#3282467 - 04/29/11 07:21 AM
Re: End of the Fokkerplage
[Re: schwip]
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Joined: Oct 2009
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MattM
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BTW Matt : Is there a specific server where you fly these old planes ? We had a mission running on our server (Hellequins), but is was not popular enough. Mixing planes like the E.III or DH2 with later planes doesn't work and the overall number of different planetypes has to be relatively low (shouldn't be more than 10 total). Most people want to fly Camel, D.VIIF, SE5a and the like and some people even react agressive as soon as their favorite ride is not avaliable. I'm planning a 1916 mission with those planes for our "objective friday" though. Of course, there are also some very important planes for that 1916 era missing, that would definately make it way more interesting (like an early British two-seater, i guess the RE8 could fill that roll, even if that would not be realistic).
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#3282554 - 04/29/11 11:56 AM
Re: End of the Fokkerplage
[Re: Kwiatek]
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It is sure that when enente fighters like Dh-2 or N11 came into front lines Eindecers domination was eneded. Only resons which help Eindecers in these time was their more experience pilots and synchronizator. German pilots flying Eindecers from the begining against entente 2 seaters gained experience which help them when new entente fighters came into front. Im sure that EIII was much worse plane then N11 and also not better then DH-2. Unfortunately in ROF EIII is better plane then Airco and near equal dogfighter to N11. McCudden talks about being chased all over the sky by an Eindecker while flying his DH2. That suggests that in experienced hands the EIII wasn't that bad, I'm not saying it shouldn't be a bit more unstable in ROF but I don't think it was a complete turky either. There's no arguement that the EIII was faster and better in a dive than the DH2. The EIII, DH2 and NP11 provide good matchups in ROF, the better pilot tends to win out.
WAS C2D 8500 3.16ghz, 285gtx 1gb, 4gig ram, XP NOW Win7 64, I5 2500K, SSD, 8Gig ram, GTX 570
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#3282560 - 04/29/11 12:08 PM
Re: End of the Fokkerplage
[Re: Lieste]
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Really? Every source I have states the DH2 is faster than the EIII, not by as much as the N11 or Tabloid, but definitely not much slower. The ROF wiki is down at the moment but the late model DH2 with the gravity tank on the top wing only does just over 80mph, irc. The often quoted 92mph is for earlier versions, according to 777 anyway. There's a long thread with charts about aircraft performance over at ROF HQ. http://riseofflight.com/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=18158
WAS C2D 8500 3.16ghz, 285gtx 1gb, 4gig ram, XP NOW Win7 64, I5 2500K, SSD, 8Gig ram, GTX 570
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#3282811 - 04/29/11 05:25 PM
Re: End of the Fokkerplage
[Re: Mogster]
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Joined: Jul 2003
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Kwiatek
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Really? Every source I have states the DH2 is faster than the EIII, not by as much as the N11 or Tabloid, but definitely not much slower. The ROF wiki is down at the moment but the late model DH2 with the gravity tank on the top wing only does just over 80mph, irc. The often quoted 92mph is for earlier versions, according to 777 anyway. There's a long thread with charts about aircraft performance over at ROF HQ. http://riseofflight.com/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=18158 Not exacly. 93 mph for Airco DH-2 was reached with gravity tank also ( for version with smaller fuel tank) but version with larger fuel tank was similar speed with EIII. So some Airco with less fuel load was faster and some with bigger tanks were equal to EIII in speed. In ROF EIII is stable like rock but also could make very sharp turns without stall - i think there are 2 main faults of EIII flight model. Also Airco DH-2 in ROF is little too slowier and shouldnt be worse in turn rate then EIII. According to WW1 opinions DH-2 should be more manouverable then Albatros DII - thats why Hawker could evaded Richthoffen in Albatros DII for such long time. Richthoffen killed Hawker when he abandomed fight and was tried to escape to his lines ( Albatros DII was much faster and better climber then DH-2)
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#3282918 - 04/29/11 07:18 PM
Re: End of the Fokkerplage
[Re: komemiute]
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,236
Lone Star Ace
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Simulated Ace
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Spring, TX
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Plus we toss these planes around the sky as if there is a reset button.
Back in 1915:
If you spin, you die. So no big wild manuevers. If you catch fire, you die. And your engine may catch fire on its own "just because." So no big engine changes. If you go too fast, you die. No placarding - you'll just have to figure out what "too fast" means before the plane falls apart. Think you'd dive vertically knowing that? If you go too slow, you die. See spins.
Remember that the big aerobatic dogfighting manuever that shook the world was the Immelman - what we call a chandell today - and it was a daring move few could really master. Best point ever. History doesn't lie. You could die back then just getting the kite in the air.
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#3282996 - 04/29/11 08:56 PM
Re: End of the Fokkerplage
[Re: Lone Star Ace]
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PatrickAWilson
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Plus we toss these planes around the sky as if there is a reset button.
Back in 1915:
If you spin, you die. So no big wild manuevers. If you catch fire, you die. And your engine may catch fire on its own "just because." So no big engine changes. If you go too fast, you die. No placarding - you'll just have to figure out what "too fast" means before the plane falls apart. Think you'd dive vertically knowing that? If you go too slow, you die. See spins.
Remember that the big aerobatic dogfighting manuever that shook the world was the Immelman - what we call a chandell today - and it was a daring move few could really master. Best point ever. History doesn't lie. You could die back then just getting the kite in the air. Not really. It was getting out of the air that could get you hurt . In the ongoing contest between aircraft and the ground, the ground remains undefeted.
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#3283155 - 04/30/11 02:45 AM
Re: End of the Fokkerplage
[Re: PatrickAWilson]
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Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,214
Avimimus
Two-speed Five-Blade Fan
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In the ongoing contest between aircraft and the ground, the ground remains undefeted. Source of this quote?
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#3283180 - 04/30/11 03:26 AM
Re: End of the Fokkerplage
[Re: Avimimus]
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PatrickAWilson
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In the ongoing contest between aircraft and the ground, the ground remains undefeted. Source of this quote? I forget where I first heard it - I think either my father or brother, and then I rephrased it a bit.
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#3283347 - 04/30/11 10:52 AM
Re: End of the Fokkerplage
[Re: Kwiatek]
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Really? Every source I have states the DH2 is faster than the EIII, not by as much as the N11 or Tabloid, but definitely not much slower. The ROF wiki is down at the moment but the late model DH2 with the gravity tank on the top wing only does just over 80mph, irc. The often quoted 92mph is for earlier versions, according to 777 anyway. There's a long thread with charts about aircraft performance over at ROF HQ. http://riseofflight.com/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=18158 Not exacly. 93 mph for Airco DH-2 was reached with gravity tank also ( for version with smaller fuel tank) but version with larger fuel tank was similar speed with EIII. So some Airco with less fuel load was faster and some with bigger tanks were equal to EIII in speed. In ROF EIII is stable like rock but also could make very sharp turns without stall - i think there are 2 main faults of EIII flight model. Also Airco DH-2 in ROF is little too slowier and shouldnt be worse in turn rate then EIII. According to WW1 opinions DH-2 should be more manouverable then Albatros DII - thats why Hawker could evaded Richthoffen in Albatros DII for such long time. Richthoffen killed Hawker when he abandomed fight and was tried to escape to his lines ( Albatros DII was much faster and better climber then DH-2) Agreed, I'd like to see a slightly faster DH2, it'd sit a bit better with historical pilots accounts, the current ROF DH2 is very very slow. I'm not sure if the DH2 is on the FM review list, it may get some indirect help if global physics changes are in the works. Like the EIII the Alb D2 has easy manoeuvrability and stalls in a very benign way, almost just slumping to the ground. The DH2 is difficult to fly stalling hard if pushed close to the limit.
WAS C2D 8500 3.16ghz, 285gtx 1gb, 4gig ram, XP NOW Win7 64, I5 2500K, SSD, 8Gig ram, GTX 570
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#3283583 - 04/30/11 07:14 PM
Re: End of the Fokkerplage
[Re: schwip]
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 77
schwip
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Germany
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That´s weird : "... the de Havilland machine has unquestionably proved itself superior to the Fokker in speed, manoeuverability, climbing and general fighting efficiency." Sir Henry Rawlinson, 23 May 1916http://www.theaerodrome.com/aircraft/gbritain/airco_dh2.php Speed sea level 1000m 2000m climbrate 1000 2000 Dh2 130 125 118 7:00 15:22 E3 142 133 123 6:28 14:35, Also (in ROF) the E3 manoeuvers WAY better.
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