Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
Hop To
Page 10 of 176 1 2 8 9 10 11 12 175 176
#3292376 - 05/11/11 05:44 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: DDG167]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hpasp Offline
Hpasp  Offline

Senior Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hungary, Europe
Ehhh...not 4 TEL with 4 missiles each, altogether 16 ready to launch?

nope

The S-300PMU (SA-10B Grumble) Organization

The S-300PMU (SA-10B) firing battery contains:
One target acquisition unit
One 36D6 (36D6 Tin Shield) medium to high altitude 3D target acquisition radar.
One 76H6 (76N6 Clam Shell) low altitude continuous wave target acquisition radar.
One fire control unit
One 30H6E RPN (30N6E Flap Lid B) target illuminator and missile guidance radar.
Four firing unit, containing
One 5P85CY; (5P85SU) launcher connected to the 30N6E with radio (~120m).
Two 5P85DY; (5P85DU) auxiliary launcher connected to the 5P85SU by cable.

Each firing unit transports 12pcs ready to launch V-500R 5V55R (Grumble mod.1) missiles, altogether 48pcs for the battery.




Last edited by Hpasp; 05/11/11 05:50 PM.

Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#3292416 - 05/11/11 06:12 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hpasp Offline
Hpasp  Offline

Senior Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hungary, Europe
Or you can count it by yourself...

-6 target channel (similar launch indicator at right as the Vega has)
-4 firing unit
-3 launcher per firing unit, with 4 missiles each

thumbsup



Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3292443 - 05/11/11 06:37 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 13
DDG167 Offline
Junior Member
DDG167  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 13
PRC
Thank you!I have made a mistake, there are 8 5P85DU...dizzy

#3292469 - 05/11/11 06:59 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 13
DDG167 Offline
Junior Member
DDG167  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 13
PRC
Formerly, I always remember that the S-300 PMU site in china have the 30N6E in the central and 4 firing position around, so get a 4*4=16 result! So shame...Thank you for corret my wrong opinion!
I have check some pictures again and found that more common firing unit in china contains one launcher with auxiliary launcher.

#3292472 - 05/11/11 07:04 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: DDG167]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hpasp Offline
Hpasp  Offline

Senior Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hungary, Europe
Easy to remember...
4 pcs 5P85SU "Smart" launchers with telecode radio channel to the RPN (illumination and guidance radar) fire control radar.
8 pcs 5P85DU "Dumb" launchers with cable only connection to a "Smart" launcher.

5P85SU "Smart" launcher
(with telecode antenna deployed, and launch preparation F3 cabin)


5P85DU "Dumb" launcher
(missing telecode antenna & F3 cabin)


Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3292477 - 05/11/11 07:13 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 13
DDG167 Offline
Junior Member
DDG167  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 13
PRC
Er, I think I would not forget it again...reading

#3293270 - 05/12/11 04:04 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 48
Amidkor Offline
Junior Member
Amidkor  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 48
Russia
Some good videos:
Strela-10 and TOR-1 - http://twower.livejournal.com/539519.html
Shilka, Tunguska and Igla - http://twower.livejournal.com/534952.html


TOR-1 fotos - http://twower.livejournal.com/533778.html
Later in this journal will be more!

#3294948 - 05/14/11 10:30 AM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hpasp Offline
Hpasp  Offline

Senior Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hungary, Europe
The next system to be included in the SAM Simulator will be the SA-75MK Dvina (SA-2F Guideline).
62.5% of the votes arrived for the Dvina, 37.5% for the Shilka.



Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3295092 - 05/14/11 04:55 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hpasp Offline
Hpasp  Offline

Senior Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hungary, Europe
In 1953, after the successful fielding the first Soviet SAM sytem the S-25 Berkut (SA-1 Guild), the Counsel of the Soviet Union is decided on the following systems.
The prohibitive cost of the fixed S-25 system initiated the development of two new SAM systems.

Leningrad (as the second most important city) was planned to be defended by the fixed S-50 Dal (SA-5 Griffon) system, while all the other cities was planned to be defended by the cheaper, towed S-75 (SA-2) family.

Lavochkin OKB-301 was appointed to design the fixed S-50 Dal "Leningrad" system, while the tougher task of designing a cheap - towed SAM system was given to Raspeltins KB-1, the successful designer of the S-25 Berkut (SA-1).

The "75" design called for a SAM system of 29km range, and 20km altitude.

During 1954 it become clear, that the new 6cm wavelength microwave parts of the planned S-75 system has severe delays of production.
A crash parallel design is started using the old 10cm wavelength ("A" band in Russian) parts of the S-25 Berkut (SA-1) system. This design was called SA-75 Dvina.

In December of 1957, the first 10cm wavelength SA-75 Dvina (SA-2A) system was fielded in the Soviet Union...

... with the V-750 1D (Guideline mod.0) missile.



From the same year, the CIA's U-2 spy-plane started its regular flights over the Soviet Union at 22~23km height, only few thousand meters above the maximum altitude of the SA-75 Dvina system.
banghead

A second crash course started, to increase the effective altitude of the V-750 (Guideline mod.0) missile.
The thrust of the second stage was increased from 2.6 to 3.1 tonne, and the new V-750V 11D (Guideline mod.1) was fielded in 1958, with 27km altitude capability.


Further optimization of the SA-75 Dvina (SA-2A) leaded the reducing of the number of the towed vans from 5 to 3.
This system was called SA-75M Dvina (SA-2B).

The definitive version of the "75" design, the 6cm wavelength ("N" band in Russia) S-75 Desna (SA-2C) was fielded in 1959, with the V-750VN 13D (Guideline mod.3) missile.

As the definitive "N" version become available, the export of the "A" band system begun to the WarPact countries, receiving the SA-75M (SA-2B) version, with the V-750V 11D (Guideline mod.2) missiles.

In 1961, the next definitive version, the S-75M Volhov (SA-2E) was fielded with the...

... V-755 20D (Guideline mod.3) missiles.


In 1964, the nuclear tipped V-760 15D (Guideline mod.3) missile followed.

In the same year, the export of the S-75M Volhov (SA-2E) system begun to the WarPact countries, while the other friendly countries started to receive the SA-75MK Dvina (SA-2B) systems ('65 Egypt, '65 Vietnam, '68 Syria).

In 1971, the most advanced V-755 5Ya23 (Guideline mod.5) missile was fielded with the Volhov system.



During the Vietnam war, the SA-75MK Dvina (SA-2B) system was upgraded, to counter US tactics.
This system was named SA-75MK Dvina (SA-2F), Your new friend!
thumbsup


In 1979, all the further development on the "75" system was immediately stopped, because the S-300PT (SA-10A) was ready to be fielded.
All the ready upgrades&advances were incorporated to the S-75M3-OP Volhov (SA-2E) [export] system, that You know already.
thumbsup


Last edited by Hpasp; 05/15/11 07:08 AM.

Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3295147 - 05/14/11 07:00 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 58
Redcoalition Offline
Junior Member
Redcoalition  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 58
Brazil
Hpasp, I have few questions:
1- Did Vietnam ever received SA-2E system? They received it during Vietnam War?
2- Why russian designation for SA-2E and SA-2B are the same (S-75M)?

Thank you! I'm looking foward this new update.

#3295172 - 05/14/11 07:56 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Redcoalition]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hpasp Offline
Hpasp  Offline

Senior Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hungary, Europe
1- Did Vietnam ever received SA-2E system? They received it during Vietnam War?

No.
The 6cm wavelength S-75M Volhov (SA-2E) was available for the WarPact only.
The 10cm wavelength SA-75M Dvina (SA-2B/F) was available for other friendly countries. (Vietnam, Egypt, Syria, etc...)

2- Why russian designation for SA-2E and SA-2B are the same (S-75M)?

The designation is not the same.
nope

SA-75M Dvina [please remember, that the "A" means the "A" band - 10cm wavelength] (SA-2B/F)
S-75M Volhov [definitive version without the "A"] (SA-2E)

Last edited by Hpasp; 05/15/11 09:06 AM.

Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3295175 - 05/14/11 08:01 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hpasp Offline
Hpasp  Offline

Senior Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hungary, Europe
So to cut it short...

10cm wavelength "export" version using S-25 Berkut (SA-1) parts:
SA-75 Dvina (SA-2A)
SA-75M or SA-75MK* Dvina (SA-2B)
SA-75M or SA-75MK* Dvina upgraded during the Vietnam War (SA-2F)

6cm wavelength "WarPact" definitive version:
S-75 Desna (SA-2C)
S-75M Volhov (SA-2E)

*SA-75M Dvina was the WarPact version in the beginning of the 60's...
when the Volhov become available for the WarPact, the Dvina export started to the 3rd world countries.
This version was called SA-75MK Dvina, to be able to differentiate.

So Warpact, for example Hungarian used SA-75M Dvina (SA-2B/F), while Vietnam used SA-75MK Dvina (SA-2B/F).
They had only very minor differences.

Last edited by Hpasp; 05/15/11 08:43 AM.

Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3295383 - 05/15/11 07:45 AM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 54
arkhangelsk Offline
Junior Member
arkhangelsk  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 54
Originally Posted By: Hpasp
And will terrain shadowing be modeled along with this? Seems so but still...?

Yeah!

During 1959, the locations of the SA-75/SA-75M Dvina (SA-2A/B) units in Hungary were selected against medium-high altitude targets.

Twenty years later, during the planned re-organization / re-equipping to S-75M/S-125M/S-200VE/S-300PMU (SA-2E/SA-3B/SA-5B/SA-10B) the locations were re-selected to be able to fight against low altitude targets...
... just the money went out (at the end of the Cold War), and some units were stayed in legacy positions (bottom of valleys), so they had short visibility range for low targets.

grunt


Will the search radar also show ground returns or only the fire control radar?

#3295427 - 05/15/11 10:41 AM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 105
PN79 Offline
Member
PN79  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 105
There was also export of SA-2E to non-Warsaw Pact countries but much later - Vietnam received SA-2E only in 1980s.

#3296081 - 05/16/11 09:18 AM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: arkhangelsk]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hpasp Offline
Hpasp  Offline

Senior Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hungary, Europe
Will the search radar also show ground returns or only the fire control radar?

Usually the operation of target acquisition radars are similarly complex as fire control radars.
In the SAM Simulator I focus rather on the operation of the fire control radars.

Currently the target acquisition radars in the SIM are simplified, and (as their operation is 2~3 full time job) and I have no intention to get deeper in that field.


Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3296085 - 05/16/11 09:30 AM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 105
PN79 Offline
Member
PN79  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 105
Hpasp, did Hungary operated early SA-75 ie. the 5 van version?

#3296139 - 05/16/11 12:18 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: PN79]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hpasp Offline
Hpasp  Offline

Senior Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hungary, Europe
Weapon exports were always part of economical and political decisions.
Usual Soviet method was that...
current generation is fielded by the Soviet Union only
1 generation older equipment than current is exported to WarPact
2 generation older equipment than current is exported to other friendly countries
3 generation older equipment than current is exported to anybody interested

The same can be seen in the field of SAM's.

The SA-75 Dvina (SA-2A/B) was fielded in 1957 in the Soviet Union.
In 1959, when the S-75 Desna (SA-2C) fielding started, the export of the SA-75M Dvina (SA-2B) started to the following countries...
China, Albania, Bulgaria, Hungary, GDR, Poland, Romania, Czechoslovakia.

In 1961, when the S-75M Volhov (SA-2E) fielding started, the export of the SA-75M Dvina (SA-2B) started to the following countries...
Indonesia, Iraq, N.Korea, Yugoslavia, India, Cuba.

Few years later the following countries also received it...
Algeria, Afghanistan, Vietnam, Egypt, Cyprus, Syria, Sudan, Somalia, Yemen.


Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3296155 - 05/16/11 12:42 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: PN79]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hpasp Offline
Hpasp  Offline

Senior Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hungary, Europe
Hpasp, did Hungary operated early SA-75 ie. the 5 van version?

Yes, from the 75 system, we had the "5 van", "3 van", "doghouse", "noodle drainer", "flat", and the "Karat" version.
dizzy

5 van - SA-75 Dvina (SA-2A)
3 van - SA-75M Dvina (SA-2B)
doghouse - SA-75M Dvina (SA-2F)
noodle drainer - S-75M2 Volhov (SA-2E)
flat - S-75M3 Volhov (SA-2E)
Karat - S-75M3-OP Volhov (SA-2E)

Last edited by Hpasp; 05/16/11 02:49 PM.

Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3296257 - 05/16/11 02:56 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hpasp Offline
Hpasp  Offline

Senior Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,665
Hungary, Europe
I received this book today...
http://www.amazon.co.uk/F-105-Wild-Weasel-Sa-2-Guideline/dp/1849084718



It has so stupid mistakes...
duh


Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

Book from the author - Soviet Nuclear Weapons in Hungary 1961-1991
https://sites.google.com/view/nuclear-weapons-in-hungary/

thumbsup
#3296358 - 05/16/11 04:55 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]  
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 105
PN79 Offline
Member
PN79  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 105
Thanks
Equipping with SAMs was not uniform in Warsaw Pact - Czechoslovakia had SA-75M (3 van, SA-2B - these were then gradually modified to something like SA-2F), S-75M (these were also modernized during 70s and 80s) and S-75M3.

btw:
I am pretty sure that amount of informations provided by your SAM Simulator isn't surpassed anywhere in the internet.

Last edited by PN79; 05/16/11 04:55 PM.
Page 10 of 176 1 2 8 9 10 11 12 175 176

Moderated by  Cat, Hpasp, RacerGT 

Quick Search
Recent Articles
Support SimHQ

If you shop on Amazon use this Amazon link to support SimHQ
.
Social


Recent Topics
Avenger Emergency landing
by KRT_Bong. 04/18/21 01:39 PM
Picard S2 preview is teeming with Easter Eggs
by NoFlyBoy. 04/18/21 02:01 AM
This is a great question! It's making me hungry.
by NoFlyBoy. 04/18/21 12:35 AM
NHL Playoffs are coming
by WangoTango. 04/17/21 07:49 PM
24 hrs. after Pfizer #2...
by MarkG. 04/16/21 06:18 PM
Helen McCrory: Peaky Blinders actress dies aged 52
by WangoTango. 04/16/21 05:16 PM
Eating Healty
by Bill_Grant. 04/16/21 04:51 PM
UFO footage from USS Russell - declassified
by Mr_Blastman. 04/16/21 03:18 AM
Someone needs a laugh....
by Bill_Grant. 04/15/21 08:31 PM
Copyright 1997-2016, SimHQ Inc. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0