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#3092038 - 09/12/10 10:24 AM "You got away pretty clean, Sir!"  
Joined: Oct 2001
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AD Offline
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AD  Offline
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South East Asia
Visual damage modeling is one of those areas of sim development that has sky-rocketed over the last couple of years. 10 years ago a flash and some flying debris was enough to convince us that we'd done our job of killing the enemy. It's one area where we want to avoid being too retro, but it's not an area we can compete with the big guns.







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#3092042 - 09/12/10 10:37 AM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: AD]  
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Flexman Offline
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I love the line from Wing Commander smile


Richard - You Have Control
Tricubic Studios Ltd. (dev blog)
#3092358 - 09/12/10 09:58 PM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: AD]  
Joined: Jun 2009
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InFireBaptize Offline
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Canada
hi guys,
Would different hits cause different damages? for instance, loosing pressure, gas, oil, broken glass, etc....
Would chopper be repairable? could you please elaborate on the damage system?

Thanks,

#3092402 - 09/12/10 11:13 PM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: AD]  
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Flexman Offline
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It's a bit complicated and I don't want to spend a lot of time writing up all the different ones. Also it's a list that changes over time.

Two kinds of damage: Damage from external impacts, and internal failures.

The helicopter is a collection of hit boxes (child objects), most major components will have a failure state and damage level. Power systems have transient timers to indicate how long they are operating beyond normal limits.

Damaged choppers sat on the pad will repair over time and can be seen on a toggled floating status panel. On realistic supply settings not all bases will be able to repair all damage and only achieve "make do" repairs (75% max) which may require a shuttle flight to the largest regional base (with the big maintenance tents).

Betty will announce most system failures along with an alert on the upfront display and SYS panel on the MPD. Your AI co-pilot may also use some colourful metaphors at times of being hit by large projectiles. I know Jim recorded one or two from the test ones I was sent a while back. Could use a few more as I like them.

Not decided quite how to deal with continual loss of aircraft, leaving players without a helicopter to fly in a helicopter game is NOT an option.



Richard - You Have Control
Tricubic Studios Ltd. (dev blog)
#3092546 - 09/13/10 05:07 AM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: Flexman]  
Joined: Dec 2009
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AggressorBLUE Offline
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Jerz
Originally Posted By: Flexman


Not decided quite how to deal with continual loss of aircraft, leaving players without a helicopter to fly in a helicopter game is NOT an option.



I hear real military's have the same problem...


But that's a pretty nice touch. I'd be ok with not having any birds left being "game over" for that campaign. I think it imparts a sense of responsibility and ownership of the bird.


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#3092597 - 09/13/10 08:50 AM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: Flexman]  
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EagleEye[GER] Offline
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Originally Posted By: Flexman
Not decided quite how to deal with continual loss of aircraft, leaving players without a helicopter to fly in a helicopter game is NOT an option.


He he, what about the CO is order you in his tent, to let you stand in attention! and give you some warnings. Like in Strike Commander if you loss the plane. smile

#3092601 - 09/13/10 09:24 AM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: AD]  
Joined: May 2006
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tagTaken2 Offline
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Gone
It's like looking into a crystal ball for me sigh

#3092605 - 09/13/10 09:40 AM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: AD]  
Joined: Mar 2006
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Vierzinger Offline
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Denmark
I have had a campaign in EECH die to to lack of aicraft.
You should only need this lesson once.
I have won campaigns in EECH by going after enemy supply choppers and a/c.
I flew a major in a world wide SEOW (scorched Earth Online War) in Il-2 during Q1+Q2 of this year. A campaing where the administrator found it nessesary to give more planes to both side becourse Blue side had unexpecting high lossses.

EECH where the first Sim where I found out that I could win the war by loosing single missions.
That saving a battledamage aircraft where more important than accomplishing the mission.
I fly the same way to day. To most of my Il-2 friends I a the greatest sissy behindcouch
The loss of a/c might not matter much in a dogfight server where you can get a new a/c by hitting refly, but SEOW(and COOP) missions (and the real world), this will effect the outcome. I fact that I like. I make people more consious of the fact that reallife does not have a refly button sigh

I belive that you should have an option for both; Running out of a/c and not running out of a/c.
It can be done by an option box when you initialize the campaign or as pop-up screen when you run out of a/c.
The campaign score, citations and medals should reflect this so pilots can compare stats.
Sim pilots have different need for realisme.

BTW: I rather not be a pilot in the pictures of birds you have posted. It might be safety glass, but....


Will we EVER get a real Rainbow Six game again. One for the real Tactic fans? A WWII sim with a dynamic campagn. Games with deept?
#3092668 - 09/13/10 12:44 PM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: Flexman]  
Joined: Jul 2004
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DocW Offline
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Originally Posted By: Flexman
Your AI co-pilot may also use some colourful metaphors at times of being hit by large projectiles. I know Jim recorded one or two from the test ones I was sent a while back. Could use a few more as I like them.


that sounds very good to me. I hope you collect a wide array of this.
The damage looks convincing enough, and if system can fail in a plausible way, fair enough ...

Michael

#3092790 - 09/13/10 04:21 PM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: AD]  
Joined: Nov 2009
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Raptor9 Offline
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Vierzinger's suggestion is valid I think, having an option of running out of aircraft or not during the campaign. I recall LB2 had selectable rates for how fast helos and weapons were replenished.

Of course in the real world if a unit lost an Apache in theater, they would usually be SOL until they got back Stateside. Even then, the only way they'd get a replacement would be to sign for a helo from another unit, or wait until the assembly line in Mesa spit out another one.

Wouldn't it be funny if Flexman and AD added a fading paint scheme over time so every time one was replaced, it would show up all clean and dark green, lol..."Alright Jack, did you crash another one while I was offline?" grrr

#3093389 - 09/14/10 10:11 AM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: AD]  
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hovering Offline
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Aus
or the aircraft BuNo/serial can increment by one wink

What about crew damage? rushing back to base/hospital can save a player if not mortally wounded?

Does the games ESRB rating affect the depiction of blood etc?

#3093390 - 09/14/10 10:15 AM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: hovering]  
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DocW Offline
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Originally Posted By: hovering
or the aircraft BuNo/serial can increment by one wink

What about crew damage? rushing back to base/hospital can save a player if not mortally wounded?

Does the games ESRB rating affect the depiction of blood etc?


Hehe, the wishlist expands ... RTFM

Michael

#3093403 - 09/14/10 11:12 AM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: AD]  
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Flexman Offline
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Leeds, England
There's an AI crew-roster ala Gunship 2000 that accrues experience with flight time. Don't know how well it's going to work till we get all that in and tested.


Richard - You Have Control
Tricubic Studios Ltd. (dev blog)
#3094118 - 09/15/10 09:27 AM Re: "You got away pretty clean, Sir!" [Re: AD]  
Joined: Aug 2006
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Ryujin Offline
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A thought for a forgiving setting would be massively sped up time (or just a time jump) until aircraft are repaired to be flyable or several new ones are transferred (you'd get a slow trickle of replacements). I'd imagine days out of the action might just hurt your campaign status a wee bit and repeatedly losing all your aircraft will lose the campaign pretty quickly. Not totally realistic, but something between the realistic "you're done" option and instantly pulling a new chopper out of your back pocket for new players/more forgiving gameplay.

The same could probably work for crew, i.e. saving your skin is important too... even if the chopper is a write off, getting you or your buddies out in one piece and being rescued should be rewarded. If you lose both a chopper and it's crew, it would be a very major setback (for online, you can just have a limited number of "playable crew" available like choppers, since you can't time jump for an injury penalty. For SP a time jump for your pilot being wounded or such would be neat, possilby with options fr how harsh and realistic it is (i.e. dead or captured is campaign over).

Just a few thoughts.


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