#3314572 - 06/09/11 11:11 AM
Re: Fieldmods?
[Re: RSColonel_131st]
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 451
RedVonHammer
Member
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Member
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 451
Norway
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You may have got a bit carried away on your initial post RSColonel, but as Nimits said, 777 was a bit off on their usual routine, so it`s not like we are attacking 777, rather we are diplomatically pleading a case here. I bought the SE5a field mods long before you even made this topic, and as you can see, I made a clean case about the S.E.5a. We`re not attacking them, it just seems odd that they take extra charge for a "field mod" on a payware plane based on a real plane that came with this "field mod" stock out of the factory. The other issue is about those who base their whole argument against any DLC complaint on this forum, on the fact that they themselfes bought everything RoF associated, i.o.w misunderstood loyalty My argument about "the pompous arses" stands until "they"( "They" Being the pompous arses) can get their act together.
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#3314599 - 06/09/11 12:02 PM
Re: Fieldmods?
[Re: RSColonel_131st]
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 498
Taipan
Sim Addict
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Sim Addict
Member
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 498
Sydney, Australia
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Hi RSColonel, Sorry if my tone seemed a bit harsh, it's the internet afterall My tone really was one of tiredness at people slagging the mistake of 777 marketing (i.e. giving the Spad mods free instead of the SE5a) as something unfair etc. The main reason people who are not employees get offended, is usually when it's a big hobby of theirs, and they don't want to prevent it's further development and improvement. ROF is the only thing I actually use my gaming computer for these days, ROF is a major hobby and I want it developed to the fullest. So the offense comes because the person complaining does not have the same "love" for the hobby and doesn't care as much about damaging it. To explain where I'm coming from, I have some insight into software development process as I work for a software company. We do look at users feedback regarding features and addons etc. If there is a negative response to addons/features etc, then that feeds back into product development, and results in similar developments ceasing and new directions being pursued. I think if we weren't paying for field mods, then we would never ever have got them - OR we never would have got the career mode. People have to eat, that's lifeNow 777 could be considering developing other theatres of war for WW1 such as Palestine, Turkey, Eastern Front, English Channel etc. This would be fantastic, but if feedback is against paying for it.. then how will they pay developers to develop with no money? Result = No more development. When people lash out about having to pay for something like DLC, or even at the "principle" of something, not only does it feedback into product development but it also can offend the developers. It offends them because of how much they offer without charge to people who already have a purchased product. This can result in getting less "free" development. Worst case, it can result in a developer calling "end of life" to the product and pursuing new products elsewhere. That would be a disaster for a sim that's currently on track to become the "best sim ever" in many people's eyes. If we have to pay to get the best we can out of it, then it's in our interest I think. I don't know about you guys but with Sims I much prefer QUALITY over QUANTITY. No point having and learning 10 different sims when they're all pretty average or dumped by the developer, end of life (Think Silent Hunter 5) etc. Even if we find 777 are not the best at sales and marketing (e.g. giving the SPAD mods free instead of the SE5a), I think it's forgivable for the greater good.
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#3314609 - 06/09/11 12:16 PM
Re: Fieldmods?
[Re: RSColonel_131st]
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 25,138
RSColonel_131st
Lifer
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Lifer
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 25,138
Vienna, 2nd rock left.
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Taipain, if you read trough my "feedback" here and in other postings, you will find that in no way does it "damage" the hobby.
Your point about product development and customer feedback is understood, however I have said
1) I'd have been willing to pay for career mode (and said so in advance) 2) I'd have been willing to pay for field mods that are actual field mods 3) I have been willing to pay for addon aircraft as I bought almost the complete collection.
I don't think my feedback could ever be understood as being against paying for content, so certainly 777 is not in danger of cutting addon projects because I want not to pay for them.
But I also expect certain quality standards, and some parts in RoF - especially the offline part until now - have not met them.
(That is also a point for debate: While the current career mode certainly is way above and beyond the call of duty, *some* kind of reasonable career mode had to be included for this to count as full-featured SP game. The mere fact that the sim finally now has a worthy career mode is in itself a "fix" of an omission present since launch day, not a full-on "extra" the devs gifted us. Albeit of course they went 200% on what they owed the community, so some praise and even money is well deserved for the effort).
In the context of the initial sim release with very little offline content, the biggest sales factor was the never-before seen accuracy and love for detail on the aircraft. And that's where I find it "inconsistent with 777 philosophy" as RvH pointed out above, to first omit an important detail and then charge later for adding it.
As for my continued debate (in another current thread) that there should be an authentication-free version of the demo or game, again I said I would pay for this feature. It is for a love of the hobby that I want a software version which will still run in 5 to 10 years, independent of activation servers still being present.
In summary, I get your point, but I don't see how concrete feedback and suggestions by me could be constructed to be "damaging the hobby" and giving people a reason for turning personal.
It's a moot point anyway. Someone else now has my login data and can change the password when he starts playing, then I'm off for good, and obviously most guys here are happy to see me go as they would rather continue the never-ending lovefest for a commercial developer - which is the point I will never understand about this forum: that paying customers with reasonable thought out arguments and criticisms are seen as pest to best be rid of. It will certainly not help the development of the title if everything the developer does is automatically praised - without "whiners" like me, there'd still be no optional offline mode, for example.
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#3314630 - 06/09/11 01:01 PM
Re: Fieldmods?
[Re: RSColonel_131st]
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 498
Taipan
Sim Addict
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Sim Addict
Member
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 498
Sydney, Australia
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Hi RSColonel, Getting an aldis is not a right, as anyone who purchased the SE5a would have seen from the store page it did not have one. We all got what we bought at the time. They have said in the past that an Aldis was "too hard" to model, and alot of work etc. Thankfully in the end they managed it. But it wasn't something that was promised to people in the store. We got what we paid for, and no sim is going to be 100% accurate. Fully featured career mode is not a "fix", it's cream on top. Lots of games/sims get released and what comes with them is what you pay for. Anything else like patches is nice, and it comes more often if the game has continued development and sales. The single player game already had 3 static campaigns and also a basic career. Other sims I own (ARMA2, CloD, DCS Black Shark, DCS A-10C, Lockon) only have a static campaign for each plane. Strike Fighters 2 series I also own, that doesn't offer MP at all, only SP. You can't assume that a sim must provide a fully featured rich SP AND MP environment. Usually they provide one but not both. MP is great, SP is now great too. Thankfully due to the funding model continued development gives us these things. Since you're willing to pay for the career mode, whether it is via an Aldis $2.50 or via a $45 expansion pack at the end of the day it comes down to an argument about the method of sales/marketing. They are a sim developer, don't expect them to be good at sales & marketing As for turning personal, I don't think I wrote any personal slurs at all and I wouldn't see the point in that. If you detect a bad tone, it's just the nature of forums don't worry about it I'm just debating that's all, I've got nothing against you personally At the end of the day, you see your point about the Aldis as important, and I don't. I'm just trying to explain why. You're looking at an individual thing, I'm looking at the whole. We just have to agree to disagree about what's important here. Your points about offline mode are valid by the way, I don't have a problem with feature requests.
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#3314702 - 06/09/11 02:37 PM
Re: Fieldmods?
[Re: RSColonel_131st]
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 13,364
Freycinet
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 13,364
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I gave it to someone who might enjoy the game more, and maybe will not get shouted down everytime he dares post in the forum. Eh, is this the same person who wrote this to me one page back: Frey, stopped beating your wife yet so you have time to stalk me again? What a honor...
(You can go back and see what I posted to deserve such a reply...) I say good riddance and don't let the door hit you on the way out. You were never in this for the simming anyway, you were just here to harrass developers and others with your la-la-land points of view. Happily you couldn't impose them on others, as previous Austrian tin-pot megalomaniacs tried to do in history...
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