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#3619578 - 08/03/12 05:09 PM B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement  
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Hpasp Offline
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I find it as an extraordinary technical achievement, that only one B-2A Spirit flying just one pass above downtown Belgrade, hit the following targets:
Nat'l MOD HQ, FRY MUP HQ, MOD HQ South, Serb MUP HQ, Army HQ Facility A



PS: After OAF, it was calculated, that the complete El-Dorado Canyon raid could have been done by only 3 B-2A launched from the US, instead of the 100+ armada launched from the UK.
tactical

Last edited by Cat; 08/18/12 01:42 AM.

Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

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Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#3619601 - 08/03/12 05:30 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: Hpasp]  
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piston79 Offline
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Stop revealing B-2 tracks, leave the entusiasts to try against it without any inteligence, as it was in reality!

#3619723 - 08/03/12 08:06 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: piston79]  
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Hpasp Offline
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Originally Posted By: piston79
Stop revealing B-2 tracks, leave the entusiasts to try against it without any inteligence, as it was in reality!


AN/ASQ-213 HARM Targeting System (HTS) "Weasel in a Can" on board of the F-16CJ Weasel Vipers are just waiting to your SAM system emission...



Just practice counting when you emit...
... 19 - 20 - 21 - bang.
attack

Last edited by Hpasp; 08/03/12 08:26 PM.

Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

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#3632130 - 08/24/12 05:22 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: Hpasp]  
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Vonzeppelin Offline
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I agree Hpasp. The B-2a is truely an amasing machine, but just to put things in perspective: Three B-2s would probably cost around the same as the 100+ armada you mention, all though their survivability is much better.

#3743213 - 02/28/13 08:38 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: Hpasp]  
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Last edited by piston79; 02/28/13 08:42 PM.
#3743302 - 02/28/13 10:57 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: Hpasp]  
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CooLDoG Offline
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very impressive that it can be that stealthy and deadly.

#3744257 - 03/02/13 09:02 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: Vonzeppelin]  
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Hpasp Offline
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Originally Posted By: Vonzeppelin
I agree Hpasp. The B-2a is truely an amasing machine, but just to put things in perspective: Three B-2s would probably cost around the same as the 100+ armada you mention, all though their survivability is much better.


As I has a privilege to create any scenario, I can share my personal opinion, than NOT ANY SINGLE DIGIT SOVIET SAM system has any chance against the B-2A.


Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3744258 - 03/02/13 09:07 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: piston79]  
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Hpasp Offline
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Originally Posted By: piston79
Click to reveal..





F-117A with 0.025m RCS is pretty optimistic...
... according to Serbian wartime experience, it is at least one order of magnitude smaller.


Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3748322 - 03/09/13 10:07 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: Hpasp]  
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piston79 Offline
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Does anyone ever saw that B-2 bomber on screens??? Is it modeled with bigger RCS than "Nighthawk"?

#3748494 - 03/10/13 09:14 AM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: Hpasp]  
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PN79 Offline
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P-18 sees it but I was unable to find it with SNR.

#3748538 - 03/10/13 01:56 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: piston79]  
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farokh Offline
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I-RAN
Originally Posted By: piston79
Does anyone ever saw that B-2 bomber on screens??? Is it modeled with bigger RCS than "Nighthawk"?


ok guys ! just let me show you somthing on manual 3DAAR biggrin

1. as you see , i mark on picture with RED mark , so you can set the 2 picture near together as The roughness of a ground



2.im not good painter but i did my best on paint software !
so i paint the position of the PVO and kill zone ! by yellow sign ! aso you see 3/250 has no chance to meet the b-2 !



3. // // //
i paint the 4.250 position on map ! so you can see the best position for attack is 4.250

#3748559 - 03/10/13 02:41 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: Hpasp]  
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piston79 Offline
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I believe that only possible way to detect it is with 4/250 ....
As I used "Volhnov" with wide and narrow beam (as it's transmitters are the most powerful available into the SIM, and didn't saw it at this range, so my conclusions are that it is more "stealthy" than F-117... Maybe when it drops bombs it's RCS is much bigger, but don't know is it simulated or not (probably not)... Anyway I am interested about RCS of B-2 in the SIM...

Last edited by piston79; 03/17/13 08:28 AM.
#3748586 - 03/10/13 04:33 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: Hpasp]  
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farokh Offline
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i hunted f-117 during allied forces few hours ago .. now i thinking about b-2 hunting.
im not sure but i guess .. hpasp do not simulate it ! because in reall life no b-2 hit ot crash!
its a rumor ! of course i see on video from zoltan danis team and one man talking about hit b-2 sprit of missuri but im not sure it wa truth !

Click to reveal..
22:06pm 30th of April, 1999.
Operation Allied Force, B-2A raid on Belgrade

Targets:
Nat'l MOD HQ
FRY MUP HQ
MOD HQ South
Serb MUP HQ
Army HQ Facility A

Supporting force:
F-15C Eagle CAP
F-16CJ Falcon SEAD
EA-6B Prowler ECM
RQ-1 Predator UAV


3/250 rd PVO, Petrovcic ( 83m)
S-125M1 Neva


+++++++++++++++++
00:03:46, SNR ON AIR


00:03:58, SNR OFF THE AIR
-----------------


+++++++++++++++++
00:04:19, SNR ON AIR


00:04:34, V601PD 5V27D Missile launched on Channel-1
Target distance: 16km
Target azimuth: 68
Target elevation: 24
Target altitude: 6.9km
Missile guidance method: TT (Three Point)


00:04:34, F-16CJ Falcon SEAD Number-2 launched AGM-88 HARM missile No. 1


00:04:40, V601PD 5V27D Missile launched on Channel-2
Target distance: 16km
Target azimuth: 63
Target elevation: 24
Target altitude: 6.9km
Missile guidance method: TT (Three Point)


00:05:01, Missile exploded on Channel-1
F-117A Stealth killed by SAM. (miss distance: 34m)

00:05:07, Missile exploded on Channel-2
F-117A Stealth killed by SAM. (miss distance: 3m)

00:05:09, SNR OFF THE AIR
-----------------


00:05:10, SNR knocked out by HARM


Total, SNR On Air Time: 1min 2sec

Last edited by farokh; 03/10/13 04:41 PM.
#3929898 - 03/25/14 08:48 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: Hpasp]  
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piston79 Offline
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#3929914 - 03/25/14 09:19 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: piston79]  
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Hpasp Offline
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Originally Posted By: piston79
I believe that only possible way to detect it is with 4/250 ....
As I used "Volhnov" with wide and narrow beam (as it's transmitters are the most powerful available into the SIM, and didn't saw it at this range, so my conclusions are that it is more "stealthy" than F-117... Maybe when it drops bombs it's RCS is much bigger, but don't know is it simulated or not (probably not)... Anyway I am interested about RCS of B-2 in the SIM...


In the sim, the detection range of the B2 is 15% smaller compared to the F117.


Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3930002 - 03/25/14 11:44 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: piston79]  
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ricnunes Offline
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Originally Posted By: piston79





Where did you get that image from?

What's weird in that image is that according to it, the F-117 is "stealthier" (have less RCS) than the B-2. That's weird because every information that I read so far indicates exactly the opposite: that the B-2 has in fact a lower RCS than the F-117. I also read that the B-2 is currently the stealthier aircraft in existence (at least regarding full production in service combat aircraft).

Resuming, what I read regarding US Stealth combat aircraft RCS is as follows:
- The B-2 is the most stealth of all US Stealth combat aircraft (the one with the lower RCS)
- Next (in "2nd place") comes the F-22 and the F-117 which have a very similar (or almost identical) RCS
- Finally (in 3rd) comes the F-35.
Albeit that, I also read that the F-35 is stealthier than the F-117 regarding frontal arc but in the remaining arcs (side and rear) and in overall/average the F-117 is stealthier than the F-35. This of course means that an aircraft RCS will differ depending on the angle/arc which is facing the radar.
Finally I read that the RCS value that we usually see for a particular aircraft (like the ones seen in that picture) are usually an average value from every RCS from the various different aircraft arc/angles.

This information was mainly gathered from a very interesting article that came in a Combat Aircraft Magazine issue, regarding the history of stealth and it's application on US stealth aircraft (F-117, B-2, F-22 and F-35), this among other sources.

#3930439 - 03/26/14 08:19 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: ricnunes]  
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piston79 Offline
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Originally Posted By: ricnunes


Where did you get that image from?


http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=1978041

Originally Posted By: ricnunes

This information was mainly gathered from a very interesting article that came in a Combat Aircraft Magazine issue, regarding the history of stealth and it's application on US stealth aircraft (F-117, B-2, F-22 and F-35), this among other sources.


It would be REALLY NICE if you do bother to share it here.... yep

#3930446 - 03/26/14 08:28 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: Hpasp]  
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Hpasp Offline
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There are some S-200V/D firing manuals around, and it would be nice to compare those to these open sources...
... albeit, Russians used to underestimate Stealth.


Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3930880 - 03/27/14 06:28 PM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: piston79]  
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ricnunes Offline
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Thanks!


Originally Posted By: piston79

It would be REALLY NICE if you do bother to share it here.... yep


It's not a "bother" but a pleasure to share it. wink
Unfortunally, I couldn't find the original article that I was initially talking about (can't find the magazine) but fortunally I found another article in another magazine (this one called "Air International") which while a little bit less informative (since it kinda center on the F-117 recent retirement) it basically says the same things that I mentioned before with only a little difference - According to this article the F-22 is a little bit less stealthy than the F-117 but it still says that the B-2 is the stealthiest of all US Stealth aircraft and the F-35 the least stealth (albeit probably more stealth than the F-117 in the front arc).

Anyway here the 4 page article that I could find on the subject (I hope you like):

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwK-B4mRQeNLWnB1V2J6NGpYRDA/edit?usp=sharing

#3932065 - 03/30/14 09:31 AM Re: B-2 over Belgrade....an extraordinary technical achievement [Re: Hpasp]  
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piston79 Offline
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Originally Posted By: Hpasp
There are some S-200V/D firing manuals around, and it would be nice to compare those to these open sources...
... albeit, Russians used to underestimate Stealth.


There it is - 1 square meter (huge underestimation!)


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