I have the demo but before buying the game I was wondering what your opinions are about my biggest traditional complaint about this series, from OFP onwards, which is that, for all the intricacy of the orders structure, it is virtually impossible in singleplayer to get a platoon to perform tactics effectively. I really like the sandbox nature of the sim but I have experienced too much frustration in seeing decently planned platoon-level actions like ambushes or village assaults get ruined becuase the buddy AI cannot use cover and the enemy AI is, by contrast, ultra-efficient.

I feel that even if MP is the major justification for a sandbox tactical infantry sim like this, SP has to do a decent job in simulating real-world small-unit teamwork, allowing for a few frustrations, of corse. This is where ArmA has always fallen down for me. Wouls anyone care to comment on whether ArmA 2 has addressed this issue and whether it is possible to command platoon-level AI units effectively in combat? Many thanks.

Well...

The new AI is not perfect - recently I hate that they are not following in line, but besides me for example - but they are pretty good at combat. Consider the campaign needs all your razor guys to SURVIVE which didn't work with Queen's gambit since the morons got themselfs killed. But people are playing and enjoying the new campaign, some even say the AI is saving their butts.

For platoon level AI, you want the new High Command module which lets you set waypoints, combat mode, speed, and time different squads to move at the same minute. It is certainly better than attaching 20+ units to your single team and scrolling around with the F11 and F12 keys.

I think they are far less stupid than ever before. But the enemy AI has also smartened up. In a long time, this is the first game where I command troops and get the "oh #%&*$#, can't just rush down there" feeling as I see my guys dropping left and right by a nicely covered enemy MG.

For "line" formation they should be following beside you. To get them to follow behind you "in a line" choose "column" or "column compact".

That's what I used, I know the nomenclature from A1.

Hmm... well I'll test it out and report if it's working OK in an hour or so. (Unless somebody else beats me to it!)

Friendly AI work best when you let them be, they resent orders for some reason.

I only have the demo, but I was experimenting with this myself.

They seemed to have expanded upon the default "Safe, Aware, Danger, Stealth" options.

Instead of micro-managing the AI (which was needed in OFP and ArmA), I sense you simply change modes on a macro level and the micro-AI handles the grey areas.

For example, If I set my squad to "Safe" and "Column" I can walk down the road with them in good formation. If I "hit the dirt" and go prone, they seem to notice my behavior and raise their weapons and start scanning the area like little lemmings (LOL - try it once with no enemies near you - it's funny to see them get all hyper). If I get back up, they fall back in tow.

If you start messing with their stance, it gets a bit weird. For example, I set them to "Prone" and started running down a hill while standing. They got confused and meandered around trying to keep up and stay prone at the same time. If you set the stance to "Keep Low" (I think thats the one) you can hear yourself say "Follow my behavior!" which is what you want unless you plan on running off to do something else.

I sense the same thing with formations. I had them in a "Line" formation and hid behind a bush with nothing on my right and more bushes to my left. The units on my left took cover behind the bushes, but the unit that should have been on my right actually knelt down behind me. Almost like he knew it wasn't safe out there.

Now in some situations I can bet it is not perfect. I notice they are keen to running around ahead of me even in "Line" formation, but I think it's due mostly to where the cover is. If you leave them on "Aware" and do not have an enemies to engage, they seem to stay together better. I think it is when enemies are noticed they try and act "smarter" and get more flexible in their structure. Sometimes this is good, and sometimes this is bad.

Just got to test. All my formation commands show the AI doing as expected. I have noticed that the AI will momentarily get disorganized if I turn 180 and travel (they will run ahead and slowly 'merge' to where they should be in formation), but each time I tested they did get back into the ordered formation.

I'm still on patch 1.02.58064, BTW... haven't had time to get that latest release. I probably won't have time today.

I'm enjoying the High Command modules and subordinate command modules. It is simple to build into missions a combined with SOM and some mortar support, very rapidly gives you a pretty good Platoon leader simulator mission. (Unlike in Arma where CEX was very finicky and caused many problems in multiplayer)It works well with Multilayer too.

I have a mission I've run with my kid as one of the squad leaders multiple times and it gives different enemy AI actions, and some of the SOM missions that they interject work well to and variety and complicate the tactical decision making. Then I made a scenario where there were two platoons each with it's high command structure. As the CO I could give the other PL orders and the can see the waypoint then he in turn can command all his squads. In a third mission I made a whole company structure with three platoon leaders.

In every case I as the CO retain control of the artillery. In every case if you as the commander are killed, however, even if you respawn as another guy in the squad you cant use the high command function. though I am going to do a test where I synch up the High command module to multiple guys in the HQ squad.

All of this put together adds up to a reasonably accurate infantry platoon leader simulator EVEN in single player mode, something that has been my holy grail for some time.

Even in a server where you have a bunch of guys playing COOP now someone can go opfor and add some good tactical capability to the AI opfor as their commander. Good stuff...

WRT to friendly AI I think it's pretty good. Squads will bound forward by Fireteam even without micromanaging. As wills quads on their own. The Ai wil go out of it's way to flank and dos not give the same old moves every time. It's not bad.

Los

Very helpful response, gents, many thanks.

Los, I found your post very encouraging. I like high-fidelity tactical sims but the ability to combine such a thing with first person gameplay that is not scripted or on rails is a challenge which I must say I feel ArmA has not met in the past. It has seemed to have all the functionality in the command structure but not the tacAI to match. My expectations are not huge; I just want to say to my squad, go there and suppress while I send a vehicle to flank.

So you play with your kid, huh? My 10 year-old would like a piece of that but not for him yet if his mother has anything to do with it.

I haven't checked out High Command yet in the demo but I believe it is included in a tutorial mission.

I, too, enjyed the high command module. It could easily be scripted to re-assign the high command when you respawn.

Although, when I tried being commander of two other commanded groups (AI commanders), they would bunch up right on top of each other. Something I am sure will be fixed.

CrashDome: "I notice they are keen to running around ahead of me even in "Line" formation, but I think it's due mostly to where the cover is. "

This is what I meant, which can be slightly annoying if I want to be point. And yes, it seems to be due to the fact that the AI is now trying to move between cover.

Also agree on the fact they don't like micro-management. Was playing Avgani, and sending them around in pairs and fours to certain corners didn't really work well. Having them follow me in formation works a ton better - they just want to figure it out themself.