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#3703822 - 12/21/12 02:52 PM Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have?  
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MACADEMIC Offline
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Will Gaijin realize this unique window of opportunity and give us the WWII flight simulation game we've been dreaming of? What should it be like, what shouldn't it be like? Speak your mind, and keep it positive please. The world is coming to and end, it's Christmas, and the best is yet to come.

MAC

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#3704087 - 12/21/12 10:12 PM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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Maps large enough to fly realistic missions on, accuracy of flight models, damage models, and handling of physics, historically based aircraft matchups
Quality off line campaigns, online campaigns, a mission builder! To this day I have yet to play a sim that equaled RBII for quality of gameplay, maybe I am
Looking back with rose coloured glasses, but they were good times.

Craig


The problem with the World is stupidity. I'm not saying there should be a capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
#3704106 - 12/21/12 10:58 PM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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Thanks Craig. Full mission builder for me too. All of the content available without having to play MMO. Make it a separate game, or within WT, I don't care. Don't mind paying for a starter set including a set of planes and maps, and paying for expansions and further content as it becomes available. Let us make and share our own missions, all we need is a true sandbox with lots of toys to play our way, not MMO gameplay.

MAC

P.S.: No disrespect intented for anyone who likes MMO style play, or Gaijin.

#3704204 - 12/22/12 01:39 AM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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Yep, both posts above are good. I also would like some kind of triggers and some randomness with the FMB (% of random possibilities) so the person that creates the mission can play it and actually be surprised by some of the things that happen. Like limping back to base and have two enemies show up because the last pilot you killed got a radio message out. And, and, and a runway full of planes you have to wait in to be part of a hundred plane attack and escort on some oil fields in Romania. I could go on for hours but will let others have a turn.

#3704239 - 12/22/12 02:30 AM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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How about organizing what they've got right now so you don't have biplanes fighting late war stuff and get rid of all the MMO style gimmicks like timers, etc. IMO.


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#3704380 - 12/22/12 08:10 AM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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I just downloaded the latest update of the beta game.
And I must say I was astonished by the beauty of the Stalingrad map.
First time I see a map in an aviation simulation which looks almost real!
After that, impossible to play on another sim, without saying: "mehhhh"!
I must also insist on the absolute beauty of the clouds and the light just under
or just above the clouds, the feeling of "being there".
It seems also they have toned down the "save the private Ryan" filter,
what is a very good thing.

Frankly, this game engine is a marvel and the textures and clouds guys are top.

I just hope too that the Gaijin studio will realize that they have a marvel
in their hands, that means they have the perfect sim as a possible target,
if, yes IF they go on the path of realistic FM's and game modes also without "airquakers" features.

#3704383 - 12/22/12 08:15 AM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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" Don't mind paying for a starter set including a set of planes and maps, and paying for expansions and further content as it becomes available."

Me too.
I'm ready to pay for an "adulte" version of the game.
That means not at all to drop the MMO features for those who like that,
but to add other features for the guys who prefer to play in
a more classic way.

Last edited by CHDT; 12/22/12 10:04 AM.
#3704501 - 12/22/12 03:05 PM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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Hey MAC,

Awhile ago I created a post in the gaijin beta forum on this exact topic. The "simmer's club" feature had all of the goodies mentioned above plus more but no word from the devs. I think what's going to get us noticed is the revenue steam to them. How many of us simmers will pay how much for how long and not be pestering them constantly on the appearance of a single rivit.

For the features above, I would pay $50+ annually, maybe more. I would agree to the 777 RoF sales model too.

Last edited by gx007; 12/22/12 03:06 PM.
#3704560 - 12/22/12 04:48 PM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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MACADEMIC Offline
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Hey gx007,

I remember your thread there and also posted. You're very right about the devs' silence, it's annoying, however they haven't been talking about ANY aspect of their game for a long time. It's their style to work away (and by the speed and number of updates, the whole team is working very hard) and not talk. I wish they'd more and communication wouldn't be so one sided, but it is noticeable how inputs are being worked with.

I still want to think it's worth to keep telling them what we want. We can't say if that's what we're going to get, it's a bit like writing to Santa. So, let's keep writing and hope for the best.

MAC

#3704606 - 12/22/12 05:58 PM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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I just played on a mountain map, I was asthonished by the beauty of the light and how real it looked (I'm used to fly over Swiss mountains and I almost got the feeling to be flying over Meiringen to the Valais).

Unfortunately, the mountains were modeled on the fantasy way looking like some scifi landscape.
It would be a real shame that this fabulous render engine would be, in some way, wasted only on arcade contents.

Me too, I would gladly pay some 50 dollars pro year to get access to realistic maps with of course blocked realistic settings (not want to pay anything to be forced to play with Bozo the clown and his friends).

#3704610 - 12/22/12 06:10 PM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: CHDT]  
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MACADEMIC Offline
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Originally Posted By: CHDT
I just played on a mountain map, I was asthonished by the beauty of the light and how real it looked (I'm used to fly over Swiss mountains and I almost got the feeling to be flying over Meiringen to the Valais).

Unfortunately, the mountains were modeled on the fantasy way looking like some scifi landscape.
It would be a real shame that this fabulous render engine would be, in some way, wasted only on arcade contents.

Me too, I would gladly pay some 50 dollars pro year to get access to realistic maps with of course blocked realistic settings (not want to pay anything to be forced to play with Bozo the clown and his friends).


Precisely my thoughts too. The light was very nice, they got the 'alpine feel' very right, but the mountains are about three times as steep and high than IRL. LOL about being forced to play with Bozo and friends. Whatever good the game may have to offer later in terms of Mission Editor, having to play MMO to get the planes to make it work will just, well, not work.

MAC

#3704770 - 12/22/12 11:56 PM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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I'm not sure how all this winning gameplay and buying Lions/Tigers wink works to expand flyable aircraft?? Will it be possible to just buy the sim with all possible content included. Is it possible to download other user made missions?


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#3704773 - 12/23/12 12:05 AM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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Pilots did not have to worry about an economy or paying to get a plane repaired. I really hope they offer a full content game that excludes such silliness.

#3705022 - 12/23/12 01:16 PM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: Craterman]  
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Originally Posted By: Craterman
Pilots did not have to worry about an economy or paying to get a plane repaired. I really hope they offer a full content game that excludes such silliness.


Me too and add a dynamic SP campaign..just give me a proper fully fledged no MMO gimmicks full price sim please.

#3705427 - 12/24/12 05:40 AM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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Good post Mac, and I’m with all of you on this one! I often wondered how many others felt as I do about this game.

I’m not a fan of the MMO model either and I just don’t care for the ‘gaming’ environment that it seems to be for many. I heartily endorse and wish for most of the things that all of you have already suggested in this thread… FMB/Sandbox, single player dynamic missions and campaigns, etc. The chance to fly as realistically and historically as we wish in an environment that we can create or share and manage.

I love this game. The graphics and ambience are amazing. So much of it is so good. It’s a big step forward from WoP which I also enjoyed.

At the moment I’m not concerned about the odd mix of aircraft or some of the other peculiarities like the missions that are not at all ‘map historical’… this is a beta and my feeling is that they turned it loose just for testing purposes knowingly with these oddities, probably by design. I expect that some of these things will be changed for the final product. But, they are steadily improving aspects of the flight physics as well as other things and it’s all slowly coming together. They are working on flight models and apparently trying to make them as true to the original specs as they can.

Having said that, they are obviously working with a business model that they hope will appeal to the masses and that will be profitable. Who can blame them for that? But, the suggestion that we have a niche portion that can share the basic game technology that they have developed is exactly what I’ve been hoping and watching for.

I can even live with purchasing planes and other items with Eagles, Lions, and teddy bears… whatever. But grinding points and levels is not of any real interest for me. I’d rather just buy what I want.

There is so much discussion and debate on the WT Beta forum about MMO issues that it’s hard to believe that other more minor suggestions are always noticed.
Although they have improved them to some extent, I hope to hear still better engine sounds which I really haven’t heard the likes of since CFS2 add-ons. And I would love some improved flight physics such as what I consider to be the very important ‘stall-buffeting warning’ that is currently missing. All in good time, I hope. Much more important at the moment is the theme of this thread.

I did miss the posts that you alluded to in the WT Beta forum on this topic… this is one I would like to weigh in on. Perhaps it can be revived there.

Last edited by Jimko; 12/24/12 03:46 PM.

Jimko

"The older we are, the better we were!"
#3706171 - 12/25/12 02:38 PM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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Excellent post Jimko. The sim community's confidence in Gaijin doing more for them seems to be rather low though, judging from the number of replies to a thread like this. It probably has to do with similar threads on Gaijin's forum not receiving answers from the devs. I am also not convinced what we write here or there will make a difference for their plans. It's worth a try, but I guess it just comes down to the economic prospects they perceive (i.e. outlook to achieve profits) with a more simulation orientated product. Time will tell.

MAC

#3706260 - 12/25/12 05:00 PM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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We can only hope, but I'm not too optimistic. I think what you see is what you are going to wind up with. Here's hoping they take that fantastic engine and do something more hardcore sim/IL2 46 with it.


i5-4460@3.2ghz, 16GB Ram, Gigabyte GTX1050Ti 4GB, 2TB HDD, 500GB SDD
#3706824 - 12/26/12 08:12 PM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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I guess I'm a bit more optimistic about the future of sim quality gameplay in WT. Admittedly, I use both the semi-sim 'Realistic' flight controls as well as 'Full Realistic' controls depending on time and mood... but 'Arcade Mode', never.

Gaijin has incorporated a largely full engine and flight control management option. They are trying, apparently to achieve very realistic and accurate FMs.

I think the issue for them at the moment, is more one of dealing with the masses and where their largest revenue is and that includes the highly popular 'Arcade Mode'. There is a huge clamour about largely MMO aspects... mouse vs joystick flight and aiming controls, leveling, points and rank systems, etc. etc. I don't doubt that they are keeping a close eye on these issues. Apparently they are avoiding commenting on every item and every whim that's expressed and concentrating on major issues and reported bugs.

There already is some sign of managed gameplay, ie. the ability to limit some single mission to friends or play offline with AI.
There are a few single missions unlocked in more historic settings with a number as yet locked from use. But yes, other aspects such as a full, wide open mission builder and historic dynamic missions are still lacking. However, they have promised a FMB and I hope that other things will follow.

I can only hope that as they get some of the other issues resolved that so many of the 'gamers' are complaining about, that eventually they may pay a bit more attention to the more historic and sim aspects of the game. I think that one of the problems to date is that any suggestions such as those presented in this thread have been diluted in the popular MMO gameplay issues and presented in bits and pieces rather than as a concise and specific presentation.

I suppose we could start another thread in the WT Beta forum that presents our wishes. If we can agree on some of the items we would like to see addressed and present it in an articulate and meaningful way, we might get a response, particularly if it stood out from the usual maze of criticisms and debates and if it was to be carefully representative of only those who have the same interests as we do. We would have to be careful to avoid appearing as a threat to the MMO and Arcade aspects of the game and to present ourselves as a niche group wanting to have a few unique oppourtunities, otherwise we risk starting another meaningless flame war.

But, that would have to be carefully pre-planned for such a presentation.

Food for thought, I suppose…

Last edited by Jimko; 12/26/12 08:14 PM.

Jimko

"The older we are, the better we were!"
#3706849 - 12/26/12 09:03 PM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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Problem is Jimko, here on SimHQ as well as on the Gaijin forum, that the people interested in more sim like features in a Gaijin product are not showing up in large enough in numbers and are not vocal enough. We also don't mix well with the MMO people, a very different sort of community.

MAC

#3706941 - 12/27/12 12:28 AM Re: Wishlist to Gaijin: what should a future WWII flight simulation have/not have? [Re: MACADEMIC]  
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I certainly agree with you Mac.

But that's why I suggested that any new post in the Beta forum on this theme would have to be, first, very distinct and separate in its design and expressed intent from that of the MMO crowd, presented as the interests of a 'niche' group, and secondly, it would have to be completely non-threatening and be perceived as not interfering with any aspect of the MMO game modes.

Put another way, perhaps, is to say that if the MMO crowd sees us as simply a group that wants a few game enhancements that don't interfere with their gameplay in any way, perhaps Gaijin will regard this as simply another oppourtunity to encourage another type of player.

Again, I think that by trying to suggest these things 'piecemeal' in the general forum of debates that currently take place just makes them seem like another form of controversy to others who aren't of the same mindset.

Just my thoughts...


Jimko

"The older we are, the better we were!"
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