Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 2 1 2
#3465890 - 12/01/11 06:26 PM bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated  
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,189
Osram Offline
Hotshot
Osram  Offline
Hotshot

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,189
Bielefeld, Germany
A 1.8 ton bomb was found in the Rhine river inside the city of Koblenz.
It will be defused on saturday and 45000 people will have to leave their homes for basically all of saturday. Actually hospitals already started evacuating their intensive care units.
Koblenz is quite near to me (20 km).
More for example here:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopi...erman-town.html

Bomb disposal is something normal in Germany, with about 5500 bombs found and defused each year, but the size and position of this bomb make it a bigger issue.

Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#3465910 - 12/01/11 06:53 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 26,564
wheelsup_cavu Offline
Lifer
wheelsup_cavu  Offline
Lifer

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 26,564
Corona, California
It's seems amazing to me that after all these years unexploded bombs are still being found.


Wheels


Cheers wave
Wheelsup_cavu

Mission4Today (Campaigns, Missions, and Skins for IL-2)
Planes of Fame Air Museum | March Field Air Museum | Palm Springs Air Museum
#3465912 - 12/01/11 06:54 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 9,248
U-96 Offline
%!#Stack Overflow#!%
U-96  Offline
%!#Stack Overflow#!%
Hotshot

Joined: May 2000
Posts: 9,248
wheelsup, there's still a factory in Belgium expressly designed to dispose of WW1 chemical shells the farmers dig up.

#3465916 - 12/01/11 06:59 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 11,752
Vertigo1 Offline
Veteran
Vertigo1  Offline
Veteran

Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 11,752
Zeta Aquilae System
You should check out Afghanistan when it comes to UXO! Russians mined the crap out of the place.


"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

“One of the great mistakes is to judge policies and programs by their intentions rather than their results.” -Milton Friedman

Quem Deus vult perdere, prius dementat
#3465917 - 12/01/11 07:00 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: U-96]  
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 26,564
wheelsup_cavu Offline
Lifer
wheelsup_cavu  Offline
Lifer

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 26,564
Corona, California
Originally Posted By: U-96
wheelsup, there's still a factory in Belgium expressly designed to dispose of WW1 chemical shells the farmers dig up.

That's very interesting I didn't know that there was a specific factory for dealing with such ordnance.

I've also read that they still are finding ordnance from the Napoleanic wars but it still amazes me that it all hasn't been found by now.


Wheels


Cheers wave
Wheelsup_cavu

Mission4Today (Campaigns, Missions, and Skins for IL-2)
Planes of Fame Air Museum | March Field Air Museum | Palm Springs Air Museum
#3465919 - 12/01/11 07:03 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 9,705
Blade_RJ Offline
Simhq Weather man, dropping rain in your parade
Blade_RJ  Offline
Simhq Weather man, dropping rain in your parade
Hotshot

Joined: May 2005
Posts: 9,705
brasil
1.8 TONS ? Wow !

#3465953 - 12/01/11 07:57 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 3,900
Gopher Offline
Senior Member
Gopher  Offline
Senior Member

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 3,900
Midlands
Sounds like the size of one of our Cookie bombs (~4000lb) that would have come out the back of a Lanc.

#3466052 - 12/01/11 09:41 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 402
SFViper19D Offline
Forum Scout
SFViper19D  Offline
Forum Scout
Member

Joined: May 2009
Posts: 402
Goshen, IN.
I'm curious as to the blast radius on a 1.8 ton bomb. Anyone venture a guess? 45,000 people sounds a bit like overkill but I guess it's better to err on the side of safety.


"In the absence of orders, go find something and kill it."
- Field Marshal Erwin Rommel

I5-2500K
Corsair H80 Cooler
Asus P8Z68-V PRO
16GB DDR3 1600 Corsair Vengeance
Diamond Radeon HD5870
1TB HDD
Corsair HX750w
Windows 7 (64-bit)
#3466080 - 12/01/11 10:11 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 19,381
Ajay Offline
newbie
Ajay  Offline
newbie
Veteran

Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 19,381
Brisbane OZ
Yes it would be overkill but better safe than sorry smile Depends how tightly packed the area is with people i suppose but it sounds like they evacuated a very large area.

The amount of tallboys ( 12000 pound) that hit the Tirpitz ended up being three in total and maybe four over three operations with five or six near misses before she finally rolled over and sunk.Probably sinking through water and exploding underneath once penetrating the lake bed would have dissapated a fair amount of the energy i imagine.But still, pretty big bomb, and three tallboy operations to sink one ship.

The blockbuster (cookie) was a bit different than most bombs of the day though as something like 75% of it was explosive and it was a thin case bomb so for explosive to weight ratio she was a bit of a monster.Interesting fact, even the mighty Mossie could carry the cookie and they sometimes did two trips to Berlin in a night with them.Total war is a b/tch huh smile


My il2 page
Seelowe Campaign
Cliffs of Dover page
CloD
My Models
Tanks/Planes/Ships


#3466096 - 12/01/11 10:33 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,113
KraziKanuK Offline
Veteran
KraziKanuK  Offline
Veteran

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,113
Ottawa Canada
Want to know about British aerial bombs?

http://www.wwiiequipment.com/index.php?o...;layout=default


There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#3466099 - 12/01/11 10:37 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Gopher]  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,113
KraziKanuK Offline
Veteran
KraziKanuK  Offline
Veteran

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,113
Ottawa Canada
Originally Posted By: Gopher
Sounds like the size of one of our Cookie bombs (~4000lb) that would have come out the back of a Lanc.


Or a Halifax.


There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#3466110 - 12/01/11 10:52 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 3,351
Lieste Online sigh
Senior Member
Lieste  Online Sigh
Senior Member

Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 3,351
Bomb effect for the 4000lb (3200lb HE) bomb was considered to be total demolition within 120 ft, and significant visible damage to 265 ft
(Compared - a 2000lb bomb would demolish all within 54 ft and seriously damage within 118 ft). Crater ~40-50ft radius.

Obviously the overpressures involved would break some glass windows at much longer ranges, fragments of casing and secondary projectiles could travel a very long way and the blast would give some temporary ground movement to much greater distances (around 2" movement at 150ft, and the movement is roughly inversely proportional to distance for longer distances).

Another rule of thumb of 'factory type buildings' is that GP bombs damage/destroy 400-450 square yards of structure per ton, but the LC 4000lb is 'significantly better per ton'.

However - the same report indicates that 'demolition' only occurs within the structure hit, and doesn't transfer 'out' to nearby buildings even if they lie within the distance that the bomb can damage. Obviously this can only refer to major structural damage, and doesn't account for damage to roofing, windows or other blast sensitive elements.

Seems to be that the authorities are ensuring the entire possible blast damage area is cleared - but the likelihood of serious damage is low as the bomb is in soft river mud and not directly adjacent to structures (except possibly the quay-side/road?)

#3466114 - 12/01/11 10:57 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: wheelsup_cavu]  
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,126
DJCarney Offline
Member
DJCarney  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,126
Victoria BC Canada
Originally Posted By: wheelsup_cavu
Originally Posted By: U-96
wheelsup, there's still a factory in Belgium expressly designed to dispose of WW1 chemical shells the farmers dig up.

That's very interesting I didn't know that there was a specific factory for dealing with such ordnance.

I've also read that they still are finding ordnance from the Napoleanic wars but it still amazes me that it all hasn't been found by now.


Wheels


They get buried over the years these were in a river bank and were found with low water levels this Fall...There's gotta be thousands of American UXB's in Vietnam

Last edited by DJCarney; 12/01/11 10:58 PM.
#3466118 - 12/01/11 11:01 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: KraziKanuK]  
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 19,381
Ajay Offline
newbie
Ajay  Offline
newbie
Veteran

Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 19,381
Brisbane OZ
Originally Posted By: KraziKanuK
Originally Posted By: Gopher
Sounds like the size of one of our Cookie bombs (~4000lb) that would have come out the back of a Lanc.


Or a Halifax.



..or a mossie wink



My il2 page
Seelowe Campaign
Cliffs of Dover page
CloD
My Models
Tanks/Planes/Ships


#3466277 - 12/02/11 04:14 AM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Ajay]  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,113
KraziKanuK Offline
Veteran
KraziKanuK  Offline
Veteran

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,113
Ottawa Canada
Originally Posted By: Ajay
Originally Posted By: KraziKanuK
Originally Posted By: Gopher
Sounds like the size of one of our Cookie bombs (~4000lb) that would have come out the back of a Lanc.


Or a Halifax.



..or a mossie wink




The Mossie had been already mentioned in a post.;)


There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#3466321 - 12/02/11 05:55 AM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 19,381
Ajay Offline
newbie
Ajay  Offline
newbie
Veteran

Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 19,381
Brisbane OZ
Lol, sorry...i thought you were skimming smile


My il2 page
Seelowe Campaign
Cliffs of Dover page
CloD
My Models
Tanks/Planes/Ships


#3466377 - 12/02/11 08:40 AM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,681
Old Dux Offline
Hotshot
Old Dux  Offline
Hotshot

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,681
Derbyshire
And the Stirling.

The Wellington was the first to carry the 'Cookie' operationally.

General Arnold was so impressed with the 4000Ib 'Cookie' that the American Ordnance Department organized production for the USAAF (MkV & VI) based on the British design information which was made available.



'Find your enemy and shoot him down - everything else is unimportant.'

Manfred von Richtofen
---------------------------



#3466395 - 12/02/11 10:32 AM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,771
Para_Bellum Offline
Oberkriegkaboomfhrer
Para_Bellum  Offline
Oberkriegkaboomfhrer
Hotshot

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,771
Germany
I had to evacuate various homes three times over the last 20 years during bomb disposals. Twice due to an RAF bomb, once due to a USAAF bomb.

My best friend works as a construction engineer and it's standard procedure in Germany to inquire about WW2 bombing attacks and possible duds prior to every major construction work.


"...late afternoon the Air Tasking Order came in [and] we found the A-10 part and we said, "We are going where!? We are doing what!?"

Capt. Todd Sheehy, Hog pilot, on receiving orders during Operation Desert Storm

#3466417 - 12/02/11 12:17 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,189
Osram Offline
Hotshot
Osram  Offline
Hotshot

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,189
Bielefeld, Germany
Here is an article with a google.map showing the evacuation radius:
http://www.rhein-zeitung.de/regionales_a...rid,341006.html
BTW the evacuation will be Sunday, not Saturday as I first wrote. Still, they already started evacuating some hospitals and also a prison, as they can not evacuate it safely in one day. On Sunday there will be 2500 "officials" (police, firemen, THW, etc)

Here are some very good photos:
http://www.rhein-zeitung.de/fotos/bilder-regional_costart,1_mmid,10610.html#pic
1: The bomb under water (current situation)
2+3: Here you clear see the damm made from sand sacks that they will pump dry before defusing the bomb.
4: The same type of bomb, but in a museum
5: WWII
6: Again the museumn, which, BTW, is very good.
The explosive weighs 1.4 t of the 1.8 t
7 WWII
8: There is still ship traffic on the Rhine, so the
so called "water + ship agency" put a boat almost perpendicular in front of the bomb

Trains on both sides of the Rhine will also be halted.
These are one of the major train lines in Germany.
Everyone has to be out of the zone at 9:00, but the defusing only starts at 15:00.
The main guy that will defuse it has already defused several of them ("HC 4000 IV").

A few days ago they already exploded a fogcontainer
a few km away from Koblenz. At least 4 others are knwon and three of them will be exploded on Saturday.

On the 28.11. a bomb was defused in Spay, about 10 km away from Koblenz.

All of this is not so surprising, they say that the allied dropped about 2500 bombs onto each of the bridges around here. This shows how bad the accuracy of the allied bombers at the time was.

Another, although small bomb that had been dropped from a plane was found around 1500 meters from me (article in german):
http://www.rhein-zeitung.de/startseite_a...rid,341310.html

#3466874 - 12/02/11 10:50 PM Re: bomb will be defused - 45 000 Germans evacuated [Re: Osram]  
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 19,381
Ajay Offline
newbie
Ajay  Offline
newbie
Veteran

Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 19,381
Brisbane OZ
Thanks for the links Osram. Makes me wonder what the older couple closest to camera are thinking, they look very sombre.



My il2 page
Seelowe Campaign
Cliffs of Dover page
CloD
My Models
Tanks/Planes/Ships


Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  RacerGT 

Quick Search
Recent Articles
Support SimHQ

If you shop on Amazon use this Amazon link to support SimHQ
.
Social


Recent Topics
Grumman Wildcat unique landing gear
by Coot. 04/17/24 03:54 PM
Peter Higgs was 94
by Rick_Rawlings. 04/17/24 12:28 AM
Whitey Herzog was 92
by F4UDash4. 04/16/24 04:41 PM
Anyone can tell me what this is?
by NoFlyBoy. 04/16/24 04:10 PM
10 Years ago MV Sewol
by wormfood. 04/15/24 08:25 PM
Pride Of Jenni race win
by NoFlyBoy. 04/15/24 12:22 AM
It's Friday: grown up humor for the weekend.
by NoFlyBoy. 04/12/24 01:41 PM
OJ Simpson Dead at 76
by bones. 04/11/24 03:02 PM
They wokefied tomb raider !!
by Blade_RJ. 04/10/24 03:09 PM
Copyright 1997-2016, SimHQ Inc. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0