't Luthier write that both versions will be possible, a merged one and a standalone version?




I may have missed that. Why would you increase dev costs by making 2 versions? I am not smart enough to know that answer, that is why I am confoosed.


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#3830606 - 09/02/13 12:13 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Para_Bellum]  
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Originally Posted By: Para_Bellum
Didn't Luthier write that both versions will be possible, a merged one and a standalone version?

I'd personally prefer a single DCS world. That's the beauty of the whole thing.





The only thing I could find is this.

"As the last major release in the DCS line, DCS World, DCS WWII will also be distributed via a free-to-play model. The full-featured core game will be available as a free download, allowing anyone to check out the game and its features. Additional modules containing new aircraft or new gameplay areas will be available as a separate purchase".

Edit:
I must confess that I am a little confused. Do not really understand - can DCS P-51 be used?

Last edited by saf1; 09/02/13 12:18 PM.

Up there the world is divided into bastards and suckers. Make your choice. Derek Robinson, Piece of Cake, 1983. Sådan er det bare.

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#3830610 - 09/02/13 12:28 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: saf1]  
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Originally Posted By: saf1
Originally Posted By: Para_Bellum
Didn't Luthier write that both versions will be possible, a merged one and a standalone version?

I'd personally prefer a single DCS world. That's the beauty of the whole thing.





The only thing I could find is this.

"As the last major release in the DCS line, DCS World, DCS WWII will also be distributed via a free-to-play model. The full-featured core game will be available as a free download, allowing anyone to check out the game and its features. Additional modules containing new aircraft or new gameplay areas will be available as a separate purchase".

Edit:
I must confess that I am a little confused. Do not really understand - can DCS P-51 be used?


My guess is that you could with the purchase of the new area take along your P-51


Post composed with speech to text, it woks grape!


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#3830617 - 09/02/13 12:41 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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You can use all DCS:W addon on DCS: W WW2


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#3830621 - 09/02/13 12:54 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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Thx guy`s understand now, must be sleepy


Up there the world is divided into bastards and suckers. Make your choice. Derek Robinson, Piece of Cake, 1983. Sådan er det bare.

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#3830669 - 09/02/13 03:56 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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Luthier more info:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Charly_Owl View Post
Please tell me that multiplayer will be included!.


Multiplayer is definitely included in the project! We have a lot of ideas, and we even have some old colleagues that have lots of experience making multiplayer great, but this is one area where we're not making any concrete promises.

After we did all the thinking and planned things out on paper, we realized we were looking at a huge project of its own. We can't afford to plug it into the core Kickstarter tier because it more than doubles the money we'll need. We don't want to risk not reaching even the initial goal because of this. The basic tier is supposed to be basic, after all.

We can only start rehiring old friends and programming and designing away once we hit larger stretch goals, but there's another problem there. This is an entirely new codebase for our old programmers, and multiplayer is extremely hard to program and test and perfect. This is the riskiest component of the entire project with both time and budget. If we make hard kickstarter promises about multiplayer, we run the risk of sinking the entire project by not meeting them on time.

So we're not going to promise anything now, or list any multiplayer features in kickstarter. If we hit larger stretch goals, we will work away on expanding and improving multiplayer, but there is a chance that a large comprehensive multiplayer update won't be ready in time for the initial DCS WWII release.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lighthaze View Post
Just a pinch of crew management (think B-17 Flying Fortress) would be absolutely amazing.


We're trying not to go feature creep on this project. This is definitely something we've thought about, but at this time we're trying to go lean.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SiThSpAwN View Post
So FM goes through inspector Yo-Yo?


Yup.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chivas View Post
Good to cya back Luthier. Since this is going to be a European Campaign that could include B17's, is there any chance the map will be large enough that the bombers will be able to takeoff/RTB from Britain or France. If not how big a map do you plan to build, and what are your thoughts on expanding the map for a realistic bombing campaign at a later date? I'm not a huge fan of the current DCS terrain, but I'm hoping the new EDGE graphic engine will allow you to develop an immersive WW2 terrain.


Making terrain in EDGE is kind of an interesting process.

It takes almost no time to define things like shorelines and elevation. But then making that terrain look good takes a tremendous effort. There are areas with coarse detail and areas with very fine detail. For example, our Pointe du Hoc is virtually one-for-one with all the bunkers, trenches, cliffs, bomb craters, etc. Just that one little triangle took several weeks to make. Conversely, some random piece of coastline or an out of the way village are done in a few minutes. They look generic and if you were to compare them to the real thing, you'd see lots of differences.

Then there are areas that aren't hand-built at all. They are intended as a background, something you see far off on the horizon while you fly over a more important area. If you were to take the time to fly over there, you'd see a barren landscape that isn't intended to be seen up close. In other sims this would be the area beyond the map edge that was not done at all; in EDGE we just define it so looking towards the map edge looks good.

So, what I'm saying is, at this time we've only defined Normandy as hand-built.

Quote:
Originally Posted by =4c=Nikola View Post
As you said the aircraft will be able to insert into DCS World, but what about map, AI vehicles, ships, aircraft...? Can we plug all that in DCS World and make true sandbox or there will be some limitations?


I'm not sure if this can be done manually. We only discussed module compatibility, i.e. cross-plugging things we ourselves make to be compatible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by leafer View Post
My first wish would be to see RRG dump the icons that act as objects on the map, and come up with a way to allow players to visually see the objects as they are, intuitively manipulate its orientation and move it around to the exact location we want on the map in DCS WWII mission editor. ED ain't gonna let us do it in theirs, so please make this a possibility. It is really frustrating having to go back and forth between in-game and ME a dozens of times just to move the vehicles around on a farp.


We don't have a budget for a mission builder programmer or artist.

If any changes are made to the editors, they'd have to be done by ED.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MadTommy View Post
It all sounds rather over ambitious to me. I'd love to see this be achieved in single year. But i won't be holding my breath.


Lots of experienced people from another sim coming together to work in parallel.

It's also somewhat easier to make things now with the P-51 and Dora already done. When P-51 was being done, most of the systems had to be written from scratch. With something like a Bf.109 now, we can use a lot of P-51 code which speeds things up by a huge factor.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Geronimo989 View Post
Do you guys have the permission to use aircraft models and textures from Cliffs of Dover? That could bring us early WW2 scenarios faster.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Suchacz View Post
Imho they already have something WIP from their previous projects in their drawers


Nope. Not only do we not have permission, we are absolutely not going to reuse a single asset from any old project. We know that we will be challenged on every single thing that looks remotely similar and have to prove to the current copyright owner that we made everything from scratch.


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#3830673 - 09/02/13 04:06 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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and continue....

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1856209&postcount=821
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by HolyGrail_FxFactory View Post
" DCS WWII: Europe 1944 will boast an all-new EDGE landscape engine, as well as many new and updated features "


Oh , I thought they've said that WWII will feature a newer updated version of the game engine
Game engine includes a lot more than landscape. It consists of multiple modules. GUI, vehicles, aircraft, weather, etc. We're just taking the old landscape module and swapping it out for EDGE, but the rest is all the same.

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadTommy View Post
Does RRG Studios have a website?

Not at this time.

There is an unpleasant issue that has to do with using the name of the old game series I've worked on. Can't really have a site that says "well we worked on something, but we can't tell you the name of the project or show any screenshots."

We'll have something once kickstarter hits. It'll only be about DCS WWII and the future.

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by hegykc View Post
Since your team is a 3rd party developer, would it make DCS WWII world open for 4th party content?
If a team decides to make a study level plane, that's not on your list, would it be compatible with your world?

Anything that's compatible with DCS is compatible with DCS WWII by definition.

There are a lot of people already making WWII stuff in addition to ourselves. We'll need some sort of a plan for sharing things with 4th parties to make sure there are no parallel developments on one hand, and things are getting done on the other.

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Double_D View Post
Only Luthier1 hair dresser will know for sure...

I think now its best for him to fully explain..DCS/Luthier1 plans will be on it...

Guys, can you please stop fighting about the separate installs?

It's one thing to discuss it with me. I'll be glad to answer questions or entertain ideas. But it's absolutely pointless to get riled up and argue with each other.

Think about this not from the point of you of today, but five years from now. DCS WWII has grown to include Pacific, Mediterranean, Korea, I don't know. DCS World has Nevada, a whole bunch of other maps, and a huge line-up of new aircraft.

The number of fans that own the entire product line will number in the single digits.

But if we were to keep everything as a single install, then the number of people that have to download and keep content they never use would be huge!


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#3830682 - 09/02/13 04:19 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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Luthier russian forum info (By google translator):
http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1856185&postcount=12
I'm sorry guys, I'm moving - divorce, trucks, division of property. On the new web site is not connected, so that a communication complexity. Will respond to all, but with delays.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Steam View Post
1. What size card are planning to release it in detail and compliance history and that of the place?
---------
Cherbourg - Falaise - Rouen about. Detailing high. Some places are played 1-to-1. For example Pointe du Hoc is made ​​with all the bunkers, trenches, cliffs, craters from bombs. Complies with staggering. Other important places of the city, the battlefields, will also copy number. The rest of card - the similarity in the middle distance. Village-roads in the right places, but the average home-street.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Steam View Post
2. How many man hours scheduled for the creation of one fighter from the ground until you are ready?
-----------------
Too many create 3D models in general for ointments, get the hand to do very quickly. But the programming and testing for a long time, especially by the standards of my old projects. We are trying to understand whether we can accelerate without losing quality, as we found with the 3D. So about a year old-man + a couple of months, depending on the complexity of the systems.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Steam View Post
3. Tell us about DM.
----------
How to Musa.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steam View Post
4. How many people in the development team, who work full-time?
----------
While 9. After Kick grow, as a result thereof.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steam View Post
5. Who will communicate with the community?
-----------
Mua.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steam View Post
6. Will Friday's update, or some other format?
----------------
Probably will, but Pipeline very long. There will be many times when on the fair will have nothing to show. "John suffered all week with the chassis and Messer did not work out, and Peter zateksturil back armor to Sleep" - update is not specified.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steam View Post
7. In which city is the office and a team of developers?
------------------
Programmers are all in Moscow, the core of the team there. Also scattered 3D modelers - outsourcers around the planet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elefant View Post
Tell me please, what is planned bombers??
--------------
Neletab B-17 at level 0. A-26, Mosquito, and S-88 in the more expensive steps. Lethaby B-17 at the latest.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Theo View Post
Q: The
new engine is planned EDZH.
Provision-whether "material" trees?
----------
I mean, with collisions? Test right now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lightningstrike View Post
after Vagner said that he has no access to information about EDZH which develop there at some of the Minsk studio, thanks to this announcement even though there was a ray of hope about EDZha! far, this unexpected EDZhe even able to produce 3D cube or triangle? you can at least see one screen? whether it weighs 3D circle in the clouds or stand-maker in the grass ...
--------------

The engine is a fully working screens are 5th with Normandy, houses, trenches, bunkers, statues, cliffs, sea, trees, and you Di.


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#3830688 - 09/02/13 04:27 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1856242&postcount=18
Quote:
Originally Posted by podvoxx View Post
Terms of output alpha (for winter) will depend on the kick starter?
-------------
Alpha does not go anywhere, it is an internal boundary. Accessing supported the Kick starts with beta. And of course depends. If you reach the higher levels of funding means more work, then all the terms relegated.

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1856245&postcount=19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elefant View Post
This is how to understand? Latest revision?

---------------
Kick works. If we collect $ 100, we'll give you that's so-and-so. If you collect 200, we'll give you another mosquito. Putting 300 - and then still be able to pull Yushku. I mean it.

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1856238&postcount=832
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by cichlidfan View Post
Regarding the entirety of DCS World and DCS WWII, you might be right, but regarding the number of people who will own both core games, I suspect you are extremely underestimating your audience.

----------------
That's exactly what I said above

What happens if we release, say, a G4M Betty for DCS WWII. You already bought the F6F but you have no interest in the Betty so you don't buy it. What happens when you go online with someone who owns the Betty? You gotta be able to do it, right? So you've gotta see that Betty, right, just not fly it? And the Betty owner, if he never bought that F6F, has to be able to see you dive on him out of the sun for just a split second before he explodes, right?

Now extrapolate that to modern jets. See where I'm going with this?

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by droz View Post
Out of Curiosity, the P-51D and FW-190 Modules that are available for DCS, will those be incorporated into your DCS: WWII 1944?

-----------------
Of course! How can we possibly have 1944 Europe without a P-51!


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#3830721 - 09/02/13 05:51 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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You can't have 1944 Europe without the Typhoon either.

#3830810 - 09/02/13 09:57 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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I find it very amusing and sad at the same time, that we'll get either WW2 or space sims in the near future... I hope the 90s and 2000s will eventually get some love and attention when the Hornets, Mudhens and Flankers come alive and the devs "just" need to make terrain and missions/campaigns.

#3830970 - 09/03/13 11:28 AM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: SAPPER]  
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Originally Posted By: HeinKill
Must be good, all discussion on it is already banned on 777 forums!
H


Nothing at all like that ,, and as I am sure you are aware discussion is niow allowed there.. It is more of a reflection on the fact that often.. too often as far as I am concerned these kinds of discussions stop being discussions and devolve into a pi$$ing contest of sorts.. We try very hard to insure that that does not happen at BoS.

Originally Posted By: SAPPER
777 Forums can be really... well anal really. The ban on freetrack discussion comes to mind.


I think that may be because there were some copyright issues associated with FT IIRC.. but don't quote me in it..

This is a good thing.. and I like the fact that it will start at 44 .....


Start where you are. Use what you have. Do what you can.
#3830979 - 09/03/13 12:08 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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Will it come with a dynamic campaign?

-> If yes (which I doubt) than I'll support this.

-> If not than I'll NOT support this (at least thru kickstarter, buying it latter is something to be seen in the future).


BTW, I also agree that we can't have a credible Western Europe 1944 over Normandy scenario without a Typhoon! Making a Western Europe 1944 over Normandy scenario without the Typhoon is the same thing has making a Battle of Britain scenario without the Spitfire! Or having a whorehouse without whores for that matter.

#3830980 - 09/03/13 12:10 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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Agreed!

#3831206 - 09/03/13 07:16 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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Well, 777's one will be out and proven long before this comes out, so there won't be any "which should I get?" hand-wringing. By the end of 2013 we're supposed to have the initial BoS up and running. The DCS one won't be till the end of 2014. There's zero reason to sit around for a year waiting for the DCS one before asking "which should I get?" Especially if the DCS one is going to be free to play to start off.



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#3831252 - 09/03/13 08:41 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: ricnunes]  
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Originally Posted By: ricnunes
Will it come with a dynamic campaign?

-> If yes (which I doubt) than I'll support this.

-> If not than I'll NOT support this (at least thru kickstarter, buying it latter is something to be seen in the future).


What do you mean dynamic? Nazis lose and allies win no matter how good/bad you play. This isn't a fictional scenario where you can influence the outcome. Unless they set it up in a parallel universe where everything is possible...

Last edited by CTR69; 09/03/13 08:42 PM.
#3831293 - 09/03/13 09:50 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: CTR69]  
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Originally Posted By: CTR69
What do you mean dynamic? Nazis lose and allies win no matter how good/bad you play. This isn't a fictional scenario where you can influence the outcome. Unless they set it up in a parallel universe where everything is possible...


So according to your theory you must only play missions that happened in real life and never play or make any mission that didn't happen in real life and you cannot shot down more (or less) aircraft than your pilot did in real life in that mission or if your pilot was shot down and died in that mission (in real life) you must always be shot down or die in that mission, is that correct?
If you "demand" a realistic outcome for a campaign than why don't you demand a realistic outcome for a certain mission as well??

Besides, the possibility of Nazis/Germans winning could have been be more realistic than you may think so: Remember that D-Day invasion ALMOST FAILED (at least within the Omaha sector) -> Now imagine that the Luftwaffe was able to sustain less loses during the first half of 1944 and able to send some coordinated airstrikes against the D-Day invasion force? It's not hard to imagine that the chance of the allies loosing (and Germans wining) the D-Day operation would certainly increase exponentially!

#3831326 - 09/03/13 11:00 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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Players of WW2 sims are VERY demanding about having an accurate flight models, so i doubt they'll accept anything less than accurate historical missions.

In the end, the devs will decide what kind of missions they'll make, but there is not much artistic freedom, i'm afraid. Next thing you know they'll be called nazi sympathizers or something, if they'd made an alternative outcome possible.

#3831330 - 09/03/13 11:12 PM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Silver_Dragon]  
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I took a quick look at the DCS mission builder, and it appears to have Triggers that could make missions play out differently. I don't know if damage can be made persistent from mission to mission. There is nothing in the mission builder that demands that missions be made historic.


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#3831430 - 09/04/13 03:11 AM Re: DCS WWII: Europe 1944 [Re: Chivas]  
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Originally Posted By: Chivas
I took a quick look at the DCS mission builder, and it appears to have Triggers that could make missions play out differently. I don't know if damage can be made persistent from mission to mission. There is nothing in the mission builder that demands that missions be made historic.


If you are interested search for MIST on the ED forums as well, they are doing some pretty cool stuff with scripting as well.

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