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#3824981 - 08/20/13 11:50 PM Re: Question... Its all about CEM! [Re: JG52Krupi]  
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It's going to be interesting to see how many of those that are accustomed to the prior Il-2 series (including CloD) tolerate the take off and landing aspect in BoS. The wheels will actually grip laterally as opposed to the runway/ground being made of wax that the prior series has had.

#3825007 - 08/21/13 01:37 AM Re: Question... Its all about CEM! [Re: JG52Krupi]  
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Chivas Offline
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If the overall BOS experience is good, people will quickly adjust to any new AI,FM,DM,etc,etc, tendencies.


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#3825377 - 08/21/13 08:00 PM Re: Question... Its all about CEM! [Re: NattyIced]  
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Jedi Master Offline
Entil'zha
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Sierra Hotel

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Originally Posted By: NattyIced
It's going to be interesting to see how many of those that are accustomed to the prior Il-2 series (including CloD) tolerate the take off and landing aspect in BoS. The wheels will actually grip laterally as opposed to the runway/ground being made of wax that the prior series has had.


What?? No Il-2: Stalingrad Drift????



The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#3825581 - 08/22/13 07:52 AM Re: Question... Its all about CEM! [Re: JG52Krupi]  
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JG52Krupi Offline
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I just hope that at some point they add some more start up features, it gives each aircraft a bit more character.

Lets see if they can master the basics, I will be annoyed if certain parts of the DM are missing.

I would love to see dynamic smoke online in a few years time correct me if I am wrong but it's already kind of modelled in RoF singleplayer.

Last edited by JG52Krupi; 08/22/13 07:53 AM.
#3825600 - 08/22/13 10:43 AM Re: Question... Its all about CEM! [Re: Jedi Master]  
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Reminds me of this. In general, people are fairly dumb but have no clue that they are.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/hom...ws-8697821.html


Originally Posted By: Jedi Master
This is my prediction:

BoS will be in a far better state (functionally) on release than CloD was, and may in fact be better than CloD is NOW (as of the final patch). However, it will not have some features at first (perhaps ever) or they will be simplified vis-a-vis CloD, and the crazies will blast it for NOT having feature A subsection D paragraph 5 that CloD, with the ATAG mods, and "another year or so of development" likely will have.

It doesn't matter what CloD does or doesn't have, it's what it MIGHT have or COULD have had that BoS is apparently up against. Reality is not in the evaluation.

As a result, arguing with those people is pointless because it's like arguing religion--facts are irrelevant, it's all about personal beliefs. If they BELIEVE that one small feature like "clickable cockpits" is the ONLY thing that matters, then CloD is the only WWII "sim" that exists and BoS is a fail.
Of course, it's their reasoning that has failed.



The Jedi Master

#3825603 - 08/22/13 11:03 AM Re: Question... Its all about CEM! [Re: JG52Krupi]  
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SYN_Jedders Offline
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Im glad you are looking seriously at BoS Krupi. We must remember that 7771C are not just the RoF developers on their own but a lot of talented people from 1C aswell, people that worked on CloD. I cant imagine that their voices arent being heard in development terms with regards to DM in a WW2 theatre. After all DM in WW1 terms is worlds away from DM in WW2. For starters there are very few critical parts in a First War aircraft compared to its 2nd war equivalent.

It is for people very much more versed in engineering to tell us the minutae of that!

Im sure we will all have different opinions about what ultimately will be good/bad/indifferent about BoS but with such enthusiastic talented people at the helm I am happy to put my faith in them. I hope some of the people on the fence will aswell.

#3825641 - 08/22/13 12:44 PM Re: Question... Its all about CEM! [Re: JG52Krupi]  
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JG52Krupi Offline
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My career allows me to have a fairly good understanding of (modern) structures and systems but to produce a realistic representation of battle damage is something I have never had to do wink , one of the reason that I liked CoD was because they didn't compromise on the complexity of engine DM and I really hope this is something 1C has brought to BoS.

Like I have said elsewhere... RoF physical DM + CoD system DM would be incredibly but I imagine quite hard, I hope they pull it off smile

#3826381 - 08/23/13 07:05 PM Re: Question... Its all about CEM! [Re: Alexi_Alx_Anova]  
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Entil'zha
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Originally Posted By: Alexi_Alx_Anova
Reminds me of this. In general, people are fairly dumb but have no clue that they are.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/hom...ws-8697821.html



It shows that people want to listen to opinions that adhere to their own biases, and then use them as justification for their biases, and ignore listening to or giving any weight to any information that contradicts those biases.

A report comes out saying their opinion is wrong? "It's paid for by the opposition." "They conveniently ignore THIS and erroneously include THAT." Etc, etc, etc.

Apparently a new freedom granted in the last couple of decades is freedom from analytical thinking. You are not forced to actually come up with an opinion based on facts, you can just make one that fits your worldview which in turn generates more.



The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#3830202 - 09/01/13 02:33 PM Re: Question... Its all about CEM! [Re: JG52Krupi]  
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MackStones Offline
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I just re-posted on the Il-2 BOS forum an old Warbirds of Prey post (a VERY long one) about flight-modeling disputes, which touches on a number of points in this thread and might be of interest to (patient) readers:

Way Too Long Discourse on Flight-Modeling Disputes.

In summary, my post tries to make 2 main points: first, due to a multiplicity of sources, each of which might have their own errors, biases, or incompleteness, it is difficult to ever get a completely authoritative flight model (not to attention the difficult task of trying to recreate it in a flight sim); and second, despite many losses of data during and after the war, there remain sources of flight modeling data from WW2, but they often differ and it's easy for anyone of us to claim that the developers "porked" or "ubered" an aircraft based upon the source we've got in hand (even if not cherry-picked) - we just need to realize that the developers are relying upon another source (and presumably on a rough amalgamation of a number of sources).

Last edited by MackStones; 09/01/13 06:07 PM. Reason: Link fixed.
#3830285 - 09/01/13 05:42 PM Re: Question... Its all about CEM! [Re: MackStones]  
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wheelsup_cavu Offline
Lifer
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Originally Posted By: MackStones
I just re-posted on the Il-2 BOS forum an old Warbirds of Prey post (a VERY long one) about flight-modeling disputes, which touches on a number of points in this thread and might be of interest to (patient) readers:

Way Too Long Discourse on Flight-Modeling Disputes.

In summary, my post tries to make 2 main points: first, due to a multiplicity of sources, each of which might have their own errors, biases, or incompleteness, it is difficult to ever get a completely authoritative flight model (not to attention the difficult task of trying to recreate it in a flight sim); and second, despite many losses of data during and after the war, there remain sources of flight modeling data from WW2, but they often differ and it's easy for anyone of us to claim that the developers "porked" or "ubered" an aircraft based upon the source we've got in hand (even if not cherry-picked) - we just need to realize that the developers are relying upon another source (and presumably on a rough amalgamation of a number of sources).

Your link is not working.
Code:
http://http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/1178-way-too-long-discourse-flight-modeling-disputes/]Way Too Long Discourse on Flight-Modeling Disputes


This one should work until Mack has a chance to change his link.
http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/1178-way-too-long-discourse-flight-modeling-disputes/


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#3841550 - 09/25/13 06:25 AM Re: Question... Its all about CEM! [Re: JG52Krupi]  
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Dart Offline
Measured in Llamathrusts
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Lifer

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Alabaster, AL USA
How to have an FM/DM fight , or at least how I understand it.


The opinions of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

More dumb stuff at http://www.darts-page.com

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