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#3317087 - 06/12/11 02:59 PM Re: Disappointed *** [Re: BKHZ_Furbs]  
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I feel pretty opposite. CloD is a game that revived my interest in the whole flight sim genre which already started to fall from my attention due to a lack of anything really spectacular.
What differs CloD is that it looks so real and "next gen" and so much visually superior to everything else, including RoF, WoP, FsX with addons which also look great but not that great as CloD.
Paired with a fantastic flight and damage model altogether it create so incredible immersion feeling so I can't stop just flying and could care less about campaigns and other stuff.

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#3317100 - 06/12/11 03:13 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: soaringbird]  
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Originally Posted By: soaringbird
... a fantastic flight and damage model altogether it create so incredible immersion feeling so I can't stop just flying and could care less about campaigns and other stuff.


Genuine question and not trying to get at you, but what bits of the FM do you think are so good? I've not tested it in depth, but what does it do that isn't available in RoF or even IL-2 1946?


Beyond gliding distance
#3317120 - 06/12/11 03:57 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: BKHZ_Furbs]  
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I can't say CloD is superior in regard to FM, perhaps just the same good and close but it definitely superior in regard to visual aspect.
My point is that CloD visually looks very "next gen": lighting/shadows, cockpits, ground details, trees with shadows and backlighting at sunsets, great water surface etc. In a CloD cockpit I almost get an illusion I am in a true plane.
Perhaps RoF would look just the same good if they would make their ground detailing the same quality and put a bit more attention to the lighting. I am one who think the visual aspect is the same important to the realism and immersion as physics one.

ps. As regards to the old il2 FM I find the new one having quite a lot of improvements. I find an aircraft behavior is a bit more predictable in the new game and I like more the touchdown moments. The old one always seemed to me a bit too much bouncy.

Last edited by soaringbird; 06/12/11 04:17 PM.
#3317140 - 06/12/11 04:47 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: BKHZ_Furbs]  
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Thats my problem with it though soaringbird, its gives me moments like that often, great immersion one second with the lighting, visual affects and shadows...then it stuffs it up when the sound disappears online or the AI starts rolling like a f-16, and i remember i cant select skins or change my ammo or convergence or play a campaign that makes sense to the "battle of britain".

Its so hit and miss it almost makes me weep.

#3317159 - 06/12/11 05:24 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: BKHZ_Furbs]  
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Perhaps it's just a matter of perception. I also have all those things sometimes, not so much frequent although. It's like a watching a great movie on a not so great TV with electric malfunctions occasionally vs watching a dull one in cinema.

And perhaps also I care not so much about all the campaigns. All that war is just a nice bonus and a background for me to an enjoying flying experience. I like to test my marksmanship sometimes but mostly I prefer to do some stunts, attack and flee actions to feel the edge both with an aircraft and its engine and then make an emergency landing. No other game provides me with such things better.

ps. My current fun and mini-game is an attempt to recreate Erich Hartmann's tactic: hiding high in the clouds, then turning of the engine and gliding silently close to an enemy tail. Too bad AI are always knowing about my approach frown

Last edited by soaringbird; 06/12/11 05:47 PM.
#3317194 - 06/12/11 06:24 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: BKHZ_Furbs]  
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Originally Posted By: BKHZ_Furbs
You know it doesnt matter if your a "hater" or a "fanboy", this is all that counts...

http://store.steampowered.com/stats/ (click the top 100 games)

And COD just isnt cutting it...i think we have one more chance with the next patch plus US release.

God, i sound negative, wish i didnt...but its how im feeling about it right now... frown

does anyone know where to find the stats for COD?


Wow, people are still playing Counterstrike and Team Fortress 2? That is pathetic. That is a damning indictment of the human race.


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#3317198 - 06/12/11 06:31 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: Plainsman]  
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Originally Posted By: Plainsman
Originally Posted By: BKHZ_Furbs
You know it doesnt matter if your a "hater" or a "fanboy", this is all that counts...

http://store.steampowered.com/stats/ (click the top 100 games)

And COD just isnt cutting it...i think we have one more chance with the next patch plus US release.

God, i sound negative, wish i didnt...but its how im feeling about it right now... frown

does anyone know where to find the stats for COD?


Wow, people are still playing Counterstrike and Team Fortress 2? That is pathetic. That is a damning indictment of the human race.


"Now Playing:

Rainbow Six 3: Raven Shield"

lol

#3317206 - 06/12/11 06:34 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: FearlessFrog]  
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Originally Posted By: FearlessFrog
Originally Posted By: Plainsman
Originally Posted By: BKHZ_Furbs
You know it doesnt matter if your a "hater" or a "fanboy", this is all that counts...

http://store.steampowered.com/stats/ (click the top 100 games)

And COD just isnt cutting it...i think we have one more chance with the next patch plus US release.

God, i sound negative, wish i didnt...but its how im feeling about it right now... frown

does anyone know where to find the stats for COD?


Wow, people are still playing Counterstrike and Team Fortress 2? That is pathetic. That is a damning indictment of the human race.


"Now Playing:

Rainbow Six 3: Raven Shield"

lol


Of course. Raven Shield is superior. You should know that.


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#3317207 - 06/12/11 06:34 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: soaringbird]  
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I am with you on most of what you say Soaringbird, the feeling of flying is fantastic in this game, I was as dissapointed as anyone after firing it up on release day, but once it was patched to a decent level of playability (graphics wise ) I have had hours of fun learning the CEM, (which by the way I started learning earlier because of one of the RAF campaign bugs where the Hurri couldn't catch up a bomber with it turned off.) taking in the views, admiring all the attention to detail, flying the 110 for the first time with full CEM, lots of wonderful moments. Yes it does f@** me off when the sound dissapears online, when I can't learn the 109 properly beacause the controls are messed up, because the campaign[/i]is rubbish, [i]and because the AI can fly like a telepathic alien!
I do expect these things to be patched and sorted out over time, and I will be hugely dissapointed if they don't. I do have faith that they will however, and in the mean time I am going to enjoy the [/i] good [i]things about it and not concentrate on the bad.


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#3317209 - 06/12/11 06:35 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: Plainsman]  
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Originally Posted By: Plainsman
Originally Posted By: FearlessFrog
Originally Posted By: Plainsman
Originally Posted By: BKHZ_Furbs
You know it doesnt matter if your a "hater" or a "fanboy", this is all that counts...

http://store.steampowered.com/stats/ (click the top 100 games)

And COD just isnt cutting it...i think we have one more chance with the next patch plus US release.

God, i sound negative, wish i didnt...but its how im feeling about it right now... frown

does anyone know where to find the stats for COD?


Wow, people are still playing Counterstrike and Team Fortress 2? That is pathetic. That is a damning indictment of the human race.


"Now Playing:

Rainbow Six 3: Raven Shield"

lol


Of course. Raven Shield is superior. You should know that.


smile

#3317216 - 06/12/11 06:48 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: Bokononist]  
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Originally Posted By: Bokononist
I am with you on most of what you say Soaringbird, the feeling of flying is fantastic in this game, I was as dissapointed as anyone after firing it up on release day, but once it was patched to a decent level of playability (graphics wise ) I have had hours of fun learning the CEM, (etc. etc.) I do expect these things to be patched and sorted out over time, and I will be hugely dissapointed if they don't. I do have faith that they will however, and in the mean time I am going to enjoy the [/i] good [i]things about it and not concentrate on the bad.


You know what I am happy for you.. Really. But you lost me after CEM because aircraft peformance is terrible at altitude. CEM itself isnt that hard to learn, and once you get used to it its not
really a big deal. But I just cant get past being driven to distraction by the overheating engines at 25000 feet, when it is a struggle just to go 170 mph. It amazes me that no one seems to
get the fact that it is very cold at those altitudes and the engines should be running Cooler not HOTTER!!! When your flying that high you ought to be able to close the rad for longer than 15 seconds before the darn thing overheats, and you would only need to open it a couple increments in any case. It must be my own personal pet peeve.


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#3317226 - 06/12/11 07:06 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: Ghost_swe]  
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Originally Posted By: Ghost_swe
Originally Posted By: 2005AD
Honestly, I very much doubt that Cliffs of Dover would have made the top 100 even if it was the best sim ever made. In its current state it has few good points as a sim and none as a game. If we look at Rise of Flight it had a troubled start but after two years it has almost reached classic status (only the poor AI are holding it back IMHO). It was expensive at over $200 for the base game and every addon released but after two years it is finally worth it.

Cliffs of Dover was and still is in a worse state than RoF was on release. Right now I can't even be bothered to load it up but I will certainly support it financially by purchasing any addons when (if) released. Hopefully in two years it will have pulled of a Rise of Flight type pheonix from the flames, but right now we should not kid ourselves that it is somehow deserving of any right to belong in any gaming top 100.



Disagree 100%.

Not saying RoF (differant issues but still issues) was in a worse state but saying it was better at release is stretching it so far its getting painful.

Maby 2 years under the belt is making u think it was .Maby u forgotten that RoF forum looked exactly like present day CoD forum back then. Difference is that CoD has 3 major forums, every whine, bug, complaint etc. multiplied with 3. Thats what it ends up looking like, a mountain of bugs when its a hill, and RoF had/has 1.



Blah blah blah I got RoF when it was released too, Theres no way it was worse than CoD is now, and it definitely didnt take as much heat as Cod on the forums. I dont recall RoF getting creamed in the reviews either, maybe it did but that really isnt the point. The main point was 2005AD expressed his doubt CoD would ever be in the top 100. "In its current state it has few good points as a sim and none as a game. " With that statement I am in total agreement. The Rise of Flight team has done a great job and its now a very good game, bordering on excellent. We dont know if CoD will ever get to that level. Better wake up and smell the coffee brother because CoD does have a mountain of bugs and thats no stretch at all.


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Asus P6T MB
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#3317227 - 06/12/11 07:11 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: soaringbird]  
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nats Offline
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Originally Posted By: soaringbird
I feel pretty opposite. CloD is a game that revived my interest in the whole flight sim genre which already started to fall from my attention due to a lack of anything really spectacular.
What differs CloD is that it looks so real and "next gen" and so much visually superior to everything else, including RoF, WoP, FsX with addons which also look great but not that great as CloD.
Paired with a fantastic flight and damage model altogether it create so incredible immersion feeling so I can't stop just flying and could care less about campaigns and other stuff.


I don't play CoD anymore and wont until it gets fixed and a proper campaign probably. But like you it revitalised my interest in flight sims and after CoD I was encouraged to buy the fantastic Rise of Flight and also start playing Flightsim X again after a long while away from it. So its done some good for me. As for CoD itself, though, its pretty lame.

Cant agree CoD looks better than RoF or FSX, I have been blown away by views from default FSX flying around Geneva lately and I just love ROF especially since the new mist effects have been added. The feeling of flight is far better in both of these sims as well. The only thing CoD does well is the damage modelling and that doesnt make a great game. But personally I hate the graphics as unless you have a mega computer all the cities etc look like noddy towns and the trees/fields etc look nothing like England or anything resembling west Europe even, unlike RoF.

And as far as immersion goes there is very little in CoD other than in mission, and that is ruined all the time by a complete lack of objects or anything going on in the quick missions or campaign missions other than around your immediate flight route. And when you leave a mission you are back in an obviously basic computer GUI with nothing that keeps the immersion going, whats left of it. I mean yes MS flight sim has the same but it doesn't seem to matter too much as its modern flight sim not representing any type of historical period, and Rof reeks of historical flavour all the time even when you are in multiplayer.

There's just no comparison between CoF and the other two sims unfortunately.


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Making History: The Great War
Strike Fighters II: Europe
Hearts of Iron 3
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#3317235 - 06/12/11 07:23 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: commorange]  
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Originally Posted By: commorange
Originally Posted By: Bokononist
I am with you on most of what you say Soaringbird, the feeling of flying is fantastic in this game, I was as dissapointed as anyone after firing it up on release day, but once it was patched to a decent level of playability (graphics wise ) I have had hours of fun learning the CEM, (etc. etc.) I do expect these things to be patched and sorted out over time, and I will be hugely dissapointed if they don't. I do have faith that they will however, and in the mean time I am going to enjoy the [/i] good [i]things about it and not concentrate on the bad.


You know what I am happy for you.. Really. But you lost me after CEM because aircraft peformance is terrible at altitude. CEM itself isnt that hard to learn, and once you get used to it its not
really a big deal. But I just cant get past being driven to distraction by the overheating engines at 25000 feet, when it is a struggle just to go 170 mph. It amazes me that no one seems to
get the fact that it is very cold at those altitudes and the engines should be running Cooler not HOTTER!!! When your flying that high you ought to be able to close the rad for longer than 15 seconds before the darn thing overheats, and you would only need to open it a couple increments in any case. It must be my own personal pet peeve.

The difference is probably that you have a more detailed knowledge of how things are supposed to work, FM etc.... I have come back into the flight sim genre after a twenty year break, and I didn't even have a HOTAS before I put CloD on pre-order, I'm just accepting things like the limited altitude on the flight model as the 'way things are', I'll enjoy flying the sim to the limits which exist, rather than the ones I wish existed. I've come into this situation having great expectations like everyone else and as I said before, I [/i]am[i] dissapointed in the broken aspects of this game, but I still manage to enjoy the good aspects, and with a smile on my face biggrin

Last edited by Bokononist; 06/12/11 08:07 PM. Reason: more time!

"Tiger got to hunt, bird got to fly; Man got to sit and wonder, 'Why, why, why?' Tiger got to sleep, bird got to land; Man got to tell himself he understand." - A calypso.

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#3317308 - 06/12/11 09:16 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: Ghost_swe]  
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Originally Posted By: Ghost_swe
Originally Posted By: 2005AD
Honestly, I very much doubt that Cliffs of Dover would have made the top 100 even if it was the best sim ever made. In its current state it has few good points as a sim and none as a game. If we look at Rise of Flight it had a troubled start but after two years it has almost reached classic status (only the poor AI are holding it back IMHO). It was expensive at over $200 for the base game and every addon released but after two years it is finally worth it.

Cliffs of Dover was and still is in a worse state than RoF was on release. Right now I can't even be bothered to load it up but I will certainly support it financially by purchasing any addons when (if) released. Hopefully in two years it will have pulled of a Rise of Flight type pheonix from the flames, but right now we should not kid ourselves that it is somehow deserving of any right to belong in any gaming top 100.



Disagree 100%.

Not saying RoF (differant issues but still issues) was in a worse state but saying it was better at release is stretching it so far its getting painful.

Maby 2 years under the belt is making u think it was .Maby u forgotten that RoF forum looked exactly like present day CoD forum back then. Difference is that CoD has 3 major forums, every whine, bug, complaint etc. multiplied with 3. Thats what it ends up looking like, a mountain of bugs when its a hill, and RoF had/has 1.


I can say that a few grumpy old men out of an old IL2 Squad were able to play RoF Coops 'out of the box'. It wasn't perfect by any stretch but we did it and had hours of memorable gaming. To date 0.00 hours in CoD. Sorry, I want CoD to do well but it is broken in a way RoF never was.

Last edited by FIScott; 06/12/11 09:19 PM.
#3317312 - 06/12/11 09:26 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: nats]  
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I don't say RoF looks bad. Perhaps it's just a mater of a personal taste but I like CloD more. RoF looks a bit like an artist painted watercolor illustration from what I have tried recently. It looks nice with higher altitude but when you go lower it turns to something quite dated while CloD looks just amazing there.

I think RoF vs CloD visually is like Battlefield vs first Crysis. Both looks great but Battlefield resemble a great artist illustration while Crysis (first) looks sometimes just amazingly real. I think it's an amount of details and proper lighting that makes the difference.

Sunsets are where CloD shine and looks so great and superior, mostly because of a true dynamic lighting with all those long shadows and trees/grass backligting with the sun, with a nice patches of fog beneath the trees. I have never saw those effects done so real in games.

FSX with some addons looks also great till you go closer to a ground. It always lacks in texture resolution and has too many things looking fake : fake trees, fake clouds, fake sun, fake water surface. Maybe next one will be closer.



Last edited by soaringbird; 06/12/11 10:12 PM.
#3317333 - 06/12/11 10:18 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: soaringbird]  
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Originally Posted By: soaringbird
I don't say RoF looks bad. Perhaps it's just a mater of a personal taste but I like CloD more. RoF looks a bit like an artist painted watercolor illustration from what I have tried recently. It looks nice with higher altitude but when you go lower it turns to something quite dated while CloD looks just amazing there.

I think RoF vs CloD visually is like Battlefield vs first Crysis. Both looks great but Battlefield resemble a great artist illustration while Crysis (first) looks sometimes just amazingly real. I think it's an amount of details and proper lighting that makes the difference.

Sunsets are where CloD shine and looks so great and superior, mostly because of a true dynamic lighting with all those long shadows and trees/grass backligting with the sun, with a nice patches of fog beneath the trees. I have never saw those effects done so real in games.

FSX with some addons looks also great till you go closer to a ground. It always lacks in texture resolution and has too many things looking fake : fake trees, fake clouds, fake sun, fake water surface. Maybe next one will be closer.




You my friend need to go and take another look at RoF since the recent patch.


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#3317347 - 06/12/11 11:07 PM Re: Disappointed [Re: BKHZ_Furbs]  
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After fooling with CloD since the very beginning (1C actually sent me a test copy) and thru all the patches, it remains to date ....the most beautiful stock cockpit shadow simulator on the market smile

WD

(Yes, I borrowed the essence of that quote from another poster, but it is apt)


If you can defeat me in a fair same altitude duel, you are either Hartmann's ghost or you have a ganja problem that needs treatment.

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#3317398 - 06/13/11 12:59 AM Re: Disappointed [Re: BKHZ_Furbs]  
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To be honest I don't understand all that disappointment from the game and why people still consider it broken or unfinished after the patches. Any game has bugs. FSX was a bugs feast when it came and hardly ran on any pc. I remember a huge ugly green/violet stripes on the water in fsx at some point.
When I see all that amazing real time lighting, cockpits and unbelievable amount of ground details I don't expect the game would be a fps champion. I have some stutters over London with my not so new system and... it doesn't bother me at all. I just keep away from London. Perhaps they will squeeze a few more fps from the engine yet but doubt it makes a great difference.
What would really disappoint me if they would focus on bugs only and stop the content production. Because only I need right now is more content with the same or better quality. I would like to see Mustangs, modern stunt plane they promised, Pacific islands, carrier takeoff and landings, Russian winter battle-scape, playable big gliders and so on and on. Hope their production/art people do all those things currently to start milking my money smile

#3317439 - 06/13/11 02:38 AM Re: Disappointed [Re: LukeFF]  
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Originally Posted By: LukeFF
Without an engaging career mode a la ROF, I don't see myself buying COD any time soon.


Did you buy RoF two years ago?

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